RAIL - Back On Track Forum

Quote from: #Metro on September 21, 2022, 19:41:35 PM^^^ This looks good but where is the bus stopping so pax can get to an from the station?

It's shown on the plans on the tmr website.



Also notable is the "bus driver facilites" so maybe more routes will terminate here.

Quote from: Gazza on September 27, 2022, 13:25:15 PM

Quote from: #Metro on September 21, 2022, 19:41:35 PM^^^ This looks good but where is the bus stopping so pax can get to an from the station?

It's shown on the plans on the tmr website.



Also notable is the "bus driver facilites" so maybe more routes will terminate here.

Unlikely. There are already driver facilities there. They are being relocated as part of the project. Current facilities are where the new bus ways are going.

The wreckers was there before Carseldine station was built. It's also on a flood plain. There's also not much left of the wreckers either. Part of the station and the wreckers went under water in 2015 and again this year. This raised some serious concerns over the proposed busway underpass. New property on the east side of the station has been raised up when they were built. Same with the school. But once again kudos for signing off on a large scale development in a well known flood area

Quote from: aldonius on September 27, 2022, 11:34:31 AMJonno, what are you on about? The only things on the southern side of the road at the Beams Rd LX are the edge of the Carseldine Urban Village on the west of the tracks, and the wreckers on the east. There's practically nothing to be disconnected. Indeed there are footpaths parallel to the train tracks underneath the roadway, so arguably the north-south connection is better.

(if you're talking about other LXes then you potentially have a point, but Beams Rd is fine as proposed)

https://www.kitsapdailynews.com/news/what-is-an-urban-village-walkability-connectivity-and-diversity/

Think this is a good list of characteristics... many which are missing at Carseldine.  More words/marketing less actual facts/reality.

• Walkability. Most things are within a 10-minute walk of home and work. Pedestrian-friendly street design. Pedestrian streets free of cars in special cases - Fail.
• Connectivity. Interconnected street grid network disperses traffic and eases walking. A hierarchy of narrow streets, boulevards, and alleys. High-quality pedestrian network and public realm makes walking pleasurable. - Fail
• Mixed-Use & Diversity. A mix of shops, offices, services, recreational activities, apartments, and homes. Mixed use within neighborhoods, within blocks, and within buildings. Diversity of ages, income levels, cultures, and lifestyles.- Potenitially
• Mixed Housing. A range of types, sizes and prices in closer proximity, such as cottages; single-family detached and attached; multi-family; accessory; upper floor rentals over retail; condominiums. - looking ok
• Quality Architecture & Urban Design. Emphasis on beauty, aesthetics, human comfort, and creating a sense of place. Special placement of civic uses and sites within community. Human-scale architecture and attractive surroundings nourish the human spirit. - Fail
• Traditional Neighborhood Structure. Discernible center and edge. Public space at center, and quality public realm. Public open space designed as civic art. Contains a range of uses and densities within 10-minute walk - Fail.
• Increased Density. More buildings, residences, shops, and services closer together. New Urbanism design principles are applied at the full range of densities - Wall of Road does this no favours and potentially a Fail.
• Smart Transportation. A network of high-quality public transit connecting cities, towns, and neighborhoods together. Design that encourages a greater use of bicycles, rollerblades, scooters, and walking as daily transportation - Push leaning to a Fail.
• Sustainability. Minimal environmental impact of development and its operations. Eco-friendly technologies, respect for ecology and value of natural systems. More efficient use of public infrastructure and services. Energy efficiency. More walking, less driving. - Fail

Sent to all outlets:

'Boom gate hell': Gridlock fears as level crossings to remain despite more trains under Cross River Rail

28th September 2022

Good Morning,

Level crossing removals continue at a solid pace in Greater Melbourne.

Latest is 66 level crossings removed since 2015.  SEQ none, zero!

85 to removed by 2025 and a further 8 by 2027 in Greater Melbourne.  We need to tap into the expertise developed by Victoria when it comes to level crossing removals.

( https://bigbuild.vic.gov.au/projects/level-crossing-removal-project )

Thanks to the Couriermail Quest for the article yesterday: Couriermail Quest --> 'Boom gate hell': Gridlock fears as level crossings to remain despite more trains under Cross River Rail

Again this highlights the lack of progress in SEQ.  We have been suggesting since 2016 that at least two level crossings should be removed each year. 
There are around 52 level crossings on the Queensland Rail Citytrain Network south of Caboolture.  Unless there is a commitment from both sides of the political fence to step up the rate of level crossing elimination (grade separation) there will be increasing impacts on the road transport network and the reliability and safety of rail itself. Transport in SEQ is facing terminal gridlock, and the Olympics in 2032 will be shambolic.

Frankly it is embarrassing the spin from Government and TMR in an attempt to disguise the lack of progress.

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

Quote from: ozbob on July 18, 2022, 04:16:35 AMSent to all outlets:

Well done Victoria - more awards for level crossing removal projects

18th July 2022

Good Morning,

Victorian level crossing removal projects have again achieved excellence, recognised in the 2022 AILA Landscape Architecture Awards (https://aila.awardsplatform.com/gallery/JzOoGoPQ ).

Victoria has now removed 64 level crossings since 2015 ( https://bigbuild.vic.gov.au/projects/level-crossing-removal-project ) while in SEQ we have remove none, zero.  All we have delivered in SEQ is delay, political squabbling and frankly failure.

Unless a decision is made to set up a proper Public Transport Authority, with a dedicated Level Crossing removal agency, we will continue to see failure.  The Department of Main Roads and Transport (DTMR) is a primarily a roads focussed organisation.  We need to get public transport and rail out of DTMR, away from the pro-roads bias and away from the inherent anti-rail bias that exists with DTMR in our view.

There will be 85 (yes eighty five) dangerous and congested level crossings removed around Melbourne by 2025, in ten years.

In SEQ we will be lucky if one is removed in that time.

Queensland thinks it can deliver the Olympic Games in 2032.  In our view, Queensland will produce a shambles of a games unless they rapidly get their rail and public transport act together.

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

ABC News: Calls for action in the removal of level crossings in Brisbane, with no projects completed since 2015
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-06-02/qld-rail-level-crossings-brisbane-motorists-traffic-roads/101118982

Discussion thread RAIL Back On Track Forum
https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=2391.0

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1574883708372660225

Here is the list of Crossing that I believe can just be closed today as there is ample crossing/underpass nearby (and actually stops traffic through the suburb or removes traffic around the station):

• McKean Street Caboolture
• Todds Road, Lawnton
• Stanley Street E, Coorparoo
• Queensport Rd South, Murarrie
• Barrack Rd, Cannon Hill
• Wynnum Rd North, Wynnum North
• Fairlie Tce, Saisbury - seriously there is an overpass 20m west of it
• Stones Rd, Sunnybank
• Nathan Rd, Runcorn
• Trinder Crossing, Woodridge
• Spams Rd, Holmview
• Surely an alternative route for Holmview Rd could be considered - quickly.
• Thagoona Haigslea Rd, Thagoona
• Curlew St, Sandgate
• Kennerly St, Sandgate
• Blackwood Street, Michelton
• Arbor Street, Ferny Grove.

Probably missed some so please add or remove but 16 out of the quoted 54 (or 53?) is around 30%...overnight.

Yessss Todds Rd annoys me so much.

Prior to Francis Rd overpass, it was just a cul de sac, so rather than using the overpass to subsitute the closure of Todds Rd, they just left it open.

For crossings near the station, the issue is vexed because you want to have cross town buses going past the station.

The ones around Sandgate would need some consideration, eg Curlew St goes to the local sports ground

I can't comment on the specifics of Jonno's list but I love the concept of solving this problem in part by deprioritising car access.

What is the cost of a modest but accessible pedestrian/bike crossing?

Important to keep in mind that we shouldn't be looking to just close crossings for the sake of it. Level crossings on relatively quiet streets are fine.

Pedestrian LXs are fine too. I'd actually argue for more of them in a number of places to improve urban permeability. Many LXs don't have any real safety issues and while waiting is inconvenient, it's surely better to have some crossing than no crossing.

On two specific crossings I'm more familiar with I'd be opposed to closure without additional work on alternatives:

If you were to close Blackwood St (Mitchelton) as a crossing you'd need to find another routing for the 361, 362, 390, 398 and 598/599 buses. I'm also not aware of any incidents at that LX and you'd presumably be imposing a ~400 metre detour for a big chunk of the suburb walking to the high street area.

Arbor St (Ferny Grove) has got plenty of traffic and that traffic is logically coming from the north and west, not the east. Rat-running through the train station is not an option and neither is sending everything from the north and west the long way around via Tramway St (and the Samford Rd LX!).

Being quite familiar with McKeen St LX, simply closing this would create chaos.
It provides the most direct route for many East-West and East-North routes, and it avoids the central Caboolture CBD area. (I.e. hospital workers, school traffic, let alone North and West residents wanting to access the Station's eastern car parks).

You'd also be creating a significant detour for someone starting their trip on the southern side of Lagoon Ck (I.e. the TAFE) who wants to head north (up Beerburrum Rd).

Perhaps you could close this LX if offset with an interchange onto the Caboolture Bypass/D'Ag Highway next to the TAFE? Some reasonable traffic modelling needed to predict those ripple effects...

Queensland Parliament

https://documents.parliament.qld.gov.au/tableoffice/questionsanswers/2022/894-2022.pdf

Question on Notice
No. 894
Asked on 30 August 2022

MR S MINNIKIN ASKED MINISTER FOR TRANSPORT AND MAIN ROADS (HON M BAILEY)

QUESTION:

Will the Minister advise the project milestone dates for the Beams Road Rail Level Crossing
project including for the (a) major construction works tender award, (b) major construction start
and (c) major construction completion?

ANSWER:

I thank the Member for Chatsworth for the question.

The Department of Transport and Main Roads (TMR) finalised the business case for the Beams Road
rail level crossing removal project at Carseldine in December 2021. A design consultant has since
been engaged to carry out the design.

Beams Road is controlled by Brisbane City Council (BCC), and council's approval for the design
is required before construction can progress. The major construction contract tender is expected
to be released early 2023 and the main construction contract is expected to be awarded in 2023,
subject to design completion. Construction is expected to be complete in 2026, weather and site
conditions permitting.

Following longstanding delays to project approvals by BCC, TMR has since accelerated works
for the level crossing removal upgrade, construction has commenced on the Carseldine station
park 'n' ride upgrade. Works include building the new access from Balcara Avenue in order to
minimise disruption to park 'n' ride customers once construction of the overpass commences.

Quote from: ozbob on October 05, 2022, 07:42:13 AMQueensland Parliament

https://documents.parliament.qld.gov.au/tableoffice/questionsanswers/2022/894-2022.pdf

Question on Notice
No. 894
Asked on 30 August 2022

MR S MINNIKIN ASKED MINISTER FOR TRANSPORT AND MAIN ROADS (HON M BAILEY)

QUESTION:

Will the Minister advise the project milestone dates for the Beams Road Rail Level Crossing
project including for the (a) major construction works tender award, (b) major construction start
and (c) major construction completion?

ANSWER:

I thank the Member for Chatsworth for the question.

The Department of Transport and Main Roads (TMR) finalised the business case for the Beams Road
rail level crossing removal project at Carseldine in December 2021. A design consultant has since
been engaged to carry out the design.

Beams Road is controlled by Brisbane City Council (BCC), and council's approval for the design
is required before construction can progress. The major construction contract tender is expected
to be released early 2023 and the main construction contract is expected to be awarded in 2023,
subject to design completion. Construction is expected to be complete in 2026, weather and site
conditions permitting.

Following longstanding delays to project approvals by BCC, TMR has since accelerated works
for the level crossing removal upgrade, construction has commenced on the Carseldine station
park 'n' ride upgrade. Works include building the new access from Balcara Avenue in order to
minimise disruption to park 'n' ride customers once construction of the overpass commences.

Time is retreating in SEQ Transport Planning!!!

Sent to all outlets:

Update on level crossing removal progress in greater Melbourne

7th October 2022

Good Morning,

We note Question on Notice (QON) No. 894 recently tabled in Queensland Parliament https://documents.parliament.qld.gov.au/tableoffice/questionsanswers/2022/894-2022.pdf

The Question seeks the milestone data for the Beams Road Rail Level Crossing removal project.

The Answer to the QON suggests that construction is expected to be complete in 2026, weather and site conditions permitting.
Will this be the first level crossing to be removed in SEQ since 2015?  It again just highlights the stagnation, lack of commitment and purpose since 2015 when it comes to level crossing removals.  Unless the rate of level crossing removals is stepped up we will face serious issues with safety and congestion.

In the latest developments from Victoria, since 2015 they have now removed 67 level crossings in greater Melbourne (SEQ zero).

There are further commitments to have a total of 85 removed by 2025, 93 by 2027 and 97 by 2028 ( https://bigbuild.vic.gov.au/projects/level-crossing-removal-project).

Queensland transport is an embarrassment.  I am visiting Melbourne next week, in part to observe some of the recent level crossing removal projects, something that is not possible in SEQ.

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

Quote from: ozbob on September 28, 2022, 07:48:16 AMSent to all outlets:

'Boom gate hell': Gridlock fears as level crossings to remain despite more trains under Cross River Rail

28th September 2022

Good Morning,

Level crossing removals continue at a solid pace in Greater Melbourne.

Latest is 66 level crossings removed since 2015.  SEQ none, zero!

85 to removed by 2025 and a further 8 by 2027 in Greater Melbourne.  We need to tap into the expertise developed by Victoria when it comes to level crossing removals.

( https://bigbuild.vic.gov.au/projects/level-crossing-removal-project )

Thanks to the Couriermail Quest for the article yesterday: Couriermail Quest --> 'Boom gate hell': Gridlock fears as level crossings to remain despite more trains under Cross River Rail

Again this highlights the lack of progress in SEQ.  We have been suggesting since 2016 that at least two level crossings should be removed each year. 
There are around 52 level crossings on the Queensland Rail Citytrain Network south of Caboolture.  Unless there is a commitment from both sides of the political fence to step up the rate of level crossing elimination (grade separation) there will be increasing impacts on the road transport network and the reliability and safety of rail itself. Transport in SEQ is facing terminal gridlock, and the Olympics in 2032 will be shambolic.

Frankly it is embarrassing the spin from Government and TMR in an attempt to disguise the lack of progress.

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

Quote from: ozbob on July 18, 2022, 04:16:35 AMSent to all outlets:

Well done Victoria - more awards for level crossing removal projects

18th July 2022

Good Morning,

Victorian level crossing removal projects have again achieved excellence, recognised in the 2022 AILA Landscape Architecture Awards (https://aila.awardsplatform.com/gallery/JzOoGoPQ ).

Victoria has now removed 64 level crossings since 2015 ( https://bigbuild.vic.gov.au/projects/level-crossing-removal-project ) while in SEQ we have remove none, zero.  All we have delivered in SEQ is delay, political squabbling and frankly failure.

Unless a decision is made to set up a proper Public Transport Authority, with a dedicated Level Crossing removal agency, we will continue to see failure.  The Department of Main Roads and Transport (DTMR) is a primarily a roads focussed organisation.  We need to get public transport and rail out of DTMR, away from the pro-roads bias and away from the inherent anti-rail bias that exists with DTMR in our view.

There will be 85 (yes eighty five) dangerous and congested level crossings removed around Melbourne by 2025, in ten years.

In SEQ we will be lucky if one is removed in that time.

Queensland thinks it can deliver the Olympic Games in 2032.  In our view, Queensland will produce a shambles of a games unless they rapidly get their rail and public transport act together.

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

ABC News: Calls for action in the removal of level crossings in Brisbane, with no projects completed since 2015
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-06-02/qld-rail-level-crossings-brisbane-motorists-traffic-roads/101118982

Discussion thread RAIL Back On Track Forum
https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=2391.0

Facebook ...

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1578135117175799808

Hey Bob, do you think we could take the angle of comparing the number of freeway interchange upgrades vs the number of level crossing upgrades?

For example, there have been a few done On the M1 and Gympie arterial road and that huge one at Caloundra road.
Could we make a list of the ones that were done and their costs and compare them to the inaction on level crossings?

Quote from: Gazza on October 07, 2022, 07:01:46 AMHey Bob, do you think we could take the angle of comparing the number of freeway interchange upgrades vs the number of level crossing upgrades?

For example, there have been a few done On the M1 and Gympie arterial road and that huge one at Caloundra road.
Could we make a list of the ones that were done and their costs and compare them to the inaction on level crossings?

Could be another way of showing the inaction for sure.  Leave it for now, I will be away on my ' LX removal inspection tour ' for the next week or so ...

If we continue to have our cake (i.e. not stopping cars and trucks dominating our city) and eat it as well (i.e. significantly change mode share to active and public transport) we just end up with the status quo (i.e. cars and trucks dominating our city and mode share).  We are not going to change our city without reversing the last 50 years of prioritising the motor vehicles be it via bus/BRT lanes, bike lanes and other public space projects to prioritise humans not their cars again.

If removing a level crossing removes a pedestrian/cycle path then build the infrastructure to allow active transport to be maintained.  Netherlands and Scandinanvian cities do some great work on this.  Cycling and pedestrian underpasses for example.  We all know our bus routes need to be radically changed so some can move in the short term. Even the current Road Overpass proposals in an urban setting need to take a human focus not a motor vehicle/traffic one even if a bus uses the road.  Beams Road and Coopers Plains come to mind immediately. Thes will destroy these suburbs and hand them over to car-dominance if they arent already.

The scale of the work here is huge. It cannot take 20-30 or more years. If we look at all crossing to remove including the above the treatment should/could be:

By Treatment - Ny Line and Suburb to come.  The tables are time consuming

#	Line	Location	Treatment	Comments
48	Beenleigh/GC	TRINDER PARK: Oates Ave/ Trinder Crossing	Close – Kuraby to Beenleigh Faster Rail
17	Beenleigh/GC	HOLMVIEW: Holmview Rd	Close – Kuraby to Beenleigh Faster Rail	Build alternative route for Holmview Rd
38	Beenleigh/GC	RUNCORN: Nathan Rd	Close Immediately	Not a major road
11	Cleveland	COORPAROO: Stanley St E	Close Immediately	Will be made into parkland by SkyRail above
28	Ferny Grove	MICHELTON: Blackwood St	Close immediately	Replaced by parkland by Skyrail above
3	Beenleigh/GC	BEENLEIGH: Spanns Rd	Close Immediately	Plenty of access from east
39	Beenleigh/GC	SALISBURY: Fairlie Tce	Close Immediately	Seriously there is an overpass 20m west of it
30	Cleveland	MURARRIE: Queensport Rd	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
51	Ferny Grove	WINDSOR: Le GeytSt	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
52	Ferny Grove	WINDSOR: Eildon Rd	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
54	Cleveland	WYNNUM NORTH:    Wynnum Rd North	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
33	Caboolture/Nambour	NORTHGATE: Northgate Rd	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
24	Cleveland	LOTA: Railway Tce (Ped Only)	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
18	Doomben	HENDRA: Zilliman Rd	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
20	Ferny Grove	KEPPERRA: Station Access (Ped Only)	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
14	Ferny Grove	FERNY GROVE, Arbor St	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
44	Caboolture/Nambour	STRATHPINE: Sth Pine Rd	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass	Use Kremzow Rd as the main road.
43	Ipswich/Rosewood	SHERWOOD: Sherwood Rd	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
34	Shorncliffe	NUDGEE: St Achs St (Ped Only)	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
41	Shorncliffe	SANDGATE: Kennerly St	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass	Link Towner St to Curles St
42	Shorncliffe	Shorncliffe: Palm Ave	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass	Link Ashford Street to Curlew St
6	Caboolture/Nambour	CABOOLTURE: McKean St	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
7	Cleveland	CANNON HILL: Barrack Rd	Close immediately – Bike/pedestrian underpass
36-37	Beenleigh/GC	RUNCORN: Bonemill & Warrigal Rd	Rail Tunnel – Dutton Park to Kuraby Faster Rail
45	Beenleigh/GC	SUNNYBANK: Stones Rd	Rail Tunnel – Dutton Park to Kuraby Faster Rail
40	Shorncliffe	SANDGATE: Curlew St	Road Overpass	Minimise impact to local area (aka Not Geebung)
29	Caboolture/Nambour	MORAYFIELD: Station Rd	Road Overpass	Build on Buchanan Rd/William Berry Dr
31	Caboolture/Nambour	NARANGBA: Mumford Rd	Road Overpass
46	Caboolture/Nambour	SUNSHINE: Bilsen Rd	Road Overpass
23	Cleveland	LINDUM: Kianawah Rd -	Road Overpass	Off Kianawah Rd to Lindum Rd Station provided pedestrian access.  Cycling overpass in vicinity Location has flood issues"
13	Doomben	DOOMBEN: Nudgee Rd	Road Overpass	Minimise impact to local area (aka Not Geebung)
1	Ferny Grove	ALDERLEY: South Pine Rd	Road Overpass	Flooding issues area.
15	Ferny Grove	FERNY GROVE, Samford Rd	Road Overpass
19	Ipswich/Rosewood	KARRABIN: Karrabin Rosewood Rd	Road Overpass	East of station using Schillings Rd
35	Ipswich/Rosewood	ROSEWOOD: John St	Road Overpass	West of town – bypass to Roseood Marburg Rd
47	Ipswich/Rosewood	THAGOONA: Thagoona- Haigslea Rd	Road Overpass
49	Ipswich/Rosewood	WACOL: Wacol Station Rd	Road Overpass
50	Ipswich/Rosewood	WALLOON: Haigslea Amberley Rd	Road Overpass	Minimise impact on local area/housing
2	Shorncliffe	BANYO: St Vincents Rd	Road Overpass	"Off Tufnell Rd and St Vincents Rd Minimise impact to local area (aka Not Geebung)"
4	Beenleigh/GC	BETHANIA: Station Rd -	Road Overpass  – Kuraby to Beenleigh Faster Rail	Minimise impact to local area (aka Not Geebung)
5	Caboolture/Nambour	BURPENGARY: Rowley Rd	Road under Rail
22	Caboolture/Nambour	LAWNTON: Todds Rd	Road under Rail
16	Ferny Grove	GROVELY: Dawson Pde	Road under Rail
32	Ferny Grove	NEWMARKET: Windsor Rd	Road under Rail	Tunnel under station
12	Shorncliffe	DEAGON: Adams Stret	Road under Rail
21	Beenleigh/GC	KURABY: Beenleigh Rd	Road under Rail  – Kuraby to Beenleigh Faster Rail	Straighten bend on road.
9	Beenleigh/GC	COOPERS PLAINS: Boundary Rd	SkyRail	Coopers Plains Station @ 20m Bannon Station @32m
8	Caboolture/Nambour	CARSELDINE: Beams Road	SkyRail	Zillmere Station @ 20m Linkfield Rd overpass @ 14m
10	Cleveland	COORPAROO: Cavendish Rd	SkyRail	Buranda @ 17m Coorparoo @ 4m Norman Park @ 10m
53	Cleveland	WYNNUM: Florence St/Ronald Street	SkyRail	Wynnum North @ 17m Wynnum Station @10m Wynnum Central @ 8m Manly @ 28m
55	Cleveland	WYNNUM NORTH: Wynnum Rd	SkyRail	Also addresses low bridges on Burke, Pine & Berrima St
25-27	Ferny Grove	MITCHELTON: Prospect & Osbourne Rds & Glenholme St	SkyRail	Oxford Pk Station @ 46m Mitchelton Station @ 37m Gaythorne Station @ 39m

QuoteIf we continue to have our cake (i.e. not stopping cars and trucks dominating our city) and eat it as well (i.e. significantly change mode share to active and public transport) we just end up with the status quo (i.e. cars and trucks dominating our city and mode share).  We are not going to change our city without reversing the last 50 years of prioritising the motor vehicles be it via bus/BRT lanes, bike lanes and other public space projects to prioritise humans not their cars again.

A key problem with rail versus bus and cars, is that the average speed of trains is almost the same as cars in congested traffic. At least with bus services you have a fairly direct busway where the bus can get right up to speed.

If city leaders want a faster morning peak hour average speed, they need to lift the average speed of services on the train network. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Downs%E2%80%93Thomson_paradox

Some movement there is minor recognition of this by PT authorities, and some moves are being made to address this - e.g. express all day train services and Kuraby-Beenleigh line straightening.

The other issue is freezing PT budgets when road capital and maintenance budgets appear to be uncapped. In the face of a growing population, this results in a net cut year on year in funding per person. What is the logic of that???

Yes, it is an enormous task.  A task that needs a specialised agency (e.g. like Victoria) to develop the necessary expertise, and get started.  A roads outfit sees LXs removals as a road project, as you correctly point out Jonno they are a lot more that.

https://twitter.com/ozbob13/status/1578948333389107200

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1579000174763921409

https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/politics/federal/bruce-highway-centre-of-1-46-billion-queensland-infrastructure-spend-20221016-p5bq61.html *

*

Quote... In addition to the Bruce Highway, there will be $100 million for the Cavendish Road level crossing at Coorparoo and $133 million for the level crossing at Boundary Road in Coopers Plains. ...

If Cav Rd crossing is anything other than SkyRail between Buranda and Norman Park it will gut the area and compound flooding in the area!'

https://twitter.com/JonathanPBryant/status/1581814226460364800

^^ This would be hot stuff for the Cleveland line.

- You could get a really nice bikeway underneath it to Coorparoo, that could feed into a bikeway to UQ.

- You could also massively speed up the train, depending on the alignment chosen.

QuoteYou could also massively speed up the train, depending on the alignment chosen.

What speedy alignment did you have in mind?

Im thinking it would be something like this:

-Close Stanley St East.
-Reconnect Milsom St
-Move station to elevated location in triangle between Cavendish Rd and Milsom St (Resume properties in triangle)
-Build skyrail on north side of existing line on QR land. You could build most of the viaduct with the current line running uninterrupted, but would be a closure for the tie ins where it starts reaching the ground.

I don't have a specific alignment for that, so open season for ideas on that one 💡.

I do want to see if anything could be done for the slowest section around Norman Park.

THE BENEFITS OF LEVEL CROSSING REMOVALS:
Lessons from Melbourne's historical experience

Melbourne School of Design  University of Melbourne

https://msd.unimelb.edu.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0019/2733112/LXRA-Report_low_resolution.pdf

Quote from: Gazza on October 17, 2022, 13:07:19 PM

QuoteYou could also massively speed up the train, depending on the alignment chosen.

What speedy alignment did you have in mind?

Im thinking it would be something like this:

-Close Stanley St East.
-Reconnect Milsom St
-Move station to elevated location in triangle between Cavendish Rd and Milsom St (Resume properties in triangle)
-Build skyrail on north side of existing line on QR land. You could build most of the viaduct with the current line running uninterrupted, but would be a closure for the tie ins where it starts reaching the ground.

In my humble opinion. This section is the fastest (certainly one of the fastest) part of this line.  With station in middle does the current alignment cause any real speed concerns?

Setting aside the overall indirect route of the line, the slowest part would be the winding hill climb from Norman Park to Morningside.

But because that section has no level crossings its highly unlikely anything will ever be done with it now.

Facebook ...

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1583330145372209152

Getting strong positive responses already to this FB post:

'Elevated railway is part of the level crossing removal solution.'

Sent to all outlets:

Elevated railway is part of the level crossing removal solution.

22nd October 2022




Photographs: Murrumbeena - elevated rail soars over the level crossing it replaced.  R Dow 12 Oct 2022

In the latest Level Crossing removal developments from Victoria, since 2015 they have now removed 67 level crossings in greater Melbourne (SEQ zero). There are further commitments to have a total of 87 removed by 2026, 95 by 2027, 99 by 2028, and 106 by 2029 ( https://bigbuild.vic.gov.au/projects/level-crossing-removal-project ).

The level crossing removal projects in Victoria have not focussed on a single option, but rather have used a combination of construction methods, namely elevated rail (Sky Rail), rail under road (trench), and road over rail.
There are some early signs of progress towards some level crossing removal projects in SEQ. The default option for level crossing removals in SEQ appears to be road over rail.  This is how Robinson Road level crossing at Geebung was removed in 2014, one of the last level crossings removed in greater Brisbane.

It is timely to look more closely at elevated rail (Sky Rail) as a solution.

The Melbourne School of Design* (University of Melbourne) summarised the potential benefits of elevated rail options for level crossing removals as apart from the safety and reduction in traffic congestion as:
. Greater potential for multi-scale economic and social development related to increased activity around stations.
. Restoration of rail's prominent position in the urban fabric.
. Creation of linear parks and connected quiet streets for safer walking and cycling.
. Opportunities for the fundamental re-organisation of Melbourne's bus system and its connection to the rail network.
. Improved passenger experience, views and wayfinding.

* https://msd.unimelb.edu.au/research/projects/completed/level-crossing-removals-learning-from-melbournes-experience

Full report: THE BENEFITS OF LEVEL CROSSING REMOVALS:
Lessons from Melbourne's historical experience
https://msd.unimelb.edu.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0019/2733112/LXRA-Report_low_resolution.pdf

There are a number of potential level crossing removals in greater Brisbane that could produce significant community benefits if elevated rail was used, rather than just road over rail!

For example:
COOPERS PLAINS: Boundary Rd
CARSELDINE: Beams Road 
COORPAROO: Cavendish Rd
WYNNUM: Florence St/Ronald Street
WYNNUM NORTH: Wynnum Rd
MITCHELTON: Prospect & Osbourne Rds & Glenholme St
Level crossing removals on the Logan - Gold Coast Faster Rail project

Last week I travelled to Melbourne and reviewed some of the recent level crossing removal projects.
( More photographs can be viewed here > https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?msg=263357 ).

It is clear that Queensland needs to take note of the results achieved in Victoria with regards to level crossing removals.
Rather than just dropping into a road over rail with an ugly overpass that doesn't open up the rail corridor, look at these projects as a way of improving the community environment as well as the primary aim of improved safety.

The Melbourne experience is a very positive one.

Our Facebook post on this topic has already generated much interest and strong support.
See > https://railbotforum.org/yourls/2d

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1583524642316173313

https://twitter.com/JonathanPBryant/status/1583359084048240640

Quote from: #Metro on October 17, 2022, 12:44:44 PM^^ This would be hot stuff for the Cleveland line.

- You could get a really nice bikeway underneath it to Coorparoo, that could feed into a bikeway to UQ.

Agreed. Elevated rail at coorparoo would be transformational for that area. Vastly improved safety and reliability for rail and road. Great opportunities for park, active transport, community activation. Cav road bus stops moved under the station for much easier and safer interchange - used by lots of school children (won't somebody think of the children?!)

Is there any consultation open on the planning yet?

G'day CL.   Agree.  No, consultation is not happening as yet but it is time to make sure ALL options are considered.

I am surprised at the strong support on our Facebook post on this.  I think folk have seen the results down south and realise that the initial anti-SkyRail campaigns were largely bull dust.

Great outcomes are possible around Coorparoo for sure.

Quote from: Gazza on October 21, 2022, 09:33:02 AMthe slowest part would be the winding hill climb from Norman Park to Morningside.

Seems to me that maintaining skyrail through Norman Park would allow for a lot less climbing... and a serious straightening along Bennetts Rd.