Connect the 160 to the 161?

[Gazza]

http://translink.com.au/resources/travel-information/network-information/timetables/100222-161.pdf
http://translink.com.au/resources/travel-information/network-information/timetables/111031-111,133,160,162.pdf

The 160 is all stops to Garden City depot via Southbank.
The 161 Extends from Garden City depot to Wishart outlook, however it runs express CBD-Griffith, and goes via the CCB.


Lets take two near identical peak trips.
161 Departs Garden City Depot at 8:09, arrives QSBS 8:30, taking 21 minutes.
160 Departs Garden City Depot at 8:13, arrives QSBS 8:36, taking 23 minutes.

Only a 2 minute time saving by running express and using the CCB.

Offpeak
161 Departs Garden City Depot at 12:59, arrives QSBS at 1:19, taking 20 minutes.
160 Departs Garden City Depot at 12:53, arrives QSBS at 1:15, taking 22 minutes.

In both cases the 161 offers little time saving compared to the 160, which is lost due to the hourly frequency of the 161 versus the 15 minute frequency of the 161.

It takes 7 minutes to travel from Wishart outlook to Garden City Depot.

So to that end I think it would be better for all if the 160 were extended to Wishart outlook, with the 161 abolished.

Thoughts?

[somebody]

Better than scrapping the 160 and converting the runs to 111s.  At least this way a residential area would be served rather than a park 'n' ride.

You can't even argue that the 160 is a busway service so shouldn't serve off busway stops as it already does - Garden City Depot.

What about weekends/evenings when the 160 doesn't run though?  Would these be covered by a short working (numbered 160 or 161) or increase frequency on the full run.

[SurfRail]

Delete the 160, 161 and 557 altogether.

Put on a new route between Springwood and Garden City interchange via Logan Rd, the Technology Park and Wishart.  Give it to Clark's to run if BCC is squeamish about going outside their magic boundary.

[Gazza]

^That could work too. My other option for the 161 was to make it a short shuttle between Upper Mt Gravatt & 8MP at 4bph. Depending on how tricky you were with your route planning, it would mean 7.5 min frequency to the CBD, depending on which side of the street you waited on 

Why does the 160 exist anyway? Is there any real difference in driver hours in terms of going to 8MP versus going to the depot? Timetable says it is 3 minutes to get from 8MP to Upper Mt Gravatt, and it also takes 3 minutes from Garden City Depot to Upper Mt Gravatt. Makes sense too because you'd drive fast along the Busway, versus going slowly to exit the busway and go through roundabouts etc.

Seems dumb to have it, esp considering the city stop location issue between the 160 and 111.
And if you did give them the same stop, well then they become even more closer to being identical.

[somebody]

considering the city stop location issue between the 160 and 111.

Didn't always apply.  Only from 2008.  This problem has been created by Translink.  Before Strachan and Nolan too so they aren't the cause of all the problems.

Delete the 160, 161 and 557 altogether.

Put on a new route between Springwood and Garden City interchange via Logan Rd, the Technology Park and Wishart.  Give it to Clark's to run if BCC is squeamish about going outside their magic boundary.

Via Brandl St, McKechnie Dr and Holmead Rd?

Why not tack it on the 160?

[SurfRail]

considering the city stop location issue between the 160 and 111.

Didn't always apply.  Only from 2008.  This problem has been created by Translink.  Before Strachan and Nolan too so they aren't the cause of all the problems.

Delete the 160, 161 and 557 altogether.

Put on a new route between Springwood and Garden City interchange via Logan Rd, the Technology Park and Wishart.  Give it to Clark's to run if BCC is squeamish about going outside their magic boundary.

Via Brandl St, McKechnie Dr and Holmead Rd?

Why not tack it on the 160?

Because the 160 is not required.  If there is patronage to accommodate, use the resources to put on more 111s in the off-peak, otherwise it's more buses which can be used for something else.

[somebody]

Problem I have with that is that it increases frequency to 8mp thus increasing the attractiveness of PnR.

[SurfRail]

Problem I have with that is that it increases frequency to 8mp thus increasing the attractiveness of PnR.

Not dramatically.  You already have the 169 and 555 through there as well at 15 minute headways.

[somebody]

Problem I have with that is that it increases frequency to 8mp thus increasing the attractiveness of PnR.

Not dramatically.  You already have the 169 and 555 through there as well at 15 minute headways.

What about ex-CBD?  It's fairly dramatic there.

169 is only usable for those willing to interchange.  Maybe twice if you are boarding at KGSBS.

[Gazza]

Problem I have with that is that it increases frequency to 8mp thus increasing the attractiveness of PnR.

we'll be tying oursleves in knots if we tried to design the network around this sort of minutae.
It's moot anyway, because the park and ride is full, so therfore no more would park and ride anyway.
It's not like when we have proposed extending Bowen hills terminators, that you would terminate one stop before Petrie to avoid the big park and ride there.

[#Metro]

Ah, the horrors of urban park & ride die

[SurfRail]

Eight Mile Plains is on the (narrow) urban fringe between Brisbane and Logan and next to a motorway junction, so I've no problem with park n ride there.  It's a natural fit for the location.

[Gazza]

Plus, the benefit to the community in winding back an uneeded and oddly designed service (And shifting the resources to where they are needed) outweighs the disbenefit of increasing P+R demand at one particular station.

[somebody]

Plus, the benefit to the community in winding back an uneeded and oddly designed service (And shifting the resources to where they are needed) outweighs the disbenefit of increasing P+R demand at one particular station.

What are you saying?  That you've gone off the idea of extending the 160 to Wishart Outlook now?

[Mr X]

I believe the 160 mainly existed so that people using the Park n' ride didn't fill up all the services on the 111 and stop people from Garden City inbound getting on. Essentially, a short working. (Having admittedly never taken an inbound 111 from 8MP in the AM peak, I am not sure if this actually happens). Big F goes to TL's decision in 2008 not to can the 160 or send it to KGSBS. I have nothing against people using 8MP as a park n' ride, because being in a small strip of land next to two motorways, I can't see anything else residentially significant going in there.

[SurfRail]

The Rochedale Urban Village just down the road will be fairly sizeable, but the Eight Mile Plains car park does not accommodate anywhere near the capacity of the bus services passing through even in the off-peak so there is plenty of capacity.

There is potential to extend the 161 through to Rochedale too, although I expect it is probably in the Clark's or Mt Gravatt contract area.  No problem though, it means BCC can just invest more elsewhere and TransLink has to spend not much more than it already does to run the 161 in its current version.

[#Metro]

Wow, I have to say that I am a big fan of route 161!
Was at Garden City, going to City and it was 6pm in the evening, and a 161 turns up. I was confused and thought it must be a mistake because surely BT only runs rockets in peak hour? Apparently not!

So there I was, just myself and one other person, we had the ENTIRE BUS (it was a triaxle I think - so 100 seats) to ourselves EXPRESS past all the busway stations direct into the CBD. I couldn't bloody believe it! Total air parcel service, was like a chauffeur taxi service or something!

[beauyboy]

Personally I would like to see the 161 be replaced with the 160 extention and it be extended via Wishart all the way into Eight Mile Plains Busway station. While this would mean a change to Miles Platting Road where it meets Holmead Rd it would mean the end to a bus terminating in the middle of a suburb and link that area to the Busway in both directions.

Donald

[achiruel]

http://goo.gl/maps/iawZ

Serves Wishart Outlook, EMP station, Tech Park, a fair bit of not much along Logan Rd, Underwood Marketplace/Hotel HQ etc, various shops/industrial down Logan Rd through Underwood and Springwood Bus Station.

[somebody]

BIt of a deviation to reach the lower parts of Logan Rd on that route.

[achiruel]

True, but I'm thinking 545 to still be the main route down Logan Rd.  This is more of a feeder to cover Wishart Outlook/Tech Park.

I extended it to Springwood on the suggestion of SurfRail above.  Maybe it doesn't need to go there, I'm just not sure where else is a logical place to terminate it.  I guess it could replace the 557 which may as well not exist given its frequency (2 o/b & 3 i/b trips per day).