RAIL - Back On Track Forum

Quote from: timh on September 19, 2024, 18:41:55 PMI'd like Boondall looked at again as a potential Olympic stadium location. Carpark is about the right size.

Boondall is too far out of Brisbane to be viable, unless you were going to bulldoze the entire wetlands and but everything out there.

It's bad enough to have to go out there for major concerts (like I was several weekends ago). Even with it being on a rail line, there's just no way I could see an entire show there and then rely on public transport to be able to get home again. Best case scenario I would end up marooned in the CBD at around midnight.

My back of the napkin math estimated you could fit a roughly Olympic sized stadium on the existing footprint of the carpark for BEC. The carparking can go entirely for all I care. If stakeholders want to keep parking out there they can build a multi storey over the existing surface lot north of BEC.

Brisbane Arena is meant as a replacement for BEC for concerts. BEC will be used for Handball for the Olympics but after that it's future is unclear. Regardless the land exists and as I understand it it's too far gone to try and remediate and turn back into swamp.

And to be clear, if you were to build an Olympic stadium there, I would want additional turnback platforms built at Boondall station to run special event terminating services. the corridor on the eastern side is not very constrained. You would maybe also look at eliminating the flat junction at Northgate (or just improving sectorisation) to maintain reliability though.

I know it's not close to the city but none of the other options are great at the moment:
Gabba: footprint too small
QSAC: Too far out, no rapid transit
Vic Park: loss of public green space
Northshore Hamilton: requires resumptions, no rapid transit

Whereas Boondall:
None/minimal loss of green space (build over a carpark)
Existing railway station
Has an Olympic venue already there

I think it merits consideration

Couriermail --> David Crisafulli continues to dodge legitimate questions on 2032 Games stadium preference $

QuoteOpposition Leader David Crisafulli is quick to criticise as 'horrendous' the planned revamp of QSAC for the 2032 Games, but he still refuses to say what his preferred alternative is.

It is a bit rich for Opposition Leader David Crisafulli to, on the one hand, directly criticise as "horrendous" the Premier's plan for hosting the track and field events at the Olympics and Paralympics in 2032 when on the other hand he simply refuses to say what his preferred alternative is.

There is one certainty in all of this: That there will be track and field meets at both of the Games here in 2032. There is also one truth: That only one side of politics has so far come clean with Queenslanders on where they think it should be held. ...

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1837152834854522952

ABC News --> Here's why Victoria Park stacks up as the solution to Brisbane's Olympic venue argument

Quote from: OzGamer on September 19, 2024, 10:08:20 AMRevenue from stadiums essentially never pays for them. A stadium which would never be filled again would be a waste. A 50,000 seat stadium might potentially make sense for the longer term, but we don't need a bigger oval stadium than that for Brisbane.

Perth has a much smaller regional population and they sustain a 60k stadium so I think that should be our target, especially with a growing population and also on the back of AFL being more popular as each year passes.

Brisbanetimes --> Buses and 1000 drivers needed to avoid Olympic transport roadblock $

QuoteTransport experts say south-east Queensland faces a real challenge to temporarily boost its bus fleet – and find the required drivers – for the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games.

With rail projects taking years to deliver, the window for new Olympics infrastructure has already effectively closed.

Public transport advocate Robert Dow, from Rail Back on Track, said that meant the 2032 Games would rely heavily on buses, particularly at venues without rail access.

"That's a problem because there isn't going to be enough bus drivers in 2032 to drive these bloody things," he said.

Professor Matthew Burke, the deputy director of Griffith University's Cities Research Institute, said it was a "big issue" for organisers – not just sourcing the drivers and buses, but what would happen to those excess buses afterwards. ...

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1837874462823530610

Brisbanetimes --> School holidays to be shifted for Brisbane 2032 Games $

QuoteThe Queensland school calendar will be amended to ensure students are on holidays during the Games to reduce demand on public transport infrastructure.

The 2032 Olympic Games will be held between July 23 and August 8 that year, about a month after the traditional timing of Queensland's winter school holidays.

A spokeswoman for the State Development and Infrastructure Department, which has oversight of Games preparation, confirmed a change to the school calendar was on the cards. ...

Stating the obvious I know, but for the 2032 Games, venues need to be as far as practical, served by rail public transport primarily.  Why build new stations at Woolloongabba and Exhibition if they are not going to be used properly?

Let's hope the 100 day infrastructure review post #qldvotes get's it right!

Our transport system in SEQ is so bad that we need to shut the region down to hold the Olympics.

But let's hear from our politicians how right they have got it!!

https://x.com/railbotforum/status/1641503435123232768?s=46&t=EDszjTErsxTIqAna7yuP-w

QuoteSent to all outlets:

Transport "Perfect Storm" Building for Olympics

29th March 2023

RAIL Back On Track is forecasting a 'Perfect Storm' in transport not just for the 2032 Olympics, but for the Queensland economy and communities.

Everywhere RAIL Back On Track members look there are signs of building storm cells, just like the natural ones, that will wreak havoc on business, communities and the lives of people across the state.

The list of 'storms' grows by the day, some examples:

• delays and procrastination on the Sunshine Coast Line Duplication and rail line to Maroochydore;
• poor rail frequency particularly off-peak and weekends - embarrassingly the recent Sydney Trains disrupted services still had better frequency than SEQ;
• the Bus Driver Shortage Crisis, impacting across SEQ and urban bus throughout Queensland;
• an overdue and desperately needed bus network redesign for Brisbane & SEQ to remove duplication and inefficient, indirect, confusing routes plus integrate with rail rather than compete with it;
• little investment in safe and segregated cycling infrastructure in our suburbs and on our street and roads;
• buses stuck in ever worsening congestion in SEQ;
• a Gold Coast rail line only kilometres short of an international airport;
• infrequent or non-existent regional rail to major regional centres;
• a billion dollar BCC led electric bus project being called a 'Metro' that offers little increase in overall busway capacity;
• brand new CRR railway stations connected by 300m walks instead direct links between platforms;
• highly value land for affordable housing and mixed-use development being used for park n rides;
• more and more freeway construction/road widening that is well known to create more congestion not "bust" it;
• sky-taxis being promoted as public transport;
• Council City Plans still enforcing car-dependant, low density development.

RAIL Back On Track and other active/public transport groups appear to be the only ones aware that SEQ is headed for a very bleak future of ever congested roads, higher costs of living and worse health outcomes for the public.  All which is costing the rate and tax payers more and more every year.

Is there no one willing to stand up publicly and say "STOP!! DOING THE SAME THING OVER AND OVER EXPECTING A DIFFERENT OUTCOME IS INSANITY"

All there seems to be is Twitter fights from the major political parties - each defending their positions so much so they're blind to the pending storm.  They're certainly oblivious to the fact that they are making things worse!

Planning Institute of Australia, Engineers Australia, Australian Medical Association, Chamber of Commerce and Industry Queensland will you join RAIL Back On Track and other active/public transport groups calling for:

• Prioritisation of active and public transport investment instead of widening roads and building more freeways.
• Redesigning the SEQ bus network based on a core set of BRT routes running in their own lanes along major roads.
• Increase rail frequencies as far as the Queensland Rail fleet and network permits including hiring the necessary drivers and guards. Increases in train frequency is one of the key things that will activate the public transport network.

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

^ thanks for the reminder Jonno. I might send this out again later today. Presently at PA Hospital.

Sent to all outlets:

Brisbane 2032 Transport Challenges No Surprise

23rd September 2024

RAIL Back On Track calls for the complete overhaul of the SEQ bus network and improved rail frequencies now, rather than focusing on the weeks around the Brisbane 2032 Games.

Sourcing up to a 1000 new bus drivers and extra buses for a month of the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games is not a lasting legacy and likely to end up in international embarrassment (1).

Whilst the opportunity to build new large scale high-frequency high capacity public transport infrastructure has past, there is much that the State Government, Brisbane City Council and SEQ Council of Mayors can do, starting now. Service improvements utilising our present transport assets is cost effective.

RAIL Back On Track has campaigned for over 10 years for a SEQ Bus Network overhaul, including bus lanes and traffic signal prioritisation to make the system far more efficient and more effective by addressing:

* route duplication
* poor legibility of routes and stops for infrequent users
* low patronage on indirect/infrequent routes
* CBD centric peak hour service
* service gaps across the region
* lack of integration with the SEQ Rail Network
* limited bike facilities at stops and separated bike lanes providing safe paths to the stops

RAIL Back On Track has also campaigned for an increase in rail frequency similar to those of Sydney and Perth to make sure the extensive SEQ rail network is doing the heavy lifting it can do (2).

Finally, investing heavily in safe bike infrastructure on all our roads and stations, as evidenced in Paris, can significantly increase the number of people cycling and not adding to the congestion on our roads.  Over 75% of SEQ trips are less than 5km making cycling a healthy and cost-effective alternative.   

By making SEQ's active and public transport as efficient and effective as possible now means the increased use around the Brisbane 2032 Games is a much smaller ramp up and not the dramatic and disruptive changes currently being planned.

RAIL Back On Track says action on the bus network redesign, improved rail frequencies and more bike infrastructure must start immediately if the State Government and SEQ Council of Mayors want to avoid an international embarrassment and leave a true Olympic legacy for SEQ.

We have completely missed the bus for ' true fast rail '.

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

References:

1. Brisbanetimes: Buses and 1000 drivers needed to avoid Olympic transport roadblock
https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/national/queensland/buses-and-1000-drivers-needed-to-avoid-olympic-transport-roadblock-20240917-p5kb8t.html

2. SEQ: Train Upgrade Zones: Adopt Transperth Service Frequencies Across Greater Brisbane
https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=14672.0

Facebook ...

https://x.com/railbotforum/status/1704974643822842249

https://x.com/railbotforum/status/1838056493427642673

Brisbanetimes --> An American country music star exposes Brisbane's stadium gap $

QuoteThe latest round in the Brisbane Olympic stadium stoush shows just how far we've strayed from the original vision for the Games' legacy on the city.

Last week, Brisbane 2032 president Andrew Liveris urged cricket and AFL – two sports, it's fair to say, that are somewhat lacking in Olympic tradition – to "stand up" and argue for a venue worthy of the region's growing population.

With the Gabba nearing the end of its life, there's no doubting the need for a new or refurbished oval stadium in Brisbane. However, the architects of the Brisbane Olympic bid had something else in mind – and an American country music star has just demonstrated how on the money they were.

Suncorp Stadium, it was announced with great fanfare last week, will host two Luke Combs concerts on January 24 and 25 next year. As it happened, the Brisbane Roar was meant to play Adelaide United on the 25th.

Not surprisingly, the government-owned stadium did the maths and quickly realised a huge-drawing concert would bring in a lot more money than an A-League fixture, which would leave Suncorp mostly empty, even if the crowd did crack five figures.

So the Roar will now play Adelaide on April 22 on a Tuesday night – hardly conducive to attracting a decent crowd. If only there was a suitable alternative venue in Brisbane, Roar fans would still have their pre-public holiday night out.

Had the original plan for the 2032 Olympics been followed, any such (far-)future issues would have been avoided. ...

Considering the Roar's  average crowd size, they could've easily played at Redcliffe.

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1840404707984167147

To the wider public who say we can't build a stadium  over a railway line or freeway.

I present Exhibit A

https://x.com/rainmaker1973/status/1813247441623187580?s=46&t=EDszjTErsxTIqAna7yuP-w

Not saying we need to build this but just showing the engineering possible.

Couriermail --> Brisbane 2032: Peter Dutton leaves door open for more Games funding if LNP win state and federal elections $

QuoteFederal Opposition Leader Peter Dutton has sledged the disastrous progress of the 2032 Brisbane Olympic and Paralympic Games as he left the door open to dishing out extra funding for the mega event if he comes to power.

Mr Dutton weighed into the Olympic debate as he joined Queensland LNP Leader David Crisafulli on the campaign trail on Friday, saying he would be "very happy to have a conversation" about the additional funding if they are both elected at upcoming polls.

Mr Crisafulli has repeatedly promised to stay within the current $7.1bn joint fund if elected Premier, effectively ruling out a new stadium build.

He has also ruled out adding more state money to the funding pool, with the LNP to conduct another Olympic infrastructure review before likely scrapping the current plan to upgrade the QSAC stadium. ...

Couriermail --> Queensland election 2024: David Crisafulli says no new Olympics stadium, rules out QSAC $

QuoteDavid Crisafulli has declared the 2023 Olympic stadium won't be QSAC, while insisting a new stadium was not on the cards.

The LNP has announced a $250m Olympic infrastructure fund dedicated to grassroots sport club upgrades across the state, as Opposition Leader David Crisafulli declares the 2032 stadium "won't be QSAC".

Asked repeatedly whether he would be open to accepting private investment to build a new stadium, Mr Crisafulli insisted a new stadium was not on the cards.

"Our focus is on generational infrastructure," he said.

"Now, we are going to give people world class venues.

"It won't be QSAC, but we've spoken about no new stadiums." ...

So does that leave their only option as the Gabba and just trying to override the protests?

Surely "no new stadiums" means no Vic park and no Northshore private option. Is there another possibility I'm missing?

QuoteSurely "no new stadiums" means no Vic park and no Northshore private option. Is there another possibility I'm missing?

Yes, either they break their promise or they choose a very radical option like hold the opening ceremony/athletics on the Gold Coast (Carrara) or something like that.

Couriermail --> Qld election 2024: David Crisafulli dodges stadium question $

QuoteThe Gabba is firming as the LNP's stadium of choice for the Brisbane 2032 Olympics, but Opposition Leader David Crisafulli has continued to withhold his Olympic plans from Queenslanders.

The LNP leader was asked by journalists nine times whether he would accept private funding for the Brisbane Olympic and Paralympic Games stadium, and a total 15 questions about stadium options – all of which he refused to give a straight answer to.

While he repeatedly stated an LNP government would not build a new stadium, he conceded that knocking down and rebuilding the Gabba was still on the table. ...

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1842947118769836045

Couriermail --> Editorial: David Crisafulli owes Qld a clear policy on Olympic stadium $

QuoteIt is the height of arrogance for the man that every poll suggests will be premier in three weeks from today to refuse to tell Queenslanders what his plan is for the track and field venue at the Brisbane 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games.

On Sunday David Crisafulli stuck firm to his commitment of a 100-day venues review if he does win, but then ruled out two options – pushing ahead with the current premier's stinker of an idea for a temporary facility at the old QEII Stadium or building a new stadium – seriously limiting the terms of reference, and so the value, of yet another review.

Based on his evasive answers on Sunday, the only options left to Mr Crisafulli are a refurbishment of the outdated 38,000-seat Gabba or hosting the 2032 athletics at the 27,500-capacity Gold Coast home of the Commonwealth Games in 2018. Both would be embarrassing. ...

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1842949081980973210

Brisbanetimes --> Gabba rebuild on table under LNP's 100-day Olympic venue review $

QuoteA significant upgrade or rebuild of the Gabba to host the 2032 Olympic ceremonies and athletics would be on the cards under the LNP's proposed 100-day review of venue plans should it win government this month.

LNP leader David Crisafulli confirmed his promised review would "of course" consider the idea, but it would not investigate a new stadium and was unlikely to back the current QSAC plan.

Premier Steven Miles seized on the comments while campaigning on Bribie Island on Sunday, suggesting the LNP was committed to rebuilding the Gabba but afraid of the community backlash. ...

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1842950773476610305

Quote from: BrisbaneTimesOn Sunday David Crisafulli stuck firm to his commitment of a 100-day venues review if he does win, but then ruled out two options – pushing ahead with the current premier's stinker of an idea for a temporary facility at the old QEII Stadium or building a new stadium – seriously limiting the terms of reference, and so the value, of yet another review.

We saw this sort of football behaviour with the Queensland Government when it came to Cross River Rail. It went through three incarnations before it finally was decided on and built.

The project has not even started and there is already one review (!), with the main finding ignored anyway, and now there will be a second review (a review of the review?) but then by already ruling out options, hobbling the scope and outcomes possible in the second round review.

Why not just ask AI what the next venue should be and perhaps decide it that way??

^ even by the mediocre Queensland standards, the bumbling bungle on going is extraordinary 

https://x.com/amymacsouthbris/status/1842894973978767418

 

The Greens at it again. They didn't stop it, Labor walked away over lies and cost blowouts mostly. Greens we're just the buzzing bee nearby.

ABC News --> Queensland Opposition Leader David Crisafulli leaves the door open to rebuild Gabba for 2032 Olympics

QuoteA rebuild of the Gabba for the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games could be back on the table if the Queensland LNP wins the looming state election.

Opposition Leader David Crisafulli left the door open to a revamp of the cricket and AFL venue over the weekend, but once again ruled out building a new stadium.

The Labor government had initially planned to rebuild the Gabba and use it as the main arena for the Brisbane Games at a cost of $2.7 billion.

But the proposal was axed this year by Premier Steven Miles, who instead opted to refurbish the Queensland Sports and Athletics Centre (QSAC) at Nathan.

Mr Crisafulli had previously pledged that an independent infrastructure co-ordination authority would conduct a review of the Games if the LNP wins the October 26 poll. ...

I hope "moving Gabba to somewhere else" doesn't count as a "new stadium" 

This is a genuine question from someone (me) who doesn't know much about this stuff.

Would converting the pavillion at the RNA Showgrounds into an actual stadium be something that is remotely possible?

Quote from: kram0 on October 07, 2024, 06:44:31 AMThe Greens at it again. They didn't stop it, Labor walked away over lies and cost blowouts mostly. Greens we're just the buzzing bee nearby.

That's not accurate. The government was under huge pressure from the protests and community action. By the time they cancelled the Gabba rebuild they would've taken any excuse.

Quote from: ilovebrisvegas on October 07, 2024, 12:55:31 PMThis is a genuine question from someone (me) who doesn't know much about this stuff.

Would converting the pavillion at the RNA Showgrounds into an actual stadium be something that is remotely possible?

I'm pretty sure there's not enough space without removing the Showgrounds.

Gold Coast Bulletin --> 2024 Queensland state election: Meaghan Scanlon slams LNP leader David Crisafulli over Olympic stadium $

QuoteHousing Minister Meaghan Scanlon has accused Opposition leader David Crisafulli of trying to "slip into government" without making any commitments on the 2032 Olympics.

Mr Crisafulli on the weekend was asked nine times by journalists if he would accept private funding for the Games and total of 15 questions about stadium options – and he refused to give straight answers to any.

"Our focus is not on stadiums, our focus is on generational infrastructure," he said on Sunday.

"We are going to give people world class venues, it won't be QSAC, but we've spoken about no new stadiums." ...

The State Government's mismanagement of the Olympic Games preparation under both Labor Premiers is most certainly a very telling thing against the Miles' Government chances of re-election IMHO. 

I don't think the LNP will do much better to be honest.

Apart from the fast rail con, the venue bumbling and indecision means it is curtains.

Will Miles change tack, or will he face the sack along with QSAC?

Brisbanetimes --> Miles says Gabba rebuild would be a 'shame for Queensland' $

QuotePremier Steven Miles says it would be a "shame for Queensland" if the Gabba was rebuilt to host the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games.

With LNP leader David Crisafulli leaving open the option of a multibillion-dollar rebuild, Miles on Monday gave his thoughts on such a prospect.

"I think that would be a shame for Queensland," said Miles, who abandoned the Labor government's push for a rebuild after concluding Queenslanders felt it was too expensive. ...

Gold Coast Bulletin --> Brisbane Olympics stadium debate takes fresh twist $

QuoteThe LNP's spokesman for Sport and Olympics and Paralympics has refused to rule out building a new stadium for Brisbane 2032 – despite his leader doing so three days ago.

Tim Mander was with David Crisafulli on Sunday when the latter suggested a new stadium was not on the cards.

"We are going to give people world-class venues. It won't be QSAC, but we've spoken about no new stadiums," Mr Crisafulli said.

But on the Gold Coast on Wednesday morning, when Mr Mander announced a $900,000 commitment to the Coomera Colts soccer club for a redevelopment project, Mr Mander repeatedly refused to rule out building a new stadium for the Olympic and Paralympic Games. ...

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1844025614371799478

ABC News --> The Brisbane Olympics is on the minds of voters this election — but concerns won't end when polls close