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Author Topic: Infrastructure project shortcomings  (Read 2357 times)

Offline O_128

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Infrastructure project shortcomings
« on: February 17, 2012, 09:00:25 PM »
I think we should list all recent infrastructure projects and there shortcomings, perhaps a media release about better planning and implementation rather than having to do a project twice.

Gold coast line - Single track, had be duplicated less than 10 years later
Beenleigh triplication - hundreds of millions spent for literally no improvement
Ipswich quad - oxley issues, lack of 4th track being electrified
Ferny grove duplication - not duplicating all the way to ferny grove and only doing so when pressure was applied.
Sunshine coast duplication - A half assed improvement with absolutely zero benefit for anyone


Roads - I don't know them all but the never ending M1 widening and Ipswich works which are surely costing ridiculous amounts of money.
"Where else but Queensland?"

Offline Mr X

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2012, 09:06:28 PM »
Cultural Centre
Built 1999 (?) rebuilt a few months/a year later due to dodgy design (no passing lane WTF)

Legacy Way- no link to busway!

Bruce Highway/Ipswich Motorway/Pacific Motorway (around Slacks Creek)- millions/billions spent, lots of hot air, lots of earth works for a single (!) lane in each direction to be added. Who could forget this lovely lane, only 200m or so in length and doesn't add any capacity to anything. I pray it gets extended somewhere useful when the rest of that highway is upgraded!
Gateway Mwy, single lane merger from Southern Cross Dve to Gateway northbound at Nudgee!

Coronation Dve traffic flow system- removed a few years after being introduced.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2012, 09:14:23 PM by Mr X »
The user once known as Happy Bus User (HBU)
The opinions contained within my posts and profile are my own and don't necessarily reflect those of the greater Rail Back on Track community.

Offline Golliwog

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2012, 09:16:47 PM »
FV station upgrade only raising part of the platform.

Splitting the FG duplication into two parts I don't really have a problem with, but not touching Keperra Station is a slight sticking point. There aren't any other upgrades out there which is could be tacked onto either, unless theres a triplication in the works.
There is no silver bullet… but there is silver buckshot.
Never argue with an idiot. They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Offline Gazza

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2012, 11:29:53 PM »
My current favourite road related one is that it will go down to one lane from the Clem7 exit to Airport link entrance and vice versa.

somebody

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2012, 05:56:38 PM »
My current favourite road related one is that it will go down to one lane from the Clem7 exit to Airport link entrance and vice versa.
That's a problem because...?

Will more than 50% of users of the Clem7 continue to the Airport Link?

I think we should list all recent infrastructure projects and there shortcomings, perhaps a media release about better planning and implementation rather than having to do a project twice.

Gold coast line - Single track, had be duplicated less than 10 years later
Beenleigh triplication - hundreds of millions spent for literally no improvement
Ipswich quad - oxley issues, lack of 4th track being electrified
Ferny grove duplication - not duplicating all the way to ferny grove and only doing so when pressure was applied.
Sunshine coast duplication - A half assed improvement with absolutely zero benefit for anyone


Roads - I don't know them all but the never ending M1 widening and Ipswich works which are surely costing ridiculous amounts of money.
That's a little harsh. 

S2K + M2K did have marginal benefits.

Corinda-Darra's main limitation is the missing or mis-located crossover west of Darra.

Sunshine Coast duplication - kind of agree, but crosses do occur in the duplicated bit and it is a bit straighter and faster so not a complete loss, just near to it.

Offline Gazza

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2012, 06:03:37 PM »
Quote
Will more than 50% of users of the Clem7 continue to the Airport Link?
Just seems dumb to do that to what should really be a continuous through route......The drop to single lanes happens just before the tunnel entry...ie, it is double laned after traffic has turned off to the ICB. The drop to one lane only happens so it can "let in" the lane coming from the ICB.

Offline Fares_Fair

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2012, 06:10:21 PM »
My current favourite road related one is that it will go down to one lane from the Clem7 exit to Airport link entrance and vice versa.
That's a problem because...?

Will more than 50% of users of the Clem7 continue to the Airport Link?

I think we should list all recent infrastructure projects and there shortcomings, perhaps a media release about better planning and implementation rather than having to do a project twice.

Gold coast line - Single track, had be duplicated less than 10 years later
Beenleigh triplication - hundreds of millions spent for literally no improvement
Ipswich quad - oxley issues, lack of 4th track being electrified
Ferny grove duplication - not duplicating all the way to ferny grove and only doing so when pressure was applied.
Sunshine coast duplication - A half assed improvement with absolutely zero benefit for anyone


Roads - I don't know them all but the never ending M1 widening and Ipswich works which are surely costing ridiculous amounts of money.
That's a little harsh. 

S2K + M2K did have marginal benefits.

Corinda-Darra's main limitation is the missing or mis-located crossover west of Darra.

Sunshine Coast duplication - kind of agree, but crosses do occur in the duplicated bit and it is a bit straighter and faster so not a complete loss, just near to it.

Hello Simon,

Unfortunately, and according to the timetables, the duplication from Caboolture to Beerburrum produced no time savings whatsoever, nil, zip, zilch.  ;D

Regards,
Fares_Fair.
Regards,
Fares_Fair


somebody

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2012, 06:20:37 PM »
Unfortunately, and according to the timetables, the duplication from Caboolture to Beerburrum produced no time savings whatsoever, nil, zip, zilch.  ;D
June 2009 timetable shows a 12-13 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time, depending on direction

July 2011 timetable shows an 11 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time in both directions.

Please explain how there isn't a time saving in this section?

Offline Arnz

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2012, 06:24:54 PM »
Unfortunately, and according to the timetables, the duplication from Caboolture to Beerburrum produced no time savings whatsoever, nil, zip, zilch.  ;D
June 2009 timetable shows a 12-13 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time, depending on direction

July 2011 timetable shows an 11 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time in both directions.

Please explain how there isn't a time saving in this section?

The all-stations to Northgate + Precision cross at Beerwah for most city-bound services in the June/July 2011 timetables negated this saving
Rgds,
Arnz

Unless stated otherwise, Opinions stated in my posts are those of my own view only.

somebody

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2012, 06:29:55 PM »
Unfortunately, and according to the timetables, the duplication from Caboolture to Beerburrum produced no time savings whatsoever, nil, zip, zilch.  ;D
June 2009 timetable shows a 12-13 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time, depending on direction

July 2011 timetable shows an 11 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time in both directions.

Please explain how there isn't a time saving in this section?

The all-stations to Northgate + Precision cross at Beerwah for most city-bound services in the June/July 2011 timetables negated this saving
And you don't think that these things would have happened anyway?

Offline Fares_Fair

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2012, 06:32:03 PM »
Unfortunately, and according to the timetables, the duplication from Caboolture to Beerburrum produced no time savings whatsoever, nil, zip, zilch.  ;D
June 2009 timetable shows a 12-13 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time, depending on direction

July 2011 timetable shows an 11 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time in both directions.

Please explain how there isn't a time saving in this section?

Technically for just that sector, yes.
But as I assume you would know, the overall journey times between the Sunshine Coast and the City increased 5.8% under the new July 2011 timetable.
This is a 1 minute fudge in the overall big picture.

The times got worse, not better.

Regards,
Fares_Fair.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2012, 06:43:53 PM by Fares_Fair »
Regards,
Fares_Fair


Offline BrizCommuter

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2012, 07:08:31 PM »
Unfortunately, and according to the timetables, the duplication from Caboolture to Beerburrum produced no time savings whatsoever, nil, zip, zilch.  ;D
June 2009 timetable shows a 12-13 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time, depending on direction

July 2011 timetable shows an 11 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time in both directions.

Please explain how there isn't a time saving in this section?

Technically for just that sector, yes.
But as I assume you would know, the overall journey times between the Sunshine Coast and the City increased 5.8% under the new July 2011 timetable.
This is a 1 minute fudge in the overall big picture.

The times got worse, not better.

Regards,
Fares_Fair.

As explained before in this forum, the 2011 timetable increased the number of am peak services on the mains by approx. 25%. This was only possible by making all services stop at stations between Northgate and Bowen Hills. An increase in journey time for less than 1000 passengers has significantly improved the service frequency and reduced overcrowding for the other 15,000 travelling on the same tracks in the am peak. More duplications on the Sunshine Coast will not magically make your trains run faster between Northgate and Bowen Hills.

somebody

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2012, 07:28:16 PM »
More duplications on the Sunshine Coast will not magically make your trains run faster between Northgate and Bowen Hills.
A rare point of agreement between us.

Reliability would no doubt improve though.

Offline Fares_Fair

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #13 on: February 18, 2012, 07:36:12 PM »
Unfortunately, and according to the timetables, the duplication from Caboolture to Beerburrum produced no time savings whatsoever, nil, zip, zilch.  ;D
June 2009 timetable shows a 12-13 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time, depending on direction

July 2011 timetable shows an 11 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time in both directions.

Please explain how there isn't a time saving in this section?

Technically for just that sector, yes.
But as I assume you would know, the overall journey times between the Sunshine Coast and the City increased 5.8% under the new July 2011 timetable.
This is a 1 minute fudge in the overall big picture.

The times got worse, not better.

Regards,
Fares_Fair.

As explained before in this forum, the 2011 timetable increased the number of am peak services on the mains by approx. 25%. This was only possible by making all services stop at stations between Northgate and Bowen Hills. An increase in journey time for less than 1000 passengers has significantly improved the service frequency and reduced overcrowding for the other 15,000 travelling on the same tracks in the am peak. More duplications on the Sunshine Coast will not magically make your trains run faster between Northgate and Bowen Hills.

I don't recall ever saying that they would.
It certainly would/could improve service travel times overall, and with significant benefits for freight.

Regards,
Fares_Fair.
Regards,
Fares_Fair


Offline Arnz

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #14 on: February 18, 2012, 07:55:52 PM »
Unfortunately, and according to the timetables, the duplication from Caboolture to Beerburrum produced no time savings whatsoever, nil, zip, zilch.  ;D
June 2009 timetable shows a 12-13 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time, depending on direction

July 2011 timetable shows an 11 minute Caboolture-Beerburrum time in both directions.

Please explain how there isn't a time saving in this section?

The all-stations to Northgate + Precision cross at Beerwah for most city-bound services in the June/July 2011 timetables negated this saving
And you don't think that these things would have happened anyway?

Not at the time it was advertised (in 2007).  At the same time there wasn't expectations of a new timetable for some time either knowing Bligh and co. (SEQ 2021 or something)

Though I do agree with what you and stephenk had said about having to increase the services through all-stopping on the mains due to the lack of inner-city capacity.
Rgds,
Arnz

Unless stated otherwise, Opinions stated in my posts are those of my own view only.

Offline Gazza

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Re: Infrastructure project shortcomings
« Reply #15 on: February 18, 2012, 09:37:30 PM »
The "line" I'd like to make in a potential media release is that undercooked infrastructure means that double pressure is put on Queensland, because we're having to simultaneously spend limited funds on both new infrastructure to keep up with growth, as well as going back and (often disruptively) fixing up existing infrastructure that wasn't done right first time.
For instance, the cost of having to go back and duplicate the Gold Coast line competes with funds that could have been spent on extending it to Coolangatta.


 

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