RAIL - Back On Track Forum

Team Schrinner LNP

https://www.teamschrinner.com.au


Brisbane's rapid transit future is Metro

https://www.teamschrinner.com.au/news/brisbanes-rapid-transit-future-is-metro

QuoteA network of bus rapid transitways (BRT) serviced by fully-electric Metro vehicles is the key to Brisbane's public transport future, Lord Mayor Adrian Schrinner said.

Cr Schrinner said incorporating transitways along existing road corridors was cheaper and far more effective than trying to build heavy railways through built-up Brisbane suburbs.

"Brisbane is Australia's fastest growing capital city and that's creating opportunities and challenges for our city," he said.

"We need a proper transport plan to cater for our growth and all three levels of government will need to be involved.

"Bus rapid transit systems are being incorporated into growing cities around the world and Brisbane should do the same.

"Our Council is already delivering two Brisbane Metro lines connecting 18 stations between Eight Mile Plains and Roma Street, and Royal Brisbane and Women's Hospital and the University of Queensland.

"There is significant scope to expand Brisbane Metro services east to Capalaba, north to Chermside and out to Brisbane Airport in the future."

However, Cr Schrinner warned Council could not carry all of the burden for expanding Brisbane Metro.

"About 97 per cent of all taxation revenue is collected by the State and Federal governments," he said.

"Brisbane residents pay their fair share of tax so it's about time our road and transport network received a fair share so local motorists and public transport commuters can get home sooner and safer.

"If these other levels of government don't make significant financial investments – just like they've done repeatedly for Gold Coast Light Rail – further expansions of Brisbane Metro simply won't happen."

Turn-up-and-go Brisbane Metro services will start next year, reducing travel times and increasing capacity during peak times.

Metro vehicles and electric buses will be charged at a state-of-the-art depot currently under construction at Rochedale.

The State Government first outlined a vision for 75-kilometres of dedicated busways 26 years ago – including east and north lines – but only about a third was ever built.

"Fully separated busways probably aren't viable through Brisbane anymore but proper BRTs can work," Cr Schrinner said.

"We're already working with the State Government and Redland City Council to investigate extending Brisbane Metro services to transport hubs including Coorparoo, Carindale and Capalaba.

"Also, there's great potential for an Airport Metro given the Airtrain isn't practical or affordable for local travels as well as the 24,000 workers commuting to the ever-expanding airport precinct every day."

However, Cr Schrinner said building the proposed Gympie Road Bypass Tunnel between Kedron and Carseldine was the only way an at-surface bus rapid transitway would work through Brisbane's north.

"Queensland Investment Corporation is currently looking at our proposal for this tunnel and I am very confident it will stack up," he said.

"A proper transitway along Gympie Road could be delivered in a package deal with this tunnel, just like the Northern Busway was delivered with Airport Link.

"However, without this tunnel, it is unlikely we will ever see Brisbane Metros travel along Gympie Road to Chermside."

Bus rapid transitways have significant potential to spark suburban renewal.

"There's great potential to incorporate stations into new precincts along the route," Cr Schrinner said.

"For example, both Coorparoo Square and Carindale were built to incorporate buses and modern stations along these routes would be great places for mixed-used retail and housing developments."

Bus rapid transit networks in Brazil, Colombia and China are examples of what could be achieved in Brisbane.

Curitiba in Brazil was one of the first cities in the world to adopt bus rapid transit and has since sparked a transport revolution.

Bus rapid transit in Guangzhou, China helped regenerate many of the city's car-free urban villages, providing more employment opportunities for local residents.

Guangzhou's bus rapid transit network now carries around 800,000 people per day and is second only to Bogota's Transmilenio.

TransMilenio is now one of the world's largest bus rapid transit networks and was the Colombian capital's answer to massive population growth during the 1990s.

"World-class bus rapid transit networks are now operating successfully in cities across the world, providing fast and efficient public transport for millions of passengers every day," the Lord Mayor said.

"Brisbane is an Olympic city as well as Australia's fastest-growing capital and what it needs in the future is a network of bus rapid transit.

"We have nine years until the Brisbane 2032 Games and a once-in-a-generation opportunity to invest in critical infrastructure.

"Bus rapid transit would substantially improve connectivity throughout south east Queensland but it will only be possible if all three levels of government get on board."

Quote from: #Metro on February 08, 2024, 23:05:59 PMEngineering:

7 Evening News piece. Raised the issue of tram gross weight and load capacity for the Story Bridge.

QUT Strength and durability of the Story Bridge approach spans  1992

https://eprints.qut.edu.au/36060/

====

Until we can get a proper engineering bridge study doubt will remain about Story Bridge and light rail.

Team Schrinner is costing L1 at around $6 billion.  I think it might be a bit more than that.

$3.6 billion is based on GC LRT third stage costs. It's recent and it's Queensland.

It's unclear what basis the $6b figure put by Blue Team is based on as they haven't shown their working. 

Schrinner wants Brisbane Metro to Brisbane Airport. But the money used to do that could just subsidise more frequent Airport trains.

There seems to be a lot of dividing people by what vehicle they use. But Brisbane residents catch the Airtrain, as will Brisbane Metro passengers. Its just extending classic BCC bus vs train duplication to new areas and getting Translink to pay 75% for it.

There's also no connection between ownership and fare collection. If Translink equipment can collect a higher fare for Airtrain then they can collect a lower fare for Brisbane residents by halving the zone 1 and 2 fare rates on all modes and billing BCC the shortfall.

Lord Mayor will spend 6 billion and move 6000 pph! 

https://x.com/Pineapplerebel/status/1755713117626020216?s=20

^  I did an interview with ZZZ yesterday.

https://4zzz.org.au

Radio 4ZZZ Co-Host Alexis of the show The Pineapple Rebellion interviews Cr Ryan Murphy, Ms Tracey Price and Mr Jonathan Sriranganathan re Public Transport policies for the BCC Elections.  Some comments from Robert Dow RAIL Back On Track.

Interviews --> https://backontrack.org/docs/4zzz/4zzz9feb24.mp3 MP3  12MB

This goes for around 12 minutes.

Great interview. You can see member's research in action with the ABS statistics. Very hard to argue against sound research from a reputable third party.

Listen carefully to Cr. Ryan Murphy. It is obfuscation. He claims that BCC is just a contracted bus operator. Not so.

Maroon CityGlider exists. As does the BCC 2013 Bus Review. We don't see Kinetic buses or any of the other bus operators doing this.

So BCC is very much more than just a bus contractor. BCC meets all criteria for an actual transit agency. 

A fair funding policy from a State Government perspective would treat the same citizen similarly whichever SEQ LGA region they lived in. This implies the same per capita funding rate across all LGAs.

In turn, this also means no special exception for BCC because doing so would be unfair to all other 11 LGAs and divert funding from them to BCC.

^ Alexis also mentioned towards the end of the interviews they will be placing the full, unedited interviews with the candidates up on their web presence as well.

https://4zzz.org.au/program/the-pineapple-rebellion

https://www.facebook.com/pineapplerebellion

https://twitter.com/Pineapplerebel

Schrinner breathlessly referencing the busways of many cities much poorer than ours is interesting.

Also his hyping up of Guangzhou's BRT carrying 800 thousand passengers a day while possibly not realising that their metro carries 10 million passengers a day demonstrates how low his sights really are.

Where does the 200 tonnes come from?

Rigid Truck Trailer - 42t x 19m over 74m of Bridge = 163t. No restrictions to stop this happening!

Tram - 90t x 43.5m over 74m of Bridge = 153t!  Included 301 people @ 100kg

Hmmm

Opps typo in Cals

Rigid Truck Trailer - 42t x 19m over 770m of Bridge = 1,7022t. No restrictions to stop this happening! 42 trucks

Tram - 90t x 43.5m over 770m of Bridge = 1595t!  Includes 301 people @ 100kg - 18 trams (lifts use around 84kg average).

Whilst the individual axels weights will be different to this averaging I guess my point is that there is nothing stopping 42 trucks driving onto the bridge and 18 trams are never going to stop on the bridge either because they will be in their own lane.  I think weight is a furphy.

Edit. 

Longest Span is 282m

Rigid Truck Trailer - 42t x 19m over 282m of Bridge = 623t. No restrictions to stop this happening! 15 trucks

Tram - 90t x 43.5m over 770m of Bridge = 584t!  Includes 301 people @ 100kg - 6 trams (lifts use around 84kg average).

I can see a case for the tram being heavier than 15 trucks rolling up fully loaded.

Would there be one tram on the bridge at a time though?

Quote from: #Metro on February 09, 2024, 14:19:46 PMWould there be one tram on the bridge at a time though?

Maybe 1 or 2.  In the event trams need to stop. The rams could be stopped before they all get onto the bridge.

That's not also taking into account the infrastructure such as rails, track foundations, electrical work etc.

TBH and as if a Greens led Council will get a couple of billion to build such a tram line.

Reality check people.

Brisbanetimes --> Labor sees votes in suburban art, late-night dining and free early buses $

QuoteFor all the attention on how Brisbane will host the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games, there are many who believe the city needs a night-time economy first.

"Going into 2032, it is essential for Brisbane to become a 24-hour city," said QMusic chief executive officer Kris Stewart.

"I don't think we should be able to invite people to Brisbane in 2032 and ask them to be in bed by 6pm." ...

Four policies on the cards for mayoral candidates

Labor

Scrapping internal council spending on self-promotion and redirecting the funds to create better linkages with the arts sector and community.
Establish a Lord Mayor's LGBTQIA+ Advisory committee to reflect Brisbane's diverse community.
Make Night Link services free between midnight and 5am.
More opportunities to experience dining and entertainment options outside of normal business hours.

Greens
Revise operating hour conditions and noise limits for live entertainment precincts such as West End's Boundary Street to allow performing arts events to continue later into the night.
Introduce free off-peak (including weekends) public transport and more high-frequency bus services at night.
$6 million per year in direct funding for live music and performing arts gigs in suburban community venues.
$10 million towards a new First Nations cultural centre in Musgrave Park.

LNP
Facilitating the MoreTix initiative for ticket purchasers to explore additional events, accommodation, dining and unique experiences.
Providing evening discount parking rates at King George Square and Wickham Terrace car parks.
Supporting local organisations and communities to activate public spaces, particularly through grant and festival funding.
Encouraging suburban retail precincts to apply for the precinct promotion and activation sponsorship.

Quote from: HappyTrainGuy on February 09, 2024, 19:41:28 PMThat's not also taking into account the infrastructure such as rails, track foundations, electrical work etc.

Spot on. 

Couriermail --> Anti-tram campaigners slam Mark Bailey over light rail scheme $

QuoteFormer transport minister Mark Bailey has been slammed as "an absolute hypocrite" by Gold Coast anti-tram campaigners after he condemned a light rail scheme for Brisbane proposed by the Greens.

Greens lord mayoral candidate Jonathan Sriranganathan this week announced plans to bring trams back to Brisbane, promising a $10m study for a light-rail line from Mt Gravatt to Hamilton if his party wins control at next month's council election.

Mr Bailey - who as transport minister championed the controversial Gold Coast light-rail extension despite fierce opposition from many locals - took to social media this week to blast the Greens' Brisbane tram plan. ...

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1756174712558723100?s=20

Quote from: verbatim9 on February 09, 2024, 19:53:28 PMTBH and as if a Greens led Council will get a couple of billion to build such a tram line.

Reality check people.

Yes, never going to happen.  But credit to the Greens for having a go.

Why never?  We build 12-15 lane freeways for billions but OMG a tram!!!

Quote from: ozbob on February 10, 2024, 14:27:16 PMCouriermail --> Anti-tram campaigners slam Mark Bailey over light rail scheme $

QuoteFormer transport minister Mark Bailey has been slammed as "an absolute hypocrite" by Gold Coast anti-tram campaigners after he condemned a light rail scheme for Brisbane proposed by the Greens.

Greens lord mayoral candidate Jonathan Sriranganathan this week announced plans to bring trams back to Brisbane, promising a $10m study for a light-rail line from Mt Gravatt to Hamilton if his party wins control at next month's council election.

Mr Bailey - who as transport minister championed the controversial Gold Coast light-rail extension despite fierce opposition from many locals - took to social media this week to blast the Greens' Brisbane tram plan. ...

https://x.com/ozbob13/status/1756174712558723100?s=20

Well deserved!! He criticizes or blocked everyone  who doesn't agree with his views!! Hypocrite

Quote from: Jonno on February 10, 2024, 15:00:32 PMWhy never?  We build 12-15 lane freeways for billions but OMG a tram!!!

I am very supportive of light rail and trams. L1 will never happen IMO, not to say that light rail in some form may well happen though.  I reckon they should have gone for a route in inner Brisbane as a start (see > https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?msg=36324 for a few ideas).

What happened to the Greens excellent subway (real metro) proposal? ( https://greens.org.au/sites/greens.org.au/files/Planning%20Brisbane's%20Clean%20Transport%20Future_final_0.pdf ) Is that still to come? I hope so. 

I really wish if politicians are goingto get the crayons out and draw on maps that they actually do some of the required exercising of the noggin first.  Actual policy work is going to be many times better than dreck like this concept.

The Greens seem to have become sensible at streetscape and active transport issues, but they have a long way to go before they actually propose anything sensible when it comes to major projects like this - such as producing anything even vaguely approaching a rationale for why this should be built and to this particular alignment, and not one of any number of other things.

Something actually sensible would (for instance) include buying more articulated buses to replace rigid buses one for one, reconfiguring or purchasing additional bus depots to support them and improving inner city bus stop infrastructure to enable a higher proportion of artics.  That is a concrete and achievable thing to do (in a situation where each operator still buys their own vehicles instead of having State-supplied equipment).

More artics might be a good idea, provided there's qualified drivers available. Many bus drivers don't have HC licences.

Quote from: achiruel on February 11, 2024, 11:14:54 AMMore artics might be a good idea, provided there's qualified drivers available. Many bus drivers don't have HC licences.

In the time it would take for the order to be fulfilled it would be trivial to upskill enough existing drivers.

^ Also fixable pretty easily.

Couriermail --> Labor-Greens Brisbane City Council election deal is not on, Lord Mayor candidate says, despite Labor stalwart's comments $

QuoteLabor's Lord Mayor candidate has refuted claims from a party stalwart that she will do a deal with the Greens to form a majority in council after next month's election.

Tracey Price said "no deals have been done with the Greens, and no deals will be done with the Greens", after former Labor Lord Mayor Jim Soorley said his party and the Greens "will work together" if they believe they can form a majority in council.

Mr Soorley, speaking to ABC Radio Brisbane, said the Greens are "certainly a threat" of taking Labor seats at the March 16 election, but they pose a greater threat to the LNP. ...

Quote from: Courier MailTracey Price said "no deals have been done with the Greens, and no deals will be done with the Greens", after former Labor Lord Mayor Jim Soorley said his party and the Greens "will work together" if they believe they can form a majority in council.

To be fair, it is entirely possible to have a Red Team mayor leading a majority Blue Team council.

Tracey can win the Lord Mayoralty and still not have a majority in council.

The BCC election does not work the same way as for State and Federal elections. You can mix and match with BCC.

I believe Campbell Newman was a Blue Team Lord Mayor running a majority Red Team council for one term.

Quote from: SurfRail on February 11, 2024, 12:22:33 PM^ Also fixable pretty easily.

I don't think it will be as easy as you believe. For people with an HC licence, truck driving offers around 30% higher wages, for local shifts. Even higher for long-haul, for those who don't mind travelling. No need to deal with the public, less chance of being assaulted. I know what I'd take if driving a heavy vehicle was a career that interested me.

Former Transport Minister Mark Bailey ..

83% of trips by car! An increase instead of a reduction as per every IRTP till they removed the target

That's this his legacy!

Clearly the irony of showing a congested mess to prove that it should remain a congested mess is lost on him.

Quote from: Jonno on February 13, 2024, 07:18:36 AM83% of trips by car! An increase instead of a reduction as targeted in every IRTP till they removed the target

That's this his legacy!

Clearly the irony of showing a congested mess to prove that it should remain a congested mess is lost on him.

https://x.com/bne_lordmayor/status/1757505231318032462?s=20

^

https://x.com/CoxyJindas/status/1757506018685370416?s=20

I am starting to think that the Team Schrinner BCC Votes campaign is a flop!

A Labor / Greens Council could be a possibility for BCC.  The only factor against it is there is massive ' car brain ' out there. 

This is what Teams Schrinner thinks will get them over the line. 



I am not so sure ...

One thing I would really like if we do get a new council.  Drop the ' Brisbane Metro ' false representation and give it a proper name.

There are only 4 independent candidates for ward councillor (including Cr Johnston in Tennyson).  3 majors running in all 26 wards, and for LM (along with 3 independent mayoral candidates).

At what point did everybody just wake up and agree to replicate the nonsense in George St for the organisation that picks up the bins?

Sigh.

Quote from: SurfRail on February 15, 2024, 07:10:25 AMThere are only 4 independent candidates for ward councillor (including Cr Johnston in Tennyson).  3 majors running in all 26 wards, and for LM (along with 3 independent mayoral candidates).

At what point did everybody just wake up and agree to replicate the nonsense in George St for the organisation that picks up the bins?

Sigh.

Meanwhile in Moreton Bay, the state's third most populated LGA, both the mayor and five councillors (out of a total 12 wards) are being returned unopposed. Swings and roundabouts.

Quote from: ozbob on February 14, 2024, 15:43:30 PMI am starting to think that the Team Schrinner BCC Votes campaign is a flop!

A Labor / Greens Council could be a possibility for BCC.  The only factor against it is there is massive ' car brain ' out there. 

This is what Teams Schrinner thinks will get them over the line. 



I am not so sure ...

One thing I would really like if we do get a new council.  Drop the ' Brisbane Metro ' false representation and give it a proper name.

Agree not sure highlighting your achievements (mess) is the campaign winner they think it is.

Quote from: aldonius on February 15, 2024, 08:10:28 AM

Quote from: SurfRail on February 15, 2024, 07:10:25 AMThere are only 4 independent candidates for ward councillor (including Cr Johnston in Tennyson).  3 majors running in all 26 wards, and for LM (along with 3 independent mayoral candidates).

At what point did everybody just wake up and agree to replicate the nonsense in George St for the organisation that picks up the bins?

Sigh.

Meanwhile in Moreton Bay, the state's third most populated LGA, both the mayor and five councillors (out of a total 12 wards) are being returned unopposed. Swings and roundabouts.

Agreed.  I gather the changes around campaign spending limits has something to do with that sort of outcome.

There were a few GC divisions where the incumbent would have been automatically returned but for last minute nominations this week.  As it is that only happened in Div 4 (the current incumbent who will now be continuing replaced Cameron Caldwell after he won the Fadden by-election to replace Stuart Robert).  The AJP has 2 people running and one of those prevented Div 1 from being an automatic reelection.

4 councillor retirements out of 14 too, although in my view it should have been at least 8 of the 14.  Of the other 4 incumbents, one definitely shouldn't be re-running purely in the interest of their constituents (no prizes for guessing who I'm talking about), one has been around far too long (also no prizes for guessing who), and 2 of the others I just flat out don't like.

Sent to all outlets:

Stop Lying to the Public - Widening Roads has Never Busted Congestion

16th February 2024

RAIL Back On Track calls on all candidates in the fast-approaching Queensland Local Government election to stop lying to the public about busting congestion by widening roads.

Never Has. Never Will.

Even demanding reviews into the Queensland transport department to speed up widening roads doesn't change the fact that these projects have always encouraged the existing population to drive more for no economic benefit.

It's called Induced Demand.  Google it.

If widening roads was the answer to our congestion problems surely after all the investment over the last 50 years would have resulted in less congestion.  Yet congestion is worse than ever.

It's not population growth. It's not immigration. And it's certainly not economic growth.

It's the projects themselves that has created today's congested mess. Just ask Engineers Australia (1).

"Increasing capacity for urban road networks induces demand and is a major reason for increased traffic on the
network. Evidence of induced traffic demand has existed for more than 20 years."

"This makes attempting to "bust traffic congestion" through road construction, self-defeating. In this context, Australia's past transport investment strategy may be seen as questionable."

Even the conservative economists at the OECD are calling out the failure of the last 50 years in transport investment (2).

RAIL Back On Track welcomes Brisbane City Council Mayoral candidates calling out that widening roads will not bust congestion, and outlining policies to prioritise active and public transport.

They have clearly listened to the experts (3).

References:

1. Engineers Australia  https://www.engineersaustralia.org.au/sites/default/files/2022-01/Urban-Transport-Systems-TAS-Discussion-Paper-December-2021-revised.pdf

2. Video: The well-being lens applied to transport - OECD https://youtu.be/TkNmv6LHVrI

3. Brent Toderian: Don't "Balance" Modes — Prioritize Walking, Biking, and Transit https://denver.streetsblog.org/2017/02/09/brent-toderian-dont-balance-modes-prioritize-walking-biking-and-transit/

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