The Sunshine Coast Case : Rail duplication Beerburrum to Nambour

[ozbob]

The Sunshine Coast Case : Rail duplication Beerburrum to Nambour > https://t.co/cDQfrWmZVJ @QLDLabor @LNPQLD @QldGreens @pwellingtonmp pic.twitter.com/CUmcr64dVx

— Robert Dow (@Robert_Dow) September 20, 2016

[#Metro]

I think a more appropriate title for this thread is Re: The Sunshine Coast (Basket) Case : Rail duplication Beerburrum to Nambour

[ozbob]

Pollies ignore the lobbying. People need to run for office (and take the balance of power) , and the Sunshine Coast needs to become marginal. Nobody is going to pay attention when seat margins are in double digits.

Room for mass public tactical voting.

Yes, any volunteers?  Run as independent to stir up the issue.

[Fares_Fair]

Steve Austin from 612 ABC Radio Brisbane had Premier Annastacia Palaszczuk MP, on his show this morning to answer listener questions.
A gentleman phoned in to ask when they were going to do something about the rail duplication Beerburrum to Nambour (I love a well-informed member of the public). He said that the Highway was a shambles too (or words to that effect).

Didn't get an answer as to when of course. It's part of their plans and they are looking for federal funding etc. the excuses just continue for doing nothing.
Business case is due in Q1 of 2017 according to MR from Govt but Premier didn't know and clearly doesn't care.
She admitted knowing about it since I met with her in 2011!

My thanks go to Steve Austin of 612 ABC radio Brisbane for asking what they were doing about it.
He mentioned that I had a face to face meeting with her 5 years ago (she was Transport and Multicultural Affairs Minister at that time under Hon Anna Bligh MP), what has happened since?

[achiruel]

Just build the @#$!ing thing, now! I don't give a stuff if the State needs to borrow money, they are screwing the state over by not building it.

As for the speed, I don't understand why they can't do at least 160km/h to Landsborough North. I'm guessing the amount of tunnelling beyond there makes it a lot more expensive to build track for those kinds of speeds. 100km/h double track from Landsborough to Nambour is still a crapload better than we have now, freight would benefit greatly as well as pax.

[Stillwater]

We are about eight months away from the Business Case for the Beerburrum-Nambour duplication being completed.  Is the reported scaling back of the operational speed for the line on its new alignment part of the actions to improve the BCR?  Is the business case for all of the B-Nbr track or just to Landsborough North?  Will the costings include proposed new nine-car stations and what stations might they be?   Is CAMCOS to Caloundra being considered as part of the mix?

It would be nice to get an update from the Minister, Mr Hinchliffe.  It would be nice if the Opposition transport spokesperson, Mr Powell, whose electorate stands to benefit most from the duplication, asked the Minister for an update on progress.

[#Metro]

The trouble with NCL is that it is trying to be all things to all people.

Freight is limited to around 100 km/hr. Passenger trains are not, and it is better for passengers to go at higher speeds (say 160 km/hr) as it reduces the travel time for them.

Passengers need speed. But the NCL is going to mix freight and passenger trains together - when you do this capacity is eaten up on the tracks. Timetabling also more restrictive.

It would not surprise me if a speed reduction was applied to pax trains to relieve this "mixing of different trains" issue.

Is CAMCOS to Caloundra being considered as part of the mix?

As for CAMCOS, the report was released by ARUP in 2001, that is almost 16 years ago. I expect all the financials in it would be out of date and need to be redone. If so, I would like to see a full Sunshine Coast - Noosa alignment looked at. If we can look at a blue-sky HSR alignment proposal, there should be no issue with looking at rail to Noosa.

I would put the cost, assuming it branches off the NCL, at around $10 BN.

[Stillwater]

The SCL duplication is linked inextricably to rail freight operations, to overcome the conflict between passenger rail and freight rail.  The line's future will be led by design and operational efficiencies based on freight trains.  Passenger rail (north of Landsborough North) is a secondary consideration.  It is clear that all attention will be on getting duplication to Landsborough North in the first instance.  Will it be a nine-car station platform perhaps?

[mufreight]

The planing for the line as far as Nambour was for it to be double track with bi-directional signaling in this case any conflicts between the operation of freight services at a maximum speed of 100kph and passenger services operating at a maximum speed of 160 kph are minimised.  on such an alignment the tilts would be able to operate at speeds greater than the 160 kph.
The dumbing down of the line to save costs is another exercise in political stupidity that it to be paid for for generations to come by the increased operating costs for all trains over this section on the NCL.  Only in Queensland.

[Fares_Fair]

Steve Austin from 612 ABC radio Mornings Show spoke with Premier Annastacia Palaszczuk on Friday 30 September.
Chris from Maleny asked her about rail duplication.

Link to audio on website, it expires in 2 days.
See 12:42 sec. mark on

https://radio.abc.net.au/programitem/peWD0rVmBQ?play=true

Rail duplication is in THE PLAN, but it has no start date *facepalm*

Incidently, the Premier was incorrect when she said that they were building railway lines, they were not. They were building just one.
The only one under construction at that time (April 2009) was the Springfield line.

[Fares_Fair]

This morning I had the opportunity to speak with Steve Austin on his Mornings program, on 612 ABC radio Brisbane.

Topic was "Is Rail Back on Track?"
Discussed rail duplication to Sunshine Coast.

Link to audio is here:
https://radio.abc.net.au/programitem/peA3peJAaQ

See 13:45 sec. mark on for my RBoT interview.
Show devoted to rail travel from the get-go.

Discussion with the Hon Jackie Trad, Deputy Premier, Minister for Infrastructure, Local Government and Planning and Minister for Trade and Investment.

Link will expire in 7 days.

Thank you very much to Steve Austin for the opportunity to discuss this crucial infrastructure issue.
He asks the tough questions.

[ozbob]

Thanks FF, the ' battle ' continues .. 

[City Designer]

Nambour station is 104.8km north of Central and Varsity Lakes is 89km south of Central.

I can see why the extra distance involved compared with the Gold Coast line has made the project look too complex to deliver within a political cycle.

Notwithstanding considerations such as population the greenfield projects (Springfield and Kippa-Ring) were shorter and relatively simpler to deliver versus widening an existing line from Beerburrum to Nambour (35.2km).

[Fares_Fair]

Beerburrum to Nambour is 39 km.

Beerburrum to Landsborough is approx. 17 km (on 13 January 2015 it was costed at $532 million in an election promise by Campbell Newman)
Landsborough to Nambour is approx. 22 km (In November 2011 it was costed at $1.7 billion in the 'Landsborough to Nambour Rail Project - Report Summary by The Co-Ordinator General)

[SurfRail]

More information now available.  Looks like a seriously hobbled version of what was scoped out in the past few years.

http://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/Projects/Name/B/Beerburrum-to-Nambour-Rail-Upgrade-Project

[Stillwater]

Pauline Hansen quoted in today's Sunshine Coast Daily as saying that rail duplication should be the Coast's No.1 infrastructure priority.  That should make things uncomfortable for the LNP, in particular.

[Stillwater]

Hello, there will be community information sessions on Beerburrum to Nambour upgrade in October 2016.  That's been kept quiet.
(See these words under 'Current Investigations' heading: http://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/Projects/Name/B/Beerburrum-to-Nambour-Rail-Upgrade-Project )

"During community information sessions in October 2016, the project team will showcase the reference design, provide information on how various options were assessed and the designs finalised, and give people the opportunity to provide feedback on the project."

This seems poor wording, as it conveys the impression the design for the whole B-Nbr corridor will be revealed, when the issue that will be discussed publicly will be the track and station configuration, plus road design, at Landsborough only.

However, the TMR site goes on to say ......

The proposed upgrades may include:

•   replacing temporary single platforms at stations with permanent dual platforms connected by lifts and overbridges (Mooloolah, Eudlo, Palmwoods and Woombye)
•   replacing the Barrs Road level crossing near Glass House Mountains with a new connection to Coonowrin Road in Glass House Mountains
•   replacing the Caloundra Street level crossing in Landsborough with a road over rail solution (to be confirmed)
•   expanding the park and ride facilities in Landsborough, Nambour, Palmwoods and Beerburrum
•   extending passing loops at Landsborough, Eudlo and Woombye to improve train operations
•   improvements to the Beerburrum Road and Steve Irwin Way intersection at Beerburrum.

[ozbob]

Beerburrum - Nambour Rail Upgrade
Community information sessions Oct 2016 O_O
> https://t.co/bcaRqzA5Vr #qldpol
Hallelujah ! #2tracks pic.twitter.com/nnzXFHNpc3

— Robert Dow (@Robert_Dow) October 6, 2016

[tazzer9]

This just screams that the proper upgrade is that many years away.

The full duplicated 140kph version nambour to palmwoods should just be built now.   That would at least allow hourly trains in the off peak and counter peak with peak direction going up to 3-4 tph.   Its a small section, but its this area which is really stopping increased services.

[ozbob]

It's a start and things starting to happen after a period of not much at all.

Locals can help drive this along.   

[Stillwater]

Oh, it is for the whole corridor!  Holy crap.

See map: https://www.collaborativemap.com/B2N

[Arnz]

Noted as per past reports, it's duplication Beerburrum-Landsborough, with improvements only beyond Landsborough North to Nambour. 

The big surprise is replacing the "Temporary Platforms Extensions" with permanent full length 2 platforms with lifts & bridges at the existing station locations past Landsborough under the B2N project alongside identified crossing loop extensions/improvements.

[Fares_Fair]

Extraordinary approach in my opinion.

17km duplication Beerburrum to Landsborough - all good.
Track upgrades for 22km Landsborough to Nambour - hopeless minimal approach, but better than nought.

Permanent platforms, lifts etc. - but on the original alignment !

An absolutely minimalist approach that will stymie this line for decades into the future.

Passing loop extensions at Woombye and Eudlo, track reconfiguration at Palmwoods.

No announcements whatsoever from the Gov't over any of the community consultation sessions.
Clearly they are embarrassed at their lack of action.

A Business Case is what this is a part of, nothing more.

Funding to be advised in 2017, subject to Gov't decision - of course.


On a brighter note, today in the Sunshine Coast Daily, Senator Pauline Hanson has come out and said rail duplication is our region's number one priority.

[Stillwater]

They have squibbed on the big engineering, tunnels north of Landsborough, extended passing loops for freight trains.

[ozbob]

If the line gets duplicated to Landsborough North and with the extra loops etc.  it will allow more frequent and more reliable services.

High speed services are a while away yet.  I think it is best to get engaged and see how this all develops.

[Arnz]

Reading the report, the alignment between Beerburrum and Glasshouse Mtns have largely kept most of the 160km/h alignment from the original proposal (which also involves Steve Irwin Way road re-alignment and closing off the Barrs Road LX, with a new Barrs Road connection off Coonoowrin Road to replace the LX).

The Glasshouse Mtns to Beerwah alignment have only had slight curve easing just north of Glasshouse Mtns station, pretty much keeping the existing 120km/h speed limit (all MUs) on that section.

So when completed, the speed would be 140km/h (passenger MUs) between Caboolture and the Barrs Road LX site (where it then drops to 100km) and 120km/h between Glasshouse Mtns and Landsborough (since they are only putting the new track next to the existing 120km/h sections) if they take the minimalist approach identified in the report.

[Stillwater]

Gradual, incremental development of this project ....

Public information leaflet says the project is in the 'developing the reference design' to go to the next stage (business case), which is due mid-2017.

Subtle change to wording in document .... no longer reference to mid-2017, but "in 2017", which means the deadline for the business case completion has slipped to sometime beyond July 2017, but before end December 2017.

[Fares_Fair]

This is far, far worse than the Cross River Rail Mk I (Gold Plate) vs Cleveland Solution (Cheaper) comparative we saw in 2014.

It does not address the 2 fundamentals mentioned in virtually every report since 2006, and that are that its grade and alignment are the crucial limitations.
Neither is being addressed in their proposal north of Landsborough through to Nambour.

That said, rail duplication to Landsborough a fantastic move (if it ever gets funding).

[ozbob]

Getting the amplification to Landsborough North really is a key step.  Rest will follow ..

[Stillwater]

We need to ensure that track amplification is to Landsborough NORTH (and not just Landsborough).  Better operational efficiencies.

Completion of the Business Case 'in 2017' means that Budget 2018-19 is the earliest that state/federal funding can be allocated for this work.  Confirmation of funding in June 2018 means construction won't start until early 2019, allowing for a 2019-21 construction period.

2021 is shown as completion of 'duplication to Nambour', but we are not going to get there -- we get this proposal, in effect duplication to Landsborough (North), with some station upgrades and extended crossing loops further north.  Of course, the major station works means that the station locations are fixed.  No extensive realignment between Landsborough and Nambour.

I wonder what would be the travel time savings on a Nambour-Brisbane journey, based on this work being completed and taking into account the changed express pattern and timing due to the Redcliffe Peninsula Line changes?

[ozbob]

Ms Hanson has been talking to LNP Members on the Sunny Coast.  Time lines are not fixed IMHO.

Anything is possible including a start within a relatively short time frame.

[tazzer9]

What they are proposing is simply unacceptable.  What they are proposing would have been considered unacceptable back in the 1960's.
Any upgrade to the NCL will be its final ever upgrade, and it should be good enough that it will never need another upgrade.

Full duplication on 140km/h aligned track to nambour at the absolute minimum.

Ideally full 140km/h duplicated track to yandina, with beerburrum to beerwah having 3 tracks to allow an extended freight passing lane.  Also traveston to pomona and woondum to glanmire full duplication and realignment to be upgraded after the previous upgrade is complete.   This will not only save over 30 minutes for all rail services.  But it will allow freights to have running crosses.   

The proposed upgrade would simply never be allowed anywhere else in the world.  Anywhere else would do it properly.   This would be a backwards waste of time and money.

[ozbob]

It is a matter of being pragmatic.  They simply will not spend money on a twin high speed alignment to Nambour at present.

I would be happy for now for a near immediate start on duplication to Beerburrum to Landsborough North, some improvements north of that will improve it.  Not ideal but something is better nothing at present.

[SurfRail]

I really wonder if it is better not to spend anything north of the Landsborough straight except for 1 or 2 passing loops.  Sounds like a hideous waste of capital to do anything more.

[ozbob]

I really wonder if it is better not to spend anything north of the Landsborough straight except for 1 or 2 passing loops.  Sounds like a hideous waste of capital to do anything more.

Yep. Get the next section right.  Some improvements to the loops north of LN will help but that's about all for now.  Need to do it properly, so get the first part done now.

The section Caboolture to Beerburrum is first rate of course.  I have been in the cab of ICE on that section, really moves.

[Fares_Fair]

I really wonder if it is better not to spend anything north of the Landsborough straight except for 1 or 2 passing loops.  Sounds like a hideous waste of capital to do anything more.

The fact that they plan to build lifts and footbridge overpasses at Mooloolah, Eudlo, Palmwoods, Woombye and (currently) Nambour stations, and temporary platforms at Mooloolah, Eudlo, Palmwoods and Woombye to be replaced with permanent ones, tells us that rail duplication to Nambour will probably not occur in our lifetime, if ever at all.

Extending passing loops at Eudlo and Woombye will help freight, as will track reconfiguration at Palmwoods.

But the fundamentals remain as they always have been.
Poor grade and alignment limits everything, and that isn't changing north of Landsborough.

The BIG question in all of this is the silence to even announce anything by the State Gov't on these consultations sessions. Total silence. 
Nothing from TMR or TransLink advising anyone. 

It's utterly appalling and shows a complete disregard for the community on the Sunshine Coast.
No information sessions to be held north of Landsborough - seriously.
Just at Glass House and Landsborough.

It's seems clear to me that the current State Government have no intention of following through with funding or else they would all be announcing and parading this latest PLAN.
Instead we get silence.

I just hope I am wrong.

[#Metro]

If there isn't anyone standing for the next election, then perhaps Pauline Hanson is your next best bet.

[tazzer9]

Problem is landsborough to maryborough west, with the exception of a few short sections and the two major bypasses it is absolute horseshit.     Its slow, but also in a manner which maximises fuel, brake wear and QR's maintenance costs.   

The biggest issue I see in the document is that lack of realignment south of landsborough.  Only seem to be doing the worst sections. 

Under the upgrade stated, we will see little improvement to freight services, little improvement in travel times for both sunny coast trains and tilt trains.
Only improvement will be relatively small train frequency increases.
So in the end, we will be spending alot of money for nothing. I think we are better off spending that little bit more cash, but seeing a heap of improvement.

Under this upgrade, nothing will be taken off the bruce highway, and we will then be spending another billion dollars adding another lane to that. 

#builditrightonce

[Stillwater]

Maybe time to clue up Hansen/Ashby (advisor) ... and put some pressure on Peter Wellington, who remains quiet.  And, you would expect Andrew Powell to come out with a statement on this.  After all, he is the Opposition transport spokesperson, and this is his electorate.  HELLO!

Agree FF, clearly the immediate focus is to Landsborough North, so that is why there are no public consultation displays or consultation venues booked further north.  Kind of suggests that LN-Nbr is some way off.  But SC Council will take the alignment (as is) and put it in a planning scheme that will have land developed at the railway towns in such a way that this is the only option, now and into the future.

The annoying thing is that if people raise the issue of rail alignment between LN and Nbr at some stage in the future, TMR will say: "Oh, we had public consultation back in 2016 and no-one objected." 

Pauline Hansen could hold key.  Her party could attract up to 20 per cent of the votes in each of the SC electorates.  She backs SCL duplication and more infrastructure for the Coast.  See video in story ...

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/lnp-mp-steve-dickson-invites-one-nations-pauline-hanson-to-buderim-20161007-grxhcg.html

[Fares_Fair]

 Senator Pauline Hanson says rail duplication is Sunshine Coast's number one priority in today's Sunshine Coast Daily.

http://www.sunshinecoastdaily.com.au/news/pauline-hanson-says-coast-needs-rail-upgrade/3097770/