4xx rocket shake up + peak express service

[somebody]

Firstly, there are only a few problems in the AM peak.  

• The bit where the outbound expresses loop around William St/Elizabeth St/George St/Ann St/Riverside Expressway may have made some sense when it avoided congestion on the William Jolly Bridge but it is now a problem which needs to be fixed.
• I suggest an extension of the 455 and 456 rockets which serve Jindalee/Mt Ommaney/Riverhills from their current Queen St bus station terminus out on to William St and Margaret St.  Then remove routes 457, 458 and 459 from the AM
• The 425/430 probably do not need to run at all in the peak direction.  427/432 cover much of their service for people not heading to the city or Milton, and interchange is possible from the 426/446 for the bits which aren't covered.  Also, extension of the 427 in particular is possible.
• The express routes via Centenary Bridge could terminate at Indooroopilly and/or continue as 428s
• This would probably leave enough 426s, 431s and 446s terminating at QSBS to cover the counter peak 425s, 430s, 435s, 453s, 454s

In the PM peak:
Move 431 to Adelaide St, serving 433 stops as that's by far the most logical plan.  The rocket ideally should serve the same stops as the full time service, and there is no disadvantage in this case.
Make all the other rockets which currently start in QSBS B start in Charlotte St, similar to 343, 376, 382, 383, serving stops 90, 91 and 130.  Add a stop outside the Casino on George St (stop 116).
Don't run 425/430 outbound, and start 453/454 from Indooroopilly.  Feed with 428 (possible route number change mid run)
Remove routes 457/458/459 from the PM as well.  They don't really make much less of a walk compared to the Charlotte St start.  Wharf St is covered by the train, with connection at Roma St.


I am assuming that the 460/461 service is not going to continue for very long with the Richlands opening.  But I may be being optimistic there.

[#Metro]

I have a very out there idea, you probably are already familiar with it.
Although this is only an idea and I don't really mind if it happens or not.

* New 401 superbus bullet (every 2 mins) (originates at Indooroopilly Shops and then non-stop via Western Freeway)

[STB]

Which is quicker though? Via the Western Freeway or via Moggil Road or Coronation Drive?  The Western Freeway I find, at least on a map, isn't as direct as the other options.  And just looking at the map, to come from Indooroopilly via the Western Freeway, you actually have to travel away from the city before heading towards the city for a bit of a distance.

[#Metro]

As long as the routing is the fastest, and it is non stop and serves Mt Ommaney and Indooroopilly (may need 2 superbus arctic bullets here) then I don't mind IMHO.

Buses could feed into Mt Ommaney and be turned back for another run (except for 450/Centenary BUZ) for an extremely high frequency suburban service. Passengers could transfer to a superbus bullet service at Mt Ommaney or the 450 BUZ for Coro Drive stops.

[STB]

Why would you begin a bus route at Indooroopilly (you're suggested route 401) to run into the city if you were wanting it to stop at Mt Ommaney?  That makes no sense whatsoever.

[somebody]

Using the Western Freeway and serving Indooroopilly shops is an either/or proposition for any western bus route.  The Western Freeway is certainly faster off peak in my experience.  Also, Milton Rd is better than Coronation Drive in general.  However the bit from Upper Roma St to Cribb St can be very congested on Milton Rd heading outbound.  I'm not sure how much better this is now that the right hand turn from ICB into Coro has been re-instated, but I haven't personally seen a jam up since.

I'd really rather see upgraded rail frequency and speed than city-Indro routes, terminating at Indro!  We don't need them at all.

[STB]

Interesting that's it's quicker during off peak but what about during peak hour with the Western Freeway?  Is it any quicker than the other options?  Or are they about the same?

[ozbob]

Indro rail is going to have good frequency shortly, use that.

[#Metro]

Why would you begin a bus route at Indooroopilly (you're suggested route 401) to run into the city if you were wanting it to stop at Mt Ommaney?  That makes no sense whatsoever.

Don't worry STB, the LM will build a (toll) tunnel direct from Mt Ommaney to Indooroopilly!

Ok, on a more serious note, I was not clear enough. Maybe one beginning at Indooroopilly, and another one beginning at Mt Ommaney- so you would have two separate routes.

I think BT will hold on tooth and nail to retain buses running parallel to rail and NOT feed them into indooroopilly rail. But yes, feeding indroopilly rail makes sense. It needs a proper interchange though, which has not been built. And you need trains all day to be high frequency, unless the intention was to only run rockets to rail in peak.

[somebody]

Interesting that's it's quicker during off peak but what about during peak hour with the Western Freeway?  Is it any quicker than the other options?  Or are they about the same?

Not sure about peak hour, note that the 443 goes via Coro+Moggill, but the older rockets use Milton Rd/Freeway.  A bus lane inbound on the Freeway from Moggill Rd would be godsend.  Even if not duplicated on the outbound, which really is jammed on the approaches to it anyway.  However ozbob is right:

Indro rail is going to have good frequency shortly, use that.

This is by *FAR* the fastest of any option in peak hour.  Especially on a Friday afternoon.

EDIT: Moggill Rd, not Moggill.

[#Metro]

This is by *FAR* the fastest of any option in peak hour.  Especially on a Friday afternoon.

Do we have timetable proof of this?
I might have a look later today.
BTW what is happening with North Link Tunnel? Is that bus ramp to the busway station going in or not?

[Gazza]

Is that bus ramp to the busway station going in or not?

As said in a previous post, the design has been locked in, and it wont be happening.

[#Metro]

Do you have a link to that?
So what of the 2000 buses/day that was supposed to use the North Link tunnel I recall?

Buses fast-tracked
By connecting to the Inner Northern Busway (INB) at Kelvin Grove, Northern Link would provide for express bus services into the CBD.
This would save bus commuters about 20 minutes on a daily journey between Kenmore and the CBD in 2026.
Opportunities to connect Northern Link to the INB will be investigated during the detailed feasibility study.
Other public transport improvements as a result of reduced congestion on surface roads will also be investigated during the study.

www.northernlinkeis.com.au/pdf/northernlinkNL_nov-dec07.pdf

[ozbob]

BCC wanted $55M from the state government for building the ramps etc.  for bus access to Northern Link via  INB.  Seems not forthcoming ...

Rail is 12 minutes from Indro, 15 minute frequency average wait 7.5 minutes, 20 minutes average.  Much better at peak.  Bus is just caught up in traffic, both ways.

[somebody]

So what of the 2000 buses/day that was supposed to use the North Link tunnel I recall?

Lies.  Damned lies.

[ozbob]

So what of the 2000 buses/day that was supposed to use the North Link tunnel I recall?

Lies.  Damned lies.

One of the reasons I scored BCC rock bottom.  I questioned this publicly, no one seem to care too much.  VROOOOM !!   

[#Metro]

Crank up the CRT infrastructure!!!

[somebody]

Oops!  I'd forgotten to put in a "Don't support it" option.  This is now added.

[david]

This is fairly radical, but...

How about canning ALL the current routes in the Centenary area, creating a Centenary BUZ and then have lots of bus-rail feeders to Darra. With the proposed high frequency of trains through Darra, surely the time savings will be more significant catching a bus to Darra and then an express train to the City, rather than being stuck in traffic on Moggill Road/Coro Drive/Milton Road etc. 

Everything else sounds good, but I agree with not creating the Indooroopilly to City rocket. Indooroopilly train station will have a ridiculous frequency into the City. Duplicating this will be akin to the creation of Route 88.

[#Metro]

 

I agree with a BUZ 450 (Centenary BUZ) but I think there should be feeders at least as far as Indooroopilly. I think Gazza proposed something similar
but the problem was that you had to make people travel in the wrong direction to get to Darra station. Extension to Indooroopilly bus and then rail station
would solve that.

The tail end of the BUZ could feed into the Darra station to create a 'dual action'   route where the bus fills up with Darra station bound
passengers on the counter peak run, and similarly, transports people (from Ipswich maybe) to jobs at Mt Ommaney etc.

Of course, you need an interchange at Indooroopilly station, and there isn't one now. A missed opportunity.

I suggested rocket buses Indooroopilly to CBD for a few reasons:
1. Is there enough room on the trains in the am peak?
2. Are you going to do this all day (or just send the rockets there during peak?)
3. I have a feeling this idea (although good and sound IMHO) will be anathema to BT
(though paying for waste a la route 88, inefficiency a la train running parallel to bus and duplication a la brand new freeway parallel to richlands line in PT via my taxes and 15% compounding  fares is anathema to me, but that doesn't seem to matter much)

[somebody]

This is fairly radical, but...

How about canning ALL the current routes in the Centenary area, creating a Centenary BUZ and then have lots of bus-rail feeders to Darra. With the proposed high frequency of trains through Darra, surely the time savings will be more significant catching a bus to Darra and then an express train to the City, rather than being stuck in traffic on Moggill Road/Coro Drive/Milton Road etc. 

Everything else sounds good, but I agree with not creating the Indooroopilly to City rocket. Indooroopilly train station will have a ridiculous frequency into the City. Duplicating this will be akin to the creation of Route 88.

Media release was: http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=5146.0

Thread: http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=4448.0

My plan:


Doesn't really change any of the principles in this thread.

[somebody]

Interesting that's it's quicker during off peak but what about during peak hour with the Western Freeway?  Is it any quicker than the other options?  Or are they about the same?

Given that Moggill Rd is often bumper to bumper past Indooroopilly shops in both peaks, I would assume that the Western Freeway is the same.  Otherwise everyone would go that way.  I don't believe that only local trips (including UQ bound) cause that much congestion on Moggill Rd.  Sorry, can't give a more diffinitive answer than that.