2013 Fares

[colinw]

I didn't achieve as much as I hoped to this Christmas Holidays, and its all the former LABOR GOVERNMENT'S FAULT! 

[Stillwater]

Don't you worry about that!  You can lead a cow to water, but you can't make it give milk.

[Mozz]

I didn't achieve as much as I hoped to this Christmas Holidays, and its all the former LABOR GOVERNMENT'S FAULT! 

LMAO

[#Metro]

Hear Ye Hear Ye, Minister's statement:

*crickets chirping noises*

Great State. Great Spin. Queensland Government.
Authorised by Queensland Government, George Street, Fiscal Fantasy Land.

[ozbob]

From the Brisbanetimes click here!

Government rules out review of public transport zoning

Government rules out review of public transport zoning
January 12, 2013 - 12:01AM

The Newman government has firmly rejected calls for a review of Brisbane's public transport zone system despite expert criticism and a public outcry over the latest round of fare increases.

The Opposition indicated its support for a review, but a spokesman for Transport Minister Scott Emerson flatly ruled out any changes to the Translink zone system .

"We have no current plans to change the number of zones as this would lead to more expensive fares for some and cheaper fares for others," Mr Emerson's spokesman said.

"Our promise at the election was to halve Labor's fare hikes for everyone."

Translink fares went up by 7.5 per cent on Monday and will go up by as much again next year, half of what the rises would have been under a Bligh Government strategy introduced in 2009.

Translink, the state body that delivers bus, train and ferry services across southeast Queensland, calculates fares per zone travelled through.

The spokesman said the 23-zone system was put in place in 2004 to bring the 10,000 square kilometre southeast Queensland network under one ticketing system.

It was fully reviewed in 2008 and a number of minor boundary reviews have taken place since to satisfy the department's needs, he said.

However there are minor price discrepancies between zones depending which mode of travel is used.

For instance, a train journey from the CBD to Toowong counts as travel within one zone, while the same journey on a bus counts as travel within two zones.

A single adult ticket for that journey costs $4.80 on a train, but $5.60 on a bus.

After the latest round of fare-hikes, train travel is Brisbane is now more expensive per kilometre than in Sydney and Melbourne.

- additional reporting by Tony Moore

Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/government-rules-out-review-of-public-transport-zoning-20130111-2cl4h.html

Agree with this.  No need to review the zone system as such.

Blog comments:

Part 1: As I commented on the story concerning Professor Newman's suggestion to cut the zones.  There is not much wrong with the present TransLink zones other than the base fare cost and the fare table.  A proper fare review is needed though,  the present five year fare strategy is turning away people from public transport, at great cost to the community.

There are a few zone irregularities, like Oxley, rail zone 3 bus zone 4.  These can be sorted as part of a broader fare review, with the aim to put in place an equitable fare table, and to stop the fare box leakage occurring with the nine and free.  What a rort!  Which in turn pushes up the base fare cost.

Our petition calling for a fare review has now over a 1000 signatures.  Clearly there is a major issue and it is time the government faced up to the truth.  Petition --> http://www.gopetition.com/petitions/fare-review-for-translink-south-east-queensland-now.html

Part 2: This is the sort of fare structure and price table we need:

1. Pull back the base (flag-fall)  all zones.  So a one zone go card fare (peak adult) = $2

2. Off peak discount 40%.

3. Change 2am touch on to 7am touch off.

4. 50% fare reduction after 8 paid journeys per week - no free travel.

5. Increase number of transfers allowed in journey from 3 to 4.  Keep 6 hour limit, but change last transfer time from 3.30 hour to 4hours.

6. CPI fare increases only.

7. Concession PT travel extended to ALL health care card holders.

8. Children be allowed to travel for free with fare paying adult on weekends/holidays.

9. Seniors - capped daily fare of $3.80, free travel weekends/holidays.

Adult peak go card fares, rest are based on this.

1   $2.00
2   $2.40
3   $2.80
4   $3.20
5   $3.60
6   $4.00
7   $4.40
8   $4.80
9   $5.20
10   $6.00
11   $6.80
12   $7.60
13   $8.40
14   $9.20
15   $10.00
16   $10.80
17   $11.60
18   $12.40
19   $13.20
20   $14.00
21   $14.80
22   $15.60
23   $16.40'
'
This would drive patronage increases and improve the fare box recovery, and make public transport more accessible to all.  Things which the present TransLink five year fail (strategy) has failed to do.

[ozbob]

Sent to all outlets:

12th January 2013

Zone review not needed

Greetings,

We support the Government in ruling out a review of the TransLink's present zones for fares.

Government rules out review of public transport zoning  http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/government-rules-out-review-of-public-transport-zoning-20130111-2cl4h.html

What is needed though is a thorough fare review because the TransLink Five Year Fare strategy has failed, and failed badly. Patronage has fallen, despite service increases, the fare box recovery has worsened, and public transport is increasingly inaccessible because of cost to many.

There is not much wrong with the present TransLink zones other than the base fare cost and the fare table.  A proper fare review is needed though,  the present five year fare strategy is turning away people from public transport, at great cost to the community.

There are a few zone irregularities, like Oxley, rail zone 3 bus zone 4.  These can be sorted as part of a broader fare review, with the aim to put in place an equitable fare table, and to stop the fare box leakage occurring with the nine and free.  What a rort!  Which in turn pushes up the base fare cost.

Our petition calling for a fare review has now over a 1000 signatures.  Clearly there is a major issue and it is time the government faced up to the truth.  Petition --> http://www.gopetition.com/petitions/fare-review-for-translink-south-east-queensland-now.html

This is the sort of fare structure and price table we need:

1. Pull back the base (flag-fall)  all zones.  So a one zone go card fare (peak adult) = $2

2. Off peak discount 40%.

3. Change 2am touch on to 7am touch off.

4. 50% fare reduction after 8 paid journeys per week - no free travel.

5. Increase number of transfers allowed in journey from 3 to 4.  Keep 6 hour limit, but change last transfer time from 3.30 hour to 4 hours.

6. CPI fare increases only.

7. Concession PT travel extended to ALL health care card holders.

8. Children be allowed to travel for free with fare paying adult on weekends/holidays.

9. Seniors - capped daily fare of $3.80, free travel weekends/holidays.

Suggested Adult peak go card fares, rest are based on this.

1   $2.00
2   $2.40
3   $2.80
4   $3.20
5   $3.60
6   $4.00
7   $4.40
8   $4.80
9   $5.20
10   $6.00
11   $6.80
12   $7.60
13   $8.40
14   $9.20
15   $10.00
16   $10.80
17   $11.60
18   $12.40
19   $13.20
20   $14.00
21   $14.80
22   $15.60
23   $16.40

This would drive patronage increases and improve the fare box recovery, and make public transport more accessible to all.  Things which the present TransLink five year fail (strategy) has failed to do.

The present fare price table and fare structure is wasting money.  Time the Government lived up to its rhetoric and acted.

Best wishes
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

[#Metro]

I don't agree with CPI increases only. With that you'd only get CPI service increases which is actually code for 'no new services'. Not the kind of system I'd like. CPI is useful as a normative (descriptive) benchmark to compare everything else to, but not great for a prescriptive (what should happen) benchmark as it doesn't actually measure capacity to pay and contains a lot of irrelevant stuff like steak and TV prices.

On the other hand, as average wages increase, it would not be so controversial to increase that. Increases in subsidy is not really an option as this level is already one of the highest on the planet anyway. Hence my liking for the bus review which is to identify waste and re-allocate.

Off peak discount is a good idea, however I think it should be 50%. This opens up a very interesting possibility of simplifying the fares even further by amalgamating the off peak prices with concession fares. During peak times, concession holders would just pay off peak fares. Simples.

There should be some group ticket. This is possible on smartcards - I have seen Youtube videos where they load a 'pass' on to the card and then touch on and it covers the kids and family etc.

I don't believe in frequent user discounts because they are more about the 'discount' status conferred upon the commuter who would actually make that trip anyway, at full price. If we are to focus on providing quality service money needs to be going into bread and butter decent service not gimmicks. A 9-5 monday-friday commuter will use up 8 journeys on Thursday. Are we really going to believe that this person would not pay to go to work on Friday because the bus/train/ferry trip is no longer free? That doesn't make sense- 99% of people would pay and so actually that free trip is huge lost revenue for no reason and not really there to increase patronage at all. A solution like Perth where if you pay upfront and have autotopup or do it electronically you get it cheaper, would be nice. Personally I would like to see something concocted to rival the supermarket/docket thing which has been wildly popular with motorists.

I think that any proposed fare table that has fares going backwards is a non-starter as it would require TL to take huge risks with its budget - a transition to a fairer fare table over say 5 years through increasing peak fares only and freezing off peak fares plus making the cost rise more steeply as one uses more zones is the way to go.

[ozbob]

And what of today's 'comprehensive announcement'?

No 'comprehensive announcement' , just a position on zone rationalisation.  Still look forward to a 'comprehensive announcement' ...

[ozbob]

V/Line reduced their fares, improved frequency and the service has boomed.  Your arguments are not valid TT.

Boosting patronage is the way to improve the fare box, with ample revenue to fund services.

Fares have increased on go 70%, average earnings have increased 6%, it is little wonder we are in trouble with the 5 year fare fail.

There has to be a transition point TT, more of the same will not do it.

Time for the big steps.  No more theoretical clap-trap.  Reduce the fares, improve the system, make public transport first choice, not last choice as it is getting now ..

[#Metro]

V/Line reduced their fares, improved frequency and the service has boomed. 

There has to be a transition point TT, more of the same will not do it.

Time for the big steps.

We're in agreement about transitions/changes but not in agreement about how to reach that. I think politically going backwards is quite hard. V/Line is nowhere near on the scale of TL and so the risks (real or percieved) are much greater.

[ozbob]

Don't forget the fare box leakage will disappear to a large extent.  If people want to manipulate for a 50% offset good on them, but there still will be a fare box coming in.  The other thing that will need to be sorted is the fare evasion with go cards.  Increase the quantum on cards required for travel will fix that to a large degree ...

[ozbob]

V/Line reduced their fares, improved frequency and the service has boomed. 

There has to be a transition point TT, more of the same will not do it.

Time for the big steps.

We're in agreement about transitions/changes but not in agreement about how to reach that. I think politically going backwards is quite hard. V/Line is nowhere near on the scale of TL and so the risks (real or percieved) are much greater.

I hear you, but they need to be radical. Re-position and then fine tune from there.  Frankly, I think they will get excellent increases in both pax and fare box if they bite the fare bullet ...

[#Metro]

I hear you, but they need to be radical. Re-position and then fine tune from there.  Frankly, I think they will get excellent increases in both pax and fare box if they bite the fare bullet ...

The interesting thing that came out of the Mees Report this week was that the Perth train system was used better in the OFF PEAK. And this is despite being in the same urban format as Brisbane. If you decrease peak hour prices, then I think yeah, you're going to have radical increases where you have no capacity to carry such people. It's the OFF PEAK that needs to go down, at least in relative terms.

The cynic in me also believes that somewhere in the analysis, the need to restrict patronage before the rail system is upgraded (think Merivale rail bridge) and full busways play a part in this...

[ozbob]

Yep,  and the failure to increase off peak discount this year was surprising to me.  It is the obvious immediate thing to do to generate more fare box.  They are all pussy cats,  and don't forget the LNP hand picked CRR review team also suggested boosting off peak discount ..

IT IS A NO BRAINER ...



They could do it overnight tonight .. or with today's system upgrades ....



{sound of meows coming from George St}

[ozbob]

The other thing that drives Perth off peak is they have frequency, but also daily capping, that kicks in after 9am ...

http://www.transperth.wa.gov.au/TicketsandFares/Tickettypes.aspx

WE ARE A BACKWATER .... 

[#Metro]

Wage increases, reference

http://www.oesr.qld.gov.au/products/tables/average-weekly-earnings-qld-aus/index.php

[ozbob]

Wage increases, reference

http://www.oesr.qld.gov.au/products/tables/average-weekly-earnings-qld-aus/index.php

ABS have the proper seasonally adjusted figures

http://www.abs.gov.au/AUSSTATS/abs@.nsf/DetailsPage/6302.0May%202012?OpenDocument

The important figure is Earnings; Persons; Total earnings ;  Seasonally Adjusted, Queensland Table 12 c, because everyone uses public transport not just wage earners.  It shows that average earnings increased around 6% whilst fares ramped on go 70%

[ozbob]

When you look around the nation and the world .. not hard to draw the conclusion that the TransLink Five Year Fare Strategy is a major embarrassment.    No doubt in my mind, the worst fare paradigm ever put together, and now hopelessly corrupted by the 10 and free, 9 and free nonsense ...

[Stillwater]

It is interesting that the so-called 'comprehensive announcement' is couched in the negative -- here is something we will NOT do.  No, we won't do that, we can't do that because we haven't any money, Labor stuffed that up so we can't do that even if we wanted.  The limitations of the ticketing system software won't allow that and we are not inclined to change it.  Crewing arrangements, rolling stock shortages, infrastructure and stabling deficiencies won't allow that. 

The ideas are coming from outside and are being batted away -- computer says 'no'.  It's all very reactionary.  What appears to be lacking is good innovation and generation of ideas from within TMR/Translink/QR. 

Is there a vision?  A few goals maybe?  Not of the fanciful Connecting SEQ 3030 variety.  It just seems ad hoc and on-the-run decision making atm.  Is this not the CAN-DO Government?

[#Metro]

Something to consider - next post - fare tables

Inflation is assumed to be 3% per year                              
Peak fares are assumed that they cannot go backwards- where the 'shadow' price is cheaper than the current price, only the current price + inflation is charged                              
Zones 1-7 (inclusive): slope rise by 0.5x                              
Zones 8-15 (inclusive): slope rise by 1x                              
Zones 16-23 (inclusive): slope rise by 1.45x                              
6%  annual ticket price rise (keep pace with wage growth) is assumed - allows network to grow                              
Off-peak discounts are incrementally increased to 50% in 2018, when no further discounts apply; At this point concession fares can be amalgamated                        

It will take time to clean up the mess because change needs to be slow and there are multiple goals to achieve as well as constraints
and public acceptance. I think it is wrong to cap to CPI, this allows for zero net growth in the network and also is conflicting with the goal to get the network subsidy levels back to international baselines. To meet welfare objectives, off peak discounting should be increased. I don't believe in FUDs such as 9 then free simply because people would make that extra trip anyway and a decent system doesn't need gimmicks to sell itself, the decent service frequency, span, simplicity, and value for money would do that selling already. Long term passes and daily caps may be something to consider though.

[ozbob]

Cap to CPI, average weekly earnings, what ever but it needs to slow .... down.

Too much too quick.  Our fares are just too expensive, other places can get it right.

Change does NOT need to be slow, on the contrary, it can be fixed over night.

[#Metro]

Change does NOT need to be slow, on the contrary, it can be fixed over night.

Slow changes garner public acceptance, give time to adjust, and mitigate risk. They're also more likely
to be considered. I'm happy to disagree with you here.

[#Metro]

Note, I have assumed that this year is a write off with regards to fare table changes. A review would take a while to do analysis anyway, so 2014 is the first opportunity to make changes. I expect a lot of nitpicking and gripes, but I ask others to make up their own tables incorporating their criticisms/suggestions demonstrating how theirs is better.

Here goes:

[#Metro]

[#Metro]

[ozbob]

There has to be a lot of other changes to address the social inequity of the present fare table and structure.  Many people are already have great difficulty accessing public transport because of the cost.

Under your scenario TT, we will be lucky to have a public transport system left ...

[#Metro]

Hopefully I haven't made errors.

There has to a lot of other changes to address the social inequity of the present fare table and structure.  Many people are already have great difficulty accessing public transport because of the cost.

Under your scenario TT, we will be lucky to have a public transport system left ...

Disagree. Prices rise slower in city areas than further out - that corrects the short trip problem. In real terms the inner areas aren't paying increases at all - they're paying CPI. I think 6% fare rise per year is about right when you consider inflation around 3% (RBA target) plus having to improve the network and bring down subsidy. Off peak fares go backwards which keeps it equitable and also shifts non commuters out of the peak while meeting equity/welfare goals.

I've seen your fare table where peak prices go backwards, good luck if you can get that through. I'm happy to be proven wrong.
I've not known governments to go backwards on prices, firstly because it might financially be hard to do that, but secondly it is an admission of guilt/failure/their ego gets damaged so unlikely I think.

I'm pragmatic...

[ozbob]

It is no secret that the Five year fare strategy is a failure.

By coming out at stating it publicly and then moving to fix it smartly they will actually gain some credibility.  To blunder along as now they are just becoming further alienated from the public, and it will be rather easy to be done over electorally.

[#Metro]

By coming out at stating it publicly and then moving to fix it smartly they will actually gain some credibility.  To blunder along as now they are just becoming further alienated from the public, and it will be rather easy to be done over electorally

They would have to start by heaping blame on Labor. And then push changes through. LOL

Under my proposal there would hopefully be money to upgrade frequencies on lines etc (of course they would have to do their own financial modelling to do this, I'm not an expert). The problem isn't just that fares are too high, people gladly pay more to drive their cars and 80% of people drive, so that tells me that the actual problem is the value for money that people perceive - service quality, things like speed, frequency overall trip time RELATIVE to that taken in a car and discounted.

That and I suspect that a high level of CSO routing (community service obligation) due to low density and schemes like Springfield, Ripley and Yarrabilba which are in paddocks ATM contribute to this...

[#Metro]

6% annual increase (after correcting for short trip issues) is about right IMHO.

After CPI this gives about 3% increased revenue per year for TL, keeps transport fares as a component of wages about constant, welfare objectives met by larger off peak discounts (concessions should also be adjusted as the rates converge to unity with off peak prices in 2018, this will get rid of double discounting).

TransLink needs to commit to 5 year or similar cyclical bus/train/ferry review so that it can demonstrate VFM (value for money) by identifying waste and reallocating. BUZ and TUZ and simplification need to be rolled out each time that fares increase - new services should begin on the same day that fare increases come into effect.

That way everyone does their part and the pain is spread widely but thinly.

3% real increase is about an extra $10 million dollars per year to TL. When you consider a BUZ is about 3 million dollars per year to run this is about 3 extra BUZ services per year or one Ferny Grove Line's worth of TUZification.

When you consider this, you can see why I have problems with concepts like P88, Maroon WasteGlider, 198 West End etc...

[ozbob]

Government has rejected the notion of reviewing TransLinks zones.    I think most would be happy to keep the present zones (with the odd issue fixed eg. Oxley), provided the fare table was reasonable. Once you can the free after x journeys it is possible to reduce the fares across the board, and together with some improved structural options things will start to improve.

6% per year is too much.  Increases must be linked to actual income increases, otherwise we end up with stupid outcomes, like the ALP introducing the free after 10 journeys ... because they were getting serious flack about the cost of fares during 2011, and the ALP brains trust though it would be a good move, political panic.  Reliable sources have suggested to me they nearly brought in 10 and free in 2010 .... 

As it turned out the 10 and free has been a major political and policy failure because the LNP, the lazy LNP instead of really doing a proper review just opted to trump the ALP with the 9 and free.  The rest is history as we spiral down to failure ...



You put this together TT, have you changed your mind?

[HappyTrainGuy]

I don't really think there is a need to review the zones. Its the components of the fare structure.

[ozbob]

I don't really think there is a need to review the zones. Its the components of the fare structure.

Exactly.  Interesting to note the careful wording in the Brisbanetimes article, talks very specifically about the zones.  Door is obviously open for a proper review ...

[somebody]

The other thing that drives Perth off peak is they have frequency, but also daily capping, that kicks in after 9am ...

http://www.transperth.wa.gov.au/TicketsandFares/Tickettypes.aspx

WE ARE A BACKWATER ....

Yes, but at a fixed rate regardless of zones.  These tickets really function as an off peak return for people travelling at least 4 zones - 6 zones if you are an autoload customer.

I hope we don't advocate a zone independent cap.

I don't really think there is a need to review the zones. Its the components of the fare structure.

I think we are all in agreement on zones.

What are you thinking about though with your bolded comments?

[ozbob]

Under the 23 zones, we have, the only way I think a daily cap could work would be highest journey in the 24 hour period x 2 (plus a possible loading), not withstanding a flat cap for certain concession groups ..

[#Metro]

6% per year is too much.

3% pa is needed just to keep the lights on. That's just to keep the status quo, pay wage increases for drivers etc.
The other 3% which amounts to $10 million dollars (calculated as 0.03 x 360 million actual revenue from farebox).

How do you expect to put on new services?
$10 million pa sounds like a lot, but it doesn't go that far, 3 new BUZ services per year.

It's not possible to please everyone and I'm not going to attempt to. If you look at the lower zones carefully, you see that off peak fares go backwards, which will grow patronage in the off peak, where there is capacity, while peak fares are held at inflation as the value for money catches up. The other zones converge to a 6% increase.

That's my proposal. I get that you don't like it, but that's not the point.

[ozbob]

You are missing the point TT, fare increases need to be linked to incomes somewhere. Other wise becomes unaffordable, as we now have the fare box slide in SEQ, despite huge fare increases. Priced right, more will travel, fare box slide turned around.

We cannot continue along this failing fare path, it will lead to service cutbacks and the real death spiral ...

[STB]

I tend to agree with TT here (shock, horror!), as fares do need to go up by CPI, but there should also be a buffer to allow the subsidy to come down to reasonable levels, and in turn allow network upgrades (although that could probably be done via tax increases, or adjusting the budget across different departments), as at the end of the day every department is fighting to get funding from the Government and Treasury, so the department can continue its normal business.

I think what should probably happen is that savings need to be found within the network itself, which could offset the fare increases slightly and create some products on Go Card to entice users to the system while still allowing the fare box to grow and allow that to feed back into the public transport system.

The number of zones is fine IMO,  the area covered by the TransLink system demands a significant number of zones to make the zone boundary crosses (and in turn fare changes), fair and moderate.

[#Metro]

Your welcome to do your own 5 year fare path. It's a good exercise. peak hour fare reductions may cause capacity problems. Correct if I am wong but I chose 6 % as average wages growth over ten years or so are about that.

[somebody]

Under the 23 zones, we have, the only way I think a daily cap could work would be highest journey in the 24 hour period x 2 (plus a possible loading), not withstanding a flat cap for certain concession groups ..

This comment makes me even more confused about what you even want.  A $41.82 daily cap would be completely pointless.