RAIL - Back On Track Forum

https://www.couriermail.com.au/sport/brisbane-olympics-and-paralympics-2032/brisbane-2032-organising-boss-condemns-bickering-over-venues/news-story/306f8726ba764c312adce574901c3f81

Quote... Lord Mayor Adrian Schrinner will continue to push for a stadium at Victoria Park despite Mr Crisafulli ruling out a new facility for the 2032 Games.

Mr Crisafulli yesterday committed to setting up an independent delivery authority should he win the October election. But he said the body would be restricted to recommendations to ensure no new stadiums were proposed.

The stance has left the two senior LNP leaders at odds, with Mr Schrinner this morning declaring any review would have to consider a new facility at Victoria Park following the "very compelling case" put forward in Graham Quirk's review of Games venues.

"I think any review would have to look at Victoria Park," Mr Schrinner said ahead of the Brisbane 2032 Organising Committee meeting. ...

 

ABC News --> Dumped Gabba rebuild proposal costs Queensland taxpayers $6.4 million

Quote. In short: The Queensland government this week announced it would axe plans to demolish and rebuild the Gabba for the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games.

. The government has confirmed it spent $6.4 million on the rebuild works, which was attributed to the development of a project validation report.

. What's next? The government is insisting the rebuild works will not go to waste and will be used to inform future works at the stadium. ...

https://x.com/JarrodBleijieMP/status/1770967931549335969?s=20

Quote from: ozbob on March 22, 2024, 11:25:11 AMhttps://www.couriermail.com.au/sport/brisbane-olympics-and-paralympics-2032/brisbane-2032-organising-boss-condemns-bickering-over-venues/news-story/306f8726ba764c312adce574901c3f81

Quote... Lord Mayor Adrian Schrinner will continue to push for a stadium at Victoria Park despite Mr Crisafulli ruling out a new facility for the 2032 Games.

Mr Crisafulli yesterday committed to setting up an independent delivery authority should he win the October election. But he said the body would be restricted to recommendations to ensure no new stadiums were proposed.

The stance has left the two senior LNP leaders at odds, with Mr Schrinner this morning declaring any review would have to consider a new facility at Victoria Park following the "very compelling case" put forward in Graham Quirk's review of Games venues.

"I think any review would have to look at Victoria Park," Mr Schrinner said ahead of the Brisbane 2032 Organising Committee meeting. ...

 

The case is and was not "very compelling" otherwise as what the AOC President said yesterday, why wasn't it proposed three years ago during initial planning. If Quirk's review came out a month ago during the council elections we would have a different outcome. The case for Victoria Park does not help given we had what was a random proposal by Archipelago at the time, magically coincide with a supposed "independent" review findings.

The Archipelago proposal was for the entire Victoria Park to be converted into a giant sports precinct including an athletes village, the Gabba replacement stadium, The Brisbane Live Arena, and a new swimming complex, and also what looks like a lot of apartments too. Maybe this would have costed at $3.4 billion in total. One stadium alone is nuts. Maybe some of those details were lost by the media and key political figures.

As for the Lord Mayor doubling-down on something that is out of his jurisdiction, either put-up $1 billion of rate-payers money to the new stadium or shut-up about it. How about you get on with finishing the original Victoria Park Barrambin master-plan announced in your last term instead.

Having a "no new stadiums" restriction will ultimately conclude that you will need new stadiums/arenas.

https://documents.parliament.qld.gov.au/events/han/1982/1982_10_12.pdf

page 1208

Some interesting observations   continues at the link ...

Quote from: andrewr on March 22, 2024, 00:22:00 AMGriffith Mt Gravatt campus on the other side of the motorway is closing in the next few years, is already state owned, has sporting facilities, an Olympic swimming pool and accomodation facilities - with some (potentially a lot) of work it'd make a nice athlete's village/facility among others.

And imagine, it could be just 1 busway station away from QSAC!

I find the idea that Mains Rd park'n'ride will even exist in its current form in 2032 to be worrying.
Step 1, if QSAC is used, is to bulldoze most of the parking (the multi storey can stay) and build plazas and amenities so it's actually a nice place. QSAC may never be Brisbane's premier stadium or anything, but it could be a just fine sporting precinct, and we can't spend $1.6b for it to turn back into a godforsaken car park the moment the Games are over.

"Robust" conversation

QuoteBrisbane Olympics boss admits political bickering over venues is not a good look | 7 News Australia

Quote from: AnonymouslyBad on March 22, 2024, 18:39:39 PM

Quote from: andrewr on March 22, 2024, 00:22:00 AMGriffith Mt Gravatt campus on the other side of the motorway is closing in the next few years, is already state owned, has sporting facilities, an Olympic swimming pool and accomodation facilities - with some (potentially a lot) of work it'd make a nice athlete's village/facility among others.

And imagine, it could be just 1 busway station away from QSAC!

I find the idea that Mains Rd park'n'ride will even exist in its current form in 2032 to be worrying.
Step 1, if QSAC is used, is to bulldoze most of the parking (the multi storey can stay) and build plazas and amenities so it's actually a nice place. QSAC may never be Brisbane's premier stadium or anything, but it could be a just fine sporting precinct, and we can't spend $1.6b for it to turn back into a godforsaken car park the moment the Games are over.

The parking plays a pretty crucial role for major events at Nissan Arena. Aside from the major sports home games that are played there (Queensland Firebirds, Brisbane Bullets), it's used for a huge variety of community events and other sporting bookings (Cheerleading nationals, Taekwondo tournaments, club netball and volleyball tournaments, futsal games, etc). Unless you build a Brisbane Metro extension or railway I think just by nature of the location it will still require a large amount of parking. On Bullets game days a huge amount of parking is just for staff, and some of those shifts don't finish til well after Midnight. There will always be demand for massive parking there. You should think about That carpark is for Nissan Arena first and foremost, and is simply used as a park n ride on days off

Is the "independent delivery authority" being pushed by Crisafulli the same as the one the Miles government is working to legislate?
If so, it would be great if this authority could give recommendations before the election, so that both parties can propose their plan before voters make their decisions.

So the current plan seems to be:

1. Ask for a review (done)
2. Reject the review findings (done)
3. Set up an Independent delivery authority
4. Lose Govt
5. Have another review of the already reviewed review
6. Abolish the independent authority that was just set up
7. Create *another* independent authority (the blue team version)
8. Somewhere in all of this do actual games planning
9. Outsource transport arrangements to BCC

Couriermail --> Kylie Lang: Games farce proof our leaders only care about the election $

QuoteSteven Miles has made us a laughing stock on the world stage, and his opposite number has hardly inspired, writes Kylie Lang. We're watching our golden Olympics opportunity crumble for short-term gain at the enormous expense of long-term gain.

The answer to ending this embarrassing stadium farce is not to cancel the Games but to man up and do them right.

I'm developing neck pain from all the cringing I've done lately, watching Steven Miles make Queensland a laughing stock on the national and international stage.

Admittedly, he was served a you-know-what sandwich by his predecessor, who did zip to progress the Games beyond endorsing them as part of her penchant for fame. ...

https://www.couriermail.com.au/news/opinion/kylie-lang/kylie-lang-games-farce-proof-our-leaders-only-care-about-the-election/news-story/d9652b763145cd4ecfb0ec2de3635abf

Quote... Opposition Leader David Crisafulli has hardly inspired by appearing to follow the same narrow path and ruling out the building of any new stadia. Perhaps he thinks it's better to be beige than fire engine red on an issue that is dividing many people.

Both leaders are acting for short-term gain at the enormous expense of long-term gain, not only for the city of Brisbane but also for other Queenslanders and visitors to our capital. ...

Brisbanetimes --> Schrinner firms his push for Victoria Park stadium's 'compelling case'

QuoteBrisbane's recently re-elected LNP Lord Mayor Adrian Schrinner has doubled down on his support for a new 55,000-seat Victoria Park stadium as a 2032 Games legacy to replace the ageing Gabba.

While reiterating before the first meeting of the Brisbane 2032 organising committee on Friday he would work with whatever option the government chose, Schrinner said some options were better.

"And I think the Quirk report really clearly portrayed that Victoria Park is a better option," he said of the outcome of the 60-day review of venue plans so far by former lord mayor Graham Quirk.

Schrinner also pushed back on the narrow scope of what he described as an otherwise "sensible position" now being taken to the state election by the LNP, saying "any serious review" needed to consider the "very compelling case" for Victoria Park. ...

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1771229700842500211?s=20

Sent to all outlets:

Re: A comment on the shambles that is Queensland and the ' games '

23rd March 2024

One of the RAIL Back On Track Members has neatly summarised the present circus with the ' Games '.

"So the current plan seems to be:

1. Ask for a review (done)
2. Reject the review findings (done)
3. Set up an Independent delivery authority
4. Lose Govt
5. Have another review of the already reviewed review
6. Abolish the independent authority that was just set up
7. Create *another* independent authority (the blue team version)
8. Somewhere in all of this do actual games planning
9. Outsource transport arrangements to BCC"

https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?msg=282002

Oh dear ...

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

Quote from: ozbob on March 19, 2024, 04:46:48 AMSent to all outlets:

A comment on the shambles that is Queensland and the ' games '

19th March 2024

"So this is probably the worse outcome now.  Not so much in the choice of venues but the clear political shambles we now have.  The LNP should they be successful in the Oct #qldvotes want to do another infrastructure review!

My scanning around the media, feedback etc. would suggest the community is very much divided on what is the best approach. The @couriermail had it right yesterday when they suggested @DavidCrisafulli and @StevenJMiles should pick up the telephone and agree on a non-partisan approach.

Since Brisbane was awarded the Games we have seen not much substantive progress at all. We are now in limbo once again until the outcome of the state election in Oct 2024 is the way I see it."

Code Select Expand

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1769794478158807514?s=20
Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

Apparently Quirk and Coates have been asked to speak at a federal senate committee public hearing on April 17th?

https://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Business/Committees/Senate/Rural_and_Regional_Affairs_and_Transport/PreparednessforGames/Public_Hearings

Couriermail --> Inside the brutal Olympics board meeting as blowtorch on Premier Steven Miles $

QuoteOne William St became a "sombre" Olympic hotbed as Games heavyweights descended on government headquarters where the Premier was told he had "lost control of the narrative".

Premier Steven Miles faced a brutally honest showdown with Games heavyweights at a sombre Brisbane 2032 Organising Committee meeting, as the board scrambled to retake control and win back community support.

One William St became an Olympic hotbed as board members including president Andrew Liveris, Australian Olympic Committee chief executive Matt Carroll, AOC president Ian Chesterman and Federal Sports Minister Anika Wells descended on the government headquarters on Friday morning. ...

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1771292089575461173?s=20

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1771291651312681444?s=20

Brisbanetimes --> 'Half-arsed Olympics': Has John Coates lost his magic touch? $

QuoteNearly a quarter of a century after his star turn in Sydney, Roy and HG's unofficial mascot of the 2000 Olympics was the first thing that came to mind for a Brisbane-based sports executive when a bombshell on venues for the 2032 Games dropped this week.

"Sydney had Fatso the fat-arsed wombat," the executive quipped. "We're going to have Brisbane, the half-arsed Olympics."

Fears that Brisbane, and Australia by extension, could be humiliated before the eyes of the world have been set off by the Queensland Labor government's controversial call on where the opening ceremony and athletics are to be held in eight years' time. ...

https://x.com/10NewsFirstQLD/status/1771291861962969242?s=20

I have never seen a media pile on to this degree, ever!

I think it is warranted.

It is impossible to keep up!!

   

As one Olympic official put it, the IOC 'lends its reputation' to the government hosting the event. State Labor is trashing that reputation through the usual chaotic way that it goes about planning and building major infrastructure -- with an eye to withering politics as the main game. As envisaged by the Council of Mayors, the Olympic Legacy was to have been a better connected SEQ. That won't happen.

At this rate, Brisbane's Olympic Flame will be carried on the end of a shortened broomstick handle, with an empty jam jar nailed to one end and stuffed with a kerosene-soaked rag, then lit. Some government person will spin a yarn about 'Australian ingenuity' and 'effective recycling', or some other nonsense.

ABC News --> Brisbane's Olympic venue dispute the inevitable result of two dramatically different visions

QuoteIt really, really shouldn't have been this hard.

Back in July 2021, when Brisbane was "picked" to host the 2032 Olympics – or carefully engineered by the International Olympic Committee (IOC) to be the inevitable winner of a one-city race – the subtropical city had a massive head start with an unprecedented 11 years to prepare.

But more than 900 days later, we are up to our third major plan for key venues.

At the start of this week, Queenslanders were treated to two radically different plans for how Brisbane might host the Olympics, in less than 24 hours.

Looking back, Monday's dramatic about-face by Premier Steven Miles was arguably the inevitable result of two totally different visions for the Games that have been on a collision course for about a decade. ...

I'd like to propose that the government was always in a no win scenario here.

If Miles had come out and said they were adopting all of the recommendations the media would have blown it up saying they were destroying the history of the Gabba and Victoria Park is too expensive and that the housing crisis is getting worse so we should spend the money on fixing that.

If Miles pushed through with the Gabba rebuild, the media would have gone with "the government is bulldozing a school and is ignoring local residents, also it costs a lot, won't somebody think of the homeless?".

Now QTAC is the "cheap" option but we don't get a new stadium so the narrative becomes "this is an Olympics that is not leaving a legacy, we are the laughing stock of the world", conveniently ignoring all the smaller upgrades to existing venues going on and the fact that no one else in the world gives a sh%t what happens in the buildup to the games. Most people just want to switch on the TV for the opening ceremony and see some cool fireworks.

If we had bipartisanship on any of the plans put forward we would already have cranes around Vulture st knocking down the Gabba and preparing for the rebuild. Instead, in an effort to differentiate policy leading up to an election, the LNP and Greens have used the games as a wedge issue and trying to scuttle any plans put forward.

The LNP have also unwittingly locked themselves into the QTAC plan. They will not demolish the Gabba and have ruled out Victoria Park. A 100 day review is most likely just going to be an exercise in attempting to validate the decision to use QTAC. A change in government in October is not going to result in any changes to the plans.

The only difference between the parties will be how they plan to improve the transport infrastructure in the area. If either party slapped their balls on the table and said they were running an underground line from Kuraby or Altandi through to Boggo Rd with stops at QTAC, market square + a couple of suburban stops they could really turn this into a huge win and convince everyone this was the right plan as it is far better to have transport infrastructure than a stadium. If instead, the best we are offered is a busway spur or god forbid they just YOLO it with the same strategy as the commonwealth games then yeah, it's Joever.

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1771339152174575891?s=20

If anyone wants to feel better about this debacle: my home city of Montreal built their Olympic Stadium for the 1976 Games, with an embarrassingly unfinished central tower, and only finished paying for it in 2006! And it's on its third roof that currently has holes in it that it needs to be replaced for another billion dollars!

It's commonly referred to as the 'Big Owe". What a legacy!

Sports-related cost overrun, Olympics 1960–2016

Summer Games   Country   Cost overrun

Montreal 1976   Canada   720%
Barcelona 1992   Spain   266%
Atlanta 1996   United States   151%
Sydney 2000   Australia   90%
Athens 2004   Greece   49%
Beijing 2008   China   2%
London 2012   United Kingdom   76%
Rio 2016   Brazil   352%
Average   –   213%
Median   –   120%

Calculated in local currencies, real terms.
Source: Oxford University's Saïd Business School.
as published https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/sport/half-arsed-olympics-has-john-coates-lost-his-magic-touch-20240321-p5fe5f.html

https://x.com/9NewsQueensland/status/1771306580161552437?s=20

https://x.com/9NewsQueensland/status/1771452246477136213?s=20

Couriermail --> QSAC upgrade for 2032 Games to be within 'existing' site $

QuoteControversial upgrades to make an athletics stadium Games ready won't need to encroach into critical koala habitat according to Queensland's environment minister.

But there is still little guarantee no trees will be felled under Premier Steven Miles plan to build a $1.6bn stadium at the Queensland Sport and Athletics Centre in Nathan.

QSAC is flanked by major roads on its east and south, an 80-hectare cemetery to its north, and Griffith University owned native bushland to its west. ...

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1771574825930113058?s=20

Couriermail --> 'Zero appeal': Tourism boss, developer's give ultimate smackdown to QSAC $

QuoteThe Queensland Sport and Athletics Centre, the State government's contentious pick as the main stadium for the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games, sits amid a mix of retail factory outlets, car yards, tyre and fast food joints and is just a javelin throw away from the Mount Gravatt Cemetery and Crematorium.

Beyond the nearby grounds of Griffith University's Nathan Campus and the Toohey Forest Park – whose koala population is set for a rude shock when bulldozers roll in - lie a handful of modest hotels, motels and eateries unlikely to fill the needs of the tens of thousands of spectators set to pour into the precinct for the Olympics.

It's a far cry from the Stade de France, France's largest stadium, which can fit more than 77,000 spectators, and is set to be transformed for this year's Paris Olympics. ...

Architect of Sydney Olympics blasts Queensland government's stadium plan | 7 News Australia

The Australian --> Labor spends big to spin Brisbane Olympic Games venues debacle $

QuoteQueensland Labor is spending big to make a political virtue of the 2032 Olympic venues debacle, mounting a social media blitz to trumpet Premier Steven Miles' move to put "cost of living relief" over stadiums.

The new ad campaign attacks the Liberal National Party for "backing an Olympic stadium" after former Brisbane lord mayor Graham Quirk recommended a new $3.4bn stadium be built as the city's showpiece Games venue at Victoria Park.

Mr Quirk's proposal for a new 55,000 seat oval stadium on the CBD's northern fringe was rejected by Mr Miles' cabinet this week, which instead approved up to $1.6bn in upgrades at the ageing Queensland Sport and Athletics Centre, previously known as QEII stadium, and another $1bn to spruce up the Gabba and Suncorp Stadium.

The anti-stadium ad runs alongside a photograph of LNP Leader David Crisafulli, despite the state opposition this week ruling out spending any public money on a new stadium if it wins government at the October election.

Mr Crisafulli will not take an Olympic venue plan to the election, but has pledged an infrastructure oversight agency would deliver a "pathway to fix the mess" within 100 days. ....

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1771589077621412245?s=20

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1771675633833115765?s=20

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1771718114121498700?s=20

The trouble with the Courier Mail poll is it's not a CBA analysis.

We are not just interested in costs (they are broadly the same across all options) but the surplus or net/residual benefit for each options.

A victoria park option would have good PT access, and be able to draw in the larger concerts and events.

The future revenue stream coming from these events that could not be held elsewhere could be enough to make that Victoria Park option the better one.

Do the CBA and NPV on these, if Quirk hasn't done so.

It's a poll!  Certainly a preference for VP amongst CM readers.

I don't think we will end up with that option.  LNP have vacated the 'political space ', so it will be Suncorp, and QSAC.  Minor improvements to the Gabba.

Quote from: ozbob on March 24, 2024, 12:32:27 PMIt's a poll!  Certainly a preference for VP amongst CM readers.

I don't think we will end up with that option.  LNP have vacated the 'political space ', so it will be Suncorp, and QSAC.  Minor improvements to the Gabba.

Absolutely correct Bob, if the LNP aren't making it a campaign level issue the plan won't change.

Couriermail --> Olympic fail: Legacy 'sidelined' as key body on six-month hiatus $

QuotePremier Steven Miles has been accused of sidelining Olympic and Paralympics legacy following revelations a key body established to advise Cabinet on the long-term opportunities has not met since he took over in December.

The minister now responsible for advising Cabinet on the legacy outcomes from hosting the 2032 Games – State Development Minister Grace Grace – has conceded she is yet to convene a meeting of the government's legacy committee, and has no plans to until May.

The Premier's office passed queries on to the department of State Development and Infrastructure – where a spokesman claimed the legacy committee was a "valued and important function in advising the government regarding legacy vision, strategy and plans".

But the department also revealed the committee last met in November – when former minister Stirling Hinchliffe was responsible – and it had only met twice in the past year. ...

Couriermail --> 'Said no to $3.4bn stadium': Premier brags about 100 days of achievements $

QuoteSteven Miles says his top achievement since becoming Premier 101 days ago is rejecting the findings of his $450,000 taxpayer-funded review of venues for the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games.

In an extraordinary social media post where he lists 45 things he has done "in the job as Premier" with no acknowledgment for any of his ministers or staff, Mr Miles lists right at the top: "Said no to a $3.4 billion new stadium." ...

 ...A poll of readers on couriermail.com.au last week revealed just 13 per cent of the almost 21,000 respondents backed that idea when compared with the Gabba rebuild favoured by his predecessor Annastacia Palaszczuk (18 per cent) and the inner-city Victoria Park option recommended by his own review (69 per cent). ...