Station staff - cutbacks?

[HappyTrainGuy]

Arnz..... IIRC its been awarded.

[ozbob]

Lo and behold, my home station of Palmwoods is under threat.
The closures are projected to save just under $2m.

Regards,
Fares_Fair.

Will cost a lot more in long term grief. 

I think they might have to cut the bottled water ...  Oh no!   Reminds me, where are the water bubblers at Darra 1, 2 and 3?   It is a 'dry station'  fits in I guess with the no pee smart customer  ...

It is days like these I feel like re-igniting the campaign to rename Gailes back to  Dingo Hill.  Far more appropriate name ...   

[Fares_Fair]

I will do all I can to stop this madness.

Regards,
Fares_Fair.

[ozbob]

Cab ride a Vlocity : Bombardier DMU
V/Line.

[ozbob]

Radio 4 BC interviewed Jeff Addison after the 4pm news on this issue.

Channel 10 news ran a story on the issues during their 5pm bulletin.

[Fares_Fair]

Open letter to QR management.

Please do not remove staff from the 16 stations under threat of closure.

I am a regular commuter from Palmwoods and it is imperative that it stays open for the safety and security of QR customers, and to provide appropriate toilet facilities to long distance customers when these facilities cannot be guaranteed on ALL trains.

QR staff are the face of the company and make wonderful ambassadors for QR.

It is counter-productive to remove them from cleaning and tidying stations, reporting graffiti, maintaining toilets, providing tickets or advice if go card equipment breaks down or fails or giving advice to first time or elderly customers.

They ensure the safety and security of all personnel on the station, merely by their presence.
I can personally attest to this when confronted by drunks in front of my bike locker approx. 2 years ago.

I note that the QR CEO, Mr Paul Scurrah and other station staff received customer service awards, and deservedly so - but this action would make a mockery of the strive to improve customer services by removing the human face of this great company.


Thank you.

Regards,
Fares-fair.

[barnesy]

i spoke to a QR transit officer the other day she said to me few issues and conflicts between them and the Translink Transit officers. As for Zillmere amount of young people hanging around the station at night is unreal. where i am morayfield station is now running with a after dark worker locked in station with the security guards walking a dog up and down a platform pulling people into line

[HappyTrainGuy]

Speaking of Zillmere..... Just got off there to transfer to the 330 and was confronted by about 6 people with the oldest looking no older than 20 (Being really generous) with sacks of goon and what looked like someone had started to vomit at the top of the stairs where there was a really strong smell of metho/paint thinners. Hope the people onboard EMU01 are having a enjoyable trip to the City/Ipswich.

[#Metro]

You never get this behaviour at busway stops- even the more quiet ones in the late evening (think Stones Corner, Langlands, PA, Dutton Pk).

[HappyTrainGuy]

That's because people have to pay to get on buses. On trains fare evasion is so easy its the perferred mode of PT for the dregs out there as there's no driver to check them for tickets or tell them they can't get on without walking a fair distance. If they get caught by a transit officer onboard they just act tough in their little group when the most they can do is stop the train at a station until they get off and/or request for police assistance. Unless the railway squad is on the train. They chuck them off pretty quickly or they take out their book too and inconjuction with the TOs/SNOs just write them fine after fine as I've seen in the past

[Gazza]

Also because busways tend to only run in low crime suburbs.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Haha. Might be why the northern busway is being routed around Zillmere via Carseldine in that case

[O_128]

You never get this behaviour at busway stops- even the more quiet ones in the late evening (think Stones Corner, Langlands, PA, Dutton Pk).

As Ive said, people seem to have a fetish with hanging out at rail stations. Nerang station is in the middle of nowhere yet the islanders trek out there to hang. My local when I'm on the GC is helensvale and there are always young kids hanging out on the walking.

"I sure know what I'd like to do with my spare time......Hang out at helensvale rail"

Seriously its ridiculous and not a good look.

[Golliwog]

Don't worry, the FGSHS derro kids used to do it too. Not so much anymore due to it being a construction site. They'd hang around wagging and having a smoke.

[Fares_Fair]

It appears we all agree that to remove staff from stations may result in a crime corridor.

Regards,
Fares_Fair

[Golliwog]

It appears we all agree that to remove staff from stations may result in a crime corridor.

Regards,
Fares_Fair

I'd be interested in seeing though, is it actually the staff, or is it just the design of the station? All the busways have been built using CPTED principles (Crime Prevention Through Environmental Design) so that everything is quite visible and theres no places to hide away in a dark corner. But I do think a lot of it does come down to the social issues in the area. For example, with FG the derro kids did tend to hang around there (mostly at the bus interchange) But I never felt any real risk of being mugged or anything. I also don't think they ever hung there that late in the evening though, which could be different at the other stations.

[Mr X]

Busways are also better utilised 

[p858snake]

Don't worry, the FGSHS derro kids used to do it too. Not so much anymore due to it being a construction site. They'd hang around wagging and having a smoke.

Actually FGSHS kids generally aren't that bad [or at least when I was back in school] (at least when I had to leave school for appointments and such) at worst most of what the station dropouts did was smoke, where as the other dumb derros (who quite rightly needed a kick up the backside by the police) used to hangout at the creek, bike jumps to the side of the station (behind the petrol station) or at bilo/woolies (if they didn't know anyone that lived closeby).

[SurfRail]

You never get this behaviour at busway stops- even the more quiet ones in the late evening (think Stones Corner, Langlands, PA, Dutton Pk).

As Ive said, people seem to have a fetish with hanging out at rail stations. Nerang station is in the middle of nowhere yet the islanders trek out there to hang. My local when I'm on the GC is helensvale and there are always young kids hanging out on the walking.

"I sure know what I'd like to do with my spare time......Hang out at helensvale rail"

Seriously its ridiculous and not a good look.

For my money I consider Helensvale to be the least safe station on the Gold Coast.  Historically it has had huge problems with cars being vandalised, and the seemingly very limited staff presence does not help.  I couldn't say whether it has gotten better or worse since the Westfield opened.

Other stations (including Ormeau which is virtually unmanned) have generally been fine when I have been around late - I have particular experience with Nerang late at night nearly every week-night, and it has never been that bad.  The increasing residential density creeping up (albeit around the sea of parking) is probably helping too.

No station on the Gold Coast is comparable to Woodridge or the like though.

[Gazza]

I used to go through Helensvale heaps, frequently at night. Kids hung around (And I think that was more a product of kids going to the Westfield and the theme parks, and the bus connections to the rest of the GC, rather than as a gathering place)
Didn't really worry too much for my safety to be honest.

[Golliwog]

Don't worry, the FGSHS derro kids used to do it too. Not so much anymore due to it being a construction site. They'd hang around wagging and having a smoke.

Actually FGSHS kids generally aren't that bad [or at least when I was back in school] (at least when I had to leave school for appointments and such) at worst most of what the station dropouts did was smoke, where as the other dumb derros (who quite rightly needed a kick up the backside by the police) used to hangout at the creek, bike jumps to the side of the station (behind the petrol station) or at bilo/woolies (if they didn't know anyone that lived closeby).

Hah, how could I forget about all those? It's been too long since I was there.

[ozbob]

From the Brisbanetimes click here!

Stations have CCTV, so no need for staff: minister

Stations have CCTV, so no need for staff: minister
Daniel Hurst
November 16, 2011 - 3:00AM

Queensland's transport minister has defended a proposal to remove rail staff from 16 train stations across the southeast, saying security cameras are in place to ensure people remain safe.

Opposition spokesman Scott Emerson yesterday attacked the plan in State Parliament, saying commuters would feel less safe if Queensland Rail staff were removed from the nominated stations.

But Transport Minister Annastacia Palaszczuk said the 16 stations where staff removal was being considered as part of enterprise bargaining negotiations had low patronage and were currently only attended in the morning.

"They are not staffed all day; they are not staffed in the evening," she said.

"But every station on our network has security cameras that protect the security of the patrons.

"This is our fundamental commitment. There are also police transit officers and mobile dog patrols."

Last week, Rail, Tram and Bus Union president Bruce Mackie said Queensland Rail was planning to remove staff from Wynnum, Lota, Hemmant, Ebbw Vale, Chelmer, Gailes, Oxford Park, Keperra, Holmview, Rocklea, Moorooka, Nudgee, North Boondall, Virginia, Sunshine and Palmwoods stations.

Ms Palaszczuk said yesterday no decision had yet been made on the removal of staff from the stations, but doing so would allow employees to be redeployed to busier stations.

"The simple fact is that, as commuters embrace Go Cards, the need for certain stations to remain staffed around the clock becomes less and less," she said.

However, Robert Dow, from commuter lobby group Rail Back on Track, said having staff on hand at stations meant the toilets could be open and acted as a deterrent against anti-social activities.

Mr Dow said 6000 cameras across the rail network could not all be monitored in real-time, so the CCTV system generally provided opportunity to look back at crime that had already happened.

"I suspect it [the security camera system] does act as an some sort of deterrent but they're not viewed in real-time unless someone activates a help button or alerts the railway or police that there's an incident at the station," he said.

"It's not a good move to pull staff away.

"It actually costs more in the long term and we don't think it's an efficiency at all. It's much better to encourage public transport use by having staff available at stations."

Mr Emerson said last night safety was a key factor that influenced people's public transport choices and the removal of staff would not help encourage a sense of safety on the rail network.

In a statement issued last week, Queensland Rail chief human resources officer Robin Franklin said enterprise bargaining negotiations had only recently begun and the proposal was among a range of options to boost productivity.

"Our customers are increasingly using Go Cards - some of the stations identified, such as Rocklea, often do not sell a single [paper] ticket during their hours of operation," he said.

Mr Franklin said the proposal was not a done deal as it could not proceed without the endorsement of employees as part of the enterprise agreement process.

Under the state government's wages policy, public sector employee pay rises are limited to 2.5 per cent a year unless accompanied by productivity improvements.

Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/stations-have-cctv-so-no-need-for-staff-minister-20111115-1nh4n.html

[ozbob]

... Mr Franklin said the proposal was not a done deal as it could not proceed without the endorsement of employees as part of the enterprise agreement process ...

Note well, not a done deal ...

[Stillwater]

Well, the deal would seem to be this: Betray your fellow workers and allow us to reduce the flexibility for work opportunities across the network and we will give you an extra $1000 a year in your pay packet.  I think it was the Roman army that occasionally killed one in 100 soldiers in order to reinforce discipline.  And didn't pirates kill each other to claim their dead mate's share of the treasure? This from a Labor government that claims to be for the worker.

[ozbob]

Feedback received, thanks.

Disappointed at Queensland Rail Ceo.

What has happened to his customer service push.

Has this disappeared as a result of his government masters.

When does a security camera and a hole in the wall machine replace face to face contact.

Dakabin is a growing station and if the took time to send someone out there, they would see that there are hundreds of people use the station every day.

Even if they watched video monitor for more than the 2.6 seconds every 8 hours they may see is also.

Poor performance. 

[ozbob]

From the Couriermail Quest click here!

Crime is off the rails at Dakabin station

Crime is off the rails at Dakabin station

    by: Bernie Dowling, Pine Rivers Press
    From: Quest Newspapers
    November 16, 2011 12:00AM

PUBLIC transport lobbyist Robert Dow of Rail Back on Track believes security guards need to be rostered overnight at Dakabin Railway Station for up to three months.

Mr Dow was responding to Rail Tram and Bus Union president Bruce Mackie revealing the unstaffed Dakabin station had the highest rate of railway station crime last year.

"Dakabin is in a high growth area and I absolutely believe QR should staff the station,'' Mr Mackie told the Pine Rivers Press.

Police statistics show 45 offences at Dakabin station for 2009 compared with 16 at Lawnton station.

Deagon station on the Sandgate line had just six crimes.

In 2010, the figures for Dakabin were 39, Lawnton 25 and Deagon three.

Mr Dow believes the unstaffed Dakabin is crime-prone: "There is a connection between lack of staff and crime.''

He said the Melbourne railway network was now paying the price of years of staff decline with recent re-staffing and the hiring of 700 protective security officers.

"In effect that is 700 armed guards and we do not want to go down that road,'' Mr Dow said.

While not calling for immediate re-staffing, he said he wanted to see security officers working overnight for up to three months and then on a random basis.

"The presence of security can change the whole culture of the station,'' Mr Dow said.

Reported offences at Dakabin station in 2009 included four stolen cars, 10 vehicle break-ins, 12 thefts, 14 property damage and one assault.

QR general manager of security Drew Brock said increased security including mobile dog patrols had cut offences at the station, with crime "down substantially''.

[ozbob]

Feedback received, thanks.

referring to the article in the paper regarding Dakabin station having the highest crime rate. What this station desperately needs is a car park. On any given day passengers are risking their lives by having to park some several hundred metres away on the sides of busy roads. There is no lighting on the roads and passengers must walk hundred of metres to the cars in pitch black darkness. This is extremely dangerous. I have raised this with QR before and had no response? It seems they are not concerned with safety after all.

[SteelPan]

It's funny to see a place like New York City, most of the "second tier" stations are so basic, sure the busier "first tier" ones are often manned - perhaps 24/7, but say about 50% of the network is not manned - just basic stations, with for sure, security patrols, lighting, help points, ticketing machines etc - BUT, the amazing thing is - they actually run trains regulary - apparently, catching a train is all about a train turning up and the passengers getting onto and off the train - NOT it turns out, sitting around a dingy station, at perhaps all hours, waiting....and waiting...and waiting...for a 1960's timetabled service to finally arrive!   

[Mr X]

Bear in mind, cities like New York have higher densities than Brisbane and thus would have higher demands on the PT system than we would have, so they can justify real high frequencies.

[SteelPan]

Bear in mind, cities like New York have higher densities than Brisbane and thus would have higher demands on the PT system than we would have, so they can justify real high frequencies.

Yeah, but my post isn't really a question about density and certainly there is a substantial push to increase train frequency on most SE Qld urban lines.  Remember, I'm saying in many cases to have "functional stations" - that's a cost saving plus for the network, to help off set enhanced frequency cost.

Higher frequency would also have a multiplier effect - more rail users, safer stations!

[#Metro]

Bear in mind, cities like New York have higher densities than Brisbane and thus would have higher demands on the PT system than we would have, so they can justify real high frequencies.

Perth doesn't have high densities, in fact most of Perth has been car dependent and still is. Their frequencies are double that of ours, and that is for ALL lines and ALL stations, including the ancient ones that are more like Brisbane.

And the Frankston line in Melbourne -- services every 10 minutes ALL DAY.
Even our own Busway manages to carry 150 000 passenger trips per day, almost as much as the ENTIRE QR NETWORK COMBINED, services every few minutes or so.

With trains, high frequency will draw in more passengers. 15 minute service means most people will spend 10 minutes before the next service is along. Unlike a busway system, there needs to be a connection between the front door of a house and the station, and this is where feeder buses come into effect.

What does the presenter say about Perth?:

   We have about 1.3 million people, but they are widely spread
   to the point to where our city's population density is close
   to the lowest in the world.

   Only three other cities worldwide have a higher vehicle ownership
   per person, and our love affair with the motor vehicle continues
   with more than 90% of all private trips made by car.

Think bus. Fill TRAIN!!!

[HappyTrainGuy]

New York is also a very different network compared to ours in terms of passenger numbers, types of services that use it and the amount of resources available to them in regards to rollingstock, drivers, maintainence and their equalivant of our railway squad/TOs/SNOs. While a higher frequency gives the impression that it reduces crime by alot it doesn't. The Shorncliffe trains here still manage to get tagged at night even though their on the platform for about 10 mins while they turn them around. Sure you can have a train every 3 minutes but your still going to be standing at that bus stop forever how long the wait for your bus home is, the dregs that hang around the station, the dregs that get on the train or walking 15 minutes home along a dark street. And plus even with their higher frequency there's still a large amount of crime on the NY network which makes our network seem like world peace has been acheived and we only do it with a handful of people.

[somebody]

What about crime per trip?  NY isn't exactly known as low crime zone.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Can't say what the NY stats are but reported assults/associated acts here involving the 50ish railway squad officers at the time or on QR property (Doesn't include vandalism, small offences etc).

During the 2008/2009 financial year a total of 373 offences against the person were committed on the QR Citytrain Network. Approximately 10% of these offences were assaults committed against police officers during the execution of an arrest. The number of offences (373) represents less than 0.006% of the 65 million passenger journeys. The QPS Annual Statistical Review for the 2008/09 financial year indicates that 705 offences against the person were reported per 100,000 people. In stark contrast, 373 offences against the person from 65 million passenger journeys represent only 5.7 offences per 100,000 people.

[colinw]

I don't think the NYC subways are a good comparison.  Might be more meaningful to compare with the crime for the LIRR, or the SEPTA electric lines out of Philadelphia.  The SEPTA lines in particular are the closest American equivalent to an Australian type electric suburban railway.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SEPTA_Regional_Rail

[SteelPan]

I'm certainly not suggesting a "comparison" of the the NYC and Brisbane metro systems - obviously, two very different cities - but there's not alot that's "different" to consider, when it comes to basic/functional/unmanned/safe stations and putting dollars saved toward a more frequent train service - it would seem rather obvious in fact.  Nor am I suggesting, for the record, every station should be unmanned - clearly some will always need to be.  Interesting side-item below.

"...Despite having a population of more than 8 million people, New York City consistantly ranks in the top ten safest large cities(cities with more than 500,000 people) in the United States. Violent crimes in New York City have dropped by over two thirds in the last decade and the FBI reports that murder rates in 2000 were the lowest since 1967...."
Source: http://gonyc.about.com/od/planyourtriptonyc/a/is_nyc_safe.htm

With post 9/11 security, the above figures are highly likely to have gone down even further!

[ozbob]

From the Couriermail Quest click here!

Report reveals crime across rail network on the increase

Report reveals crime across rail network on the increase

    by: Staff Writer
    From: Quest Newspapers
    November 23, 2011 12:00AM

Reports of property damage including graffiti at stations on southeast Queensland's rail network have jumped by two thirds in the space of a year.

Offences such as indecent and disorderly behaviour are also up, from 1122 to 1379, latest figures released by Queensland Rail reveal.

The report, for the 2009-2010 financial year, covers 143 train stations on the network.

QR Security and Community Engagement general manager Drew Brock said police had boosted patrols.

"The latest figures show an increase in good order offences. Much of this increase can be put down to a greater police presence,'' he said.

Good order offences includes disorderly behaviour, indecent behaviour, armed with intent, insulting offensive language and possession of graffiti instruments.

While the number of assaults and sexual offences showed no significant increase, recorded property damage soared from 554 cases to 974.

[ozbob]

From the South West News 23 November 2011 page 5

Job cuts loom as crime rises

[Set in train]

Great work here:

http://paper.questnews.com.au/QST_TSS/tss003.pdf

Unsure what sub-forum to place this.

[ozbob]

CEO Queensland Rail said this morning on 612 ABC Radio that there will be NO station staff cutbacks.

--> http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=7143.msg76748#msg76748  for the interview