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Author Topic: Displaying "Bus Full"  (Read 1546 times)

Offline Derwan

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Displaying "Bus Full"
« on: October 20, 2016, 08:19:05 AM »
Does anyone know what the protocol is for displaying the "Bus Full" notice on buses?  Lately I've noticed more and more buses NOT stopping because the bus is full.  The bus display doesn't reflect this.  People are madly waving - thinking the driver hasn't seen them.  Occasionally the driver acknowledges them and indicates that the bus is full (e.g. points behind them).

I would've thought that two things should be happening when drivers skip stops because the bus is full:
  • The "Bus Full" notice should be displayed.
  • The driver should be recording (somehow) that they skipped stops because the bus was full - allowing collection of statistics.
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Offline #Metro

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Re: Displaying "Bus Full"
« Reply #1 on: October 20, 2016, 08:30:57 AM »
Why don't they have a "Take next bus" or simiar?
Negative people... have a problem for every solution.
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Offline verbatim9

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Re: Displaying "Bus Full"
« Reply #2 on: October 20, 2016, 08:44:06 AM »
Rarely I see the bus full sign. Not sure what the policy is on HF routes because there are always people getting off at certain stops. We need that estimator software that indicates how full your bus is. (As earlier discussed on another thread).

Offline urbanplanr

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Re: Displaying "Bus Full"
« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2016, 09:38:27 AM »
I see the Not In Service and Go Maroons one quite frequently which leads me to believe it isn't that hard to change it so the question is why don't they do it? They must not have a strict protocols around this.
I love transit but I have a specific interest in line haul transit systems, particularly LRT and BRT.

Online techblitz

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Re: Displaying "Bus Full"
« Reply #4 on: October 20, 2016, 10:07:55 AM »
many a driver that starts his run late during the peaks more often than not wont bother with 'sorry bus full' because they have a 'hunch' that another bus will follow through in the next 1-5mins.
Still very irritating that they aren't updating it once the bus hits standee capacity....takes all of 10-15 seconds to do it.
Then again....when they get to a stop and heaps jump off....they have to adjust it once again :P :P

A console on/off button similar to the fare evasion button which would:
1 record data such as station that the on/off buttons was pressed
2. Send an advance notice to p.i.d.s and translink app.

Could help in keeping track of problem routes. But once again...is it really worth it when the main reason we see full buses is because of a late starting route?

Offline Derwan

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Re: Displaying "Bus Full"
« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2016, 12:20:46 PM »
Thanks all for your responses.

when they get to a stop and heaps jump off....they have to adjust it once again :P :P

This is something I wondered about.  Something like the 150 could be full before it gets to Garden City.  (I'm two stops before Garden City so often see full buses.)  But then a lot of people change at Garden City so the bus is able to take on more passengers from there.  Perhaps the drivers are worried that if they switch on the "Bus Full" notice, they'll forget to switch it off again.

Quote
A console on/off button similar to the fare evasion button which would:
1 record data such as station that the on/off buttons was pressed
2. Send an advance notice to p.i.d.s and translink app.

Could help in keeping track of problem routes. But once again...is it really worth it when the main reason we see full buses is because of a late starting route?

I think this would be a good idea - although I'm sure BCC wouldn't like it because it would highlight just how many buses end up full.

Come to think of it, this could be AUTOMATIC - based on Go Card touches and paper ticket sales.  (The latter may have to be a guestimate.)  As the bus approaches capacity, this could be indicated on the TransLink app (with perhaps colour-coding - green/amber/red).  The stats would be reset at the start of each route (when the bus is empty) to cater for failed touch-offs and paper tickets.

This would also help spread the load as it would allow people to reconsider the times they travel.  They can monitor the capacity of buses before they leave home/work and work out the best time to leave.  They might find that if they leave 15 minutes earlier or later, the buses at that time aren't as full.
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Offline Otto

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Re: Displaying "Bus Full"
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2016, 01:42:52 PM »
Funny you should bring this up at this time.

There was a major software update last night for the Driver Consoles. ( DCU )
Two new features were added.
1. 'On Time' running indicator.
2. 'Text' button with set messages to send to TL as needed.

One of the text messages is "Fully Loaded" so that can now be sent direct to TL
We are also required to use the "Full Load" status on our radio for BT ( for keeping records )
Also we can use the " Bus Full " desto + route number to inform passengers.
If I use the Buss Full desto, I will always pre program the desto back to the proper desto so when room becomes available, I can quickly change the desto back. ( Pre programming can only be done on newer desto controllers )

2013, SNO's 13. Evaders 157
2014, SNO's 5. Evaders 75
2015, SNO's 5. Evaders 102
2016, SNO's 5. Evaders 217
2017, SNO's 3. Evaders 272
2018, SNO's 3. Evaders 247

Offline Derwan

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Re: Displaying "Bus Full"
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2016, 03:13:27 PM »
Thanks Otto.  I was hoping you'd provide a bit of insight.  :)

We are also required to use the "Full Load" status on our radio for BT ( for keeping records )

I certainly hope this is happening.  There is a "gap" in the timetable for the 150 in the mornings.  The service just after that gap is usually full.  I hope this info is getting back to BT (and TransLink) so that perhaps they can slot in an extra service.
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Online James

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Re: Displaying "Bus Full"
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2016, 06:26:51 PM »
I've found buses displaying "Bus Full" to be really hit-and-miss. Some drivers are good and display it, others don't. None ever stop. Some also don't display the route number when the bus is full, which isn't really that helpful, particularly on duplicated corridors (is it the 427 which is full, or the 428?).

It'd be nice to see a capability built in to the go card system to allow a bus driver to get an indication of how full the bus is. It is really frustrating to see a bus drive past claiming to be full when there is still room down the back because people are too lazy to move down to the back of the bus or squeeze down a little more.
Is it really that hard to run frequent, reliable public transport?

Offline SurfRail

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Re: Displaying "Bus Full"
« Reply #9 on: October 20, 2016, 06:38:10 PM »
^ Opal is already set up for it - the various apps show loading data.

Offline verbatim9

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Re: Displaying "Bus Full"
« Reply #10 on: October 20, 2016, 10:46:14 PM »
^^That must of been the update Otto was talking about for the Qld Go Card System too?
« Last Edit: October 20, 2016, 11:47:02 PM by verbatim9 »

Online James

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Re: Displaying "Bus Full"
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2016, 11:51:04 AM »
Had anothee 'Bus Full' experience this morning. Driver flashed his headlights, no 'Bus full' desto or anything.
Is it really that hard to run frequent, reliable public transport?

Offline bcasey

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Re: Displaying "Bus Full"
« Reply #12 on: October 21, 2016, 12:17:40 PM »
It'd be nice to see a capability built in to the go card system to allow a bus driver to get an indication of how full the bus is. It is really frustrating to see a bus drive past claiming to be full when there is still room down the back because people are too lazy to move down to the back of the bus or squeeze down a little more.

This happens a lot on the 340 that I usually catch, both in the morning and afternoon peaks. A couple months back, I was on one going inbound, and the standees were only back to the rear door, but because the people at the front of the bus were packed together, the bus driver probably thought it was full, and bypassed several passengers waiting at the Kedron Brook and Lutwyche bus stops. I posted on Translink's facebook about it and put forward some suggestions (https://www.facebook.com/TransLinkQLD/posts/1489964507696276), but I doubt much was done about it.

More recently, I was waiting to catch the 340 home from RBWH, and the bus driver wouldn't let us on, even though there were still space at the back for a couple of people, even after I brought up this fact with him.

I know part of the problem specific to this route is the fact that the 340 is duplicating a lot of it's route with other Gympie road routes, and based on whichever bus turns up first will get the bulk of the patronage. This tends to be the 340, since a lot of passengers end up getting off at and before Chermside Shopping Centre.

More generally, there are a number of issues causing this problem:

 1) a cultural issue with people being lazy/selfish and not thinking about others,
 2) most people aren't willing to speak up or too scared or embarrassed to do so, if they see that there is a problem here,
 3) lack of visibility for the driver to see available space at the back (is it possible for them to get access to camera feeds at the back of the bus, or access to passenger count in real-time, as you mentioned here),
 4) The design of the buses really sucks for peak-hour travel, too many seats, not enough room to move in the aisle, not enough doors, doors not large enough to allow easy exit.

A seating arrangement similar to NY subway trains would allow for much more room for passengers to stand, and more importantly, more room to maneuver to allow people to quickly disembark.


With respect to an earlier comment in this thread, Translink is able to track the loading of the buses after the fact, from using the go-card data and comparing it to the seating and standing capacity of their buses. With the real-time system they currently have installed, I think it may also be possible for them to get this data transmitted in real-time. I have brought this up on the developer's forum a couple times, where they could provide the current loading (or even some simple categories like seats available, seats full, full bus, etc), but they have basically said they can't do that, but will take it into consideration.

 

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