On the Buses

[WTN]

May I suggest that it is no coincidence that the "connecting buses" list shown at the South Bank terminals in the latest version of the ferry network map (which appear to be BUZ routes plus the Glider, 66 and 109) includes both the 100 and the 180?

http://translink.com.au/resources/travel-information/maps/111002-ferry-network-map-a3-final.pdf

Anyway, enough drip feeding. I don't want to totally spoil the surprise :p

I'm not fully convinced - not all routes on the map are BUZ, just the more "common" routes.

The 180 only serves 2 stops on Logan Rd, which are covered by 174/175. The 170 covers the next section (Holland Rd - Creek Rd). I have to agree extending the 180's run on Cav Rd is more important.

Anyway, enough drip feeding. I don't want to totally spoil the surprise :p

When is the announcement?

Nikko said end of month, so not long to go.

[david]

If the 100 is BUZed then the only remaining 1xx BUZ candidate would be the 110.

Perhaps it's time for the rest of Brisbane to see some upgrades.

Hear hear! The western side of Brisbane is in desperate and urgent need of a review/BUZ upgrades. Although, I would imagine the next lot of upgrades would be associated with the Northern Busway opening.

[Mr X]

If the 100 is BUZed then the only remaining 1xx BUZ candidate would be the 110.

Perhaps it's time for the rest of Brisbane to see some upgrades.

Funny you say that. A little birdie once said:

Those routes really don't go to the same place at all, except that they all touch Garden City.  The 444 actually covers most of the western suburbs north of the river.  Brookfield, Fig Tree Pocket and the north of Chapel Hill are too far to walk of course.  It's really the latter which I'd be mostly worried about.  Brookfield is low density, Fig Tree Pocket has the highway stop.

A bit disappointing that they aren't having 15 minute corridor to Mt Gravatt Central via Logan Rd in the evenings, at least by the implication that only "afternoon" trips are being added to those runs.

http://busaustralia.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=63125
The 110 would definitely be overkill. Does it even get decent loadings?

Meanwhile the western suburbs have rotten apple on the 420s, 430s and 450s.. nice   don't get me started on the 230 to the east. Easily the most unreliable route in Brisbane.

[somebody]

When I have used the 110 it has certainly had decent loadings.

I think it is the Centenary suburbs which really suffer under poor PT in the west.  450 is far too slow to Riverhills.

[#Metro]

A Centenary BUZ is needed; Hardly anything decent out at Jindallee/Riverhills etc.

[longboi]

Anyway, enough drip feeding. I don't want to totally spoil the surprise :p

When is the announcement?

Nikko said end of month, so not long to go.

It should be up on the website early next week (Pending the web team's approval). Customer Liaison Officers will be out on the network promoting the new services from Wednesday.

[STB]

Routes 100 and 180 has been confirmed to be upgraded to BUZ status.

Queen St bus station stop changes

From Monday 31 October, there'll be a few changes to bus stops at Queen Street bus station to make room for all the extra route 100 and route 180 services now they have been upgraded to high frequency routes.
Route 110 and 115 move to stop A5

    If you usually catch route 110 or 115 from stop A1, you'll now need to move to stop A5 to catch your bus.
    There'll also be minor timetable changes to both of these routes to give you a combined 20 minute peak and 30 minute off-peak service during the week.
    Plus there'll be an extra route 110 service on Sunday morning to get you into the city around 9am.

Route 134, 135 and 155 minor timetable changes

    To make room for routes 110 and 115 at stop A5, there'll be minor timetable changes on routes 134, 135 and 155 for a smoother journey in and out of Queen Street bus station.

Route 183 will move to stop C2

    If you usually catch route 183 from stop C1, you'll now need to move to stop C2 to catch your bus
    All route 183 services will also leave from Queen Street bus station 5 minutes later from 31 October to coordinate with the other buses that use this stop.

http://translink.com.au/travel-information/service-updates/bulletin/1316657233

[david]

Yay! I win

But in all seriousness, 100 BUZ is fantastic news! There are really no more 1xx routes that need to be BUZ-ed. Lets move on to the Brisbane West region now and sort that out.

Forest Lake residents will be spoilt for choice come Monday 31 October!

[#Metro]

Congratulations all around for RAIL BOT!

[longboi]

Congratulations all around for RAIL BOT!

It seems that RBoT chatter has also led to P88 being routed into the interchange.

Park Ridge will also see more services to give consistent 30/60min frequencies.

[#Metro]

Hallelujah! And its not even Christmas yet...

Election soon???

[david]

Wait, did I just read that P88 is going to be re-routed into Indooroopilly Bus Station???

Finally! Common sense prevails! This is a big win! P88 is no longer such a waste of a service!

[#Metro]

I think I am going to have kittens! What happened at TransLink? It's like they finally woke up!
Trains fixed up please..

[Mr X]

Ipswich TUZ req'd

[STB]

Extend 393 to Roma Street and KGSBS before Semester 1 2012 please!

[somebody]

It seems that RBoT chatter has also led to P88 being routed into the interchange.

Cool. But it's still wasteful to have a service which is duplicating what is already a well serviced corridor while it doesn't actually go anywhere.  Extend along 425 route perhaps?

[#Metro]

Simon, I think their logic is this.

Suppose that you have three activity centres.
You have a BUZ service like this (each | is a stop)

A <----|----|-----|-----B-----|-------|-----|------> C

When you get to B, you change buses.

Alternatively, if you have a feeder and trunk model, your patronage may be high enough to support that AND
an all day express.

A <----|--------------B-----------------|------> C

Question is, is it really faster on P88 vs interchange? Also P88 is a bit slow coming off the Captain Cook Bridge plus weaving around Roma Street.

[somebody]

Simon, I think their logic is this.

Suppose that you have three activity centres.
You have a BUZ service like this (each | is a stop)

A <----|----|-----|-----B-----|-------|-----|------> C

When you get to B, you change buses.

Alternatively, if you have a feeder and trunk model, your patronage may be high enough to support that AND
an all day express.

A <----|--------------B-----------------|------> C

Question is, is it really faster on P88 vs interchange? Also P88 is a bit slow coming off the Captain Cook Bridge plus weaving around Roma Street.

The problem with that model is the operating hours of the P88.  In Sydney, they'd have an L44 with the operating hours of the P88 doing the express bit, but that doesn't fit in with the BUZ principle.

It certainly feels slow along Queens Wharf Rd, but the via South Bank bit isn't fast either.  Using Elizabeth St I/B from the SE Busway would be much faster, but that doesn't work with the 111 from KGSBS.

[longboi]

The P88 serves two purposes. To provide a single seat cross-town journey for those travelling from SEB to Western suburbs and to provide an alternative to 444 between Indro-City.

[somebody]

The P88 serves two purposes. To provide a single seat cross-town journey for those travelling from SEB to Western suburbs and to provide an alternative to 444 between Indro-City.

That may be, but I would say that the through town idea isn't very well used in practice.  I can accept that Milton workers might like it better than the 15 minute train frequency though.

[longboi]

The P88 serves two purposes. To provide a single seat cross-town journey for those travelling from SEB to Western suburbs and to provide an alternative to 444 between Indro-City.

That may be, but I would say that the through town idea isn't very well used in practice.  I can accept that Milton workers might like it better than the 15 minute train frequency though.

I do know there are BBC students and Milton workers who are very happy with it.

[O_128]

The P88 serves two purposes. To provide a single seat cross-town journey for those travelling from SEB to Western suburbs and to provide an alternative to 444 between Indro-City.

That may be, but I would say that the through town idea isn't very well used in practice.  I can accept that Milton workers might like it better than the 15 minute train frequency though.

I do know there are BBC students and Milton workers who are very happy with it.

ahhh, so there was someone high up with a kid a BBC and didn't like his kid transferring so they created the 88 

[HappyTrainGuy]

Question is, is it really faster on P88 vs interchange? Also P88 is a bit slow coming off the Captain Cook Bridge plus weaving around Roma Street.

Every time I've used the P88 with the train interchange at Roma Street its always beaten the 111 to Griffith Uni Busway. Along with none of this farting around trying to find change and trying to get out of the Queen Street busway two busses at a time before the light goes red or the jam with the lights at the Cultural Centre.

[STB]

Caught another overloaded 66 out of Kelvin Grove QUT today, but with a difference.  I managed to bump into someone who might make my day next year.

[Gazza]

and to provide an alternative to 444 between Indro-City.

Why is that necessary? Is it like..."Hmm, I don't like the number 444, or the train, I think the number 88 is a much more pleasing number, I'll take a bus with that on it instead"

[somebody]

and to provide an alternative to 444 between Indro-City.

Why is that necessary? Is it like..."Hmm, I don't like the number 444, or the train, I think the number 88 is a much more pleasing number, I'll take a bus with that on it instead"

Incompetence.

444 carries the bulk of the load on the outbound due to the city stop locations, and also the previously poor O/B route via Grey St & Milton Rd.  Haven't I banged on enough about this?

If you cast your mind back, the creation of the 88 pre-dated the train frequency increase due to the Richlands branch, by a few months so the trains didn't help a great deal at the time.

[longboi]

and to provide an alternative to 444 between Indro-City.

Why is that necessary? Is it like..."Hmm, I don't like the number 444, or the train, I think the number 88 is a much more pleasing number, I'll take a bus with that on it instead"

No, its to provide extra capacity on the CBD-Indro section if 444 is already full.

[Gazza]

But the reason for going to 8MP?

Why does it need to be all day? I've used 444s at lunch hour along Coro Drive, and they aren't even half full!

Why not just do something like a '444A', and have peak hour short workings from Indro?

Why not have all Coro Drive routes leaving from the same location, so they can pick up the slack and share the love?

If they knew the train frequency boost was coming, why not hold off for a couple of months and see what that would do, and then implement this as necessary?

[somebody]

But the reason for going to 8MP?

That's the logical part of the service.  A CCB SE Busway service seems good to me.

[longboi]

But the reason for going to 8MP?

Why does it need to be all day? I've used 444s at lunch hour along Coro Drive, and they aren't even half full!

Why not just do something like a '444A', and have peak hour short workings from Indro?

Why not have all Coro Drive routes leaving from the same location, so they can pick up the slack and share the love?

If they knew the train frequency boost was coming, why not hold off for a couple of months and see what that would do, and then implement this as necessary?

The P88 wasn't implemented for that purpose; It just so happens that as a consequence it provides additional capacity along that corridor.

[Gazza]

That's the logical part of the service.  A CCB SE Busway service seems good to me.

But it's a bit of an 'indulgence' if you get what I mean, what with the current state of most of the network....Of everything wrong with PT in SEQ, saving people a little bit of time on that corridor gets to the front of the queue of funding priorites?

Why not give every Southside busway route a full time CCB counterpart for the fun of it then?

It just so happens that as a consequence it provides additional capacity along that corridor.

It might sound peverse on my part, but if its getting to a point where 444 between Indro and the City are too full, I'd rather those passengers give up on the bus and spill over to the trains instead, which are of equivalent frequency.

[somebody]

That's the logical part of the service.  A CCB SE Busway service seems good to me.

But it's a bit of an 'indulgence' if you get what I mean, what with the current state of most of the network....Of everything wrong with PT in SEQ, saving people a little bit of time on that corridor gets to the front of the queue of funding priorites?

I don't know but I expect that the loadings on the 111 supported the idea, with the 160 not properly assisting any more.

It just so happens that as a consequence it provides additional capacity along that corridor.

It might sound peverse on my part, but if its getting to a point where 444 between Indro and the City are too full, I'd rather those passengers give up on the bus and spill over to the trains instead, which are of equivalent frequency.

Did you read my post about 6 posts above?  The trains were NOT on an equivalent frequency at the time the 88 started.

EDIT: GW, split off your post for the Oct 31 changes.  Link: http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=6900.0

[Gazza]

Did you read my post about 6 posts above?  The trains were NOT on an equivalent frequency at the time the 88 started.

So why not wait the whole of 3 months? That's what network planning is all about isn't it?

I mean, how long has the INB had huge problems with people not being able to board and they happily let that drag on, but Indro City has to be fixed right there and then?

[O_128]

That's the logical part of the service.  A CCB SE Busway service seems good to me.

But it's a bit of an 'indulgence' if you get what I mean, what with the current state of most of the network....Of everything wrong with PT in SEQ, saving people a little bit of time on that corridor gets to the front of the queue of funding priorites?

Why not give every Southside busway route a full time CCB counterpart for the fun of it then?

It just so happens that as a consequence it provides additional capacity along that corridor.

It might sound peverse on my part, but if its getting to a point where 444 between Indro and the City are too full, I'd rather those passengers give up on the bus and spill over to the trains instead, which are of equivalent frequency.

Having just done a tedious assignment on Indooroopilly its mainly due to the terrible bus/train interchange. Best idea is to reroute all buses down station road then up coonan street back onto moggil road with a stop outside the rail station rather than the current loop into the shopping centre.
If i was coming from further out then intro I would stay on the bus even though it can take twice as long as the train because I cbf walking.
Red route is proposed route .

[somebody]

So why not wait the whole of 3 months?

No idea.  Although it would have been planned for some time before that.

O_128, having timed it on the 433/445 which does something similar to what you are suggesting on the I/B, it is slightly slower that way.  The train goes to the train station.  I don't have a huge problem with the bus going somewhere different.  Major problem is that it is slow and Stanley St end of Indro has a mediocre service.  If you are travelling from Sherwood to Moggill it's easy enough to walk between the stations.

[Gazza]

I suggested something to that effect in the past on here, with the bus interchange actually being a transit mall type arrangement on Station Rd, outside the pig and whistle, though my preferred routing had buses coming along Woodville Rd since it looked shorter on the map.

Terminating buses would have whipped around the trianguar block where it says "SunFay" and gone back up the hill.

The train goes to the train station.  I don't have a huge problem with the bus going somewhere different.

Still, I'm one for maximising interchange opportunities, since it just opens up a wider range of travel patterns, perhaps even ones never envisioned.

[O_128]

I suggested something to that effect in the past on here, with the bus interchange actually being a transit mall type arrangement on Station Rd, outside the pig and whistle, though my preferred routing had buses coming along Woodville Rd since it looked shorter on the map.

Terminating buses would have whipped around the trianguar block where it says "SunFay" and gone back up the hill.

The train goes to the train station.  I don't have a huge problem with the bus going somewhere different.

Still, I'm one for maximising interchange opportunities, since it just opens up a wider range of travel patterns, perhaps even ones never envisioned.

we proposed closing that section of station road to general traffic. And Simon I have some great pics of the elderly walking up that hill. for a principle activity centre its not the best solution

[Golliwog]

I don't think you'd want to make it a bus mall. If the idea is to make it an interchange stop, you'd want something more focused on having the bus stop right next to the station.

There was a post up here that had a busway style set up with 2 stops, one at the shopping centre and another at the station before going back to Moggill Rd via Coonan St. I liked that idea, though it would be infrastructure intensive. If you put a restriction on it that you just had to work with what we have an only minor changes, then I'd think you would need to take some lanes from general traffic near the station to allow for it. Or make the bottom end of Station Rd bus only, though getting on/off that from Coonan would be a nightmare in peak hour.

[Gazza]

That was my suggestion. Too hard to find the topic now.

[ozbob]

--> http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=195.msg71829#msg71829 earlier from O_128