Using the new go card fare structure optimally.

[Antoniolino]

Wow.  99% of the people who responded to the online media articles mentioned above, my parents, every single one of my friends who has ever visited from another city must be taking crazy pills.

Do you work for the Translink Go Card unit?

No I don't work for them.  You may find if you read a lot of my other posts I am very critical of Translink on many issues, but there are a few they get close to right, and Go Card is one of them.

My parents were in town for 1 day.  I'd do your homework on comparing deals for pensioners.  Example, pensioners travel free in Adelaide off peak.  I think its similar in Perth, I do know thats its a better deal in Melbourne, Can't comment on Sydney.

One might expect that they would be back.  For one day it is arguable about being worth getting a Seniors Go Card, but if you don't want to spend a few minutes to obtain a Seniors Go Card and then refund it (if you aren't coming back), then I don't have sympathy for them complaining about the expense.

In a nutshell, the pay-per-trip structure of the Go-Card closes off a whole stack of ways to save depending on usage available to these in other Australian cities.

Ways-to-save = farebox leakage.  Are the base fares going to be increased to compensate?  You have already complained that the base fares are too expensive.

I've spent a lot of time in a lot of cities.  Aus and internationally.  I have quite a few friends who come and visit me from other cities quite often.  I have 2 degrees, 1 in planning 1 in business and law.  I've caught public transport on and off in Brisbane since 1992.  I find your opinions totally bizarre.  I've never met anyone who has anything good to say about Bris Pub trans. Thats why I asked if you worked for Translink, I was genuinely thrown.  And to dismiss good feedback and data out of hand is disappointing, particularly internet-based feedback when you obviously like technology.

The fares are too expensive, the service is slack, full stop.

I spent November in HK ( don't bother starting with the 'you can't compare us to HK', I understand all those issues).  They have a true smart card.  We can only dream.  The best and most valid comparison to Brisbane is Perth.  WA has a genuine commitment to public transport and it shows.

The real issues:  Translink, the BCC buses and ferries and the metro trains should all be merged into a single true metro entity.  This would would result in monster savings and efficiencies.  The state government (either party) is to lazy or lacking in vision to do this.  And therein lies the real core issue: No commitment to affordable and effective public transport by the State.

[STB]

In regards to the Seniors Card and your parents buying a paper ticket instead, I strongly would've recommended that you brought two Seniors Card where they could've kept the cards for when they returned.  Seniors actually have the best deal around with unlimited zones, and free travel after two journeys in one day.

When I head to Melbourne next I'll be getting myself a Myki which I'll keep until I visit Melbourne again later down the track.  If I however didn't wish to return to Melbourne I would just simply get a refund.  It's not hard!

EDIT: Note I don't work for TransLink either, just for the record .

[Antoniolino]

ps. that paper ticket you list above for Melbourne, by way of another example, is not a sinlge trip ticket, it entitles the holder to travel for 2 hours in a zone with a 10km radius from the GPO.  Have a think about that.

I think Single and 2h can be used interchangeably in this context.

In Brisbane:
http://translink.com.au/tickets-and-fares/other-tickets/paper-tickets

With a single paper ticket, you can transfer between any number of buses, trains and ferries in a two hour window (within the zones your ticket is for).

The two hours starts when you buy your ticket.

Transfers must be made between different route numbered services (return journeys are not permitted).

Passengers travelling through 11 zones or more will have their final transfer time extended by 90 minutes.

So basically the same. Return journeys are not policed in effect.
In practice they work the same, so why are you clutching at straws?

Basically the same, are you serious?  Herein lies another big problem with the approach in Bris. Everything is so convoluted.  Like the 'go-free' rules, touching off within 1 hour or whatever it was, no transfers on the same line, its all very strange.  People need to do a tafe course on how not to get even more ripped off.  Geez, the minister doesn't even understand the transfer rules, (the prev one was asked in a press conf).  In Melb, 2 hrs, travel anywhere, return, 2 returns, whatever you want.

This is weird.  Some on here seem to want to score ego points rather than have a discussion.  For the record, I am of the firm belief that the feedback comments in the CM and BT articles online are true reflection of how Brisbanites feel about the current situation.  Also for the record I rarely use PT although I'd love to.  The incentives aren't there.  When I lived in Melbourne I used it all the time, no hesitation.  Bike and Car for me.  But I'm outraged by the lack of a concession for the disadvantaged people and I've seen the frustration and isolation it causes.  Basically, if you are unemployed in Bris, you can't afford to catch many, or even any, buses or trains.  In any other city, you can afford it.

[STB]

I'm unemployed, a uni student and terrible with budgeting, yet I've always managed to get and use a Go Card despite all those drawbacks, and I have managed to lose a few in recent times!  Heck, I earn less than a pensioner due to being on Austudy!  So you don't represent me in that regard.  

For the record, at the moment I'm having to use an Adult Go Card as I lost my entire wallet over Christmas, but I'm still coping fine without my wallet, my bank cards, and my Concession Go Card, which I can't get until I get a new student card.

[somebody]

I've spent a lot of time in a lot of cities.  Aus and internationally.  I have quite a few friends who come and visit me from other cities quite often.  I have 2 degrees, 1 in planning 1 in business and law.  I've caught public transport on and off in Brisbane since 1992.  

What have these comments got to do with anything?

Have you been to Sydney?  There you will really find a ridiculous fares policy.

I find your opinions totally bizarre.  I've never met anyone who has anything good to say about Bris Pub trans.

I have.  I don't know too many that don't like the Go Card actually.  As for the fare levels, that is not a problem with the technology.

Thats why I asked if you worked for Translink, I was genuinely thrown.  And to dismiss good feedback and data out of hand is disappointing, particularly internet-based feedback when you obviously like technology.

Good feedback?  All I saw was a whinge.

The fares are too expensive, the service is slack, full stop.

Agree here.

I spent November in HK ( don't bother starting with the 'you can't compare us to HK', I understand all those issues).  They have a true smart card.  We can only dream.  The best and most valid comparison to Brisbane is Perth.  WA has a genuine commitment to public transport and it shows.

Exactly how is HK's smart card better than ours?  And if you say "It cost me x to do y" I will scream.

The real issues:  Translink, the BCC buses and ferries and the metro trains should all be merged into a single true metro entity.  This would would result in monster savings and efficiencies.  The state government (either party) is to lazy or lacking in vision to do this.  And therein lies the real core issue: No commitment to affordable and effective public transport by the State.

Agree re: BCC buses coming under state control.

Basically, if you are unemployed in Bris, you can't afford to catch many, or even any, buses or trains.  In any other city, you can afford it.

I re-iterate.  Nothing to do with Go Card.  It's not like pre-Go card unemployed were granted concessions.

[STB]

Why do I get the feeling that Atoniolino is trolling.  It's all attack, attack, attack, but nothing really that constructive, sadly .

[HappyTrainGuy]

I've spent a lot of time in a lot of cities.  Aus and internationally.  I have quite a few friends who come and visit me from other cities quite often.  I have 2 degrees, 1 in planning 1 in business and law.  I've caught public transport on and off in Brisbane since 1992.  I find your opinions totally bizarre.  I've never met anyone who has anything good to say about Bris Pub trans. Thats why I asked if you worked for Translink, I was genuinely thrown.  And to dismiss good feedback and data out of hand is disappointing, particularly internet-based feedback when you obviously like technology.

What's good to say about it? If you don't live next to a busway or buz route you've jack all. Extra trains/service changes has to get the okay from so many people in Translink. The whole Translink network shuts down at 6pm. Certain bus routes stop before 8pm. Routes go on sight seeing trips to the city. Railway infrastructure has been forgotten about for the last decade. The railways aren't supported as the backbone of PT. Buses are treated like their own heavy rail network instead of operating between the two. Feeder? What's a feeder service? Translink still runs hourly and 2 hourly frequencies within 10km of the CBD. Heck, there's one daily service servicing Shorncliffe at 11ish during the week. HOW THE HELL DOES ANYONE BENEFIT FROM THAT! Along with constant fare increases and the joke of the fare structure for short trips its easy to see why.

[Gazza]

"Basically the same" in the context of this discussion.
What I was trying to do was compare the 'basic' fare for each city. Problem?
At the passengers level, you are going to use both the same way aren't you?

Yeah, Melbourne is a lot simpler (And I've always felt that there should be unlimited transfers on paper and go card anyway)

But feck, If I'm gonna compare the fares of the 5 big cites, what else should I be using in Melbourne to do the comparison then?

.....Hey so what about fares to Moorooka supposedly being over double to Preston.  

The fares are too expensive, the service is slack, full stop.

Nobody disagrees.

I've caught public transport on and off in Brisbane since 1992.  I find your opinions totally bizarre.  I've never met anyone who has anything good to say about Bris Pub trans. Thats why I asked if you worked for Translink, I was genuinely thrown.

Its not 100% bad though.  Though There is some divide between the have and have nots with respect to high frequency BUZes etc.
But its not as if I'm gonna bag out my local line for having trains every 15 minutes and a nice station (Oxley). That is something postive from my perspective.
As a whole, it is a bit crap though, and I would agree that the foot needs to be put down with BT etc so they start actually being a team player.

And yeah, I do like go card as a system because it saves time.
Fares are too high, but I think there is an over obsession with periodicals. They aren't as good as people make them out to be, and Perth runs successfully without them.

[#Metro]

I don't dwell too much on the fare structure, because its different ways of doing a fancy calculation....But as BILO used to say on their ads, "its the total on the docket that counts"

What! You shop at BILO! Cheapskate ! 

[somebody]

I find your opinions totally bizarre.  I've never met anyone who has anything good to say about Bris Pub trans.

Well you didn't complain about high fares, poor frequency, indirect routes, divided city stop locations, overloaded buses, unserviced areas or anything else which would have substance but just had a ridiculous whinge about the Go Card.

Along with constant fare increases and the joke of the fare structure for short trips its easy to see why.

Wash your mouth out.

Please say "too high a flagfall" if that is what you mean.  I'd agree with that, as I am sure you know.

[#Metro]

We're electronic now, so a lot of the older arguments are out the window, and I think the fare structure need only follow KISS, with a general guiding principle that the more you use it, the more you save.

Absolutely! I agree, it is something I like about GoCard. Whereas in Victoria they need a huge manual to make sense of anything and Sydney - Sydney is an expensive basket case. Totally horrendous.

[HappyTrainGuy]

It might be the flagfall responsible but the average joe sees it as the fare structure.

ps. I haven't seen a BILO in a decades haha. Spotting a Franklins would be easier hahaha.

[STB]

We're electronic now, so a lot of the older arguments are out the window, and I think the fare structure need only follow KISS, with a general guiding principle that the more you use it, the more you save.

Absolutely! I agree, it is something I like about GoCard. Whereas in Victoria they need a huge manual to make sense of anything and Sydney - Sydney is an expensive basket case. Totally horrendous.

Agreed about Sydney, am so not looking forward to learning the ticketing system down there when I move there in 2013.  Might need to do a Rocket Science degree before I go!    At least Brisbane uses the KISS principal when it comes to the fare structure.

[Antoniolino]

I've spent a lot of time in a lot of cities.  Aus and internationally.  I have quite a few friends who come and visit me from other cities quite often.  I have 2 degrees, 1 in planning 1 in business and law.  I've caught public transport on and off in Brisbane since 1992.  

What have these comments got to do with anything?

Have you been to Sydney?  There you will really find a ridiculous fares policy.

I find your opinions totally bizarre.  I've never met anyone who has anything good to say about Bris Pub trans.

I have.  I don't know too many that don't like the Go Card actually.  As for the fare levels, that is not a problem with the technology.

Thats why I asked if you worked for Translink, I was genuinely thrown.  And to dismiss good feedback and data out of hand is disappointing, particularly internet-based feedback when you obviously like technology.

Good feedback?  All I saw was a whinge.

The fares are too expensive, the service is slack, full stop.

Agree here.

I spent November in HK ( don't bother starting with the 'you can't compare us to HK', I understand all those issues).  They have a true smart card.  We can only dream.  The best and most valid comparison to Brisbane is Perth.  WA has a genuine commitment to public transport and it shows.

Exactly how is HK's smart card better than ours?  And if you say "It cost me x to do y" I will scream.

The real issues:  Translink, the BCC buses and ferries and the metro trains should all be merged into a single true metro entity.  This would would result in monster savings and efficiencies.  The state government (either party) is to lazy or lacking in vision to do this.  And therein lies the real core issue: No commitment to affordable and effective public transport by the State.

Agree re: BCC buses coming under state control.

Basically, if you are unemployed in Bris, you can't afford to catch many, or even any, buses or trains.  In any other city, you can afford it.

I re-iterate.  Nothing to do with Go Card.  It's not like pre-Go card unemployed were granted concessions.

Re the relevance of other cities, I call it comparative or baseline data.  Re the 'feedback v whinge' that contradicts your next comment re agreeing that 'the service is slack and too expensive'.  Again, I'm surprised and disappointed someone with an interest in this are would have that attitude.  Again I saw some excellent detailed examples of how how Brisbane transport fails individuals in all sorts of ways.

To me the Go Card is a side issue, I think thats why we are at crossed purposes.  I've wandered into a forum where all the separate issues are corralled.  I'll go now.  

[Gazza]

What! You shop at BILO! Cheapskate !

Aldi FTW.

I'll re-iterate what Simon has said. Nothing wrong with GoCard as a technology. It's the fare levels set that are the problem. If we still had Go Card, but with the fare levels from a couple of years ago, things would be pretty sweet actually.

I guess the issue of unemployed people not getting concessions is one RBoT never thought to address much. Not that we are uncaring about those on low incomes, we just never thought of it.
Have you ever lobbied MPs etc on the issue?

[STB]

Aww Altinolino, you will come back though won't you.  Your rants (somewhat misguided) are actually entertaining for me. 

[#Metro]

The fares are too expensive, the service is slack, full stop.

Much of the current system is geared towards what one might call 'welfare' or 'coverage routes', but this is slowly changing.
These inherently require high subsidy and cost to run because they are run regardless of patronage. Route 198 would be an example. There is also a lot of waste (i.e. Route P88 and the whole basket of 4XX buses out to the west) and missed opportunities (better all day use of rail).

I spent November in HK ( don't bother starting with the 'you can't compare us to HK', I understand all those issues).  They have a true smart card.  We can only dream.  The best and most valid comparison to Brisbane is Perth.  WA has a genuine commitment to public transport and it shows.

GoCard is sufficient for the city right now. I'm happy with it. I know Hong Kong has the Ferrari version where you can pay in stores etc with it, but we don't need that yet IMHO. It would be useful to have B-PAY on the Card like in Perth and Canberra.

The real issues:  Translink, the BCC buses and ferries and the metro trains should all be merged into a single true metro entity.  This would would result in monster savings and efficiencies.  The state government (either party) is to lazy or lacking in vision to do this.  And therein lies the real core issue: No commitment to affordable and effective public transport by the State.

It isn't clear what benefits this would have. They're all TransLink right now, and the real issue is frequency, scope of hours, speed and interconnectivity, all of which are being dealt with by the rollout of a Core Frequent Network.

[ozbob]

I guess the issue of unemployed people not getting concessions is one RBoT never thought to address much. Not that we are uncaring about those on low incomes, we just never thought of it.
Have you ever lobbied MPs etc on the issue?

Not so, been raised publicly many times, have supported QCOSS with their efforts in this regard and have lobbied direct at various Ministerial Level committees.

And we in fact we still support efforts for Health Care Card Holders to be given concession travel.  Been at this for a while.  eg. http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=4278.msg32648#msg32648  and http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=4278.msg32597#msg32597

[Antoniolino]

I've spent a lot of time in a lot of cities.  Aus and internationally.  I have quite a few friends who come and visit me from other cities quite often.  I have 2 degrees, 1 in planning 1 in business and law.  I've caught public transport on and off in Brisbane since 1992.  I find your opinions totally bizarre.  I've never met anyone who has anything good to say about Bris Pub trans. Thats why I asked if you worked for Translink, I was genuinely thrown.  And to dismiss good feedback and data out of hand is disappointing, particularly internet-based feedback when you obviously like technology.

What's good to say about it? If you don't live next to a busway or buz route you've jack all. Extra trains/service changes has to get the okay from so many people in Translink. The whole Translink network shuts down at 6pm. Certain bus routes stop before 8pm. Routes go on sight seeing trips to the city. Railway infrastructure has been forgotten about for the last decade. The railways aren't supported as the backbone of PT. Buses are treated like their own heavy rail network instead of operating between the two. Feeder? What's a feeder service? Translink still runs hourly and 2 hourly frequencies within 10km of the CBD. Heck, there's one daily service servicing Shorncliffe at 11ish during the week. HOW THE HELL DOES ANYONE BENEFIT FROM THAT! Along with constant fare increases and the joke of the fare structure for short trips its easy to see why.

Thank you happy train guy.

[dwb]

I guess the issue of unemployed people not getting concessions is one RBoT never thought to address much. Not that we are uncaring about those on low incomes, we just never thought of it.
Have you ever lobbied MPs etc on the issue?

Not so, been raised publicly many times, have supported QCOSS with their efforts in this regard and have lobbied direct at various Ministerial Level committees.

And we in fact we still support efforts for Health Care Card Holders to be given concession travel.  Been at this for a while.

The inclusion of HCC holders would be the biggest boon for equity, much more than simply lower fares across the board and worse services.

[#Metro]

I agree this health care card thing is an issue. It is a bit of a crack in the system- it is possible to not qualify / or be waiting many months for Centrelink and have a low income.

The inclusion of HCC holders would be the biggest boon for equity, much more than simply lower fares across the board and worse services

Absolutely. Those who can pay should pay so that those who cannot won't have to.

Lower across the board fares will just give discounts to those who can afford them (am I allowed to call these the "rich") - 9-5 commuters who work in the CBD and have well paying jobs in big corporations.

What's good to say about it? If you don't live next to a busway or buz route you've jack all. Extra trains/service changes has to get the okay from so many people in Translink. The whole Translink network shuts down at 6pm. Certain bus routes stop before 8pm. Routes go on sight seeing trips to the city. Railway infrastructure has been forgotten about for the last decade. The railways aren't supported as the backbone of PT. Buses are treated like their own heavy rail network instead of operating between the two. Feeder? What's a feeder service? Translink still runs hourly and 2 hourly frequencies within 10km of the CBD. Heck, there's one daily service servicing Shorncliffe at 11ish during the week. HOW THE HELL DOES ANYONE BENEFIT FROM THAT! Along with constant fare increases and the joke of the fare structure for short trips its easy to see why.

I agree with HTG, but as I have always said, discounting a rotten apple doesn't make it less rotten. So I think this is NOT a reason for reducing fares- increasing frequency and upgrading services is what needs to be done plus a focus on innovative network planning and movement towards a patronage oriented system. At least the increases in fares are going into service upgrades and we have seen that last year (BUZ 180/412/196/222 and so forth) and there will be more BUZification this year as well (Hopefully a BUZ 400 and BUZ 230).

[somebody]

I'll go now.  

I wouldn't mind if you actually had reasonable supporting arguments.

[Gazza]

For the record, I am of the firm belief that the feedback comments in the CM and BT articles online are true reflection of how Brisbanites feel about the current situation.

To an extent. In the media, the things that get the most attention are stuff like fares, and on time running etc, because they are easy to complain about.

People complain about fares just the same way as increases in power bills, water bills, rego, council rates, airport parking, petrol, coles/woolies prices etc. Not saying they are unjustified in doing so, its just that it gets all the limelight.
The simple fact is the price of something is the easiest thing in the world to complain about. People always have complained, people always will, no matter how cheap.

Along with this, you'll get the somewhat simplistic view that "PT fares should be half price/free etc etc and then everyone would use it", or "All the money they spend running go card, they could have free PT, derp!"
Not saying that this wouldn't help a bit, but as we all know, a cheap PT system doesn't magically make it a good one.

Same goes for on time running, and as a result we get knee jerk reactions where trains get slowed down to make them appear on time.

Occasionally you'll get a cursory comment about "I used PT in [European City] and it was wonderful, why cant we be like them?". Still not productive.

I guess what I'm really trying to say is that on the CM/BT article comments, you're only ever gonna see this type of discussion.

The real nitty gritty in terms of operation and planning NEVER gets discussed at the widespread level, even though its the stuff that actually matters in the long run.

As a result of this somewhat media driven political situation, we have stuff like the LNP announcing 9 trips then free as some big pillar of their transport policy, rather than visionary stuff like getting rail lines built and fully re-drawing the bus network, and frequent trains and so forth.
Or worse still actually being regressive and saying non solutions like Park and Ride in the inner city are the answer.

The big issue for me is that 93% of trips don't use PT.
This is why it bothers me that so much energy and political debate goes towards placating existing users and making sure don't get upset by small changes, that it actually ignores the huge number of potential trips that don't use the system.

[#Metro]

As a result of this somewhat media driven political situation, we have stuff like the LNP announcing 9 trips then free as some big pillar of their transport policy, rather than visionary stuff like getting rail lines built and fully re-drawing the bus network, and frequent trains and so forth.
Or worse still actually being regressive and saying non solutions like Park and Ride in the inner city are the answer.

Yes, I would gladly trade 9 trips then free for frequent train services that save 15 minutes off waiting time!

The big issue for me is that 93% of trips don't use PT.
This is why it bothers me that so much energy and political debate goes towards placating existing users and making sure don't get upset by small changes, that it actually ignores the huge number of potential trips that don't use the system.

agreed here!

[Set in train]

In Brisbane:
http://translink.com.au/tickets-and-fares/other-tickets/paper-tickets

With a single paper ticket, you can transfer between any number of buses, trains and ferries in a two hour window (within the zones your ticket is for).

The two hours starts when you buy your ticket.

Transfers must be made between different route numbered services (return journeys are not permitted).

Passengers travelling through 11 zones or more will have their final transfer time extended by 90 minutes.

So basically the same. Return journeys are not policed in effect.

Not policed? Year ago, bought a 2hr ticket, into city, onto ferry outbound, bus into New Farm. Bus driver whinged for a while that I was going home on a one way ticket when I hadn't even reached the Chiropractor. Reminded him of his training to avoid complaints re. fares and BT's golden quote from training, "a driver not a conductor".

[Set in train]

I guess the issue of unemployed people not getting concessions is one RBoT never thought to address much. Not that we are uncaring about those on low incomes, we just never thought of it.
Have you ever lobbied MPs etc on the issue?

Not so, been raised publicly many times, have supported QCOSS with their efforts in this regard and have lobbied direct at various Ministerial Level committees.

Great for them, what about seniors? Every other Aus jurisdiction offers a Seniors Card at 60. Qld, only 65. This needs fixing too.

[Set in train]

What's good to say about it? If you don't live next to a busway or buz route you've jack all. Extra trains/service changes has to get the okay from so many people in Translink. The whole Translink network shuts down at 6pm. Certain bus routes stop before 8pm. Routes go on sight seeing trips to the city. Railway infrastructure has been forgotten about for the last decade. The railways aren't supported as the backbone of PT. Buses are treated like their own heavy rail network instead of operating between the two. Feeder? What's a feeder service? Translink still runs hourly and 2 hourly frequencies within 10km of the CBD. Heck, there's one daily service servicing Shorncliffe at 11ish during the week. HOW THE HELL DOES ANYONE BENEFIT FROM THAT! Along with constant fare increases and the joke of the fare structure for short trips its easy to see why.

Mmmmm, good. Busway open 10-11 years, two historical city all stop buses in the area still not feeding locals to the busway station. Two former Cityexpress services still not accessing the busway as soon as possible as promised or serving the busway station. World class in the sixth world.

[ozbob]

I guess the issue of unemployed people not getting concessions is one RBoT never thought to address much. Not that we are uncaring about those on low incomes, we just never thought of it.
Have you ever lobbied MPs etc on the issue?

Not so, been raised publicly many times, have supported QCOSS with their efforts in this regard and have lobbied direct at various Ministerial Level committees.

Great for them, what about seniors? Every other Aus jurisdiction offers a Seniors Card at 60. Qld, only 65. This needs fixing too.

Seniors cards are available to all at 60 --> http://www.seniorscard.com.au/

Queensland has some restrictions between 60 and 65.  Council of The Aged, Older People Speaking Out, QCOSS are all organisations that lobby with respect to these entitlements.

[Stillwater]

The question is whether those over 60 get concessional travel on trains, ferries and buses.

Eligibility

To be eligible for a Queensland Seniors Card or Seniors Card +go, you must be a permanent resident of Queensland. You must live in Queensland for at least 6 months of the year and your home address must be shown on your driver licence or be registered in your name with (at least) 1 of the following:

•Electoral Commission of Queensland
•Centrelink
•Commonwealth Department of Veterans' Affairs

You must also be:
•65 years or older and not working full-time*
or
•60–64 years, not working full-time* and hold any of the below ◦a centrelink customer reference number (CRN) with one of the below:

■Pensioner Concession Card
■Health Care Card
■Commonwealth Seniors Health Card

◦a  Department of Veterans' Affairs file number (Gold, White or Orange card).


*Not working full time means you're not working 35 hours or more each week in paid employment.

From the above, it would appear that a concessional go-card based on a seniors qualification is issued only to those over 60 who have a pensioner concession card, health care card, or Commonwealth seniors health card, and unconditionally only after a person reaches 65 years.

At age 60, to qualify for a Seniors Card, people sqeak in on the eligibility front if they have pre-qualified for the Commonwealth Seniors Health Card.

To qualify, you must:

be an Australian resident, living in Australia
not subject to a newly arrived residents waiting period
have reached age pension age but do not qualify for Age Pension (or do not receive certain other Social Security/Veteran Affairs pensions/benefits)
provide Centrelink with your and your partner's tax file number or be granted an exemption from providing your and your partner's tax file number, and
have an annual adjusted taxable income* of less than: $50,000 (singles)
$80,000 (couples combined), or
$100,000 (couple combined for couples separated by illness, respite care or where a partner is in prison).


*This limit is increased by $639.60 for each dependent child you care for.

[Antoniolino]

Hello. again.  Very strange experience on here yesterday, very strange indeed.  I expected some productive discussion but was harangued by strangely defensive people.  I've put it down to new guy syndrome, and also the fact I didn't really understand the preoccupation with thread purity.  Thats fair enough, I'll try and play by the rules.  And besides, im a big bloke.  But you have to understand, I'm first and foremost a political activist.  Distraction by side issues is political death.  My motivation is first and foremost to 1) Get concession fares for unemployed people; and at a macro level 2) get Bris PT affordable and at least in line with other capitals.

I've got nothing against the Go Card per se (putting aside the significant amount of people who have been gouged for not touching off correctly and have sworn off PT), but politically its a side issue.  Its like being given a brand new silver-plated spoon to eat a bowl of sh%t, its still a bowl of sh%t.

Also, I'll say it one more time, for people with a genuine interest in PT reform to dismiss the feedback from the online articles is elitist and misguided.  I understand the implications of the whinge factor, I've been a long-time professional researcher, but as I've said, if you care to look, theres a lot of good data to be gleaned.  Another Quest article today with another swag of feedback.

I'll be starting 2 threads:  'Getting Concession Fares for unemployed people'
and 'Macro reform of Brisbane Public Transport', for big picture political discussion.

all the best. We'll see how we go.

[ozbob]

My motivation is first and foremost to 1) Get concession fares for unemployed people; and at a macro level 2) get Bris PT affordable and at least in line with other capitals.

Both very admirable aims and inline with much of thinking and discussion here.  By the way, we do monitor the media blog feedback constantly and in fact many here are significant contributors! 

As a researcher you well understand the the need to get the big picture and not get thrown by an individual view point ...

As some good fuel for your fire check out our survey results here --> http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=7144.0

[Antoniolino]

thanks bob, fully understand that, I'll check it out.  Where should I put the big picture political thread?  Doesn't rally fit into any of your sections?

[ozbob]

thanks bob, fully understand that, I'll check it out.  Where should I put the big picture political thread?  Doesn't rally fit into any of your sections?

Queensland Open is fine, or if you want to use it  for the looming elections ( good strategy ) --> 2012 Queensland State Election  http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?board=64.0

Concession stuff is probably best in the Go card and TransLinkfares ...

[Set in train]

I've got nothing against the Go Card per se (putting aside the significant amount of people who have been gouged for not touching off correctly and have sworn off PT), but

I had a few problems, three or four times, phoned up to correct them and all fixed fares were refunded to me, it was not a problem, the only negative was having to register my go card.

[Gazza]

I've had the same thoughts about the forum set up too, Open Forum is the best bet: http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?board=11.0

Also, I'll say it one more time, for people with a genuine interest in PT reform to dismiss the feedback from the online articles is elitist and misguided.  I understand the implications of the whinge factor, I've been a long-time professional researcher, but as I've said, if you care to look, theres a lot of good data to be gleaned.  Another Quest article today with another swag of feedback.

I'm not really disagreeing with the on-line feedback (Example of where I have?). I agree that fares are too high. I agree that services are largely inconvenient.
Whenever an article gets run about Cross River Rail, there tends to be a high level of support for that project so people are on the money there.

My point was that on-line articles only capture a snapshot of what current users think about the issues that affect them at a micro level, which is narrow in the context of what actually needs to be done to fix PT here.

....Things like WiFi and Quiet Carriages gets media attention and public discussion.
....Things like a flat junction between rail lines not being grade separated, causing delays and capacity constraints on a day to day basis doesn't get media attention.

Hello. again.  Very strange experience on here yesterday, very strange indeed.  I expected some productive discussion but was harangued by strangely defensive people.

You've never used an online messageboard before? I don't think its fair to single people out as being 'bad' or whatever because they disagreed with you on only some of your points.

[Antoniolino]

Didn't say bad Gazza I said strange.  I've said why I thought that happened.

I fully understand the implications of your comment re the micro individual effects.  But broad themes can be gleaned from that data.  Any decent researcher can pick an irrelevant spoiler, misinformed or party hack comment and dismiss it.  Its social research 101.

[Gazza]

Didn't say bad Gazza I said strange.

Still, calling people strange is a little unfriendly IMO.

I fully understand the implications of your comment re the micro individual effects.  But broad themes can be gleaned from that data.  Any decent researcher can pick an irrelevant spoiler, misinformed or party hack comment and dismiss it.  Its social research 101.

True, but I think its flogging a dead horse a bit at this stage.
PT in Brisbane is inconvenient and too expensive. Cool.

Now, how will we actually go about fixing everything?
The answers probably wont come from a CM blog at this point (Though you may notice a few RBoTers get on there and try and post 'semi techincal' solutions and explanations

At least down in Melbourne the discourse in the media went from just bagging Connex, to a realisation the networks woes were infrastructure based and so forth, and then at that point the govt got voted out.

[Antoniolino]

Sorry Gaz but I found the defensive tone and dynamic of the forum strange, just being honest.

[#Metro]

Sorry Gaz but I found the defensive tone and dynamic of the forum strange, just being honest.

On this forum, everyone argues a lot (I disagree with a lot of other forum posters) but we also try not to be personal
and stick to arguments/facts; a lot of good comes out of it.

If you have a position, you do have to back it up etc. Not everyone will agree and that's fine. I disagree with Gazza on a number of things, other things we agree on, that's how it works.

[ozbob]

Twitter

TransLinkSEQ TransLink SEQ
go frequently then go free; take 10 go card journeys in a week then travel free http://t.co/M68wDtgQ
1 hour ago

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Good advice ...