Station staff - cutbacks?

[ozbob]

From the Queensland Times click here!

Unmanned stations target for crime

Unmanned stations target for crime

Kieran Banks | 10th November 2011

THE removal of Queensland Rail staff from two Ipswich line stations will put passengers at risk of criminal activity, according to the Rail, Bus and Tram Union.

President Bruce Mackie criticised the move to remove staff from Gailes and crime "hot spot" Ebbw Vale stations.

The removed staff will be absorbed into QR, but Mr Mackie said it was the commuters who would be left short-changed by a lack of customer service.

Mr Mackie said staff keep stations clean and safe, open the toilets for public use, sell tickets and help disabled passengers.

During a trial period without onsite staff there was an average of 228 weekly users on the test train, with more than 5000 in total during the whole trial run.

"I suppose the big issue is that QR needs to learn from the lessons of NSW and Victoria who are putting staff back in because unstaffed stations become crime hubs," he said.

The criticism of staffing levels follows Mr Mackie's claims recently that Translink sets infringement notice quotas for Transit Officer to meet.

The union and QR have been locked in wage negotiations for several months, but Mr Mackie said quota claims were unrelated to the industrial dispute.

He said transit officers made every effort to catch fare evaders but passenger safety must come first.

"Our Transit Officer members have been told that they must intercept and fine a certain number of fare evaders each month," he said.

"If they don't then the officer will be 'performance managed' to ensure they reach the target in future."

A QR spokesman denied they set infringement quotas, but instead set clear and measurable performance expectations relating to fines and warnings handed out by all Transit Officers.

The spokesman also denied transit officers were on a fine blitz.

Train fines range from $200 for fare evasion and smoking in carriages, to $400 for serious safety breaches.

[ozbob]

Removing staff from stations is a recipe for disaster, increasing costs and security issues. It also means further restrictions to toilets.

Staffing should be increased, not reduced.  The experience in Melbourne where staff removal just resulted in an out of control security/safety situation which has now necessitated Metro to put staff back on stations, and additionally armed guards are being rolled out on their network.  Do we really want this?

[ozbob]

Sent to all outlets:

10th November 2011

Station staff cutbacks

Greetings,

The Queensland Times has this morning highlighted possible station staff cutbacks.  http://www.qt.com.au/story/2011/11/10/unmanned-stations-target-for-crime-queensland-rail/

Apparently this is related to enterprise bargaining negotiations.

Why should the public transport community be the ones impacted?

Removing staff from stations is a recipe for disaster, increasing costs and security issues. It also means further restrictions to toilet access, which is not a trivial issue at all.

Staffing should be increased, not reduced.  The experience in Melbourne is when staff were removed, it just resulted in an out of control security/safety situation which has now necessitated Metro Melbourne to put staff back on stations, and additionally armed guards are being rolled out on their network to guard stations.  Do we really want this?

Why don't we learn from others' experiences?

Best wishes
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

[#Metro]

I think it is OK to remove staff. I know this might not be everyone's opinion but all the busway stations are unmanned.
The problem with stations is that they look old and jail like, the newer ones are much nicer and incorporate CPTD principles (crime prevention through design).

[ozbob]

612 ABC Brisbane Breakfast with Spencer Howson have followed this up morning.

--> http://blogs.abc.net.au/queensland/2011/11/suburban-railway-station-staff-cut-backs.html?site=brisbane&program=612_breakfast

Removing staff from railway stations has been a disaster in Melbourne and Sydney.   700 PSOs (Protective Service Officers, armed) are being recruited and trained right now to regain control of the security and safety on the Melbourne network.  One can patter on about design but like Melbourne and Sydney, we have stations up to 100 year old in design.   And why should the public transport community be the ones to wear the EB outcome?

Once you remove the staff you give ground to the 'enemy'.  As Melbourne is finding out it is very expensive to reclaim that back from the 'enemy'.    Rather than cutback there should be more staff and longer hours.

Busway stations are a different kettle of fish, bus frequency improves safety and relatively few in number and new mean the surveillance systems are better.

Lack of toilet access is also a major issue for many at unstaffed stations.

[O_128]

I think it is OK to remove staff. I know this might not be everyone's opinion but all the busway stations are unmanned.
The problem with stations is that they look old and jail like, the newer ones are much nicer and incorporate CPTD principles (crime prevention through design).

yes but certain groups of people seem to have a fetish of hanging out at train stations, The busway stations are fine as there is a bus coming every few minutes, where as the rail has a train every 15. The staff also help the guards out in peak hour.

[#Metro]

I think it has more to do with bad station design.
If I want a ticket I can use a ticket machine
If I want information I can ring translink

If its late at night you can put security guards on (actual guards, not just ticket sellers).

If security is the issue wouldn't it make more sense to get a security officer not a general staff?

Bring on higher frequency.

[ozbob]

@TT  Melbourne has put their staff back, and has had to further support with the PSOs.  Why go there in the first place?

Just heard on the ABC News Bulletin that there will be industrial action according to the RTBU on Tuesday and Friday for 4 hours each day.

Obviously there are bigger issues at play, as usual it will the travelling public jigged around.

[ozbob]

From the Couriermail click here!

Citytrain workers in stopwork next Tuesday

Citytrain workers in stopwork next Tuesday

    by: Robyn Ironside
    From: The Courier-Mail
    November 10, 2011 7:02AM

QUEENSLAND Rail workers who maintain the Citytrain fleet have announced a four-hour stopwork next Tuesday.

It is unclear at this stage if the stoppage by engineers and fitters will disrupt the running of trains in the period.

The workers are angry about what they say is QR's refusal to negotiate a new enterprise bargaining agreement.

Rail Tram and Bus Union president Bruce Mackie said the stoppage and another by train shunting staff on Friday, were designed to have minimal impact on the public.

He said they had come about as a result of QR's "blind adherence" to the government's wages policy limiting all pay rises to 2.5 per cent.

"The cost of living is considerably higher than 2.5 per cent and QR's bargaining team must recognise this," said Mr Mackie.

[ozbob]

Brisbanetimes --> Crime concerns at unmanned stations

[Gazza]

I can't comment on Ebbw Vale, but, not shedding any tears over Gailes. There are many busway/bus interchanges (And possibly even some ferry stops) that get many times more pax and deserve staff more.

[#Metro]

@TT  Melbourne has put their staff back, and has had to further support with the PSOs.  Why go there in the first place?

They had a trial at the station already. What was the data from that?

[ozbob]

No idea.  There are 16 stations that are apparently in line.  Includes Chelmer, Rocklea, Gailes, Ebbwvale, Manly.  Not sure of the others.  

These stations generally only have a morning staff presence, but it is important for those that use those stations.   Once they start there will be more no doubt, until it all breaks down and the due to the community outrage the Government then has to back track and implement real costly solutions as we have seen in Melbourne.

We have been given assurances a number of times that Queensland Rail does not intend to cut station staff, but apparenty now plans to remove staff from stations.   Guess they have to pay for their uniforms some how ...

[ozbob]

From the Couriermail click here!

QR considers unmanned Citytrain stations at 16 locations

QR considers unmanned Citytrain stations at 16 locations

    by: Robyn Ironside
    From: The Courier-Mail
    November 10, 2011 7:26AM

QUEENSLAND Rail is considering removing staff from 16 Citytrain stations to save money.

The proposal has been raised in enterprise bargaining negotiations with the Rail, Tram and Bus Union as a "trade-off" for pay rises in excess of 2.5 per cent a year.

Stations earmarked to become unstaffed under the plan, include Wynnum, Lota, Oxford Park, Holmview, North Boondall, Keperra, Virginia, Ebbw Vale, Gailes, Chelmer, Hemmant, Rocklea, Moorooka, Sunshine, Nudgee and Palmwoods on the Sunshine Coast.

Union president Bruce Mackie has been quick to condemn the proposal saying QR would "abandon local communities if it went ahead with the move".

He said station staff currently took on many roles, including cleaning and securing stations, opening toilets for public use, selling tickets, answering commuter questions, helping disabled passengers and assisting with go card issues.

"QR staff at these stations undertake tasks that are vital to ensure an efficient, comfortable and safe travelling environment for rail users," Mr Mackie said.

"The unstaffed Dakabin station had the highest rate of crime last year, and now QR wants to take staff away from Ebbw Vale station, which is already a rail crime hotspot."

Robert Dow from commuter advocacy group Back on Track said they would like to see more staff on stations.

"There's nothing better than a person present in our opinion," said Mr Dow.

"They act as good agents for the operators, they keep the station clean and tidy and they add to the feeling of security and well-being."

He said the argument that stations were monitored by CCTV would be of no comfort to commuters and tourists in need of assistance whether it be travel advice or the use of a toilet.

"When staff are there the toilets are generally open. It's hard to imagine that would be the case if the stations were not manned," said Mr Dow.

QR Chief Human Resources Officer Robin Franklin said the 16 stations under consideration were already operating on significantly reduced hours.

"Our customers are increasingly using go cards. Some of the stations identified, such as Rocklea, often do not sell a single ticket during their hours of operation," said Mr Franklin.

"This is a smart proposal, which reflects our customers needs and the way they are increasingly using our service, but at this stage it is just that - a proposal to be considered by the negotiating parties."

[somebody]

Manly is odd.  That's the 2nd busiest station on the line!

From the article, I'm guessing Lota actually.

[ozbob]

Manly was suggested to me by a media rep, looks like they meant Lota or Wynnum.

[Gazza]

Staff are needed at Chelmer, the locals might go out of control and throw caviar at innocent pax!

[#Metro]

The money has to come from somewhere...

If I have 10 staff and they ask for a pay rise I can keep revenue neutral by firing one and using their
pay to pay the other 9 staff a higher wage. See where this goes???

Now, I think there should be a trial. I'm not against this proposal.
Toilets can be cleaned by roving staff on the network.

What are the 'crime' statistics at these stations? If it were removal of staff at somewhere like central
then I'd be concerned, but if it is at a station which hardly has pax, seems ok

Public toilets  everywhere else are unmanned too...

[ozbob]

Once it starts, it just keeps going to meltdown as for Melbourne.   The next EB more staff go and so it continues until there is a grand announcement
'armed guards are being rolled out on the network'.   How long before DOO hits the streets?  Now that is where the real issue is ...

Chelmer is in line for an upgrade ...  fancy that!

Be interesting to see if the LNP comes forward with anything on this ...

Quite frankly, I think Queensland Rail is not doing much at all for average commuter in terms of the 'Customer experience' by continuing to remove staff.

Re toilets, the problem with the rail ones is they are closed when you need them.  Again first class 'Customer service'.  We have suggested some form of card entry system but I think the one attempt at such an endeavour was a failure (vague memory something, can't recall the specifics). Will they leave them open and have roving teams of cleaners as you suggest?   They might if pushed, but then I guess then there will other issues arising.

[ozbob]

This was predicted --> http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=257.0

[#Metro]

Re toilets, the problem with the rail ones is they are closed when you need them.  Again first class 'Customer service'.  We have suggested some form of card entry system but I think the one attempt at such an endeavour was a failure (vague memory something, can't recall the specifics). Will they leave them open and have roving teams of cleaners as you suggest?   They might if pushed, but then I guess then there will other issues arising.

There are already roving cleaners on the trains, I don't see why they can't hop off and start at one end of the line at the start of the day and then cycle.

As for Melbourne -- I think it's more to do with politics. Is there statistically significant evidence that the rate of crime increased over and above what it would be at stations without staff?

[ozbob]

Yes, clearly political as much as perceptual. http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=4126.msg30354#msg30354  That is why the PSOs are being rolled out.

It is a broader cultural thing too as once the perception that stations are no longer staffed they do become local hubs for other than the public transport users at the time.  Police can only visit so often and so forth.  

[Gazza]

'armed guards are being rolled out on the network'.   How long before DOO hits the streets?  Now that is where the real issue is ...

I was thinking that too this morning. Sometimes I wonder if financial constraints will force the introduction of DOO more than any other reason.

I'm not opposed to station staff by the way, but having them roving the platform in a vest is how they should do it.

[#Metro]

I would be happy to accept DOO if the guards were re-trained as drivers and we got a doubling of rail frequency to boot in the off-peak.

Rail Revolution should include modernising and reviewing work practices as well as infrastructure. Some things will be possible, others won't.

[#Metro]

Interesting link OzBob

I think there should be a review of station staff powers.
Give them the power to hand out fines etc.

[ozbob]

I would be happy to accept DOO if the guards were re-trained as drivers and we got a doubling of rail frequency to boot in the off-peak.

Rail Revolution should include modernising and reviewing work practices as well as infrastructure. Some things will be possible, others won't.

I think there is one essential thing that needs to occur before DOO could be contemplated.   ATP across the suburban/interurban network for the trains.

Platform modifications would also be needed, but not insurmountable issue.  The lack of ATP is a biggy I think.  There are some loose plans for ATP as I understand it, but it will cost a lot.

[Fares_Fair]

Lo and behold, my home station of Palmwoods is under threat.
The closures are projected to save just under $2m.

Regards,
Fares_Fair.

[somebody]

Interesting link OzBob

I think there should be a review of station staff powers.
Give them the power to hand out fines etc.

I'd support this.  Add a security licence also.

[#Metro]

If security is what you want, why get just a ticket seller. Doesn't make sense.

What is the ticket seller going to do if thugs turn up at station X? They're going to call security... not helpful!

[SurfRail]

DOO with manned stations sounds good.  Any safeworking, security or disability access issues could be handled on the platform more easily by CSOs rather than by train crew, so you save on manpower.  Stations in woop woop could just have the accessible boarding points moved to the end of the platform so the driver can render assistance, as the likelihood of that being a regular delay to the service (or of there being serious public disorder issues) at places like Eudlo or Gailes would be minuscule compared to stations like Indooroopilly.

[ozbob]

DOO with manned stations sounds good.

Yes, I think that is the optimal end point.  With the caveat that some stations will not need staff all hours, or some at all.

[Fares_Fair]

Quote

QR Chief Human Resources Officer Robin Franklin said the 16 stations under consideration were already operating on significantly reduced hours.

"Our customers are increasingly using go cards. Some of the stations identified, such as Rocklea, often do not sell a single ticket during their hours of operation," said Mr Franklin.

"This is a smart proposal, which reflects our customers needs and the way they are increasingly using our service, but at this stage it is just that - a proposal to be considered by the negotiating parties."

This is totally untrue, it DOES NOT in any way reflect customers needs.
In fact quite the opposite.

Regards,
Fares_Fair.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Crime really ramps up around train stations when no one is there. Plain and simple. There's a sh%t load of crime that goes along next to and at stations without it being reported. With the removal of the local police at Zillmere crime/vandalism started to rise at Zillmere Railway station. Gangs of kids started roaming Zillmere road (the road along/through the station) yelling and screaming before wondering off into the abandoned Toyota car yard/station car park to do drugs and get high (Back in 09 the passengers on the platform waiting for the 2.45-3am ANZAC day train were really concerned for their safety as they couldn't see what was happening but they could hear men yelling, glass bottles being thrown, sticks being hit on the ground, random taunts, girls screaming, abusive language etc - Ask a local what they think and they say that happens most night), kids/teens started having rock fights with the track ballast, people start hanging around the station stair cases during the day scoping out people walking past, a few times barricades were put up across the street using stuff from peoples front lawn/the charity drop off point and a few times piles of ballast started forming in the middle of the Northbound tracks. It wasn't until someone was bleeding, brused and taken to hospital all for being mugged for his gocard and phone on the stairs at 11pm that the station had private security every friday night, the police mounted squad started patroling the place and police made a more heavier appearance around the area that patronage started to rebound at nights. That's just Zillmere but the same has happened to plenty of other stations around the network. Lawnton had a heavier police and security presence after an attempted murder or something but then they slowly faded away (It can still be a probelm late at night). Bowen Hills started to get a high presence of security and police but then it slowly faded away. Caboolture... South Bank... Ipswich... Nundah... Nerang... Well, you get the point.

While station staff should have security powers I don't see it happening due to the fact that some stations have one staff member on at a time and that there are some people out there that take advantage of that and treat them like sh%t or as to go so far as to spit on them (Watch the transit officers approach people being disruptive to see what I mean )

[#Metro]

While station staff should have security powers I don't see it happening due to the fact that some stations have one staff member on at a time and that there are some people out there that take advantage of that and treat them like sh%t or as to go so far as to spit on them (Watch the transit officers approach people being disruptive to see what I mean )

my point exactly.

Let's say these high drunk whatever people come on to the platform. What is the ticket seller supposed to do?
Press a button and call security.

This is my point: If you want safety and security it doesn't make sense to put a ticket seller in that position.
Just like I would not call a cleaner to my house if I needed an ambulance.

[mufreight]

Quote

QR Chief Human Resources Officer Robin Franklin said the 16 stations under consideration were already operating on significantly reduced hours.

"Our customers are increasingly using go cards. Some of the stations identified, such as Rocklea, often do not sell a single ticket during their hours of operation," said Mr Franklin.

"This is a smart proposal, which reflects our customers needs and the way they are increasingly using our service, but at this stage it is just that - a proposal to be considered by the negotiating parties."

This is totally untrue, it DOES NOT in any way reflect customers needs.
In fact quite the opposite.

Regards,
Fares_Fair.

Ok lets take this one point at a time.
Destaffing the stations, this might be a great idea for the Translink beancounters in reducing staff numbers but the outcomes are not encouraging for the general public who use rail services nor are they in reality a saving anyway.
Experience has shown that where staff are removed from stations the levels and costs of vandalisim rises sharply and patronage drops,
public transport is, as I am informed by the QR and Translink staff, their business so the standards of public safety being reduced (station staff have a positive deterrent effect on social misconduct) and the presentation / cleanliness of stations also diminishes as does the convenience factor (toilets locked) all of which further deter public transport usage.
Next the selling of tickets is fairly way down the list of importance in duties of station staff, as a commuter the provision of information and assistance to disabled commuters and keeping the station clean and as attractive to the travelling public as possibe and the deterrent effect to anti-social behaviour by their mere presence rate above ticket sales, for the users of Go cards while it might reduce the need for staff does not remove that need especially considering the failure rate of the equipment and indeed the cards themselves.
The comment asserting that this is " a smart proposal" is simply spin and illconsidered at best, to continue with the statement " which reflects our customers needs[/b][/i]" is simply a blatant fabrication, it does nothing towards addressing customers needs whatsoever and in fact is contrary to passenger needs.

[p858snake]

Quote

QR Chief Human Resources Officer Robin Franklin said the 16 stations under consideration were already operating on significantly reduced hours.

"Our customers are increasingly using go cards. Some of the stations identified, such as Rocklea, often do not sell a single ticket during their hours of operation," said Mr Franklin.

"This is a smart proposal, which reflects our customers needs and the way they are increasingly using our service, but at this stage it is just that - a proposal to be considered by the negotiating parties."

This is totally untrue, it DOES NOT in any way reflect customers needs.
In fact quite the opposite.

Regards,
Fares_Fair.

I wonder if that no over the counter transactions include goCard related activities? Because I know i've had to go to the counter a few times because you can't top up with coins.

[Arnz]

If I recall, there was a tender for ATP to be installed in the 10x IMU100 trains.  I wonder if they've got somebody to do it.

https://secure.publicworks.qld.gov.au/etender/tender/display/tender-details.do?id=4101&action=display-tender-details

[ozbob]

Once upon a time, the railway was focussed on passengers ... now it is a 'smart customer experience'  so smart in fact that no one pees any more ...  the pax have p%ssed off ...



Gailes.

Photograph R Dow 10th November 2011

[barnesy]

i think its wrong what they r thinking. u hop on the train read the little billboards and they say they take pride in customer service yea right....

[ozbob]

From the Couriermail Quest Maroochy Journal click here!

More crime, less facilities if staff taken from stations

More crime, less facilities if staff taken from stations

   by: Sherine Conyers, Maroochy Journal
   From: Quest Newspapers
   November 10, 2011 11:18AM

Commuter advocates warn taking staff from stations could see a greater risk to passenger safety and less toilets open.

The news came after the Courier-Mail reported Queensland Rail was considering removing staff from 16 Citytrain stations to save money.

The proposal was raised in enterprise bargaining negotiations with the Rail, Tram and Bus Union as a "trade-off" for pay rises in excess of 2.5 per cent a year.

One of the stations proposed to be unmanned is Palmwoods on the Sunshine Coast.

Palmwoods commuter Jeff Addison said the potential reduction of stuff was not only inconvenient it was also a security risk.

"It diminishes your safety and security.

"When the go card reader shows "seek assistance," who do you turn to?

"When you are a woman alone at the station and are concerned for your safety, who do you turn to?" he said.

Rail Back on Track spokesperson Robert Dow said the more stations that were unmanned, the less toilets available for passengers on the long commute home.

"When stations are closed they generally close toilets.

"If you've got stations that are closed and have closed toilets, there's no toilets on the rail bus, you're only option is to hope you get lucky with a toilet on a train.

"Other states don't do it, this is just cowboy stuff up here, it really does need a complete rethink on how they operate the long-haul services," he said.

Mr Dow said having stations with no staff in Melbourne had increased rail crime and resulted in the need to employ 700 prescribed service officers acting as armed guards on the network.

"What happened in Melbourne was a culture of lawlessness established around the rail network.

"In stations where they pulled staff out, the enemy gained ground .

"Do we want a culture in Queensland where we have armed guards at stations?" he said.

Mr Dow said for stations such as Landsborough, Glass House Mountains and Palmwoods there was an argument them open for longer.

"Staff do more than sell tickets. They offer information, they fix Go-Card problems, they offer information that's important for tourists visiting the Sunshine Coast," he said.