POLL: Next most pressing BUZifications #3

[somebody]

I don't think I've missed anything worthy there!

Put it another way, if the 29 increase didn't proceed, that would get about 1/4 to 1/3 the needed seats for a brand new BUZ where one doesn't exist already.

2 votes allowed.

[Mr X]

I vote 230 as #1, having used it regularly for 5 years it is truly one of the most terrible bus routes in Brisbane. If not a BUZ, I'd at least support a radical change to the routing in this area and minimum 15min daytime/30min at night frequencies.
Centenary goes without saying.

[#Metro]

Simon, I like the poll but please make the voting non-ambiguous. Allowing 2 votes may bias the poll.

I voted BUZ 400 Centenary and BUZ 230. These are the blank spots in the "mobility map" of Brisbane suburbs. Along with 359 to Albany Creek or whatever it goes. Once that and the GCL and the 358 are in, we have the barebones basic CFN ready to use. Sure you might add other BUZifications, but that is the minimum to get to for freedom to travel in any direction at any time at will in this city.

We can't BUZ everything, we really can't. It is very costly to do, no doubt as everyone who has complained about 15% fare rises can attest. When you double the frequency, you double the cost (and double the patronge).

TransLink really needs to start using the chainsaw to cut back / prune the bush to interchanges, so we can make savings and free up cash for more improvements without drawing on more fresh cash. 461 should be one of the first to go. 198 as well, and there are others. There needs to be a "air parcel audit" to see which buses mainly carry air and work from there.

There also needs to be a values discussion, as Human Transit describes, about how much welfare we are going to allow, what to cap it at, whether relaxing the 400m rule to say 500m is acceptable and how much patronage we will allow. 100% coverage and 100% patronage conflict. You can't have both.

[somebody]

I don't see the problem with 2 votes.

[#Metro]

I don't see the problem with 2 votes.

Of course you don't you designed the poll!

[somebody]

I don't see the problem with 2 votes.

Of course you don't you designed the poll!

So where's the bias allegation come into it?

[Mr X]

2 votes is good. Any less is too restrictive and if you allow people to make any number of posts, some forumers might just vote for everything.

[SurfRail]

I have said 230 and 359.  (I suspect that they will be very reticent to run something like the 231 full-time - and at least East Brisbane would have something reasonably frequent in the absence of a 220 BUZ.)

Centenary already has 4 buses an hour to Mt Ommaney and the inner corridor itself is reasonable (ie City to Indro).  359 runs out of steam closer to the city.

[BrizCommuter]

198? 

[#Metro]

So where's the bias allegation come into it?

i was talking about sample bias

[Golliwog]

My opinion for Bulimba still remains to focus the network in the area on feeding to local hubs and the citycats. There is a use for a city bound route there, but I hardly see it up there with some of the other routes. I voted for something like the 350. That area needs a flagship route.

[HappyTrainGuy]

If the 340s, 341s etc are still running empty alot of the time from Bridgeman Downs to the station it shouldn't be a buz route.

[david]

Centenary already has 4 buses an hour to Mt Ommaney and the inner corridor itself is reasonable (ie City to Indro).

Are you kidding me? Have you checked the 450/453/454/460 timetable recently??? The inbound services ex Mt Ommaney are so bunched up that they all leave within a space of 10 minutes at the best of times. Outbound is slightly more palatable (every 15 minutes), but it is still slightly ridiculous that the 454 leaves 2 minutes AFTER the 460, and they basically follow the same route to Mt Ommaney, effectively making buses to Mt Ommaney every 30 minutes off-peak (unless you want to endure the Tour de Jindalee on the 453).

A Centenary BUZ IS the next most urgent upgrade.

[Gazza]

Centenary seems like a p%ss easy area to sort out. 2 BUZes, covers the area with basically no gaps in catchment (Purple Shading).


Uploaded with ImageShack.us

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/163/mitommaney2.jpg/

Park and ride, what park and ride
You'd literally only need it for the people right along the riverfront at westlake, and they wouldn't even need formal park and ride, just park along the roads the BUZ services.

Didn't add it, but there should be a simple dead straight route along the length of Summner Rd, Westcombe St & Station Ave plugging into Darra. Would be the most beautiful station feeder ever.

[#Metro]

Didn't add it, but there should be a simple dead straight route along the length of Summner Rd, Westcombe st Station Ave plugging into Darra. Would be the most beautiful station feeder ever

I would probably make a connection between darra and the shopping centre, direct via the freeway and Mt Ommaney Shops. That way you get all the connections that the straight line doesn't. This would mainly benefit Ipswich bound pax.

[#Metro]

WOW, that is 'effing amazing! Totally for this!

I reckon they can abolish ALL the express services too. You want express? Change to P88 at Indooroopilly.

[#Metro]

This "two line" model works nicely for Brisbane's riverbend pockets.

Analogous situations are West End (CityGlider & 199)
Yeronga (still have to sort that out)
New Farm (196 & 199)
Bulimba (230 & 235)
St Lucia (411 & 412)

[Gazza]

I don't really care too much if they still have peak hour rockets to the CBD or not (They are only required politically), but they would literally be the exact same routes, except via the Western Freeway rather than Indro.
Indro bound pax just use the BUZ, simple.

I think a media release could be done on this. Play the whole simplicity angle, and compare the 9 routes to the area to a simple 2 route proposal.
I think a good tagline is something like, "some of Brisbanes PT issues are going to be costly to fix, but the Centenary Suburbs could be provided with a high quality, easy to use bus network, with only 2 routes".

Bob is there a way to ensure images are packaged in with media releases. Do we ever send out PDFs in this manner?

[Set in train]

Centenary seems like a p%ss easy area to sort out. 2 BUZes, covers the area with basically no gaps in catchment (Purple Shading).


Uploaded with ImageShack.us

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/163/mitommaney2.jpg/

Park and ride, what park and ride
You'd literally only need it for the people right along the riverfront at westlake, and they wouldn't even need formal park and ride, just park along the roads the BUZ services.

Didn't add it, but there should be a simple dead straight route along the length of Summner Rd, Westcombe St & Station Ave plugging into Darra. Would be the most beautiful station feeder ever.

Lovely work Gazza. What about 17 Mi Rocks & Sinammon Park?

Get onto Tania Smith and Julie Attwood, put the pressure on for them to commit out there. Local policies are being asked for by political parties now for the upcoming campaigns. Also, there are so many community groups out there, progress associations that should be loudly championing this too, get them revved up.

[Gazza]

Havent touched my home turf yet low. Afraid too..To F***** hard to design for. Sinnamon Park and Edenbrooke I think is lost forever as an island of suburban cul de sacs.

[david]

I think TransLink have done well with what they have been given at Sinnamon Park and 17 Mile Rocks. The only change I would make is to re-route the 467 to Darra Station to take advantage of the very frequent services there, and of course, upgrade the 103 to all-day cross-town frequency (something I am very passionate about). I would leave the 451 alone, add a few extra services in the shoulder peak times. It's a neat little feeder service - it's quicker than driving because it uses the bus-only link there, so the service is popular.

I do realise that Fort Rd in 17 Mile Rocks is a PT blackspot, maybe something could be done in terms of a little feeder into Oxley Station? Also, I'll have to dig up the maps where I proposed an Edenbrooke deviation of the 467, but that might slow down the route too much.

Love the Centenary BUZes proposal. The entire length of Sumners Rd has the 452, which funny enough, some years ago, was cut back from an all-day service to a peak-hour only feeder.

Just putting it out there, but if you were to have two BUZes in the region, would retaining the 453 and 454 in its current state and BUZing them make more sense (ie cause less confusion then creating two new routes)

[#Metro]

Havent touched my home turf yet low. Afraid too..To F***** hard to design for. Sinnamon Park and Edenbrooke I think is lost forever as an island of suburban cul de sacs.

Park and Ride? 

[#Metro]

One might be a feeder - depends on how the loadings go and $$$ there are. Four BUZ routes (BUZ 444/453/454/P88/) gives 16 buses per hour or a bus every 4 minutes - that's more than enough frequency for Coronation Drive (which also has 411 and 412, so a bus every 3 min) and Moggill Road to Indooroopilly. Anything above that and too much air will be carried to the Brisbane CBD.

[Set in train]

Park and ride for the difficult to access areas the best idea.

As for a rail connection, buses must meet every service, otherwise it is useless. Fast transfer times too, the current BCC timetable is great for this, much better than Surfside.

[longboi]

230 and 350.

230 because of reasons previously discussed. 350 because as Golliwog has said, the area needs a flagship route which fills in that gap through that corridor. There are constantly new developments popping up around Everton Park which would make a BUZ on the South Pine Rd corridor even more necessary.

[HappyTrainGuy]

230 and 359 from me.

[Mr X]

Another idea could be a 234 BUZ, operating to Bulimba via Vulture/Stanley, Bennetts Rd and Riding Road. From my experiences of using the service for 5 years, the routes along Vulture/Stanley (184,185,210,212) are quite unreliable. A proper pedestrian crossing facility (traffic lights) on Vulture St East is a MUST- that road is a death trap for pedestrians.

[somebody]

Another idea could be a 234 BUZ, operating to Bulimba via Vulture/Stanley, Bennetts Rd and Riding Road. From my experiences of using the service for 5 years, the routes along Vulture/Stanley (184,185,210,212) are quite unreliable. A proper pedestrian crossing facility (traffic lights) on Vulture St East is a MUST- that road is a death trap for pedestrians.

Don't like that idea.  You wouldn't drive to Bulimba via the Stanley Bridge, why should a bus go that way?

I've suggested a 210 BUZ before.  If you want to improve services here then I think that is the direction you should head in.

[Mr X]

Traffic on Lytton Road can get quite bad in the afternoons I have found and this introduces a BUZ to Bennetts Road. Lytton road can have a BUZ230 via Story Bridge or South Bank.

I'd support abolishing the 174 and making a BUZ175, with the 180 rerouted straight down Newnham Road to Garden City.

So I support:
- BUZ175
- BUZ210 OR BUZ234 via Bennetts Road
- BUZ230
- BUZ to Centenary
- BUZ198 (jks jks  )

[#Metro]

The minimum set of BUZ services form the CFN.
Anything above that minimum set is a bonus.

In my mind the minimum set (on bus at least) will be complete IMHO when BUZ 230 / BUZ 400 / BUZ 359 are done plus the GCL is dissolved and replaced with 59X services.

The CFN on buses could be complete by the end of this year if we are lucky. Then TL can start cutting services back to interchanges.

A BUZ 235 could be terminated at Wooloongabba and turned around with pax transferring over to BUZ 100 and BUZ 230 for example.
A BUZ 453 or BUZ 454 (can't remember which one goes down which road) can be terminated at Indooroopilly and pax can transfer over
to BUZ 400 / BUZ 444 / P88.

105/108/107 could be terminated at PA Hospital or perhaps even Stones Corner busway turnaround people could then transfer to rail, Eastern Busway services, and SE Busway services.

and so on... not all BUZ services need to end up in the city. We don't have that much cash and there really is no need for 50 bus routes to ply between the CBD and Fortitude Valley - cut it back to the Flagship routes - BUZ 199/196 and CityGlider.

Fewer routes, with more patronage and less air.

[somebody]

Traffic on Lytton Road can get quite bad in the afternoons I have found and this introduces a BUZ to Bennetts Road. Lytton road can have a BUZ230 via Story Bridge or South Bank.

Hmm, I guess if it's via South Bank then maybe that option is OK.

[achiruel]

We can't BUZ everything, we really can't. It is very costly to do, no doubt as everyone who has complained about 15% fare rises can attest. When you double the frequency, you double the cost (and double the patronge).

I could be wrong, but I remember reading possibly here or somewhere else a while ago that several of the BUZ routes were some of the least subsidised routes in the network, because they often run very full a lot of the day.

BTW where is the 330?

[Mr X]

Short popular all stoppers like the 199 and CityGlider would be very profitable imho.

I imagine long distance expresses such as the 142 are where the money gets sucked up 

[achiruel]

Apparently I'm the only vote for the 555 

Not only would I like to see it BUZzed (well, technically not BUZzed, since it's not a BT route, but an equivalent timetable), I'd also like to see it extended to Beenleigh Station.

Why?

• Beenleigh and Logan Hyperdome are both large shopping/commerical centres in the Logan City area, and also serve as transport interchanges to other bus routes.  Transfers to train are also available at Beenleigh, including to Gold Coast services.
• Current frequency between Beenleigh and Hyperdome is poor (2 per hours, not even so wait up to 40min, and one goes via backroads).  This applies even in peak, as the peak hour specials that travel through Beenleigh
• Would also provide a direct link between Beenleigh and Springwood (another large centre) making bus more car-competive.  Can currently take 45 mintues by public transport from Springwood to Beenleigh vs about 15-20 minutes by car (obviously this will be affected by congestion but so is the bus, no busway down this far (yet!).  555 should be able to do it in ~25 minutes in good traffic conditions (as it needs to leave & re-enter the motorway at Loganholme).  Also would improve Beenleigh connection with Garden City

I would also support BUZ330 as every time I've been on that route it's been like a sardine can.  Clearly crying out for higher frequency!

[somebody]

BTW where is the 330?

I'm assuming 330 BUZ is a fait accompli.

[Mr X]

Is the 330BUZ likely to still go ahead after the announcement of a City - Chermside - Aspley BUZ?

[achiruel]

I think the 330 still needs to be BUZzed anyway.  Loadings between Bracken Ridge and Chermside are quite high (during daytime at least, not sure about night).  If if not BUZzed, it definitely needs more off-peak daytime services.  I think a lot of passengers are students going to/from Bracken Ridge TAFE.

[dwb]

I voted for 175.

However I'd like to see a BUZification of a new Paddington to Woolloongabba 386/374. Paddington is sufficiently inner urban enough to warrant more than the 385.

[somebody]

I voted for 175.

However I'd like to see a BUZification of a new Paddington to Woolloongabba 386/374. Paddington is sufficiently inner urban enough to warrant more than the 385.

I can't believe that I left off the 375!  Added.

[dwb]

I voted for 175.

However I'd like to see a BUZification of a new Paddington to Woolloongabba 386/374. Paddington is sufficiently inner urban enough to warrant more than the 385.

I can't believe that I left off the 375!  Added.

Was wondering about that Simon.... can I revote? Also I only spent one vote, yet it seems closed to me now? I'm not experienced with polls on the forum...