QLD Smart Ticketing - Open Payment

[ozbob]

IT News --> Could fingerprint scans replace Queensland's Go Card?

[ozbob]

TTA13-087 Request for Information for Next Generation Ticketing Project

--> here!

Description

Request for Information
Department of Transport and Main Roads (TransLink Division) Queensland, Australia.


The Queensland Government Department of Transport and Main Roads (TMR) is seeking information from the ticketing supplier industry about equipment and services relating to the provision of an automated fare collection (AFC) system. This information will assist TMR to further refine its requirements for the Next Generation Ticketing Project and understand the capability and capacity of the market to satisfy these requirements.

A Request for Information (RFI) document has been prepared to provide suppliers with:

    Information on the size and nature of the public transport system in Queensland, and
    An overview of the key functionality that the Department is looking to put in place at the completion of its current contract arrangements.

In addition to existing products and services, TMR is interested in receiving information from suppliers about implementation and transition approaches as well as options for future commercial arrangements.

All enquiries in relation to this RFI should be addressed to Nadeem Latif, Project Director (Next Generation Ticketing) by emailing NGTProject@translink.com.au.

The above information is provided by the TransLink Division of the Department of Transport and Main Roads (TMR).

[ozbob]

IT News --> Could fingerprint scans replace Queensland's Go Card?

^ interesting article.

As I understand it Q-connect (TMR) sets fares for rural Queensland not operators.

Seems that a minimum AFC for SEQ will be replaced, possibly Queensland wide.

Looking at all options.

Is there any kind soul that would care to drop me a copy of the Specification Documents please?  email admin@backontrack.org

[Stillwater]

An interesting sentence from the above article:

"In tender documents released today it explained that the current system is starting to show its age and is struggle with "above forecasted network growth".

[ozbob]

Yo, noticed that.  Just dismissed it as  largely more latent spin ....

System is struggling because of bad policy, right back in 2007.  No frills, no thrills ...

Bad policy begets more bad policy and it has moved into a classic death spiral  ...  junk it and move forwards ... 

[ozbob]

Media release 18th July 2014

Queensland: Next Generation Public Transport ticketing

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport passengers has welcomed the commencement of the Request for Information process for the Next Generation ticketing Project (1).

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"The present go card system is aging and lacks options such as open payment with credit cards and smart phone payment (2)."

"The failed fare structure, high cost and bizarre and in fact anti-public transport (3), is partly the result of the limited system options set up in 2007."

"We welcome moves to upgrade/replace the Automatic Fare Collection system (AFC). In so doing however it is important that detailed community consultation occur with respect to actual fare products such as possible periodical options and so forth as the project develops."

"Particular importance needs to be given to the present qconnect urban bus network. Qconnect fares are around half of what fares cost in south-east Queensland (4).  A move to a Queensland wide AFC, although desirable needs to be considerate  of possible fare cost impacts on rural Queensland public transport users."

References:

1. TTA13-087 Request for Information for Next Generation Ticketing Project

https://secure.publicworks.qld.gov.au/etender/tender/display/tender-details.do?id=12630&action=display-tender-details&returnUrl=%2Ftender%2Fsearch%2Ftender-search.do%3Faction%3Dadvanced-tender-search-open-tender%26amp%3BchangeLevel%3D%26amp%3Binputlist%3DhasETB%26amp%3BorderBy%3DcloseDate%26amp%3BwithdrawalReason%3D%26amp%3BexpiredReason%3D%26amp%3BtenderState%3D%26amp%3BtenderId%3D%26amp%3Bpage%3D3

2. Could fingerprint scans replace Queensland's Go Card?
http://www.itnews.com.au/News/389986,could-fingerprint-scans-replace-queensland8217s-go-card.aspx

3. Fare unaffordability crisis in SEQ
http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=10048.msg144110#msg144110

4. qconnect urban bus services http://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/travel-and-transport/qconnect/urban-bus-services.aspx

Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

[SurfRail]

I did an interview on regional ABC (throughout QLD) a few months back re ticketing and options.  Locals will take some convincing mainly because of the fare cost differential between Q connect  (reasonable fares) and SEQ (ripoff), the punters are not silly. It also appears that plans for TransLink to ' take over ' and rebrand Q-connect as TransLink and be integrated have also stalled.  Sound familiar?

Anyone found the e-tender notice yet?

The platform just needs to be common so you don't need a separate card when going between 2 different systems.

The ticket pricing shouldn't be problematic, all of the regional towns in WA which accept Smartrider have different pricing as I understand it. 

[ozbob]

I did an interview on regional ABC (throughout QLD) a few months back re ticketing and options.  Locals will take some convincing mainly because of the fare cost differential between Q connect  (reasonable fares) and SEQ (ripoff), the punters are not silly. It also appears that plans for TransLink to ' take over ' and rebrand Q-connect as TransLink and be integrated have also stalled.  Sound familiar?

Anyone found the e-tender notice yet?

The platform just needs to be common so you don't need a separate card when going between 2 different systems.

The ticket pricing shouldn't be problematic, all of the regional towns in WA which accept Smartrider have different pricing as I understand it.

Sure do SR  --> Regional Town Bus Services [WA]

What is a no brainer outside Queensland is often beyond the feeble bureaucracy in banana land ... 

[longboi]

IT News --> Could fingerprint scans replace Queensland's Go Card?

^ interesting article.

As I understand it Q-connect (TMR) sets fares for rural Queensland not operators.

Really qConnect only continue to exist so as not to confuse customers until a statewide rollout of TransLink occurs.

Contracted operators that don't come under the qconnect contracts do set their own fares - dependent on government approval.

[ozbob]

IT News --> Could fingerprint scans replace Queensland's Go Card?

^ interesting article.

As I understand it Q-connect (TMR) sets fares for rural Queensland not operators.

Really qConnect only continue to exist so as not to confuse customers until a statewide rollout of TransLink occurs.

Contracted operators that don't come under the qconnect contracts do set their own fares - dependent on government approval.

Thanks Nikko.  I would expect that most of the qconnect operators are on contracts?   If not on contract will this complicate the roll out to urban bus of the new AFC?  As would operators invest the necessary $$?

[ozbob]

The Guardian --> Contactless bank cards could see tube customers ditch Oyster cards

[ozbob]

Twitter

TfL Ways to Pay @TfLWaystoPay

Contactless arrives Sept 16, will cost the same as adult Oyster pay as you go. Daily and Monday-Sunday capping apply

[ozbob]

[ozbob]

Twitter

Transport for London ‏@TfLOfficial

From 16 September customers using contactless on Tube, tram, DLR London Overground & National Rail services will get daily & Mon-Sun capping

[STB]

I wouldn't mind seeing this as being a way to completely phase out paper tickets.  Pretty much everyone will have a contactless card - they can easily ask their local bank about getting one, if they don't have one already - and if they are infrequent travellers who don't feel that a Go Card is right for them, or they end up on a bus without any money on their Go Card  and have no cash on them to top up, then they could use this method instead. 

Have the same fares across the board between contactless and Go Cards with daily caps depending on where you initially touch on, plus weekly rewards such as half price travel say after 8 journeys, plus a standard account using your email address on the TransLink website to check your journey history and top up/register etc your Go Card and that's all you really need I think.

I'm rather excited by this technology, and I hope Brisbane takes this up and at least gives it a go.

[ozbob]

I would hope that the next generation ticketing will include open payment as an option.

It is time Queensland was welcomed into the real ticketing world ...

[Derwan]

With the new iPhone containing NFC there's now no reason NOT to have phone apps as an option for ticketing.

Apple Watch will also have NFC.  How cool would it be to touch on/off by placing your wrist over the reader!

[Gazza]

With the new iPhone containing NFC there's now no reason NOT to have phone apps as an option for ticketing.

Apple Watch will also have NFC.  How cool would it be to touch on/off by placing your wrist over the reader!

NFC has been on phones for a while, hence Singapore etc having it.
Apple have lagged in their implementation.

[Derwan]

NFC has been on phones for a while, hence Singapore etc having it.
Apple have lagged in their implementation.

My point was that now that all major phone manufacturers have it, apps can be developed for all of them. Let's not get into a pointless Apple Vs Android discussion.

[darthcaligula666]

just a question: how would that proposal affect people who do not have (and do not intend to have) a smart phone? i am more than happy with my phone as it is (and with extreme ocd, that wont be changing!) but me aside, what about a lot of the elderly who use the network? i cant imagine the would be in a rush to change the way they purchase their fares. would it really happen that these cards are replaced? i seriously hope not
it took me a very very long time to adopt the go card system into my routine, and now that i have i actually dont mind it (see my blog for example...) as for paper tickets, what about people who are visiting the network from interstate/overseas/interstellar space and only need to make a single or handful or journeys, and thus a paper ticket is more than adequate? (ie eliminates the hassle of go card purchase as they can rock up to the station and throw some coins into a vending machine and bingo, fare is paid for.
one thing i find incredibly frustrating is change for the sake of it. by all means, introduce new methods of purchase and payment. congratulations to the most innovative ideas: gold star, large cheque and all that stuff; but i dont agree with, nor see the point, of completely overhauling the system and doing away with paper tickets and go cards entirely.

[ozbob]

Smart phone is just an added option for those so inclined, as would be open payment generally.

Base go card (or equivalent) for all as required.

Paper tickets will probably get the chop.

[dancingmongoose]

I expect we will see passes pop up again like on the Gold Coast and when they do paper tickets will go

[STB]

I'm not sure why this is such an issue.  For Melbourne, I brought myself a Myki after I landed in Melbourne and got to Southern Cross via the Skybus.  For Sydney, I ordered an Opal Card in advance which arrived in time before I flew down there.

If tourists and infrequent travelers aren't doing their research prior to travel, then frankly that's their problem, we shouldn't be spoon feeding via paper tickets, just because people are lazy or can't be bothered in buying a Go Card.  We've seen in Melbourne that if push comes to shove, then people will head out there and buy a card, even if they don't use it that often.

I think that the Go Card will be the new paper ticket come 2016, with hopefully smartphone and/or contactless cards being an option for the more regular passengers.  If people don't have either, then they can fall back on the Go Cards and perhaps just load up a day or timed pass onto them when they purchase it or use one of their personal ones.

[techblitz]

on paper tickets...

the gold coast network has gone leaps and bounds since the G opened...there is now 7.5 SCHEDULED frequency across the board from southport to tweed heads.....

but imagine this....a full load of tram passengers arrive @ broadbeach south and there is a waiting 700 ready to head south....a line of about 20-30pax walkover to board...8 or so of them buy paper tickets...this is what i observed on sunday...it took the bus at least 5 minutes just to get out of the station.
When you have a case of 2 back to back and sometimes 3 back to back 700`s.....that means that someone has actually waited much longer than the promised 7.5 mins.sometimes the wait can blowout to 15 minutes.......tell me whats the purpose of even having 7.5min frequency buses in the first place?
Paper tickets are what is setting back an otherwise brilliant southport to tweed frequency...

[SurfRail]

^ Agreed, which is just another reason why the option of buying paper tickets should be buried in the machines as far as humanly possible so people just buy a go card.

[STB]

on paper tickets...

the gold coast network has gone leaps and bounds since the G opened...there is now 7.5 SCHEDULED frequency across the board from southport to tweed heads.....

but imagine this....a full load of tram passengers arrive @ broadbeach south and there is a waiting 700 ready to head south....a line of about 20-30pax walkover to board...8 or so of them buy paper tickets...this is what i observed on sunday...it took the bus at least 5 minutes just to get out of the station.
When you have a case of 2 back to back and sometimes 3 back to back 700`s.....that means that someone has actually waited much longer than the promised 7.5 mins.sometimes the wait can blowout to 15 minutes.......tell me whats the purpose of even having 7.5min frequency buses in the first place?
Paper tickets are what is setting back an otherwise brilliant southport to tweed frequency...

Just curious, is there confusion happening with tourists who don't realise that the ticketing system is integrated ala, buying a ticket on the tram, throwing that ticket out and then buying another on the bus?  I know it has happened on the Sunshine Coast in the past.

[BrizCommuter]

An article on contactless payment (e.g. credit cards) in London (written in the usual register style).
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/10/01/one_million_people_have_bonked_on_london_transport/

[ozbob]

I just registered a new Seniors/Go card combo ... expires 2023, is this a vote of confidence? 

[ozbob]

Metro (Washington) --> Riders invited to test new fare payment technology

Payment IconsMetro is inviting riders to help test its next-generation fare payment system using new payment methods, such as contactless credit cards and mobile phones.

Today, Metro began the process of recruiting up to 3,000 riders to participate in the pilot program, which will begin in January and last about three months. Riders selected to test the new electronic payment system (NEPP) will use transit cards, contactless bankcards or mobile wallets on their smartphones to ride Metrorail or Metrobus, and to pay for parking at selected locations.

Pilot participants will use new-generation faregates that will be installed at 10 Metrorail stations and new payment devices on six bus routes.

[ozbob]

If new Cubic consoles are to be rolled out does this mean that Cubic has the next generation electronic ticketing project?

Makes sense if they have ...

[Derwan]

Some interesting info:

http://www.news.com.au/technology/gadgets/iphone-6-and-6-plus-nfc-apples-plans-for-the-future/story-fn6vihic-1227104813694

The company is reportedly talking with partners to use the technology for anything from ID passes to train tickets. The report says that Apple is already in talks with HID Global and Cubic, one of the world's largest makers of secure building keycard and transit fare systems.

My dream of using Apple Watch to touch on/off might become a reality. 

[ozbob]

City AM --> Mastercard "Fare Free Friday": Free travel on London transport on 14 and 28 November using TFL's contactless payment

[ozbob]

Railway Gazette --> Chicago to introduce mobile ticketing

[ozbob]

Railway Gazette --> TfL plans to replace Oyster smart card technology

UK: Transport for London is exploring options to replace the technology which is currently used inside its Oyster smart cards.

Under the proposal, future Oyster cards would incorporate the contactless payment card technology which is used by bank credit and debit cards. This would allow fare payments to be handled using the proprietary Transit Transaction Model of payment rules and software which TfL developed to enable passengers to pay for travel using contactless bank cards instead of a dedicated smart card.

The Transit Transaction Model was rolled out across rail modes last year, and by moving the focus of the ticketing system from the smart card to the back office has provided TfL with the ability to offer CPC users a greater range of ticketing products, including a more flexible range of fare capping periods than was possible with the older Oyster technology. The development of a TfL CPC Oyster card would extend these benefits to smart card users.

The existing Oyster brand would be retained for the TfL CPC, with just the card technology changing. Passengers would apply for and manage the new card online, with a refundable deposit but no transaction fees for travel. The TfL CPC would only be used for travel, and would not offer the ability to make other payments such as at coffee shops.

If the supply industry response proves positive, the TfL CPC Oyster cards could be ready for passenger use in early 2016.

[ozbob]

Railway Gazette --> Hands-free mobile ticketing demonstration

[Derwan]

Railway Gazette --> Hands-free mobile ticketing demonstration

I actually wondered if something like this was possible.  It might be difficult to build in at remote stations though.  It might only be possible for things like subways.

[ozbob]

Cubic --> Mobile Payment

[verbatim9]

Apple pay coming to London Tube http://qz.com/422761/apple-pay-is-coming-to-londons-tube/

[verbatim9]

A good pay medium for tourists and infrequent users would work well here for PT uptake

[verbatim9]

Some interesting info:

http://www.news.com.au/technology/gadgets/iphone-6-and-6-plus-nfc-apples-plans-for-the-future/story-fn6vihic-1227104813694

The company is reportedly talking with partners to use the technology for anything from ID passes to train tickets. The report says that Apple is already in talks with HID Global and Cubic, one of the world's largest makers of secure building keycard and transit fare systems.

My dream of using Apple Watch to touch on/off might become a reality. 

http://qz.com/422761/apple-pay-is-coming-to-londons-tube/