15 minute frequency, we are dreaming folks ...

[ozbob]

I hate to tell you this, 4TPH is not achievable on the Ipswich line, the Caboolture line, the southern line, the Cleveland Line, the Shorncliffe line (advice from Queensland Rail), for reasons of infrastructure constraints (without considering rolling stock and crew limitations at present).

I'd believe that.  From my little timetabling exercise the other day, Cleveland can get a 20min all day frequency, but only just.  It's tight with precision crosses and that's including non scheduled services such as departmental trains, and then there's the freight which the third track only carries some of the freight movements to/from the Port of Brisbane, other freighters head along the Up line between the passenger services during the day.  And that's not including the Beenleigh/Gold Coast lines which in my little timetabling exercise was a little too difficult to schedule around, we really need CRR and additional track on those lines.

At the end of the day, the Planners will only schedule with what they've got, which was reminded to us at the last CRG.  And if they can't schedule a 20min frequency, or 15min frequency, even if they did have the budget for it, it only means one thing, more track, and not just CRR, but duplication of the Cleveland line and triplication and/or quadding on the Beenleigh/Gold Coast line.

Certainly a possibility as compared to 15 minutes.  Unless there  are the infrastructure improvements frequency is unlikely to be improved beyond 20 minutes if ever.

[STB]

Ask Queensland Rail Simon, I am sure you will enjoy the response.  You seem to have an insight that the operator doesn't.

What would be the point of that?  I would not believe the answer.

Great pity that comment.  If you don't engage how can you ever expect to properly understand.

Everyone else is wrong but you're correct?  Suggest you get off your soapbox and listen to others  for a change.  There other viewpoints than just yours, fortunately.

In other words Simon, you believe only what you want to hear and believe in.  Great pity indeed.  Open your mind up, the world isn't black and white!

[ozbob]

Yes, the problems with implementation of a 15 minute frequency are very real on our network.  I have had a  lot of chats about it with those who work in the railways and other places. Often discussed at CRGs as well.  They don't make it up.

[somebody]

There are other ways this can be managed which are far more achievable than what you suggest.

Well lets agree to disagree and see what happens down the track hey?

Yep.  I tried for quite some time to get you to substantiate what you are referring to here, but you were either unwilling or unable.

Only time I've been to Darra is when passing through on the train or on the motorway, FWIW.  I can't recall going to Darra with the current set up.

And PM peak:
- I/B via Oxley #3
- O/B to Ipswich via Oxley #2 (non-stopping)
- O/B to Richlands via Oxley #1 (stopping)

Trains coming off Richlands have multiple conflicts.  Running on the subs through to Sherwood removes all that.  I thought you would have seen that.

By having the UP sub for UP Springfield, down Sub for trains to City from Richlands (Springfield) a lot of conflicts are removed.  The absurd crossings from subs to mains and back to subs post Corinda are avoided.  This is turn improves train operations.  And will be important if you ever hope to have  4 TPH to Springfield.

Richlands I/B via Oxley #3 has one conflict, up to 10/hr crossing 2/hr + non revenue services.   Hardly the end of the world.  Unless of course Ipswich O/B goes via Darra #1, which would be stupid.  People can easily change platforms at Darra.

Great pity that comment.  If you don't engage how can you ever expect to properly understand.

Everyone else is wrong but you're correct?  Suggest you get off your soapbox and listen to others  for a change.  There other viewpoints than just yours, fortunately.

I thought you'd pick up on that much faster.  I agree it is a great pity.  If I didn't have a permanent government job, I would leave QLD so fast that you wouldn't see me for dust.  I deal with it all the time in my work: "It can't be done" is code for "We don't want to do it".

In other words Simon, you believe only what you want to hear and believe in.  Great pity indeed.  Open your mind up, the world isn't black and white!

I do not see why I should accept as fact implausible statements with no supporting arguments.  Why don't I just sell the Story Bridge?

Yes, the problems with implementation of a 15 minute frequency are very real on our network.  I have had a  lot of chats about it with those who work in the railways and other places. Often discussed at CRGs as well.  They don't make it up.

There are real problems, particularly on the south side.  A couple of issues on the north side particularly Doomben.

EDIT: Spelling

[somebody]

True, but commuter rail in Australa's low density cities is generally built for peak, not off-peak

Well parts of our cities are clearly a bit higher density: Sydney's Eastern Suburbs and even in Brisbane the bit city-Indooroopilly is notably higher density.

I don't see the value in a railway which provides a peak obsessed service.  It would be better to just target increased bus infrastructure.

[petey3801]

And PM peak:
- I/B via Oxley #3
- O/B to Ipswich via Oxley #2 (non-stopping)
- O/B to Richlands via Oxley #1 (stopping)

This is a rather large problem. Every OB Ipswich PM peak express I have run, I have been running on restricted signals from Corinda to Oxley/Darra section due to IB Richlands/empty trains crossing over to the Down Main. It is already a problem, it will become a much larger problem in time when frequencies are improved.

In a perfect world, Richlands/Springfield trains would use to subs all the way (with Up sub electrified) and Ips trains would use the mains. That would remove all the conflicting moves and coalies could use the subs with the Richlands/Springfield trains, meaning less conflicting moves at Corinda as well.

[mufreight]

But do you agree that putting in the missing crossover west of Darra enables everything that the 4th platform+electrification does?  Only exception I can think of is via Tennyson services extending beyond Corinda but that would require a 6th platform or an additional crossover at Corinda.

Most emphaticly NO,

The junction arrangement at Darra West is one of the best examples of shortsighted stupidity perpetrated on the rail system over the last century but that said the additional crossover that Simon suggests might reduce the problem but resolve it.
There is a need for a connection between platform 2 at Corinda and the fourth track with the electrification of the fourth track from Corinda to the Panard Street crossover at Darra.
To fully utilise this fourth track the fourth platform is needed at Oxley.
At the time of the quadruplication works this could have been carried out for about $18 million, a recent costing to carry out these works was estimated to now be about $54 million with something like a further $5.5 million to rectify the junction at Darra West.
The provision of the crossover at Corinda, the platform on the fourth track at Oxley and electrification of the missing link would allow the operation of all Springfield line trains on the subs while Ipswich line trains would use the mains.
This would reduce the conflicting moves that currently take place at Panard Street and Darra West.
There is at the present time sufficent capacity to operate ten or possibly eleven trains per hour between Corinda and Ipswich and on occasion there have been this many movements over this section.
Working on the basis of ten trains per hour that allows for a fifteen minute frequency and six paths for freight and other services.
Might I suggest that instead of talking through your a*se you get off it and spend a couple of week days check out for yourself what actually happens in practice.
Between Corinda and Darra the capacity on the subs with the fourth track electrified would give a capacity of some 20 trains per hour over the four tracks effectively increasing the capacity over the present arrangement which frequently sees both freight and passenger services delayed because of what are effectively two single track sections between Corinda and the Panard Street crossover and the conflicting moves as a consequence of Springfield line (Richlands) services having to cross to the fourth track at that location.
The operation of freight (coal and grain) services are effectively being restricted to operating over the fourth track rather than them being able to use both the up and down subs between Darra West and Corinda.
There is considerable difference between what might look like a good idea in theory or on paper and making it work in operating practice.  The more complicated and complex the operating patten the higher the probability that it will fail in operation.
      and if this critisim is too much then might I suggest get on a :bi and leave town. at this stage we do not need to have to get a  to negotiate the foam.   

[somebody]

That would remove all the conflicting moves and coalies could use the subs with the Richlands/Springfield trains, meaning less conflicting moves at Corinda as well.

Umm, wouldn't it just move the conflicting moves to between Roma St and Milton?  Unless the empties are to head via Tennyson.  And how can frequencies be improved?  Surely it is already at its maximum for a pre-CRR world running at every 3 minutes.  Only the span of this intense service can be expanded before CRR.

[somebody]

No hard feelings, mufreight, but I don't see much reason in your post why we should spend $54 million to remove some restricted signals.  We could speed up the Ipswich Line just by updating the timetable.

EDIT: I'll add that I can see merit in the 4th platform if Clapham stabling is to be utilised for Springfield trains.  But only then.

[Cam]

Anyone want a bottle of water?

Off topic:

I was given a bottle of water at Wacol on Friday as I boarded the train. Are QR/Translink trying to appease commuters with the occasional bottle of water?

BTW I risked a $150 fine by drinking some of that QR branded bottle of water on the journey.  Perhaps, sense will prevail one day & commuters will be able to rehydrate legally.

[petey3801]

And how can frequencies be improved?  Surely it is already at its maximum for a pre-CRR world running at every 3 minutes.  Only the span of this intense service can be expanded before CRR.

PM peak frequencies are not to the same high frequencies as AM peak. Around half, by memory (ie: 12min frequencies to Richlands and Ipswich instead of 6).

[somebody]

Hmm, never noticed that before.  Thanks.

[Cam]

PM peak frequencies are not to the same high frequencies as AM peak. Around half, by memory (ie: 12min frequencies to Richlands and Ipswich instead of 6).

petey3801 is correct. No problems with the AM peak direction service frequency on the Ipswich Line. The PM peak frequency is the problem. We all know that the counter peak & off peak are even more of a problem.

The excessive fares & completed upgrade to the Ipswich Motorway outbound from Darra are helping reduce overcrowding.

[mufreight]

No hard feelings, mufreight, but I don't see much reason in your post why we should spend $54 million to remove some restricted signals.  We could speed up the Ipswich Line just by updating the timetable.

EDIT: I'll add that I can see merit in the 4th platform if Clapham stabling is to be utilised for Springfield trains.  But only then.

The actual cost is now irrelevant, it could have been done for $18 million if done properly in the first place, the 40km crossovers are not the main problem, the problem is the need to operate two sections of what is effectively single track.  The speed restricted crossovers simply excabate the problem more so with the freighters because they take a considerably longer time to clear these crossovers because of their length and weight.

There has been more foam sprayed about on this subject than a fire brigade putting out a crasshed 747 with a full fuel load by people less than well informed and lacking any practical experience or understanding in rail operation.  A 4000tonne 41 waggon long freighter neither brakes nor accelerates like an EMU, by removing the conflicting moves the speed restricted crossovers have no impact as they are no longer used for divirging movements.

[techblitz]

Anyone want a bottle of water?

Off topic:

I was given a bottle of water at Wacol on Friday as I boarded the train. Are QR/Translink trying to appease commuters with the occasional bottle of water?

BTW I risked a $150 fine by drinking some of that QR branded bottle of water on the journey.  Perhaps, sense will prevail one day & commuters will be able to rehydrate legally.

Off topic but i thought bottled water is fine on trains/buses as its resealable. A cup of coke from say maccas/hungry jacks however is another story.Ive boarded many a bus/train with my gym bottle(and drunk from it in plain view of the drivers) and never been spoken to.

Ferny grove 15 min services are going to be the benchmark to see how well 15 min services are needed. I want to see hard stats proving that 15 min services are infact working out that way and enticing customers out of thier cars and onto the trains.Im not a believer though sorry.

[somebody]

Stats are a bit of a rarity in QLD, but there are stats that show BUZ has dramatically increased usage.  google "BUZ warren thredbo".  If it works for buses, it would presumably work for trains.  Base is perhaps a bit higher though.

[techblitz]

well if 15 min is a pipedream & we end up sticking to 30 min frequencies and nothing can be done then the only other option is for a thorough review of the feeder bus services and other connections to allow leeway for delays etc. Not this junk where a bus is scheduled to leave 2 minutes after the train arrives(what happens when the 1/2 hourly train is late?) or when an hourly bus service passes/leaves 2 minutes before the train arrives!!

As an example, translink did a good job by reworking the hornibrook timetables in with each caboolture train which gives the trains a 10-15 minute gap incase of any delays before the bus departs from petrie.It is so handy knowing that even if the caboolture train is delayed,you dont have to panic that your going to miss the  680 o/b bus.This needs to be mirrored wherever possible accross the entire network.The priority should be given to 2tph stations with the appropriate bus connections.

[ozbob]

And PM peak:
- I/B via Oxley #3
- O/B to Ipswich via Oxley #2 (non-stopping)
- O/B to Richlands via Oxley #1 (stopping)

This is a rather large problem. Every OB Ipswich PM peak express I have run, I have been running on restricted signals from Corinda to Oxley/Darra section due to IB Richlands/empty trains crossing over to the Down Main. It is already a problem, it will become a much larger problem in time when frequencies are improved.

In a perfect world, Richlands/Springfield trains would use to subs all the way (with Up sub electrified) and Ips trains would use the mains. That would remove all the conflicting moves and coalies could use the subs with the Richlands/Springfield trains, meaning less conflicting moves at Corinda as well.

Thanks for the feedback.  mu and myself spent three years watching the project at very close quarters.  We spent a lot of time talking to engineers and construction staff and so forth.  In my case I would have been at least 3 or 4 times a week over that period at Darra/Oxley itself.  We also had some escorted tours by Trackstar.  It was a marvellous opportunity to observe a major rail brownfield infrastructure project progress.  It was clear that there were going to be significant limitations and we all tried to get a better outcome. Trackstar managed to change the concept from a triple to a quad but despite very rational arguments as to why the up sub should be full electrification and drawings were done for the 4th platform at Oxley, it wasn't pulled off. The problem didn't lie with Trackstar, or QR, but was higher IMHO.

Queensland has a marvellous ability to botch projects. 

[ozbob]

well if 15 min is a pipedream & we end up sticking to 30 min frequencies and nothing can be done then the only other option is for a thorough review of the feeder bus services and other connections to allow leeway for delays etc. Not this junk where a bus is scheduled to leave 2 minutes after the train arrives(what happens when the 1/2 hourly train is late?) or when an hourly bus service passes/leaves 2 minutes before the train arrives!!

As an example, translink did a good job by reworking the hornibrook timetables in with each caboolture train which gives the trains a 10-15 minute gap incase of any delays before the bus departs from petrie.It is so handy knowing that even if the caboolture train is delayed,you dont have to panic that your going to miss the  680 o/b bus.This needs to be mirrored wherever possible accross the entire network.The priority should be given to 2tph stations with the appropriate bus connections.

Well put!

[SurfRail]

Ideal solution:

1. Independent auditors brought in from somewhere properly run to assess whether and where 15 minute frequency is actually possible (protestations of TransLink and QR aside), and if ,what infrastructure or safeworking practices need to be upgraded to allow it.

2. TransLink and the proposed "Infrastructure Queensland" are given a brief to commission a 15 minute timetable.

3. IQ develops a staging plan for how best to implement it given population, demand etc needs and upgrades are prioritised for certain things/spots accordingly.

4. Timetable is implemented over time as infrastructure is built.

The biggest problem with the whole thing is not so much the physical state of the network, as odd as that sounds.  The problem is that NOBODY is actively campaigning for this stuff within government, so the job falls to us. 

[mufreight]

If the costs of operating a 15minute frequency are the justification used by Translink/QR for not operating 15 minute frequencies then driver only trains operated as three car sets is the obvious answer and as the exrension of services for the Richlands line has proved the higher frequency has seen a considerable growt in passenger numbers off peak from Darra and Oxley.
Yes there are problems with dissability access because on low level problems with DOO which further points out the stupidity of not raising the platform heights when Darra and Oxley were rebuilt and Indooroopilly and Toowong when they were refurbished/upgraded as the works carried out at these stations were carried out with the ful knowledge of the requirements for disability access but 2021 as I understand it.
DOO operates quite well in Melbourne, Adelaide and Perth and there would be no loss of jobs as the current guards can be retrained as drivers, the introduction would be progressive over sections between crew changes, the logical first segment would be between Bowen Hills and Richlands/Springfield 

[somebody]

What of the proposals to have a grade separation around Corinda?  How would that work: a flyover tracking south from Corinda #2, #2 & #3 or something else?

[petey3801]

Trackstar managed to change the concept from a triple to a quad but despite very rational arguments as to why the up sub should be full electrification and drawings were done for the 4th platform at Oxley, it wasn't pulled off. The problem didn't lie with Trackstar, or QR, but was higher IMHO.

I have heard on the grape vine that the main reason for the 4th track not being electrified was due to freight refusing to pay anything towards the upgrade if it was electrified. All comes down to $$$

[somebody]

What?  Why would freight be asked to pay for something like that?

[ozbob]

Trackstar managed to change the concept from a triple to a quad but despite very rational arguments as to why the up sub should be full electrification and drawings were done for the 4th platform at Oxley, it wasn't pulled off. The problem didn't lie with Trackstar, or QR, but was higher IMHO.

I have heard on the grape vine that the main reason for the 4th track not being electrified was due to freight refusing to pay anything towards the upgrade if it was electrified. All comes down to $$$

Funny hey, and now they have a worse outcome ...     they still like the mains ... lol

[ozbob]

Interesting foot note re Darra.  The footbridge was not originally going to be replaced, it was determined around July 2010 that the old bridge was unsafe and not compatible with new platform one.  So that was added to the project ...

( http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=1373.msg29669#msg29669 )

[mufreight]

What of the proposals to have a grade separation around Corinda?  How would that work: a flyover tracking south from Corinda #2, #2 & #3 or something else?

If you did your homework you would know that a flyover from between the mains on the  Corinda side of Cliveden Avenue and Corinda joining into the freight third line and platform 1 was considered and rejected on the basis that such a flyover would only be required for freight traffic (read coal) and the proposed southern freight line between Rosewood and Bromelton would make it redundent

[mufreight]

I have heard on the grape vine that the main reason for the 4th track not being electrified was due to freight refusing to pay anything towards the upgrade if it was electrified. All comes down to $$$

Another rumor, it was not electrified because TMR would not fund it, TMR was opposed to building the fourth track much less electrifing it and was supported by Translink who despite TMR in its forward growth projections of passenger numbers reporting that the fourth track would be required for passenger services by 2020 wasw of the opinion that the electyrification of the fourth track was unjustified.
The nett result is they did not spend $18 million then and it would now cost upwards of $59.5 million to do it today with a guesstimated figure well in excess of $90 millioin in 2020.
So much for the logic and planning ability of the beancounters.

[BrizCommuter]

Ideal solution:

1. Independent auditors brought in from somewhere properly run to assess whether and where 15 minute frequency is actually possible (protestations of TransLink and QR aside), and if ,what infrastructure or safeworking practices need to be upgraded to allow it.

Maybe some Japanese railway companies should do the audit. The Japanese are experts at making effective use of minimal infrastructure.

[justanotheruser]

At the last CRG and more recently I have been told by Queensland Rail staff that they cannot implement 15 minute frequencies due to infrastructure constraints, freight requirements, crew and rolling stock issues.  Which just corroborates what Mr Scales CEO TransLink is saying as well.  Whether you believe that or not, that is as they see it.

This is a huge load of horse hooey.

Certainly there are certain lines where 15 minute frequency is unviable (outer Beenleigh/Gold Coast, outer Cleveland, Doomben, maybe Shorncliffe and certainly Sunshine Coast)

BUT

15 minute frequency could be operated on Ipswich, Caboolture, Richlands, Beenleigh to probably Coopers Plains, Cleveland to Manly or Lota, and probably Shorncliffe without too much difficulty.  There might be minimal investment required on some of these lines regarding signalling/platform upgrades/crossovers etc but it's overall fairly small compared to the cost of running 1000s of buses, building new busways, expanding freeways.

Even the cost of duplicating the Doomben line is bugger all compared with the proposed KSD upgrades.

So what your saying is that the sunshine coast people are just a bunch of whingers making up stories? or are the problems that have been pointed out on the stretch before caboolture that have gone unchallenged actually wrong but nobody wanted to say that? I'm confused.

[somebody]

DOO operates quite well in Melbourne, Adelaide and Perth and there would be no loss of jobs as the current guards can be retrained as drivers, the introduction would be progressive over sections between crew changes, the logical first segment would be between Bowen Hills and Richlands/Springfield

Pretty sure that DOO operates in Melbourne in spite of significant platform gaps, certainly enough to require ramps for wheelchairs to access trains.

Maybe some Japanese railway companies should do the audit. The Japanese are experts at making effective use of minimal infrastructure.

+1

But I'm not sure that the audit is to cover such things at all!

[achiruel]

So what your saying is that the sunshine coast people are just a bunch of whingers making up stories? or are the problems that have been pointed out on the stretch before caboolture that have gone unchallenged actually wrong but nobody wanted to say that? I'm confused.

No, I'm not saying that at all.  Obviously I made myself very poorly understood.  What I meant is that there's absolutely no way to run a 15 minute service on the Sunshine Coast line.  I don't think anyone here would claim that it is.

I believe that with some small infrastructure improvements (e.g. 2nd platform at Shorncliffe), 15 minute services could run at least partway along most of the suburban lines.

[justanotheruser]

So what your saying is that the sunshine coast people are just a bunch of whingers making up stories? or are the problems that have been pointed out on the stretch before caboolture that have gone unchallenged actually wrong but nobody wanted to say that? I'm confused.

No, I'm not saying that at all.  Obviously I made myself very poorly understood.  What I meant is that there's absolutely no way to run a 15 minute service on the Sunshine Coast line.  I don't think anyone here would claim that it is.

I believe that with some small infrastructure improvements (e.g. 2nd platform at Shorncliffe), 15 minute services could run at least partway along most of the suburban lines.

perhaps i didn't make myself clear either. it has been said several times on these forums that part of the problem with getting decent frequency on sunshine coast line is within the suburban network before caboolture. you said 15 min frequency was not a problem to caboolture. So both views can't be right.

[somebody]

The 20min Timetable --> http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=7619.0

Even if they stepped up Springfield to 20 minutes to start with would be better than nothing.

I think the chances of getting the 15 minutes on the Ferny Grove extended are zero as well.

We are just going to have to keep plugging away.

Not sure how this was an answer?

20 minute has two possibilities: express/not express.  The latter option is IMO considerably inferior to the 30 minute express option for stations beyond Darra, the former option is considerably inferior to the 4tph Richlands option for people Oxley-Chelmer+Taringa+Auchenflower.  Based on the graph in the survey released a few years ago, I get very approximately:
9500 station entries 5:30am-20:30 Oxley-Chelmer+Taringa+Auchenflower
9000 station entries 5:30am-20:30 Wacol-Ipswich

Tough call as to who is more important.  I think the 4tph Richlands + 2tph Ipswich express is the most reasonable proposition.  The above ignores the increase in patronage at Oxley after 15 minute frequency.

[ozbob]

It is a comment ...

Anyway where is the growth going to occur?  Darra to Springfield, Wacol to Ipswich?  Inner Oxley to Chelmer is fairly static I expect.

20 minutes - you are right either express pattern on the Ipswich or not.  Down side of that is a reduction from 15 to 20 minutes for some stations if express, otherwise 10 minute frequency Darra to town.

4 TPH to Springfield would work, but it still leaves Ipswich without frequency.   Ipswich is already to starting to clamour for frequency and recent developments are only going to increase that pressure.  Out of peak express pattern is not as relevant to frequency gains for the Ipswich crowd in my observation. Always exceptions but there is a lot of local travel on the Ipswich line out of peak.

What will finally determine it  I expect will be the actual data, data that we don't know yet.  One thing is clear, they do appear to be starting with 30 minute frequency to Springfield out of peak.

[somebody]

I guess 20 minute does have some other angles, if all stopping.  I don't think I can support a reduction in frequency for the inner crowd, which leaves it all stopping.

The positive might be that Caboolture and Shorncliffe 20 minute frequency become achievable, if Shorncliffe-Milton & beyond can be revived.  20 minute is perfectly achievable to Shorncliffe and there has been no actual reduction in conflicting moves by attaching Shorncliffe to the suburbans.  Perhaps this is foaming!

[somebody]

Another angle is if 20 minute is introduced, then what is the next upgrade to?  3tph express Ipswich + 6tph Springfield all stops?  That would have 6 conflicting moves per hour, or 3/hr with the Oxley 4th platform.  An alternate might be 3tph express Ipswich + 6tph all to Corinda + Springfield via Tennyson which with appropriate infrastructure could have no conflicting moves, although the expresses can only gain 4-6 minutes on the all stoppers outbound.  It also requires QR to reverse trains faster than the current 8 minutes at Corinda #3.

[ozbob]

I think if they went 3 TPH Springfield / Ipswich it would be like that for a while (probably 5 - 10 years).  The next step would 4 TPH Springfield / Ipswich with possibly the  2 all stoppers / 2 express type running Ipswich. (Darra - CBD, stops at Indooroopilly, Toowong, Milton).

[somebody]

I think if they went 3 TPH Springfield / Ipswich it would be like that for a while (probably 5 - 10 years).  The next step would 4 TPH Springfield / Ipswich with possibly the  2 all stoppers / 2 express type running Ipswich. (Darra - CBD, stops at Indooroopilly, Toowong, Milton) Ipswich.

Which means either a service downgrade either in going TO or FROM the 3tph frequency for some people.

[ozbob]

Not really.  Still have 6 trains per hour all stopping Darra to CBD but 4 tph Darra - Springfield,  Darra - Ipswich now.  This where the real pax loads will be.

3 tph Springfield and Ipswich is actually a big improvement over 2 tph.