Article: Mum's train 'trip from hell'

[ozbob]

From the Sunshine Coast Daily click here!

Mum's train 'trip from hell'

Mum's train 'trip from hell'

Bill Hoffman | 5th November 2011

LAYLA Treffery isn't interested about the merits or otherwise of a rapid light rail system for the Sunshine Coast.

She just wants the existing heavy rail service brought into the 21st century.

The life-long public transport user is now seeking a driver's licence after a "trip from hell" from Brisbane to Eumundi this week.

Queensland Rail staff's only suggestion when her three-year-old boy wanted to use a toilet was that he would have to wet his pants.

Some, but not all, trains to the Coast have toilets - a situation Layla says is ludicrous.

"It's just completely crazy," she said. "What about old people with weak bladders. What do they do? In this day and age this is crazy."

Ms Treffery said her son was crying and yelling that he also needed to do a "poo".

She was helpless. "It was like it was my fault," she said. "I've always caught public transport and after all these years there's still just one train a day and no loo for a two-and-a-half hour journey.

"When money's involved, humanity steps out the door."

Ms Treffery urged other train users to speak up. "If nobody says anything, nothing changes."

A spokesman for Queensland Transport Minister Annastacia Palaszczuk said Queensland Rail has enough trains with toilets to fill every service on the North Coast line.

"However, due to unplanned events, Queensland Rail may be required to replace these dedicated trains with the first available alternate train to ensure services operate to the timetable.

"On behalf of Queensland Rail, I would like to take the opportunity to apologise to the mother and her child for the inconvenience."

[ozbob]

From the 'archives' ....

http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=4781.0

Media Release 9 November 2008

SEQ:  Please stop for us or we will do it on the train!

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport is concerned that North Coast rail commuters are being serviced by suburban trains without toilets.  Some of these runs are potentially three hours and it is a long time to sit with one's legs crossed.  Commuters are becoming a little perplexed as they note Interurban Multiple Unit (IMU) trains (toilet equipped) running short haul suburban runs whilst on many of long haul runs north, for example Nambour and beyond they have to sit it in Electric Multiple Unit (EMU ) trains which don?t have toilets.  It is even more confounding as passengers note IMU trains sitting in the marshalling yards as they pass on by in the EMU trains.

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"RAIL Back On Track has received consistent feedback from north coast commuters concerned about the failure to provide toilet equipped trains on the interurban runs north.  This is further problematical as many stations don?t have toilets open for use either!"

"We believe it is not an unreasonable request from the north coast commuters for toilet equipped trains. Particularly as we note IMU trains frequently running short haul suburban services around the Brisbane Citytrain network."

"Can QR Citytrain consider providing IMU trains for the north coast interurban runs please?  We appreciate the lack of funding for QR passenger services has lead to the need for some non toilet trains to do the long haul runs, but now that the new trains are available surely something can be done?"

"Goodness, what would the Gold Coast commuters do if they had regular EMU trains?  It does seem that some interurban lines are more interurban than others?"

Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org

====================

http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=4781.0

Media Release 4 November 2010

SEQ:  Please provide trains with toilets north of Caboolture

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport commuters is concerned that Sunshine Coast rail commuters are being forced to travel on suburban trains without toilets on journeys of long duration.  Some of these runs are potentially three hours and it is a long time to sit with one's legs crossed.  Commuters are perplexed as they note Interurban Multiple Unit (IMU) trains (toilet equipped) running short haul suburban runs around Brisbane whilst on many of long haul runs north, for example Nambour (1) and beyond they have to sit it in Electric Multiple Unit (EMU) or Suburban Multiple Unit (SMU) trains which don't have toilets.  It is even more confounding as passengers note IMU trains sitting in the marshalling yards as they pass on by in the toilet-less trains. We have been raising this issue now for a number of years (2).

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"RAIL Back On Track has received consistent feedback from north coast commuters concerned about the failure to provide toilet equipped trains on the interurban runs north.  This is further problematical as many stations don't have toilets open for use either!"

"Yesterday, the 3rd of November I travelled on the 3.08pm service to Roma St from Nambour which was an EMU 6 car train, with no toilets. It was a very uncomfortable journey. We noted a Queensland Rail advertisement in the Brisbane mX yesterday asking 'What do accessible trains and stations mean to you?' (3). Well, to the many passengers north of Caboolture having access to toilets is part of what accessible trains and stations means to them."

"We believe it is not an unreasonable request from the north coast commuters for toilet equipped trains. Particularly as we note IMU trains frequently running short haul suburban services around the Brisbane suburban network."

"Can Queensland Rail consider providing IMU trains for the north coast interurban runs as an automatic allocation please?  We appreciate the lack of funding for Queensland Rail passenger services did lead to the need for some non toilet trains to do the long haul runs, but now that the new trains are available surely something can be done?"

References:

1. http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=3031.msg38273#msg38273

2. 9 November 2008 SEQ: Please stop for us or we will do it on the train!  http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=1503.0

3. http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=1503.msg38352#msg38352

Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org

[O_128]

theres always enough trains with toilets for the GC line

[Arnz]

theres always enough trains with toilets for the GC line

Even some GC trains are SMU260-ed those days.  

It's a bit poor that either the daytime (or afternoon peak) Gympie North service scored a SMU260 (normally the ICE/IMU substitutes) when they could've pulled either one of the GC rostered or a different Nambour rostered IMU for the Gympie run. :\  

Yardmasters regularly pull the IMU from the 8:30am (ex-Richlands) and 1:00pm Nambour runs from Roma Street (both services worked by the same unit on the one roster) and transfer that unit onto the daytime Gympielander whenever the ICE is not available.  Sometimes a IMU from the GC roster is pulled and transferred to the daytime Gympielander instead of pulling from the Nambour roster.

[SurfRail]

theres always enough trains with toilets for the GC line

Don't make me laugh!

Virtually every second train is a 260-series, and half of the IMUs have toilets that are out of service most of the time.

This needs to be resolved - it would be inexcusable anywhere but here.  Having only a single toilet per 3-car set is itself a problem...

[STB]

It's almost as though the GC and SC lines need their own dedicated fleet, completely separated from the rest of the suburban fleet.  I suppose the only problem with that though is then you get a chance of trains sitting around doing nothing while the others are doing what the runs, rather than getting those trains out onto the suburban areas.

[Set in train]

This needs to be resolved - it would be inexcusable anywhere but here.  Having only a single toilet per 3-car set is itself a problem...

This is Queensland remember! 3 car sets are considered a full train in media releases.

[Set in train]

theres always enough trains with toilets for the GC line

Even some GC trains are SMU260-ed those days.  

It's a bit poor that either the daytime (or afternoon peak) Gympie North service scored a SMU260 (normally the ICE/IMU substitutes) when they could've pulled either one of the GC rostered or a different Nambour rostered IMU for the Gympie run. :\  

Yardmasters regularly pull the IMU from the 8:30am (ex-Richlands) and 1:00pm Nambour runs from Roma Street (both services worked by the same unit on the one roster) and transfer that unit onto the daytime Gympielander whenever the ICE is not available.  Sometimes a IMU from the GC roster is pulled and transferred to the daytime Gympielander instead of pulling from the Nambour roster.

Thanks for such an informative post Arnz. I do like the turn of phrase, 'Gympielander', very nice!

[SurfRail]

It's almost as though the GC and SC lines need their own dedicated fleet, completely separated from the rest of the suburban fleet.  I suppose the only problem with that though is then you get a chance of trains sitting around doing nothing while the others are doing what the runs, rather than getting those trains out onto the suburban areas.

Happens in every state but here (V-sets/H-sets for instance - H-sets can found in suburban service but you will never find a K-set on the South Coast).  We are the only state with regular non-toilet equipped trains operating on inter-city routes, and in QR's book any train can go anywhere except for ICEs.  Goes beyond mere correlation I think.

[HappyTrainGuy]

theres always enough trains with toilets for the GC line

Hahaha. The Gold Coast line isn't a fulltime dedicated IMU line. Its only because IMUs and SMU260s are the only rollingstock capable of sticking to the assigned timetable due to the 140kph running past Beenleigh.

[Gazza]

you get a chance of trains sitting around doing nothing while the others are doing what the runs, rather than getting those trains out onto the suburban areas.

Why is that a negative?

[ozbob]

Some feedback received, thanks.

I had my own wee crisis on a toiletless GympieLander this week.  I left Alderley at 8.30am to head to the city to do some banking and other stuff before returning to Central to catch the morning service to Gympie North.  I did not go to the toilet at Central because I assumed the train would be an ICE.  It was not.  I felt bladder discomfort onset at Beerwah-Landsborough and began hatching alternative plans -- get off at Palmwoods, use public toilet, walk to friend's house and wait out until the afternoon GympieLander came through.  I decided to stay on until Nambour, where my plan was to alight from the train and spend the afternoon doing research at the library; counter meal at the pub and catch the next train north at 7.36pm.  Fortunately, as the train pulled into Nambour, the door of my carriage aligned perfectly with the door to the gents toilet.  I dashed out, did what I had to do, and did not have time to wash my hands.  I was halfway across the platform when the whistle blew and I was able to jump back on board just in time.

For mothers with kids, it must be a nightmare.

[somebody]

theres always enough trains with toilets for the GC line

Hahaha. The Gold Coast line isn't a fulltime dedicated IMU line. Its only because IMUs and SMU260s are the only rollingstock capable of sticking to the assigned timetable due to the 140kph running past Beenleigh.

It should be though.  As with the Sunshine Coast.

[ozbob]

Yes, this toilet issue has been around for while now.  Every now and then it ramps up.  If non toilet equipped (and IMUs with non-functioning) trains have to be used, a special toilet break should be implemented at least at Nambour on a Gympie North service. 

Any rail service north of Caboolture, south of Beenleigh should have toilet facilities.  Some jurisdictions are moving to toilets on all trains, suburban and interurban.  Occasionally I have been on the Ipswich line for example when IMUs used.  Once upon a time the 'TennysonLander' was the ICE.  Not much time for the loo though ... 

[Arnz]

Any rail service north of Caboolture, south of Beenleigh should have toilet facilities.  Some jurisdictions are moving to toilets on all trains, suburban and interurban.  Occasionally I have been on the Ipswich line for example when IMUs used.  Once upon a time the 'TennysonLander' was the ICE.  Not much time for the loo though ...  

Here's one interesting fact, the 5:04pm Central to Ipswich begins in Nambour at 3:13pm as service #T5X6 (scheduled as a IMU, but 33% of the time may be a SMU260).  The auto-announcement before arrival at Caboolture is long winded though (running express from Caboolture to Northgate and express Milton to Darra stopping only at Indooroopilly)

[ozbob]

Yes, from memory there is  Richlands starter Nambour service in AM peak (8am)  that is rostered to be an IMU as well.

[Cam]

It's embarrasing enough that there are services to Nambour without toilets. However, it's totally unacceptable that a service to Gympie North does not have a toilet. Where is the contingency plan QR?

It's just not good enough - not even close. The transport minister apologises but will we see an additional IMU with a toilet on board in the fleet before the next election?

[HappyTrainGuy]

The Gympie route is the only route with fulltime dedicated rollingstock being the ICE sets. Since their ex-Traveltrain/Rocky services they have toilets in each carriage. The contingency plan encorporates the whole network which has to factor in maintainence schedules, rollingstock currently in use, rollingstock positioning on the network, refurbs etc and pairable sets (IMU104 won't pair up with IMU173). If the service is cancelled at the last minute its subject to whatever rollingstock is currently available to get out of the yard because of  time constraints on holding trains outside of Roma Street via Normanby for new services, the Caboolture line (Holding trains at Lawnton for the Gympie to leap frog it) and the Nambour line (Holding passenger/freight trains in crossing loops in both directions) which has a domino effect across the whole network hours after the service left Roma Street. A held up freighter outside of Gympie might be delayed and impact services once the freighter gets to Roma Street. The Nambour train might get stuck behind the City/Ipswich all stopper and the list goes on. So why some might perfer to have toilets or different types of rollingstock its pretty much luck of the draw. The IMU is stowed behind the EMU but there are two SMU260 pairs and SMU200 pair. The 260 gets sent as it can stick to the schedule and is the quickest to be able to get sent out.

[Gazza]

^How come yards aren't set up so each road only has one type of train on it, eg have a road dedicated to IMUs, so its never a case of one being stuck behind an EMU or whatever, rather it is a the front of the queue and can drive straight out when needed, as can all the others behind it, because they are all the same.

[HappyTrainGuy]

It already tends to be the case but it also depends on other factors such as uneven rollingstock numbers, 3 car services and where rollingstock is positioned for peak hour services (The western yard can service via Bowen hills and Normanby while the eastern yard is via Normanby).

[mufreight]

^How come yards aren't set up so each road only has one type of train on it, eg have a road dedicated to IMUs, so its never a case of one being stuck behind an EMU or whatever, rather it is a the front of the queue and can drive straight out when needed, as can all the others behind it, because they are all the same.

Then you could well have the situation that the lead IMU set fails and boxes in the next two or three sets, a problem with crowded stabling failities.
It seems of late that IMU sets are more frequently being stabled at Ipswich during the day for use on the pm Ipswich - Nambour through services.

[Arnz]

^How come yards aren't set up so each road only has one type of train on it, eg have a road dedicated to IMUs, so its never a case of one being stuck behind an EMU or whatever, rather it is a the front of the queue and can drive straight out when needed, as can all the others behind it, because they are all the same.

Then you could well have the situation that the lead IMU set fails and boxes in the next two or three sets, a problem with crowded stabling failities.
It seems of late that IMU sets are more frequently being stabled at Ipswich during the day for use on the pm Ipswich - Nambour through services.

If I recall correctly that IMU set that is stored at Ipswich during the day forms either the 4:30pm or the 5:00pm from Roma Street out to Nambour (Will stand corrected by those in the know on which service this IMU from Ipswich forms). Some people here would be seething to hear that this IMU runs empty from Ipswich to Roma Street to form either Nambour peak service.  

On a related note, the 4:00pm Roma Street to Nambour service is worked by the same IMU that operates the 11:30am Roma Street to Nambour service (the 11:30am and 4:00pm Nambour trains from Roma Street are on the same roster).  This unit comes from GC stabling, as this IMU is rostered to do VL-Airport-Roma Street-Nambour-Roma Street-Nambour (not sure if it stables in NBR or CAB stabling yards overnight).

[Set in train]

I was halfway across the platform when the whistle blew and I was able to jump back on board just in time.

Would it not be possible to simply let the guard know of the need to use a toilet on the services lacking a toilet and if only a 'quick stop', then they would hold the train? Isn't this what the 'new' QR is supposed to be all about? Customer service?

[ozbob]

Sent to all outlets:

6th November 2011

Greetings,

We have long highlighted the problem of lack of toilet facilities on some long haul trains.

The issue has been raised again.

We have a suggestion to make. If it is necessary to use non-toilet equipped trains on the Gympie North services, could a short 'wee' break be scheduled at Nambour please?

Feedback received;

http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=6996.msg73877#msg73877

I had my own wee crisis on a toiletless GympieLander this week.  I left Alderley at 8.30am to head to the city to do some banking and other stuff before returning to Central to catch the morning service to Gympie North.  I did not go to the toilet at Central because I assumed the train would be an ICE.  It was not.  I felt bladder discomfort onset at Beerwah-Landsborough and began hatching alternative plans -- get off at Palmwoods, use public toilet, walk to friend's house and wait out until the afternoon GympieLander came through.  I decided to stay on until Nambour, where my plan was to alight from the train and spend the afternoon doing research at the library; counter meal at the pub and catch the next train north at 7.36pm.  Fortunately, as the train pulled into Nambour, the door of my carriage aligned perfectly with the door to the gents toilet.  I dashed out, did what I had to do, and did not have time to wash my hands.  I was halfway across the platform when the whistle blew and I was able to jump back on board just in time.

For mothers with kids, it must be a nightmare.

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org


====================

From the Sunshine Coast Daily click here!

Mum's train 'trip from hell'

Quote
Mum's train 'trip from hell'

Bill Hoffman | 5th November 2011

LAYLA Treffery isn't interested about the merits or otherwise of a rapid light rail system for the Sunshine Coast.

She just wants the existing heavy rail service brought into the 21st century.

The life-long public transport user is now seeking a driver's licence after a "trip from hell" from Brisbane to Eumundi this week.

Queensland Rail staff's only suggestion when her three-year-old boy wanted to use a toilet was that he would have to wet his pants.

Some, but not all, trains to the Coast have toilets - a situation Layla says is ludicrous.

"It's just completely crazy," she said. "What about old people with weak bladders. What do they do? In this day and age this is crazy."

Ms Treffery said her son was crying and yelling that he also needed to do a "poo".

She was helpless. "It was like it was my fault," she said. "I've always caught public transport and after all these years there's still just one train a day and no loo for a two-and-a-half hour journey.

"When money's involved, humanity steps out the door."

Ms Treffery urged other train users to speak up. "If nobody says anything, nothing changes."

A spokesman for Queensland Transport Minister Annastacia Palaszczuk said Queensland Rail has enough trains with toilets to fill every service on the North Coast line.

"However, due to unplanned events, Queensland Rail may be required to replace these dedicated trains with the first available alternate train to ensure services operate to the timetable.

"On behalf of Queensland Rail, I would like to take the opportunity to apologise to the mother and her child for the inconvenience."

=================

From the 'archives' ....

http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=4781.0

Media Release 9 November 2008

SEQ:  Please stop for us or we will do it on the train!

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport is concerned that North Coast rail commuters are being serviced by suburban trains without toilets.  Some of these runs are potentially three hours and it is a long time to sit with one's legs crossed.  Commuters are becoming a little perplexed as they note Interurban Multiple Unit (IMU) trains (toilet equipped) running short haul suburban runs whilst on many of long haul runs north, for example Nambour and beyond they have to sit it in Electric Multiple Unit (EMU ) trains which don?t have toilets.  It is even more confounding as passengers note IMU trains sitting in the marshalling yards as they pass on by in the EMU trains.

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"RAIL Back On Track has received consistent feedback from north coast commuters concerned about the failure to provide toilet equipped trains on the interurban runs north.  This is further problematical as many stations don?t have toilets open for use either!"

"We believe it is not an unreasonable request from the north coast commuters for toilet equipped trains. Particularly as we note IMU trains frequently running short haul suburban services around the Brisbane Citytrain network."

"Can QR Citytrain consider providing IMU trains for the north coast interurban runs please?  We appreciate the lack of funding for QR passenger services has lead to the need for some non toilet trains to do the long haul runs, but now that the new trains are available surely something can be done?"

"Goodness, what would the Gold Coast commuters do if they had regular EMU trains?  It does seem that some interurban lines are more interurban than others?"

Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org

====================

http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=4781.0

Media Release 4 November 2010

SEQ:  Please provide trains with toilets north of Caboolture

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport commuters is concerned that Sunshine Coast rail commuters are being forced to travel on suburban trains without toilets on journeys of long duration.  Some of these runs are potentially three hours and it is a long time to sit with one's legs crossed.  Commuters are perplexed as they note Interurban Multiple Unit (IMU) trains (toilet equipped) running short haul suburban runs around Brisbane whilst on many of long haul runs north, for example Nambour (1) and beyond they have to sit it in Electric Multiple Unit (EMU) or Suburban Multiple Unit (SMU) trains which don't have toilets.  It is even more confounding as passengers note IMU trains sitting in the marshalling yards as they pass on by in the toilet-less trains. We have been raising this issue now for a number of years (2).

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"RAIL Back On Track has received consistent feedback from north coast commuters concerned about the failure to provide toilet equipped trains on the interurban runs north.  This is further problematical as many stations don't have toilets open for use either!"

"Yesterday, the 3rd of November I travelled on the 3.08pm service to Roma St from Nambour which was an EMU 6 car train, with no toilets. It was a very uncomfortable journey. We noted a Queensland Rail advertisement in the Brisbane mX yesterday asking 'What do accessible trains and stations mean to you?' (3). Well, to the many passengers north of Caboolture having access to toilets is part of what accessible trains and stations means to them."

"We believe it is not an unreasonable request from the north coast commuters for toilet equipped trains. Particularly as we note IMU trains frequently running short haul suburban services around the Brisbane suburban network."

"Can Queensland Rail consider providing IMU trains for the north coast interurban runs as an automatic allocation please?  We appreciate the lack of funding for Queensland Rail passenger services did lead to the need for some non toilet trains to do the long haul runs, but now that the new trains are available surely something can be done?"

References:

1. http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=3031.msg38273#msg38273

2. 9 November 2008 SEQ: Please stop for us or we will do it on the train!  http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=1503.0

3. http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=1503.msg38352#msg38352

Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org

[somebody]

I'd wondered if trains were stored at Ipswich during the day.  It doesn't make any sense if you ask me.  It only increases out-of-service running.

[mufreight]

Positions them for the PM services

[somebody]

Positions them for the PM services

To Rosewood?  Interesting.

[Arnz]

Positions them for the PM services

To Rosewood?  Interesting.

The 6 car IMU that is stored at Ipswich for half the day during weekdays runs empty from Ipswich stabling to Roma Street to form either the 4:30pm or 5:00pm train to Nambour.

[somebody]

Positions them for the PM services

To Rosewood?  Interesting.

The 6 car IMU that is stored at Ipswich for half the day during weekdays runs empty from Ipswich stabling to Roma Street to form either the 4:30pm or 5:00pm train to Nambour.

Not enough room in Mayne for it?

[Golliwog]

If it was just going to run back to Mayne as an empty in the middle of the day then theres less wasted travel distance leaving it at Ipswich for the day. If you took it back to Mayne then you'd have wasted travelling between Roma St and Mayne twice. If you can get away with leaving it at Ipswich for the day then why not? Though I would question why it runs out of service Ipswich to Roma St (though if it's not dedicated to a specific Nambour service then that understandable).

[somebody]

How's it get to Ipswich?  Either it has to have run empty there, or another train has to run empty to Ipswich to serve the inbound services which it would have served.

Looking at the timetable, it seems this would be the 9:28am arrival.  Presumably, that would normally form the :37 departure, but another train runs to Ipswich to fill this role.  Looking at the timetable, it looks like the 8:26am Rosewood arrival runs out of service to Ipswich to form this 9:37am departure!

Bizarre! Surely the main traffic on the Rosewood line in the AM peak is Ipswich bound!

But I could be wrong on the details.

[mufreight]

Unfortunately there are usually three sets that run empty to Ipswich just after the end of the morning peak as they are within minutes of timetabled services they are run empty cars.
Yes it would be nice if they were run as services but I would assume that to do so they would have to wait in the CBD and would block other services hence the need to keep them moving and get them out of the way.

[somebody]

I think we should accept not having the clockface counter peak timetable.  That is the cause of the Nambour-Ipswich run, as well as the 5 minutes of bloat on the 8:44am Central arrival from GYN.  Either that or there should be an un-sectorisation with the NBR/GYN(I/B) trains using the suburbans.

[Arnz]

How's it get to Ipswich?  Either it has to have run empty there, or another train has to run empty to Ipswich to serve the inbound services which it would have served.

Looking at the timetable, it seems this would be the 9:28am arrival.  Presumably, that would normally form the :37 departure, but another train runs to Ipswich to fill this role.  Looking at the timetable, it looks like the 8:26am Rosewood arrival runs out of service to Ipswich to form this 9:37am departure!

Bizarre! Surely the main traffic on the Rosewood line in the AM peak is Ipswich bound!

But I could be wrong on the details.

The IMU is stored at Ipswich for just over 6 hrs, and leaves the Ipswich yard just after 3:40pm

Meanwhile on a related note, one of the ICEs is stored at Caboolture for 5 hrs (off the 10:13am Caboolture arrival ex-Nambour, sits in the yard for much of the day, and forms the 3:23pm ex-Caboolture to Nambour), this ICE is required for the "Counter-Peak" shuttle service leaving Caboolture at 7:53am and leaving Nambour at 4:30pm.

[somebody]

Meanwhile on a related note, one of the ICEs is stored at Caboolture for 5 hrs (off the 10:13am Caboolture arrival ex-Nambour, sits in the yard for much of the day, and forms the 3:23pm ex-Caboolture to Nambour), this ICE is required for the "Counter-Peak" shuttle service leaving Caboolture at 7:53am and leaving Nambour at 4:30pm.

Both the trains should be extended to the CBD.  Having the ICE make the stops on the Sunshine Coast and be deprived of the express leg is pretty odd.

As with the 8:52am Nambour arrival and 9:13am Nambour departure.

[Arnz]

Meanwhile on a related note, one of the ICEs is stored at Caboolture for 5 hrs (off the 10:13am Caboolture arrival ex-Nambour, sits in the yard for much of the day, and forms the 3:23pm ex-Caboolture to Nambour), this ICE is required for the "Counter-Peak" shuttle service leaving Caboolture at 7:53am and leaving Nambour at 4:30pm.

Both the trains should be extended to the CBD.  Having the ICE make the stops on the Sunshine Coast and be deprived of the express leg is pretty odd.

As with the 8:52am Nambour arrival and 9:13am Nambour departure.

Lack of express paths (with the exception Petrie to Northgate in both peak periods and maybe Caboolture-Petrie for the PM departure) in the counter-peak direction.  Also, the ICE is already unreliable enough as it is, this train type will not want to be stopping at more stops.  Not to mention the Eagle Junction curve.

You could probably extend those trains to Cooroy so the ICEs can operate on the suburbans instead of the mains (express Caboolture-Bowen Hills), but that is also subject to paths beyond Nambour, and at the same time changing the Sunshine Coast timetable to keep the 90 min clockface off-peak headway.

[somebody]

If it can serve the 11 stations CAB-NBR I don't see why it can't serve 7 stations: PET/N'Gate/EJ/BH-Roma St.

The 9:13am NBR departure shouldn't have any issues, as with the 16:22 NBR arrival (15:23 CAB dep).

[Arnz]

If it can serve the 11 stations CAB-NBR I don't see why it can't serve 7 stations: PET/N'Gate/EJ/BH-Roma St.

The 9:13am NBR departure shouldn't have any issues, as with the 16:22 NBR arrival (15:23 CAB dep).

The ICEs were originally designed for long distance between stops, not continual short-stopping suburban stops.  It's bad enough when they put it on the Gympie North corridor, but still at least there's 5-8 mins between stations.  

They could replace that ICE with a IMU, but finding unit/s is the hard part. They can however roster the 3-car IMU that arrives 2:07pm at Roma Street (12:13pm Nambour departure) to turn back as the 2:30pm to Nambour (arrive 3:23pm at Caboolture). But I'm not sure where that 3-car IMU is rostered after the 2:07pm Roma Street arrival.

The ICEs are really underutilised those days.  Only 2x 5-car units are rostered on any given day. (The peak and daytime Gympie services).

[somebody]

The only part with less than 5 minutes between stops in my proposal is Roma St-Bowen Hills which they are able to manage now.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Not exactly true simon. If you catch the Petrie train at the same time as the Gympie North ICE you'll be dwelling at stations for longer than the ICE train even though both leave each station at the same time (Infact you can bail from the Petrie train on platform 4 at Albion, run up the stairs and you can get a photo of the ICE going past platform 2 even though they left Bowen Hills at the same time).

The problem with the ICE is what Arnz stated. They were designed for long distance speciality running. There's a range of fundamental things that's different about them. They have a slower acceleration rate from 0 for  passenger comfort but mostly because of many other major factors The traction motors just hate the short stop runs (They perfer it when the train has momentum pushing it along rather than move 260t from a dead stop). They are substantially heavier than other rollingstock (IIRC - 1x 6 car EMU is about 240t while 1x 6 car ICE is about ~260-265t (lost a few bits during modification) although they might be comparable to an 1x 6 car IMU which is about 255-265t - depending on rollingstock generation - They both sport different setups). Inside their different as areas are/were configured to make hot meals, cold food/drink storage, refreshments, sinks, catering carts, toilets, luggage etc. Less passenger seats. Different door configuration positions. Different door sizes. There are two doors per enterance. One to enter the carriage and another to enter the seating compartment. This was to reduce the amount of noise made from outside, catering staff, toilets and noise made by some passengers. The outside doors were also built heavier as they're to reduce the outside noise. They have a different door closure system that is manual/spring loaded compared to other rollingstock. They aren't as suited to stations with curves and the list goes on and on.

I'm pretty sure the reason for Eagle Junction being removed from the route route yonks ago was because of proper visability for the guard/driver to check the train/platform was clear before releasing the spring loaded doors as they were located at both ends of the train. I wouldn't mind seeing the Gympie North services run express Bowen Hills to Caboolture express to Lansbrough express to Nambour all stops to Gympie.... Although its a similar leg as the Tilts....  

IIRC an interesting note about 6 car ICE trains they have the heaviest carriage (the driver motor) at ~52t and the lightest carriage (the trailer) at ~34t.

Arnz, I think that unit operates as a 3 car airport train or it might hook up with another 3 car IMU to form an extra Gold Coast service during peak. I know one Gold Coast service splits into two IMUs post peak running.