SEQ Bus Network Review

[ozbob]

Gold Coast timetables are STILL not available.

Been advised that the timetables will be available week commencing 6 Jan 2014.

[nathandavid88]

This means the less busy journeys have to dawdle through the suburbs and dwell excessively in order to maintain timetable (i.e. not run early).

I do think the 6:02 + 6:32 and 2:00 + 2:30 times should either stick with the off-peak clockface or the peak clockfate, though. Much easier to remember that if it's peak hour, they're on the :25 and :55, off-peak they're on the :01 and :31 (I'd maybe tidy that up to be on the :00 and :30, but that is just me).

I just think the benefits of an inconsistent timetable on runtimes are countered by the disadvantages of generally p%ssing people off by having harder to remember departure times. If they have to alter them, they should at least make them consistent on and off peak changes like you suggested.

Highly disappointed at connections and span of services linking (use that word lightly, it remains an oxymoron in many cases) to train stations.

The Gold Coast compared with its northern cousin has not enjoyed the same treatment.

Detailed analysis to follow.

That's one thing I really can't fault Translink and LCBS on! Connections to train stations are all really good from what I can see, with the timetables indicating dwell times of 6–10 minutes between getting off one service and on the other. The only slight downside is that the indicated bus connections at Loganlea Station are all based around the Beenleigh Line services rather than the expresses (that said, the 562 (& 564/568 Sunday Loops) from Loganholme should connect alright with the expresses, but it's only an hourly bus and that connection isn't indicated on the timetable.)

[Cam]

540 inbound on the Victoria Bridge about 8am this morning with 1 passenger on board - 2 passengers alighted at Cultural Centre. It must have been an easy decision to have this service truncated in the network revue.

[techblitz]

540 inbound on the Victoria Bridge about 8am this morning with 1 passenger on board - 2 passengers alighted at Cultural Centre. It must have been an easy decision to have this service truncated in the network revue.

Prolly a case of beaudesert pax switching @ park ridge to take advantage of the p546 from park ridge to the city. 50 mins.... as opposed to 70 mins via the 540
They must have kept the 540 in service due to the beaudesert rd factor. P142 and p546 will give beaudesert pax good options instead of sitting in traffic on mains rd routes.

[ozbob]

Gold Coast timetables are STILL not available.

Been advised that the timetables will be available week commencing 6 Jan 2014.

Now online eg.  http://jp.translink.com.au/travel-information/network-information/buses/700

Just change the link for the desired route number ...

[STB]

540 inbound on the Victoria Bridge about 8am this morning with 1 passenger on board - 2 passengers alighted at Cultural Centre. It must have been an easy decision to have this service truncated in the network revue.

Prolly a case of beaudesert pax switching @ park ridge to take advantage of the p546 from park ridge to the city. 50 mins.... as opposed to 70 mins via the 540
They must have kept the 540 in service due to the beaudesert rd factor. P142 and p546 will give beaudesert pax good options instead of sitting in traffic on mains rd routes.

I asked the Planner looking after the Southern Region several years ago over why route 540 wasn't truncated at Browns Plains.  He said that there was a large number of students going to Annerley using route 540, and also he was nervous touching it after the fallout of the then recent network changes to the greater Logan area, which caused him some grief, including some passengers tracking down his direct number at work and abusing him on the phone.

I'm glad though that it has come to fruition, and I look forward to trying it out myself, especially knowing it will now be an hourly service.

[James]

Taking a look through the timetables now. 765 has a 9-minute gap between bus arrival and train departing to Brisbane, and 8-minute gap between train arrival and bus departure at Varsity Lakes. Hardly an improvement on the current 10-minute gaps. 745 has gone backwards as far as I can see - 10 minute gaps post-20th January.

ffs, why is it not possible to cut this down to 5 minutes for all routes? Yes, it is only a few minutes, but those minutes do add up vs. the car. If there was one thing I was looking forward to with the review, it was better co-ordinating bus-rail interchanges. Taking a look at other coast timetables, gaps of >5 minutes between connecting services are now common. What happened to actually coordinating services? Are we trying to discourage people from transferring and catching buses to train stations?

Yes, on the odd day the smaller window may cause pax to miss a service (generally in peak anyway so that would hardly matter), but I'd much rather miss a train every few weeks rather than have a 10 minute wait every time I use the bus to get to the station. Service amenity needs to come first, and as far as I'm concerned, having a 10 minute transfer window is hardly convenient.

I asked the Planner looking after the Southern Region several years ago over why route 540 wasn't truncated at Browns Plains.  He said that there was a large number of students going to Annerley using route 540, and also he was nervous touching it after the fallout of the then recent network changes to the greater Logan area, which caused him some grief, including some passengers tracking down his direct number at work and abusing him on the phone.

I'm glad though that it has come to fruition, and I look forward to trying it out myself, especially knowing it will now be an hourly service.

Goodness, some people are so f***ing territorial about their buses...

540 will now be useful at an hourly frequency. Might even go for a day trip out to Beaudesert with the improved frequency. Would be nice if they could put a few services on weekends too, though.

[STB]

Taking a look through the timetables now. 765 has a 9-minute gap between bus arrival and train departing to Brisbane, and 8-minute gap between train arrival and bus departure at Varsity Lakes. Hardly an improvement on the current 10-minute gaps. 745 has gone backwards as far as I can see - 10 minute gaps post-20th January.

ffs, why is it not possible to cut this down to 5 minutes for all routes? Yes, it is only a few minutes, but those minutes do add up vs. the car. If there was one thing I was looking forward to with the review, it was better co-ordinating bus-rail interchanges. Taking a look at other coast timetables, gaps of >5 minutes between connecting services are now common. What happened to actually coordinating services? Are we trying to discourage people from transferring and catching buses to train stations?

Yes, on the odd day the smaller window may cause pax to miss a service (generally in peak anyway so that would hardly matter), but I'd much rather miss a train every few weeks rather than have a 10 minute wait every time I use the bus to get to the station. Service amenity needs to come first, and as far as I'm concerned, having a 10 minute transfer window is hardly convenient.

I actually don't think that's much of a problem actually.  I'd rather some fat in the transfer time in case of wayward passengers and unexpected traffic conditions.  Anyway, eight minutes is nothing, I've got route 254 with 20min+ connections during the day Monday to Friday!  Currently it's a 5min connection.  Ideally, as long as the transfer isn't longer than 10mins, then I think it's fine.

[SurfRail]

The only matter jumping out at me as in any way surprising from the Gold Coast timetables is that the 753 appears to only run between Burleigh Heads and Varsity Lakes station for most of the day.  This is yet another shame as it is a half-decent route now on its current alignment.

Basically, the whole thing is a big sack of excrement unless you happen to be living in exactly the right place (which is effectively on the highway corridor or Route 750).

[nathandavid88]

Taking a look through the timetables now. 765 has a 9-minute gap between bus arrival and train departing to Brisbane, and 8-minute gap between train arrival and bus departure at Varsity Lakes. Hardly an improvement on the current 10-minute gaps. 745 has gone backwards as far as I can see - 10 minute gaps post-20th January.

ffs, why is it not possible to cut this down to 5 minutes for all routes? Yes, it is only a few minutes, but those minutes do add up vs. the car. If there was one thing I was looking forward to with the review, it was better co-ordinating bus-rail interchanges. Taking a look at other coast timetables, gaps of >5 minutes between connecting services are now common. What happened to actually coordinating services? Are we trying to discourage people from transferring and catching buses to train stations?

Yes, on the odd day the smaller window may cause pax to miss a service (generally in peak anyway so that would hardly matter), but I'd much rather miss a train every few weeks rather than have a 10 minute wait every time I use the bus to get to the station. Service amenity needs to come first, and as far as I'm concerned, having a 10 minute transfer window is hardly convenient.

I actually don't think that's much of a problem actually.  I'd rather some fat in the transfer time in case of wayward passengers and unexpected traffic conditions.  Anyway, eight minutes is nothing, I've got route 254 with 20min+ connections during the day Monday to Friday!  Currently it's a 5min connection.  Ideally, as long as the transfer isn't longer than 10mins, then I think it's fine.

I'm with STB, I think 5-10 minutes isn't an issue at all. In fact, I would say that 5 mins is leaving far too narrow a window.

Leaving aside the issue of the Gold Coast's traffic which I know from experience can result in routes like the 745 running over 5 minutes late more often than not, it means that any minor, non traffic-related late running (from picking up and dropping off an elderly person or PWD who take a bit longer getting on/off the service, or the driver trying to decipher where a family of Chinese tourists are wanting to go for example) could result in a service arriving at the station only 1 or 2 minutes before the train. With all GC stations having stairs, that simply is not enough time to get from the bus interchange to the platform, and there is nothing more infuriating than turning up just in time to see the train leave! A window of 8 or 9 minutes, like the 765 has, gives the ability of absorbing minor late running and still giving a 5 minute interchange time.

And as for the 745 going backwards (I assume you mean from 6 minute gaps to 10 minute gaps), I disagree – look at the weekends! If you catch a 745 to Nerang, you are currently looking at a 13 minute gap if you're lucky enough to be able to get the express, and a utterly ridiculous 26 minute gap if not! After Jan 20th, that is reduced down to a 10 minute gap. For me, that is a massive leap forward.

[STB]

One has to remember too that route 740 will be a far better route to catch to Surfers Paradise than route 745 which goes via Pacific Fair.  I'll be interested to see just how the patronage goes with route 740 in the changes and if people going to Surfers will catch on that route 740 is a much better option for them.

[James]

One has to remember too that route 740 will be a far better route to catch to Surfers Paradise than route 745 which goes via Pacific Fair.  I'll be interested to see just how the patronage goes with route 740 in the changes and if people going to Surfers will catch on that route 740 is a much better option for them.

Agree with regards to the 740 - it is good to see that they're finally getting co-ordination with that route right. Coordination before the review was plain awful.

When GCLRT comes in, the 745 will become far more reliable by running away from the GC Highway - but regardless, a 10 minute gap is huge. Maybe this is because I am used to low levels of transferring, but spending 10 minutes waiting around a train station is a pain in the butt! Halving that time makes the service a lot more attractive - if the service is unreliable, fatten the timetable to reflect that (and this is coming from someone who disagrees with timetable fat!).

I am aware there are issues in other regions - and they should be fixed too - but we really need to get things like this right. I personally support the feederisation of my bus, the 411, at Toowong. But if you made me wait 10 minutes for a bloody train, I'd hop back in my car or simply walk to the 412 and never use it again! All long transfer times do is encourage people to shun the connecting bus service and just use their car.

[ozbob]

Changes to Brisbane Transport buses on 20 January 2014
--> http://translink.com.au/travel-information/service-notices/3891/details

[techblitz]

7-10 minutes im quite ok with....5 mins cuts it too close..especially at peak....13 mins is pushing it...which is what pax at sandgate and petrie have to deal with in the offpeak.Best way to fine tune it..is to have slightly closer conn.  times in the offpeak and a bit more of a gap in the peaks.Messes around with clockface unfortunately...

[SurfRail]

I am putting together the attached assessment of the new Gold Coast network, using a very basic standard of hourly service from 6-7am to 6-7pm minimum (so around 12-13 services per day minimum).

I've done most of the big ticket services already by virtue of starting up the top of the list, so I expect there will be a LOT more red and orange on my list.

[SurfRail]

Completed draft version now attached.  I have stuck to my guns and identified the minimum standard as being 13 services per day - period - which is basically hourly from 6-7 to 6-7 without compromise.  This is a bit of an arbitrary standard as you will see below, but the line has to be drawn somewhere.

Based on the fairly easy to achieve standard I have set out, and which I would define as the absolute bare minimum a standard bus service should be reaching, there are only 10 routes out of 57 which qualify (excluding the 6 special purpose routes which are not being assessed).  I have not double checked but I would wager there are several routes which do meet this standard now (eg 20/20A) whose replacement services will not after 20 January.

Of those 10 routes, 7 are high-frequency routes (700, 701, 703, 704, 750 and 705/777), and the balance 3 are major corridor routes to Nerang (735) and Robina (761 and 765).  There are a few which "just" fall of qualifying short based on when services start and stop running (eg 713, 719, 720 and 740, which are mainly 30 minute services).

I am planning on running this via the press, any thoughts on content?

[James]

I would ensure to make a general comparison of what exists currently vs. what exists now - a general assessment plus a specific example (e.g. a user of the 20 is worse off in this area) would do it.

State that the current network has __ basic standard routes and that the new network has __ basic standard routes - and look at examples of needless duplication on coverage routes (which provides half-hourly frequency on awful span). Then give some kind of example.

[SurfRail]

I would like to go into greater detail on comparison with the current network, trust me, but I am back at work (de facto if not officially) tomorow and I will need to put this under somebody's nose early this week so it gets picked up.

Going through the current timetables would actually be a bit more challenging because (and this is at least one benefit of the new timetables) they are far from homogenous in terms of route diversions, short workings and the like.  The new ones may be cut back but at least you can, with very limited and well-posted exceptions, expect the same thing on each trip.

Happy to look at this after the event of course, for my own interest if nothing else.  Probably create a separate spreadsheet in the same workbook so you can flip between the 2.

[ozbob]

Media release 12th January 2014



SEQ: BCC Bus Cost Explosion Engulfs Community

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport passengers highlights growing community anger with the public transport cost explosions.

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"One year on, it is now possible to observe the long term effect of Brisbane City Councillors opposing the TransLink bus review. In our opinion BCC's opposition has contributed to a cost explosion on public transport affecting all of SEQ. BCC does not set fares, but it does set bus supplier costs and obviously, higher costs equals higher fares."

"In our opinion, it is extraordinary that after two bus reviews, BCC's bus monopoly continues to operate a hi-waste service paradigm that operates buses as if they were taxi-style services. Naturally, this has led to taxi-style fare levels, along with $400 per council ratepayer subsidies to prop up the inefficient bus network."

"The cosmetic changes to the bus network, the fare gimmicks and spin tactics are now not working. Anger is spreading across family dinner tables around SEQ. Ordinary passengers are being affected and disillusioned."

"We call for the Queensland Government to reverse its 1925 decision to hand BCC public transport control. By losing control of the bus route planning to BCC, the Queensland Government has lost control of service costs and let ticket prices of public transport explode. BCC did not allow Brisbane Transport to properly cooperate with the TransLink during the main bus review process, effectively sabotaging real reform."

"It is a sad irony that the councillors that went around claiming that they were concerned about representing the interests of the disadvantaged and needy are the same people now responsible for causing a massive cost explosion that is slamming low income and the disadvantaged into the ground," concluded Robert Dow.

Here are some examples from the petition ( https://www.change.org/en-AU/petitions/scott-emerson-minister-for-transport-and-main-roads-reduce-translink-fares ) going around:

"I would be happy to pay premium prices for a premium service. However, as it stands the BCC transport service is far from premium."

"I cannot afford on minimum wage to get to my job."

"I'm currently on a Centrelink wage while I spend my days job searching. As the prices were before the new year rise I struggled with my budget just getting to and from maybe 3-4 interviews on a weekly basis. With the new prices I would be lucky to be able to make it to 2 while still paying my rent (A meagre $100 by the way) in addition to dedicating myself to full time job hunting."

"As a student on centrelink, current rates already eat a lot of my weekly budget. I simply can't afford more expensive rates. It is cheaper to drive!"

Robert Dow continued " We think this comment on the petition sums up our consistent position neatly:

Marc Fotsch-Heatley AUSTRALIA 'We could have such better services for cheaper if the network was rationally designed.'

"As we have always said, the sooner the bus network control is removed from BCC hands, the quicker the network can be re-organised to be efficient, properly mode integrated and fares lowered."

References:

1. SEQ: Bus cost explosion - zone one paper ticket fare breaks $5 barrier http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=10447.0

2. Kangaroo Point 234 bus passengers upset over wait times and walking http://www.couriermail.com.au/questnews/city/kangaroo-point-234-bus-passengers-upset-over-wait-times-and-walking/story-fni9r0jy-1226749825307

3. Pensioner protest over bus route changes http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/pensioner-protest-over-bus-route-changes-20131030-2whig.html

4. Scott Emerson, Minister for Transport and Main Roads: Reduce Translink fares
https://www.change.org/en-AU/petitions/scott-emerson-minister-for-transport-and-main-roads-reduce-translink-fares

Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

[STB]

The driver of route 254 (the one I caught) was handing out the new 254 timetable.  The only problem, for me, the 255 will become the primary route due to the connections.  I asked about it and he wasn't sure where I could get a physical timetable (yes, I know it's online but not everyone has access to the internet) - I'm talking about others, not myself, and those who live on corridors that have multiple routes - the part between Redland Bay and Victoria Pt for example with routes 250, 280 and 282 where there are separate timetables for each.

By the way, where the heck are the helping hands events that should really be held across the various regions, throughout the day at various locations?  Other than the Gold Coast, I haven't seen any planned.  As for some regions, this is a massive change, especially for the railway.

Must admit, other than the online stuff, communication has been a bit 'meh', despite the level of the change, which is fairly major in parts.

[SurfRail]

^ There was a girl at Stop 85 on Elizabeth St today around lunchtime.

Certainly plenty of presence out and about down here.

[longboi]

The driver of route 254 (the one I caught) was handing out the new 254 timetable.  The only problem, for me, the 255 will become the primary route due to the connections.  I asked about it and he wasn't sure where I could get a physical timetable (yes, I know it's online but not everyone has access to the internet) - I'm talking about others, not myself, and those who live on corridors that have multiple routes - the part between Redland Bay and Victoria Pt for example with routes 250, 280 and 282 where there are separate timetables for each.

By the way, where the heck are the helping hands events that should really be held across the various regions, throughout the day at various locations?  Other than the Gold Coast, I haven't seen any planned.  As for some regions, this is a massive change, especially for the railway.

Must admit, other than the online stuff, communication has been a bit 'meh', despite the level of the change, which is fairly major in parts.

There are over 100 CLOs currently out on the network. Some are roving in vehicles to various locations and intermediate stops.

Timetables are generally distributed to relevant operators' depots, Council offices and local libraries. Generally electorate offices will also get timetables and people can request one to be sent to them by post by calling the call centre.

[ozbob]

Bus changes from Monday 20th Jan 2014

Brisbane City  http://translink.com.au/travel-information/service-notices/3891/details

Gold Coast  http://translink.com.au/travel-information/service-notices/seq-bus-network-review-2013/gold-coast

Logan Region  http://translink.com.au/travel-information/service-notices/seq-bus-network-review-2013/logan

Moreton Bay region  http://translink.com.au/travel-information/service-notices/seq-bus-network-review-2013/moreton-bay

Redlands region http://translink.com.au/travel-information/service-notices/seq-bus-network-review-2013/redlands

[SurfRail]

http://www.goldcoastbulletin.com.au/news/gold-coast/nerang-a-public-transport-black-hole-in-transport-changes/story-fnj94idh-1226802681480

[nathandavid88]

I noticed this morning on the new bus stop timetables (which I'm impressed to see have all been changed on my route – it took a while the last time timetables were updated for the ones at my stops to be changed) that they've now include a QR code to take people to the Translink's list of services for that stop. While you've always been able to access these pages, having a QR code to take you there makes it much easier than having to punch in the whole stop name or stop ID. 

[HappyTrainGuy]

I forgot where I was driving..... Trouts Road.... Maybe Maundrell Terrace... and I saw a bus stop with the timetable improvement sign on it. An old beaten up district bus stop with part of the bus stop sign missing as if it has broken in half with age. I had a good chuckle that they plastered every single bus stop with one of those timetable change signs.

[SurfRail]

Might have been on the 680 if it was north of Aspley?

[HappyTrainGuy]

South of Aspley. There was a state of the art bus stop about 50m later

[minbrisbane]

South of Aspley. There was a state of the art bus stop about 50m later

It's the same out my way.  The stops had only just been DDA upgraded too, even fitted with timetable boxes with TL info inside.

[SurfRail]

But that sounds like poor management. Similar to Chermside. There are tons of ways that interchange can be improved starting with stop redesigns and that handles way more buses than what Browns Plains does.

Chermside only handles the buses it does now because of the stops on Hamilton and Gympie Roads.  If they were all inside the interchange it would go kaput.

[HappyTrainGuy]

But that sounds like poor management. Similar to Chermside. There are tons of ways that interchange can be improved starting with stop redesigns and that handles way more buses than what Browns Plains does.

Chermside only handles the buses it does now because of the stops on Hamilton and Gympie Roads.  If they were all inside the interchange it would go kaput.

The interchange is already kaput but that's down to the lack of changing anything in the Brisbane bus network. The 77 should already be using the interchange rather than the Hamilton Road stops. The 332/333 has two dedicated bays while the 330, 335, 340 all share the same single bay? The amount of duplicate bus routes also makes it worse such as the 330, 333, 340, 370 all using it. During peak hour its worse because the duplication problems are magnified when the same routes bunch up on Gympie Road then head into the interchange at the same time. Even the outbound stops are chockers due to the amount of duplication in the area. Everything all arrives at the same time and then nothing enters the interchange for about 5-10 minutes in the middle of peak hour before the cycle repeats itself.

[techblitz]

Htg kindly give us an actual VALID reason why the 77 should be sent into the interchange 
Remember were talking about a route that most on here want canned. We know you support the route.....but now you want it sent into the interchange?
Must be that sky high 77 patronage 

[HappyTrainGuy]

You want me to answer that question again even when you know what my answer is? It's transit time. Always has been. Always will be. The 77 is heavily delayed using the backstreets. As soon as it gets onto Hamilton Road it is stuck in traffic as a result of the Hamilton and Gympie Road intersection. The inbound 325 has the exact same issues. The ped crossing on the Rode Road side of Gympie Road only allows a handful of cars to turn right each time before the whole intersection goes red. There is already plenty of fat in the 77 timetable and it runs ahead of schedule quite frequently in both directions. I assume the drivers don't care because they are running in duplicated corridors eg northside has 333, 340, 370 and the southside has the busway services. Any user of the 77 before would know the painful transit time on the Chermside bound services as it dordles in traffic along Hamilton Road as you watch bus after bus enter the bus interchange in the distance.

Yeah because we all know how slow it is catching a 77 from the Northside to the Southside.

07:00 AM    'Chermside (Hamilton Road)' Hamilton Road    07:26 AM    Griffith University Station

Suck on that transit time 330 "Express" buz.

[ozbob]

Media release 28 January 2014



SEQ: BCC Bus Cost Explosion Engulfs Refugees

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport passengers highlights growing community damage with the public transport cost explosions.

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"One year on, it is now possible to observe the long term effect of Brisbane City Councillors opposing the TransLink bus review. In our opinion BCC's opposition has contributed to a cost explosion on public transport affecting all of SEQ. BCC does not set fares, but it does set bus supplier costs and obviously, higher costs equals higher fares."

"We have recently received news that Refugee agencies are now appealing for donations to assist in covering the travel expenses of their volunteers (1)."

Examples include (taken directly from the public appeal website):

* An organisation located in Rocklea that sorts and repackages food offers clients with a volunteer opportunity. This food is distributed to vulnerable people in our community throughout Brisbane. A large number of MDA clients have been volunteered for this organisation last year, however due to increased living costs a number of clients are unable to make any future commitment.

* In Morningside there is an organisation that relies on volunteers to carry out important conservation work. They provide a volunteer opportunity for a number of MDA clients. Unfortunately this year half the clients who attended last year can not afford to continue volunteering.

"It is a sad irony that the councillors that went around claiming that they were concerned about representing the interests of the disadvantaged and needy are the same people now responsible for causing a massive cost explosion that is slamming low income and the disadvantaged into the ground, and damaging the community social fabric."

"No transit agency in the world has made its fares more affordable or improved services by retaining and protecting waste, duplication and inefficiency. The BCC bus network MUST be reformed so that fares can come down."

Examples of waste and unproductive issues surviving two rounds of bus 'review' include:

* BCC 50% air buses in peak hour at Cultural Centre

* Maroon WasteGlider from the CBD to Stones Corner

* Express Bus 161 which duplicates almost everything on the South East Busway

* Enormous service duplication and wasteful competition along Coronation Drive both against BCC's own bus routes and rail

* Enormous waste along Old Cleveland Road where an excessive 16 buses per hour pass (a bus every 3.75 minutes) in the OFF peak, mostly carrying air.

* Lack of quality service to Albany Creek, The Centenary Suburbs, Bulimba, Yeronga and Wynnum Road.

References:

1. Multicultural Development Association Inc https://give.everydayhero.com/au/giving-back-to-those-who-are-giving-back

2. BCC Bus Cost Explosion Engulfs Queensland Government http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=10447.msg137073#msg137073

3. 12 Jan 2014: SEQ: BCC Bus Cost Explosion Engulfs Community http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=10458.0

Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

[techblitz]

There is already plenty of fat in the 77 timetable and it runs ahead of schedule quite frequently in both directions.

:conf
whats the issue then?

im aware of the 'minor' delays but its not a valid enough reason to divert it into the interchange for such a minor route to only dropoff/ pick up a handful of passengers at best....while saving at best a couple of minutes from avoiding those backstreets...

o/b 333 kedron brook - chermside interchange 10 mins
o/b 77 kedron brook - hamilton rd stop 12 mins
2 minutes scheduled difference.......blowout to probably 5-7 max with bad runs at traffic lights...people will not abandon the 77 over something as minor as that delay...

[SurfRail]

It's a pointless service for the most part anyway.  Should be operating in peak hour only like the Belconnen to Woden and Belconnen to Tuggeranong services in Canberra - if at all.

[James]

It's a pointless service for the most part anyway.  Should be operating in peak hour only like the Belconnen to Woden and Belconnen to Tuggeranong services in Canberra - if at all.

I would hardly call the service pointless. It just doesn't really fit in with BCC's "all services to the City"-style network. Introduce a connective network and the service will start to do really well.

If we had buses feeding places like Chermside on a large scale, due to the transfer penalty existing regardless of whether one transferred to a 330 or a 77, the 77 would start winning hands down. As it is, the feeders into Chermside are pretty ordinary, and when you factor in a 15 minute transfer penalty (plus the trauma of having to move one's bum, which according to some rate payers, is near impossible), you might as well just catch the City-bound bus and transfer there. Off-peak, thanks to hourly frequency, the route right now is totally useless. The demand is there for this connection, and the route does well in peak. It just needs to be given the network to support it.

[SurfRail]

^ Unfortunately this is a bit like Baron von Munchausen's bootstraps.  How can you pull yourself up like that when the cost of routes like the 77 is weighing you down?

The easiest way to get the feeder network improved is to cull luxury services like the 77 which don't actually improve service coverage and have no measurable improvement on frequency on the corridors on which is operates.  Use those resources to run more 336/337/338 services among others.  Nobody will "suffer" from a loss of access in this scenario - some will be mildly inconvenienced.  On the contrary, the catchment for meaningful public transport opens up more.

[HappyTrainGuy]

The cost of the 77 is hardly weighting down the network. There's far more money blowing options out there. Running more 336/337's are also not the answer. The network is way beyond that. There's too much duplication and wasted resources. Too many buses in places where they aren't needed. It needs a complete and total revamp. Delete every bus route and start again. Actually utilize that long big steel thing that runs on electricity. No more short terminus and swapping of services ie terminating the 327 preventing it from running Strathpine-Bald Hills in peak. No more of the 338/357/359 service swapping. Remove the no sunday service rule. Have duplication down to a minimum. Make more east-west connections. No more running routes in the peak direction during peak hour only ie 329. Have bus priority intersections. Cut dead running down to a minimum. Have higher capacity buses running on the corridors that actually need them ie no more high capacity buses running the 334 route while the 333 gets a pissy little Volvo. Cut the buz standard to reflect the different routes and patronage ie changing the standard to 4bph 6am-8pm then back to 2bph till final service and then modify that on a route by route basis ie 333 can maintain a 4bph at 10pm while the 340 has 2bph.  I could keep ranting but this isn't the place.

[James]

^ Unfortunately this is a bit like Baron von Munchausen's bootstraps.  How can you pull yourself up like that when the cost of routes like the 77 is weighing you down?

The easiest way to get the feeder network improved is to cull luxury services like the 77 which don't actually improve service coverage and have no measurable improvement on frequency on the corridors on which is operates.  Use those resources to run more 336/337/338 services among others.  Nobody will "suffer" from a loss of access in this scenario - some will be mildly inconvenienced.  On the contrary, the catchment for meaningful public transport opens up more.

And the fact the 411/415/416/417/425/P426/430/431/433/435/445/446/453/460 continue to the CBD from Indooroopilly/Toowong and all duplicate each other is not a "luxury"? The 160, 222 and 333 are far more "luxury" than the 77. In fact, it could be argued outside of peak that the 111 is luxury as well, given it just duplicates the 555. If you told BCC that though, they would deport you for suggesting that running their flagship 111 on the busway is 'wasteful'.

There are numerous savings and improvements that can be made on the northside WITHOUT chopping off the route. Heck, the route might actually start to haul some decent loads once you stop running a stupid amount of buses down the SEB/Gympie Road, collecting trips being made between Buranda-8MP/Windsor-Chermside.

In the current network, outside of peak, the 77 has no place. But if we shifted to a connective network, the route would work a lot better.