RAIL - Back On Track Forum

Moorooka station designs released > Mellish FB https://www.facebook.com/reel/1329242315136740

CRR > https://crossriverrail.qld.gov.au/stations-routes/salisbury-to-fairfield-line/moorooka-station/

Concept design > https://cross-river-rail.s3.ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/02/05085304/02139_CRR_2024_Moorooka_Station_Fact_Sheet_A4_FINAL.pdf

Interestingly, the design features a fourth track to the east of the station that doesn't have a platform. Wonder what that's for?

Quote from: timh on February 06, 2024, 08:35:33 AMInterestingly, the design features a fourth track to the east of the station that doesn't have a platform. Wonder what that's for?

Presumably for southbound expresses to pass all-stoppers? I guess under some headways (5 minutes, maybe) this could plausibly show up as a passing point. Maybe it's a potential passing point in both directions? And they have space in the corridor there for 4 tracks, but they also don't actually need 4 platforms (heck, they don't really need 3 either).

^You have to wonder for the money if they were shutting down stations anyway if they had been better off just quadding, and only doing 2 platform stations.
Fairfield for instance should have just been a single island, and then use the space in the corridor to do a quad passing loop there at least.

How does the removal of the Balloon Loop affect the ability to turn around non-bidirectional trains (eg long distance "Landers" or heritage specials)?

There must be plans to mitigate against it being removed.  I wouldn't have thought it would have that much of an impact given the access to the Ferny Grove flyover is still there, along with the hole in the wall and the Normanby - Milton - Roma Street wye etc. 

Quote from: SurfRail on February 16, 2024, 16:00:16 PMThere must be plans to mitigate against it being removed.  I wouldn't have thought it would have that much of an impact given the access to the Ferny Grove flyover is still there, along with the hole in the wall and the Normanby - Milton - Roma Street wye etc. 

With the inner and out balloons now gone and the only northern access now only being the ferny flyovers as had a major change in operations and when coming in from the flyovers they now need to have space available if they need to get into the the sheds in the middle of the yard as they need to now enter then shunt down the new shunt neck then double back through to head that way where the balloons they had access to the stabling areas and the sheds in the middle of the yard add when they have the ekka lines closed then boom everything needing mayne yard proper is now 1 way in and out.

Not the best planning I must say. But hey cutting costs gets you this.  And with the loops you also had dual access to the yards via Roma street as you can only shunt so many trains at 8kph.

Queensland Parliament

https://documents.parliament.qld.gov.au/tableOffice/questionsAnswers/2024/2-2024.pdf

Question on Notice
No. 2
Asked on 13 February 2024

MR S MINNIKIN ASKED MINISTER FOR TRANSPORT AND MAIN ROADS AND MINISTER
FOR DIGITAL SERVICES (HON B MELLISH)

QUESTION:

Will the Minister advise the total cost to the taxpayer for the Cross River Rail project including
the full construction price and any payments forecast to be made to PPP proponents over the
maintenance period?

ANSWER:

I thank the Member for Chatsworth for the question.

The total cost of the Cross River Rail project can be found in the Queensland State Budget
2023-24 Capital Statement, Budget Paper No. 3, from page 8 as tabled in Parliament on 13
June 2023.

Any payments made over the next 25 years under the public-private partnership, including
servicing the capital and interest, maintenance and operations can be found in the Cross River
Rail Delivery Authority Annual Report 2022–23, Financial Statements from page 23, as tabled
by the former Minister for Transport and Main Roads and Minister for Digital Services on 29
September 2023

That it? That's all they got? We are doombed!!!

Government Statement: Incredible progress at Roma Street as Cross River Rail station emerges

26th March 2024

https://statements.qld.gov.au/statements/99980

. The new Roma Street underground station as part of Cross River Rail is becoming a reality.

. Significant progress so far provides best sense yet for how thousands of people will make their way from street to seat every day.

. More works in coming months will see station's roof lifted into place and public art installed.

The massive underground station at the centre of what will become Queensland's most significant transport interchange is becoming a reality, with incredible progress underway at Cross River Rail's Roma Street station site.

Six of the eight escalators along the station's underground platform have been installed, while four of the 20 escalators that passengers will use to travel to surface level are also in place.

Various architectural finishes are also now visible, including panels for the station's permanent walls and final touches to the baffle ceilings, which will help absorb sound in the massive underground space.

More than 46,000 people are expected to use the new Roma Street station each weekday by 2036.

The combined work underway across the mega-site provides the best sense yet of not only just how expansive the new underground stations are but also the journey passengers will take as they descend almost 30 metres below ground to board their train.

The transformation from construction site to train station will continue over coming months as the final escalators are installed in the station box, artwork is set in place and the station canopy is erected, soaring a massive 23 metres above street level.

Once complete, the addition of the new high-capacity underground station and the new station entrance to the existing local, regional and interstate rail connections, bus platforms and coach terminal will see Roma Street reborn as not only Queensland's most significant public transport interchange but also an iconic gateway to Brisbane.

Quotes attributable to Transport and Main Roads Minister Bart Mellish:

"Roma Street is looking less like a construction site and more like a train station every day.

"The rate of progress is incredible, and the works give you a real sense of the sheer size and scale of the finished station.

"The significant progress so far is testament to the dedication and hard work of the 250-strong crew at Roma Street who are making this underground station a reality.

"Roma Street is set to become our state's most significant transport interchange and will provide a vital link for commuters during the Brisbane 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games.

"With Suncorp Stadium set to host the opening and closing ceremonies and the state-of-the-art Brisbane Arena to be constructed only a short walk away, Roma Street will bring significant benefits to how commuters travel during the Games and for many years to come.

"It will be the main Cross River Rail station connecting to surface bus and rail networks, meaning that for many people it will be how they switch to trains travelling through the new tunnels beneath the Brisbane River and CBD.

"The new underground station's extraordinary transformation will continue in coming months.

"We'll see renowned Indigenous artist Judy Watson's massive and stunning artwork go up in the station box and the construction of the station's canopy, which will become a defining feature of this part of the CBD.

"For people travelling to Brisbane for the first time on regional and interstate bus and train services, Roma Street will be their 'gateway' to the city's new underground line.

"The new Roma Street underground station will help revitalise one of the most under-used inner-city precincts, connecting more people to the northwest part of the CBD."

Quotes attributable to Minister for State Development and Infrastructure and Member for McConnel Grace Grace:

"It is fantastic to see this brand-new underground station well on track to completion.

"There is no denying the significant impact this piece of infrastructure will bring, not only to residents of Brisbane, but to Queenslanders and visitors alike.

"I have lived in central Brisbane all my life and cannot wait to see how this project will transform the city, for the better."

Roma Street progress fast facts:

. There will be 28 escalators installed in the Roma Street underground station, including eight in the station cavern and 20 in the station box.

. The eight cavern escalators are almost 20 metres long and weigh more than 18 tonnes each.

. The 20 station box escalators are various sizes up to almost 27 metres in length and weigh more than 26 tonnes.

. Several other permanent features have started to be installed including the first few of about 950 wall panels and baffle ceilings.

. The station canopy will consist of 16 20-metre high pillars and 110 glass panels, each 1.2 metres by 2.5 metres.

ENDS



Assets: Timelapse, aerials and stills of station construction
> https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/hnt77oul8xam9h2xuk25f/h?rlkey=ryyp5mc4firahacao9oi8zkxg&dl=0

https://x.com/7NewsBrisbane/status/1772476117590671602?s=20

https://x.com/9NewsQueensland/status/1772544632968163331?s=20

Queensland Parliament

https://documents.parliament.qld.gov.au/tableOffice/questionsAnswers/2024/258-2024.pdf

Question on Notice
No. 258
Asked on 19 March 2024

DR M ROBINSON ASKED MINISTER FOR TRANSPORT AND MAIN ROADS AND MINISTER
FOR DIGITAL SERVICES (HON B MELLISH)

QUESTION:

Will the Minister advise the total budgeted cost for artwork for the Cross River Rail stations?

ANSWER:

I thank the Member for Oodgeroo for the question.

There are 14 pieces of art from 13 highly-renowned and celebrated Indigenous artists being
installed in total.

Station art was a requirement built into the major contract for the four new underground stations
awarded in 2019 and the cost is included in the construction cost of each station.

The specific details around cost, compensation and usage rights for each artwork is a matter
between the artist and the contractor and is commercial-in-confidence.

Dunno why he is having a go at the artwork, its a pretty standard thing to have in major public facilities.

https://danielbowen.com/2013/01/18/find-the-transport-mural/

Cost! It is the only question they ask

Queensland Parliament

https://documents.parliament.qld.gov.au/tableOffice/questionsAnswers/2024/247-2024.pdf

Question on Notice
No. 247
Asked on 19 March 2024

MR J KRAUSE ASKED MINISTER FOR TRANSPORT AND MAIN ROADS AND MINISTER
FOR DIGITAL SERVICES (HON B MELLISH)

QUESTION:

With reference to the current construction and commissioning program—
Will the Minister advise the forecast date (month and year) that the first passengers are expected
to use Cross River Rail?

ANSWER:

I thank the Member for Scenic Rim for the question.

The majority of construction on Cross River Rail is expected to be complete within 2025 and first
passenger services are expected to commence in 2026, once sufficient time has been allowed
for safety testing, commissioning, familiarisation and integration with existing public transport
services. I am advised that the precise month of commencing passenger services will be
determined closer to the opening date.

Couriermail --> Cross River Rail to feature Sydney-style screen doors at inner stations $

QuoteBrisbane train passengers using the underground Cross River Rail stations from 2026 will be greeted by platform screen doors, similar to those recently installed on the Sydney Metro.

The screens, which haven't been used on the city's train network before, are being installed at the Boggo Road, Woolloongabba, Albert Street and Roma Street underground stations. ...

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1782088862258585897

Sent to all outlets:

Cross River Rail - rail network changes update

25th April 2024

Cross River Rail (CRR) is scheduled to open in 2026 with the redesigned rail network divided into three timetable sectors:

Sector one (via CRR) - Gold Coast, Beenleigh, Sunshine Coast, Caboolture and Redcliffe Peninsula lines.

Sector two (via Central) - Ipswich, Springfield, Doomben, Brisbane Airport and Shorncliffe lines.

Sector three (via Central) - Ferny Grove and Cleveland lines.

The line pairings at this stage will be:

Sector one

Gold Coast - Redcliffe Peninsula lines

Beenleigh - Sunshine Coast and Caboolture lines

Sector two

Rosewood Ipswich - Brisbane Airport

Springfield - Shorncliffe

Doomben (not paired)

Sector three

Ferny Grove - Cleveland

The old catch cry for Cross River Rail was " more trains, more often " this was quietly changed a while back to " transform the way we will travel ".  No doubt the reality of the train fleet numbers causing a rethink of the projected message.

The Queensland Rail Citytrain fleet comprises a theoretical equivalent of 60 six car trains (120 three car units) see > https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=15599.0. There are a small number of EMUs still in service as well.  This combined with the New Generation Rollingstock which comprise 75 six car trains we have potentially available 135 six car trains plus EMUs. Not all trains are in service due to upgrades and maintenance at any one time. Presently 12 three car EMUs are undergoing life extension upgrades so that will boost the QR Citytrain fleet to the equivalent of 66 six car trains.

The total train fleet is just able to support the present peak timetable.  Additional significant numbers of trains from the Queensland Train Manufacturing Program are unlikely to be available until 2027/28. This means then that when CRR opens it is not really possible for an increase in peak train frequency.  The only frequency increase that has been potentially flagged is off peak on the Springfield line, trains may run every 15 minutes to allow the Ipswich line to operate on the present peak express pattern all the time. Apart from this welcome initiative, somewhat of an anti-climax overall.

Here is a recent interview where train numbers are discussed.

Interview 22 Apr 2024 4BC Drive Host Peter Gleeson with Robert Dow RBoT

Topic Citytrain train numbers

Interview --> https://backontrack.org/docs/4bc/4bcdrive_pgrd_22apr24.mp3 MP3 5.1MB

Contact:
Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org



References:

1. SEQ Rail Connect
https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/_/media/aboutus/corpinfo/publications/seq-rail-connect/seq-rail-connect.pdf
Diagram page 7

2. Queensland Train Manufacturing Program
https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/projects/programs/queensland-train-manufacturing-program

Facebook ...

https://x.com/railbotforum/status/1783376342165373204

It is that arcing line from Eagle Junction to Caboolture that is intriguing. What is it supposed to depict. If so, what is its status? If it is a thought bubble, it should not be there.

Sunshine coast line trains using the Gympie Road tunnel perhaps? 

Quote from: Stillwater on April 25, 2024, 19:46:14 PMIt is that arcing line from Eagle Junction to Caboolture that is intriguing. What is it supposed to depict. If so, what is its status? If it is a thought bubble, it should not be there.

North West Transport Corridor I suspect.  Another casualty of the ' car brain ' ...

Quote from: ozbob on April 25, 2024, 15:44:25 PMFacebook ...

Cross River Rail - rail network changes update 25th April 2024 Cross River Rail (CRR) is scheduled to open in 2026...

Posted by RAIL - Back On Track on Wednesday 24 April 2024

Been a very good response to this FB post.  Some great points raised in the comments.

Quote from: ozbob on April 26, 2024, 05:21:07 AM

Quote from: Stillwater on April 25, 2024, 19:46:14 PMIt is that arcing line from Eagle Junction to Caboolture that is intriguing. What is it supposed to depict. If so, what is its status? If it is a thought bubble, it should not be there.

North West Transport Corridor I suspect.  Another casualty of the ' car brain ' ...

Pretty much sums up transport planning in QLD! 

"Just draw a line that we'll never build. She'll be right!!"

^ Correct. It is not reality. Why is it being portrayed as part of CRR. It isn't. It is just more falsehood being peddled to the people of the Sunshine Coast by this government.

Quote from: Stillwater on April 26, 2024, 08:34:48 AM^ Correct. It is not reality. Why is it being portrayed as part of CRR. It isn't. It is just more falsehood being peddled to the people of the Sunshine Coast by this government.

It is really part of the ' redesigned rail network ' but your sentiment still stands.

It is more than that. It represents the politicisation of the Cross River Rail Authority. It holds out the false hope of a direct (new) railway line to Caloundra and the purpose of the depiction is to allow the Labor state government to spin some yarn around 'future rail' in crucial seats at the upcoming state election.

Quote from: Stillwater on April 26, 2024, 08:34:48 AM^ Correct. It is not reality. Why is it being portrayed as part of CRR. It isn't. It is just more falsehood being peddled to the people of the Sunshine Coast by this government.

This is from SEQ Rail Connects, not CRR.

https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/about-us/corporate-information/publications/seq-rail-connect

This link also apt, but my point is that Brisbane-Sunshine Coast rail upgrade is not a CRR project per se, unlike the improvements on the Beenleigh-Gold Coast Line.

https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/projects/brisbane-sunshine-coast-rail-corridor-strategy
 

Quote from: Stillwater on April 25, 2024, 19:46:14 PMIt is that arcing line from Eagle Junction to Caboolture that is intriguing. What is it supposed to depict. If so, what is its status? If it is a thought bubble, it should not be there.

Quote from: #Metro on April 25, 2024, 22:59:30 PMSunshine coast line trains using the Gympie Road tunnel perhaps? 

It's the tunnel proposal from Albion to North of Carseldine via Chermside. I guess it's likely to be built after the Gympie road tunnel is completed.

Came across this while looking for something else, mentions us!

Quote from: verbatim9 on April 26, 2024, 22:58:10 PM

Quote from: Stillwater on April 25, 2024, 19:46:14 PMIt is that arcing line from Eagle Junction to Caboolture that is intriguing. What is it supposed to depict. If so, what is its status? If it is a thought bubble, it should not be there.

Quote from: #Metro on April 25, 2024, 22:59:30 PMSunshine coast line trains using the Gympie Road tunnel perhaps? 

It's the tunnel proposal from Albion to North of Carseldine via Chermside. I guess it's likely to be built after the Gympie road tunnel is completed.

It's not anything. It's just a placeheader for any of the public and not public corridors and projects that are in and not within the corridor. Bowen hills-nambour has an extensively vast amount of possible projects depending on the network configuration. This includes quads, triples, platform extensions, stabling yards, realignment, new corridors for passenger and freight, freight yards, new facilities etc. It's vague for that reason as to encompass all the different possible outcomes.

There is a new request to change the scope of works approved for the Roma Street station.

QuoteThe change involves:

• closure of Herschel Street to vehicles between George and Roma streets
• adjusting signalised intersections, footpaths, cycle infrastructure and urban design to accommodate the new arrangements
• maintaining the Inner Northern Busway at its current location, removing the previously proposed design to shift the busway underground as part of the new Roma Street station
• maintaining the current intersection arrangement at Roma Street and Parkland Boulevard.

^ Not sure if the curving arrow is much of much. Thanks HTG for his insight. And then we have this ... the '2051 Vision', vague as it is: https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/projects/brisbane-sunshine-coast-rail-corridor-strategy#:~:text=The%20Brisbane%20to%20Sunshine%20Coast,efficiency%20for%20passengers%20and%20freight.