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Couriermail --> Have your say on the name of the Cross River Rail station at Albert St, Brisbane $

QuoteQueenslanders will have the rare chance to name the first new train station in Brisbane's CBD in more than 120 years.

The state government is seeking the help of residents to determine the name of the new Albert St station being delivered as part of the Cross River Rail project.

While the names of all other stations being delivered through Cross River Rail have already been decided, the name of the station on Albert St remains undecided as the thoroughfare is not as well-known as other streets within the city.

The four short-listed names are Albert Street, Brisbane City, City Botanic Gardens, and Frog's Hollow. ...

Have your say on Albert Street naming

> https://crossriverrail.qld.gov.au/albert-street-station-naming/

The four short-listed names are Albert Street, Brisbane City, City Botanic Gardens, and Frog's Hollow.
The poll does not have ' other option '.  Farce!

Tell us if you have an alternative

If you would like to suggest a different or alternative name, you can do so by completing a naming submission form here:

Via a web form

Download the naming submission form

Electronic forms can be emailed to: info@crossriverrail.qld.gov.au

Hard copy forms can be mailed to: PO Box 15476, Brisbane City East QLD 4002

Nominations for naming close at 5pm on Friday 20 September 2024.

If you have any questions or enquiries please reach out to us using the options below:

Call 1800 010 875; or
Email info@crossriverrail.qld.gov.au

Facebook ...

Sent to all outlets:

Possible renaming of Albert St Station

6th September 2024

Greetings,

It has been ' announced ' that there is a possibility that Albert Street Station (Cross River Rail) could be renamed.
https://crossriverrail.qld.gov.au/albert-street-station-naming/

Four names have been put forward by DTMR:

1. Albert Street
2. Brisbane City
3. City Botanic Gardens
4. Frogs Hollow

Although there is no " other option " in poll there is a provision for suggesting an alternative if you look lower down on the page.
But it seems that the outcome is already confined to the 4 choices as presented by DTMR.

I have suggested previously that Meanjin would have been a good name for Albert St. 
See  Rename Albert St station Meanjin station  https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=15393.0

I lodged a Queensland Parliament E-Petition for this change which also received good support
https://www.parliament.qld.gov.au/Work-of-the-Assembly/Petitions/Petition-Details?id=3979

Sydney named a new Metro (a real metro) Station in Sydney City Gadigal. 
They are clearly  a more enlightened jurisdiction than Queensland.

This Albert Street naming exercise as presented on the CRR web site is an absolute farce! 
It is crass politics and is a deliberate attempt to manipulate an outcome.

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

https://x.com/railbotforum/status/1831719771118956869

They might as well have suggested King Charles III station. What a crap bunch of options.

They might not want to rename the station to Meanjin, so rather than just come out and say it, they will rename it to something else instead.

The effect of this will be to shut down attempts to rename the station, because why would you then rename a station twice before opening?

What a fuking bizarre poll  hey.  Vote for one of OUR 4 options but hey, you can suggest another but because it is not on the poll not really going to be counted hey?

No wonder our PT system is very much rooted, they really are incompetent. 

Record reported bus service disruptions yesterday.  Oh, don't worry about that.  Lets play musical station names!



Take note        game. is. on!

Enjoy! 

Quote from: Jonno on September 06, 2024, 06:39:38 AMThey might as well have suggested King Charles III station. What a crap bunch of options.

I could live with Frogs Hollow.

Quote from: ozbob on September 06, 2024, 06:59:26 AMWhat a fuking bizarre poll  hey.  Vote for one of OUR 4 options but hey, you can suggest another but because it is not on the poll not really going to be counted hey?

No wonder our PT system is very much rooted, they really are incompetent. 

Record reported bus service disruptions yesterday.  Oh, don't worry about that.  Lets play musical station names!



Take note        game. is. on!

Enjoy! 

You know that's how they do all consultation. Here is OUR plan now comment. Ok thanks for that we are changing nothing.

I just commented to a journalist that the proper approach would be to ask the community what their name suggestions would be. Then shortlist those and go to a poll. Presenting TMRs (allegedly) chosen names as a fait accompli just reconfirms the disconnect.

Quote from: Gazza on September 06, 2024, 07:50:43 AM

Quote from: Jonno on September 06, 2024, 06:39:38 AMThey might as well have suggested King Charles III station. What a crap bunch of options.

I could live with Frogs Hollow.

Agreed 👍 Of the four dictated names indeed.

🐸🐸🐸🐸🐸🐸

They are all bad options. As pointed out above, despite the location accuracy of "Brisbane City", it would be too confusing seeing as you'd have to change all QR voiceovers from the years and years of having every city bound train referred to as "this is a Brisbane City train".

Botanic gardens isn't great because of the location of the Northern entrance. Nowhere near the gardens.

Frogs Hollow is historically accurate but I actually don't think that many people know about it. I've often used that a as a fun "did you know" fact with people, so I doubt it would be accepted.

Albert Street is annoying as I don't like street names for stations but at the moment unfortunately it looks like the best bet.

My preference would still have been for Meanjin. I wonder why that has been so clearly and utterly rejected internally

They could have dual name system convention such as what they do in Canada or NZ.

e.g Albert Street (Meanjin)

They are both geographical descriptors.

I don't like Frogs Hollow as it sounds like something out of a Harry Potter Novel. We are not naming theme park precincts here either.

Surely "King Charles the Third, by the Grace of God King of Australia and His other Realms and Territories, Head of the Commonwealth Station" should have been an option.  Will be at Roma Street or the Gabba before the announcement has finished.

I swear to the Lords of Lords they have purposely made the survey as difficult to fill out as possible on purpose. They require you to submit a document! I just submitted this png 

Quote from: Jonno on September 06, 2024, 10:36:10 AMSurely "King Charles the Third, by the Grace of God King of Australia and His other Realms and Territories, Head of the Commonwealth Station" should have been an option.  Will be at Roma Street or the Gabba before the announcement has finished.

😂😂😂😂

---

Honestly Frog's Hollow is my favourite choice here. It might sound like a joke option now, but there are plenty of objectively bizarre place names and because people are used to hearing them it's a non-issue. This name has some personality, it will catch on quickly and it's geographically accurate.

Albert Street is fine. Generally speaking I don't think street names are the best approach, but in the CBD streets are a point of reference for everybody, and Albert Street isn't particularly long or hard to place.

Brisbane City is too vague and City Botanic Gardens is too far away (and too unwieldy of a name). Just no.

---

Meanjin is still the best option IMO. If there's a lot of chatter about that name, the government won't have any option except to address it.

I doubt this survey is a ploy to make Meanjin disappear as an option. If we're being cynical, it's probably more likely they're leaving it out so "overwhelming public feedback" makes Meanjin a clear decision. Including Meanjin as a survey option is ... fraught; throwing out the survey and going with Meanjin is easy and a good news story.

Government Statement

Queenslanders encouraged to help name new train station

https://statements.qld.gov.au/statements/101277

Queenslanders will have the chance to help name the first new train station in Brisbane's CBD in more than 120 years.

The new train station, located on Albert Street in the Brisbane CBD, is being delivered as part of the revolutionary Cross River Rail project, which will transform rail travel in south east Queensland and improve connectivity to the southern part of the CBD.

The Miles Government is seeking the help of sunshine state residents for this once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to determine the final name of the new Albert Street station.

Public transport stops and stations are traditionally named in line with the location of the station such as the suburb (for example, Bowen Hills) or a major street (Roma Street), or in line with a nearby landmark (Cultural Centre).

While the names of all other stations being delivered through Cross River Rail have already been decided, the name of the station on Albert Street remains undecided as Albert Street is not as well-known as other streets within the Brisbane CBD.

The four shortlisted names are:

. Albert Street;
. Brisbane City;
. City Botanic Gardens; and
. Frog's Hollow.

To have your say on the name of the new train station located on Albert Street, or to suggest an alternate name, please visit the Cross River Rail project website and click on the link marked 'A new name for Albert Street'.

Once the public has had their say, all of the feedback will be reviewed and a suggestion made to the  Minister for Transport & Main Roads on what the station should be called.

The Minister will then make a decision on the final name of the station.

Quotes attributable to Minister for Transport and Main Roads, Bart Mellish

"We want to make sure public transport is as easy to use as possible and that's why we're asking the public to help us name the new train station located on Albert Street.

"It is important to us that whatever name is decided on ensures customers have a clear understanding of the station's geographic location, can easily orient themselves when travelling on the Translink network, and helps customers connect with the local community in a consistent and common-sense way.

"The four names being suggested already meet traditional station naming conventions and would make it easy for our customers to understand where the station is located."

"Albert Street station is one of the shortlisted names and if that is the public's preference then we will move forward with that name, but this is about ensuring the name of the station makes it easy for customers."

More > https://statements.qld.gov.au/statements/101277

====

Sent to all outlets:

Re: Possible renaming of Albert St Station

6th September 2024

Greetings,

The proper approach would be to ask the community what their name suggestions would be. Then short-list those and then go to a poll.

Presenting DTMRs (allegedly) chosen names as a fait accompli just reconfirms the disconnect and the perception of token consultation.

Government Statement: 
Queenslanders encouraged to help name new train station
https://statements.qld.gov.au/statements/101277

This process should be terminated.  Corrected, and then start again.

Interesting feedback on RAIL Back On Track Facebook > https://www.facebook.com/RAILBackOnTrack/posts/929047649262091

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

Quote from: ozbob on September 06, 2024, 01:08:21 AMSent to all outlets:

Possible renaming of Albert St Station

6th September 2024

Greetings,

It has been ' announced ' that there is a possibility that Albert Street Station (Cross River Rail) could be renamed.
https://crossriverrail.qld.gov.au/albert-street-station-naming/

Four names have been put forward by DTMR:

1. Albert Street
2. Brisbane City
3. City Botanic Gardens
4. Frogs Hollow

Although there is no " other option " in poll there is a provision for suggesting an alternative if you look lower down on the page.
But it seems that the outcome is already confined to the 4 choices as presented by DTMR.

I have suggested previously that Meanjin would have been a good name for Albert St. 
See  Rename Albert St station Meanjin station  https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=15393.0

I lodged a Queensland Parliament E-Petition for this change which also received good support
https://www.parliament.qld.gov.au/Work-of-the-Assembly/Petitions/Petition-Details?id=3979

Sydney named a new Metro (a real metro) Station in Sydney City Gadigal. 
They are clearly  a more enlightened jurisdiction than Queensland.

This Albert Street naming exercise as presented on the CRR web site is an absolute farce! 
It is crass politics and is a deliberate attempt to manipulate an outcome.

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

https://x.com/railmaps/status/1831858433198530718

Quote from: RowBro on September 06, 2024, 11:05:37 AMI swear to the Lords of Lords they have purposely made the survey as difficult to fill out as possible on purpose. They require you to submit a document! I just submitted this png 

I just uploaded the indigenous place names image from the CRR website and circled Meeanjin.

I'm Team Frogs Hollow! With the recent trend of reviving CBD precinct names like Queen's Wharf and Howard Smith Wharves, I would love for the Frogs Hollow name to join them. What better way to acknowledge the one time district of Opium Dens and Brothels! 

Other than that, of the remaining 3 options, only Albert Street really works. Brisbane City is too vague and the City Botanic Gardens is too far away for the name to be accurate. Meanjin would be fine as well, if it gets up, but the history nerd in me really wants Frogs Hollow. We already have a Frogs Hollow Saloon up the road, why not Frogs Hollow Station as well.

Brisbanetimes --> CBD train station naming poll reignites calls to update network names $

Quote... Public transport advocacy group Rail Back on Track's Robert Dow said the options are not good enough.

"They've all got problems," he said. "Albert Street doesn't really define it, Brisbane City is really confusing."

"Frogs Hollow was the early name [given by] the white settlers for the area."

He added the Botanic Gardens were not close enough to warrant being the station's namesake.

It's not the first Dow has said about the station name, having spearheaded a petition last year to name the CBD station Meanjin, which attracted more than 1000 signatures from impassioned locals and was tabled in state parliament.

"The reason I put it in was so I could prompt a minister's response," Dow said.

"Frogs Hollow is probably the best name they've put up, but Meanjin is the traditional name for the area."

He said Sydney's recent Gadigal Station renaming proved First Nations names were not only possible for major cities, but were welcomed by the public. ...
 

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1832182200764395613

Sent to all outlets:

Re: Possible renaming of Albert St Station

Greetings,

Thanks to Brisbanetimes for publishing an article on this fiasco --> CBD train station naming poll reignites calls to update network names
https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/national/queensland/cbd-train-station-naming-poll-reignites-calls-to-update-network-names-20240906-p5k8jd.html

Quote

" ... Public transport advocacy group Rail Back on Track's Robert Dow said the options are not good enough.

"They've all got problems," he said. "Albert Street doesn't really define it, Brisbane City is really confusing."

"Frogs Hollow was the early name [given by] the white settlers for the area."

He added the Botanic Gardens were not close enough to warrant being the station's namesake.

It's not the first Dow has said about the station name, having spearheaded a petition last year to name the CBD station Meanjin, which attracted more than 1000 signatures from impassioned locals and was tabled in state parliament.

"The reason I put it in was so I could prompt a minister's response," Dow said.

"Frogs Hollow is probably the best name they've put up, but Meanjin is the traditional name for the area."

He said Sydney's recent Gadigal Station renaming proved First Nations names were not only possible for major cities, but were welcomed by the public. ... "

I think the authorities need to rethink this naming exercise with some priority. 

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

Attached: https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?msg=287287

I'm literally disgusted that Meanjin has not been offered as an option. Maybe the ALP are worried about being seen as too "woke" or something by choosing an Indigenous name, in the lead-up to an election?

They're probably also concerned the LNP will rename it if they're elected (remember Lady Cilento Hospital), probably to something daft like King Charles III station.

Quote from: GonzoFonzie on September 06, 2024, 10:00:36 AMThey could have dual name system convention such as what they do in Canada or NZ.

e.g Albert Street (Meanjin)

They are both geographical descriptors.

I quite like GonzoFonzie's suggestion, except IMO it might look better hyphenated i.e. Albert Street-Meanjin, rather than bracketed.
The other suggestions, including Meanjin on its own, would be meaningless to those not familiar with the city, or the rail network.

Quote from: achiruel on September 07, 2024, 10:28:02 AMI'm literally disgusted that Meanjin has not been offered as an option. Maybe the ALP are worried about being seen as too "woke" or something by choosing an Indigenous name, in the lead-up to an election?

They're probably also concerned the LNP will rename it if they're elected (remember Lady Cilento Hospital), probably to something daft like King Charles III station.

Lady Cilento had a lot of negative controversies to her name, including her saying at one point that children shouldn't be treated by people of colour, and that homosexuality was a 'cult' and wrong.  Hence, why people didn't want her name attached to the new hospital.

https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/national/queensland/cbd-train-station-naming-poll-reignites-calls-to-update-network-names-20240906-p5k8jd.html

Quote... However, Dow said members of his advocacy group feel existing stations are already failing this test, adding Central Station to their renaming hit-list.

"We think a good name for Central Station would be Anzac Square," he said.

This is not the first time Dow has pushed for change to the names of public transport infrastructure. After his recent advocacy for Park Road station to be renamed as Boggo Road, the name changed with little fanfare in August. ...

====

Recorded to support the Rail Back on Track suggestion to rename Central Station: "Anzac Sq. Station"

Sent to all outlets:

Renaming Central Station to ANZAC Square

7th September 2024

Greetings,

The anomalous 'Park Road Railway Station' has been properly renamed to Boggo Road.  Albert Street Station needs to renamed  'Meanjin' - this correctly describes its location. Albert Street doesn't.  Albert Street runs kilometres throughout Brisbane City and is not a location but a thoroughfare.

The final part of the improved legibility and common-sense is to rename Central Station to ANZAC Square.  Central has never been central to Brisbane, it was central to the rail network in a sense, but with our new network it is no longer central. 

This video explains why.

Recorded to support the Rail Back on Track suggestion to rename Central Station: "Anzac Sq. Station"



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6d94H5WNng
Regards
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

Lee Kernaghan - Spirit of the Anzacs (Official Music Video)

I have today submitted a submission to info@crossriverrail.qld.gov.au supporting the naming of the present Albert Street Station as Meanjin Station as per https://crossriverrail.qld.gov.au/albert-street-station-naming/

Note deadline for submissions is 20th September 2024.

"Better to have tried and failed than to have never tried at all." Sean-Paul Thomas,

Previous discussion forum thread Rename Albert St station Meanjin station > https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=15393.0

Just put in a submission explaining why I thought all four names were terrible and asking them to reconsider "Meanjin" as a name.

Imagine having the gall to say you can't use "Meanjin" because it's not a well known geographical term and then coming up with "Frogs Hollow". FFS - I've lived in this city for more than half a century and never once in that time heard that name used by anybody.

We're still just a frightened little colony.

^ thanks 🙏

Quote from: OzGamer on September 09, 2024, 10:55:38 AMImagine having the gall to say you can't use "Meanjin" because it's not a well known geographical term and then coming up with "Frogs Hollow". FFS - I've lived in this city for more than half a century and never once in that time heard that name used by anybody.

It was the first time I had heard of "Frogs Hollow" as well. Of the options they presented, I had to pick Albert Street. It does seem like it was designed that way on purpose.

I was surprised that Sydney went with Gadigal, given that when I am at the airport, Sydney appears to be the only one that doesn't show a secondary name (Brisbane shows Meanjin). If Sydney can do this, there's no reason Brisbane can't.

I'm beginning to wonder whether there is something that has happened behind the scenes that has nixed Meanjin as an option. Maybe local Indigenous groups have objected to using the name in this way? Or maybe the Government just fears a strong Anti-Voice style backlash over using an Indigenous name, this close to the election.

Quote from: nathandavid88 on September 09, 2024, 14:07:39 PMI'm beginning to wonder whether there is something that has happened behind the scenes that has nixed Meanjin as an option. Maybe local Indigenous groups have objected to using the name in this way? Or maybe the Government just fears a strong Anti-Voice style backlash over using an Indigenous name, this close to the election.

Then say so.  "We talked to the Turrbal and Jagera elders and that have asked us not to use Meanjin....

Quote from: nathandavid88 on September 09, 2024, 14:07:39 PMI'm beginning to wonder whether there is something that has happened behind the scenes that has nixed Meanjin as an option. Maybe local Indigenous groups have objected to using the name in this way? Or maybe the Government just fears a strong Anti-Voice style backlash over using an Indigenous name, this close to the election.

The suggestion re Meanjin has been around a long while and my understanding is the local elders don't have any issues.  The Government is just afraid to do anything that might rock a few peoples boats.

Gadigal is a great example of a decision by a Government that makes the right decisions.

There are already 2 Citycats named "Mianjin" - the original first gen and the more recent fourth gen.  I doubt if it was a mistake the first time in 1996 they would have compounded it.

The name is culturally and geographically appropriate in my view.