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Author Topic: 6 Apr 2011: SEQ: Call to scrutinise Kingsford Smith Drive 'Car Rapid Transit'  (Read 3582 times)

Offline ozbob

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Media release 6 April 2011

SEQ: Call to scrutinise Kingsford Smith Drive 'Car Rapid Transit'

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport commuters calls on Infrastructure Australia to scrutinise Kingsford Smith Drive Car Rapid Transit. Other cost-effective solutions including public transport-only options should be considered.

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"RAIL Back on Track notes that 'Kingsford Smith Drive upgrade is now back on the agenda' (1,2).

"All options presented for capacity expansion on Kingsford Smith Drive so far have focused solely on Car Rapid Transit – the fast movement of single occupant vehicles. The cost of the most expensive option is an eye watering $3.2 BILLION dollars, equivalent to three Gold Coast Light Rail projects, with money to spare!"

"The modal choice of Car Rapid Transit needs to be independently scrutinised by Infrastructure Australia against Bus Rapid Transit (BUZ in peak hour T2 lanes), Rail Rapid Transit (Doomben Line upgrade), more frequent ferries and de-congestion pricing, all of which are are likely to cost a lot less than $3.2 BILLION."

"There has already been a duplication of the Gateway Motorway, while a tunnel will connect to Brisbane Airport as part of the Airport Link Car Rapid Transit project. It seems that the real purpose of this Kingsford Smith Drive road upgrade project is to relieve congestion encouraged by people rat-running off the so-called 'Inner City (Congested) Bypass (ICB) to access the Gateway Motorway and avoid tolls. It would be prudent to wait to see the effects of the Airport Link tunnel before spending billions."

"RAIL Back on Track has written extensively on the simplicity of upgrading the Doomben railway line as providing increased transport capacity in this area (3,4,5). Public transport upgrades can proceed separately from, and independent to, any road upgrade for Kingsford Smith Drive. Public transport upgrades and road upgrades are logically separate projects and it is not necessary for improvements to public transport to come mandatorily pre-packaged with road upgrades. We would like to see decent 'public transport only' options. The Doomben line duplication was planned and initial works done in the 1950s. In light of increasing congestion, it's completion is surely due now, not in 20 years time if the community is lucky."

"RAIL Back on Track again calls for the total abandonment of 'balanced transport' and a shift to 'rebalanced transport' based around walking, cycling, buses, ferries and rail. Incentives for public transport must be combined with disincentives for driving because any other combination is self-defeating. 'Car Rapid Transit' is a low capacity, high-pollution, expensive-to-construct, high-toll mode inappropriate for mass transit purposes. Looming peak oil crises are going to precipitate a transport crisis of major proportions. Now is the time to properly prepare."

"The unblocking of the Sunshine Coast rail line for example (which is at capacity) could do more for national freight objectives and passenger transport than more redundant expensive road projects."

"RAIL Back on Track also does not understand why, after boasting about making a $300 million dollar saving on Legacy Way, $50 million dollars could not be found for a bus interconnection to the busway to allow Council's own buses to use the Legacy Way (Northern Link Tunnel) (6). Another 'non-core' promise or just badly managed obfuscation? Either way, it is certainly reflective of the appalling transport planning generally in south-east Queensland, and why the 'locals' cannot be trusted as they are obsessed with car rapid transit!"

Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org

References:

1.Kingsford Smith Drive back on agenda
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/kingsford-smith-drive-back-on-agenda-20110404-1ctha.html

2. Kingsford Smith Drive upgrade
http://www.brisbane.qld.gov.au/traffic-transport/plans-projects/transport-projects/Kingsford-Smith-Drive-Upgrade/index.htm

3. SEQ: Car Rapid Transit money better spent on Real Rapid Transit
http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=5492.0

4. SEQ:  Doomben Line upgrade required
 http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=5469.0
 
5. SEQ: "Car rapid transit" is NOT the only option for Kingsford Smith Drive
http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=5166.0

6. Express bus mooted for western suburbs
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/express-bus-mooted-for-western-suburbs-20100920-15jmr.html
« Last Edit: April 06, 2011, 05:39:05 AM by ozbob »
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Offline Harry Zyx

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Engineering feasibility investigations by Aecom for Queensland Transport showed that linking the Doomben line to Northshore by tunnel is not feasible, but an elevated structure all the way into Northshore is.
Unfortunately, the Doomben line is a lemon, because it's such a tortuous route between Doomben and the city. Existing patronage is the lowest on the network because of this, and Translink excludes this line from meeting its standard performance criteria. A more direct rail route is needed.

Offline ozbob

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Patronage on the Doomben line is lowest because of the abysmal train frequency ...  it is much faster than bus or car, particularly at peak.

No need for a tunnel, but a deep cutting to negotiate under KSD.
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Offline Harry Zyx

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A cutting under KSD won't work for two reasons: the grades needed to get down would have to start way before Doomben station, and it's so close to the river, flooding would be a serious problem. The elevated solution would work, and also be a neater solution to integrating the station with the Northshore activity centre.

Offline ozbob

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Quote
The elevated solution would work, and also be a neater solution to integrating the station with the Northshore activity centre.

Yes, good solution.  A cutting need not be that deep the road can be pushed up a bit as well.  But elevation is a better solution in view of probable water table rises ..  ;)
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Offline Gazza

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Quote
flooding would be a serious problem.
Couldn't they just accept it might flood once every 40 years or so, and just pump it out when that happens (As they did with the Breakfast Creek tunnel on the ICB)

A bridge would indeed be cheaper though.

Offline Golliwog

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Its possible, but the cost of that could be high, depending on your track structure. If you used a ballasted track bed, you would not only have to pump out all the water, but likely clean and replace the ballast etc due to it probably clogging up with sediments and causing poor drainage, which causes poor track quality and effects the ride of your train.

Digging things out also has a tendency to be more expensive and disruptive than bridging things.
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Offline Harry Zyx

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Both at-grade rail and cuttings are serious barriers to transverse movement, split valuable properties and reduce the opportunities for developing greefield or brownfield sites (such as the area south of KSD at Hamilton). An elevated structure allows free transverse movement or built development beneath, and is ideal for an elevated station which can be integrated into a TOD at Northshore. It's cheaper to build and maintain, requiring no ventilation, less risky in terms of flooding, and more pleasant for rail passengers. On the negative side, it is visually intrusive, but good design can create an iconic structure integrated with the surrounding environment.

Offline #Metro

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I'd like to see all options looked at and a proper feasibility study into it (surely they have feasibility and multiple options for KSD tunnel, so why not rail also).
A station similar to that of, say Springfield station, would be great. That's elevated, but in such a way that you can walk all around it and it is pleasant.
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Offline #Metro

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I have this image in my head of the train station being elevated like Springfield, but instead of a normal station platform, the entire station
is enclosed in a glass 'box' that comes down to ground level so that it is transparent and encloses the entire station and you can see the train arrive through the station wall.

Like this, but much smaller and simpler. With a good station, you could get development galore-- maybe something like Toowong right there, ensuring high patronage all day.
Something like that encourages TOD, adds value to the area, makes a good business location out of the CBD. You can't do that with a tunnel buried underneath the river.


Hauptbahnhof Berlin
http://blog.freetimegears.com.tw/patrick/archives/Berlin%20Hauptbahnhof_001.jpg
« Last Edit: April 07, 2011, 03:36:23 PM by tramtrain »
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Offline Gazza

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Like this, though I think the long space under the station should be used for shops, supermarkets etc:


http://img268.imageshack.us/i/northshore.jpg/

Offline #Metro

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Holy #*$#* You have been reading my mind!!!

YES!!!

The only thing different things would be that

(a) I would have the glass wall go ALL the way down to ground level.
(b) bus bays indented
(c) bus could go around the entire station (like Springfield). This allows departures on one side, and arrivals on the other. Simple!

I love it. It can be the poster example for the concept.  :-w  :is-  :-t
I am amazed at your ability to turn ideas into images like that.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2011, 09:55:54 PM by tramtrain »
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Offline Stillwater

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Humm ... posters of design concept.... buckets of glue ..... dead of night ..... lamp posts.

Offline Gazza

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Quote
(a) I would have the glass wall go ALL the way down to ground level.
I wanted to avoid that so the elevated track would form a verandah, and the shops below would sit in the envelope of the station platform above.
Quote
(b) bus bays indented
Realised I should've done that whilst drawing....Whoops.

Quote
(c) bus could go around the entire station (like Springfield). This allows departures on one side, and arrivals on the other. Simple!
Since it would be a terminus, there is no need for separate stops, Bus pulls in, unloads, loads, pulls out, and turns around at the end and heads back out again.

Quote
I love it. It can be the poster example for the concept.  Wow!
I am amazed at your ability to turn ideas into images like that.
It is what I do for a living  ;)

Offline #Metro

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Quote
I wanted to avoid that so the elevated track would form a verandah, and the shops below would sit in the envelope of the station platform above.

Sounds good.

Quote
Realised I should've done that whilst drawing....Whoops.
  :)

Quote
Since it would be a terminus, there is no need for separate stops, Bus pulls in, unloads, loads, pulls out, and turns around at the end and heads back out again.

This sounds a bit like the current UQ Lakes. There may need to be a layover or something as it is conceivable that BT operators might want to take a break and so forth.

 :-t  :-c
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Offline ozbob

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Sent to all outlets:

6th March 2016

Call to scrutinise Kingsford Smith Drive 'Car Rapid Transit'

Good Morning,

It is no surprise to us that Team Quirk's signature Kingsford Smith Drive (KSD) upgrade project is an expensive white elephant.  There are far higher priorities, and it seems the citizens of Brisbane are starting to realise that.

See the Sunday Mail--> Graham Quirk’s $650m Kingsford Smith Drive upgrade gets lukewarm response from voters

Even the RACQ considers the KSD upgrade funds could be spent better elsewhere.

Both the ALP and Greens have far more mature and future visions for Brisbane than the present LNP administration, clearly.

The failure to properly enable Legacy Way for buses as promised is a signature failure of the present LNP Council Administration. Can they really be trusted with respect to KSD?

For interest this is what we said in 2011 about the KSD  ....  still relevant (below).

Little wonder it is not only the wheels on the rubber tyre ' pie in the sky ' Metro  that are falling off the Team Quirk bus it is?

Best wishes
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

===================

http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=5743.0

Media release 6 April 2011

SEQ: Call to scrutinise Kingsford Smith Drive 'Car Rapid Transit'

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport commuters calls on Infrastructure Australia to scrutinise Kingsford Smith Drive Car Rapid Transit. Other cost-effective solutions including public transport-only options should be considered.

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"RAIL Back on Track notes that 'Kingsford Smith Drive upgrade is now back on the agenda' (1,2).

"All options presented for capacity expansion on Kingsford Smith Drive so far have focused solely on Car Rapid Transit – the fast movement of single occupant vehicles. The cost of the most expensive option is an eye watering $3.2 BILLION dollars, equivalent to three Gold Coast Light Rail projects, with money to spare!"

"The modal choice of Car Rapid Transit needs to be independently scrutinised by Infrastructure Australia against Bus Rapid Transit (BUZ in peak hour T2 lanes), Rail Rapid Transit (Doomben Line upgrade), more frequent ferries and de-congestion pricing, all of which are are likely to cost a lot less than $3.2 BILLION."

"There has already been a duplication of the Gateway Motorway, while a tunnel will connect to Brisbane Airport as part of the Airport Link Car Rapid Transit project. It seems that the real purpose of this Kingsford Smith Drive road upgrade project is to relieve congestion encouraged by people rat-running off the so-called 'Inner City (Congested) Bypass (ICB) to access the Gateway Motorway and avoid tolls. It would be prudent to wait to see the effects of the Airport Link tunnel before spending billions."

"RAIL Back on Track has written extensively on the simplicity of upgrading the Doomben railway line as providing increased transport capacity in this area (3,4,5). Public transport upgrades can proceed separately from, and independent to, any road upgrade for Kingsford Smith Drive. Public transport upgrades and road upgrades are logically separate projects and it is not necessary for improvements to public transport to come mandatorily pre-packaged with road upgrades. We would like to see decent 'public transport only' options. The Doomben line duplication was planned and initial works done in the 1950s. In light of increasing congestion, it's completion is surely due now, not in 20 years time if the community is lucky."

"RAIL Back on Track again calls for the total abandonment of 'balanced transport' and a shift to 'rebalanced transport' based around walking, cycling, buses, ferries and rail. Incentives for public transport must be combined with disincentives for driving because any other combination is self-defeating. 'Car Rapid Transit' is a low capacity, high-pollution, expensive-to-construct, high-toll mode inappropriate for mass transit purposes. Looming peak oil crises are going to precipitate a transport crisis of major proportions. Now is the time to properly prepare."

"The unblocking of the Sunshine Coast rail line for example (which is at capacity) could do more for national freight objectives and passenger transport than more redundant expensive road projects."

"RAIL Back on Track also does not understand why, after boasting about making a $300 million dollar saving on Legacy Way, $50 million dollars could not be found for a bus interconnection to the busway to allow Council's own buses to use the Legacy Way (Northern Link Tunnel) (6). Another 'non-core' promise or just badly managed obfuscation? Either way, it is certainly reflective of the appalling transport planning generally in south-east Queensland, and why the 'locals' cannot be trusted as they are obsessed with car rapid transit!"

Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

References:

1.Kingsford Smith Drive back on agenda
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/kingsford-smith-drive-back-on-agenda-20110404-1ctha.html

2. Kingsford Smith Drive upgrade
http://www.brisbane.qld.gov.au/traffic-transport/plans-projects/transport-projects/Kingsford-Smith-Drive-Upgrade/index.htm

3. SEQ: Car Rapid Transit money better spent on Real Rapid Transit
http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=5492.0

4. SEQ:  Doomben Line upgrade required
 http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=5469.0
 
5. SEQ: "Car rapid transit" is NOT the only option for Kingsford Smith Drive
http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=5166.0

6. Express bus mooted for western suburbs
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/express-bus-mooted-for-western-suburbs-20100920-15jmr.html
Half baked projects, have long term consequences ...
  Bob's Blog

 

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