BrizCommuter Blog

[somebody]

There was an adjustment for weekly tickets, they were previously counted as 11 trips but that was changed to 10.  This also had an effect on the data reliability.   

What, so some figures in the same graph are based on 11 trips/weekly and others are based on 10/weekly!?  Is that what you are telling me?

[ozbob]

That was part of the explanation for the fall in patronage ..  only the messenger .. 

[somebody]

That was part of the explanation for the fall in patronage ..  only the messenger .. 

I always assumed that the correction would be applied to all graphs produced subsequent to their adjusted estimate.

[ozbob]

Train patronage decreased by 1.64 million
to 12.78 million trips, although this is
subject to an adjustment factor due to the
accuracy of go card data – as outlined in
the Tracker Q1 2009/10.

Tracker q3 09-10 page 4

Haven't got Tracker Q1 2009/10

Train trip numbers continue to be impacted
by the increased accuracy of go card data
when compared with the formulas applied
to periodical paper tickets (as outlined
in Tracker Q1 2008/9). Despite this
correction trend, train trips recorded
a rise this quarter.

Tracker Q4 2009/10 page 4

So in essence the apparent fall in rail patronage may not be real as indicated by the data, it may be just the adjustment from weekly tickets previously credited with 11 trips being counted effectively as 10.

[ozbob]

Found it, Tracker Q1 2009/10

We are also seeing a correction in some of the data previously collected due to the
accuracy provided by go card. For example a weekly train ticket was previously
considered as 11 trips. The go card is providing a more accurate data showing
customers actually travelled nine or 10 times, sometimes across train, bus and ferry.
As go card uptake increases we expect to see this correction continue.

   

[BrizCommuter]

There was an adjustment for weekly tickets, they were previously counted as 11 trips but that was changed to 10.  This also had an effect on the data reliability.   

The source of the rail patronage figures in the blog are from head counts (the quarterly QR passenger load survey), not ticketing data.

[ozbob]

Any data reporting that manages to have bus as 100% reliable, leads one to have not much faith in the other data either ...

The load survey is probably more accurate than the Tracker figures ..

[somebody]

The source of the rail patronage figures in the blog are from head counts (the quarterly QR passenger load survey), not ticketing data.

Problem with the load survey is that it only covers peak patronage.

[BrizCommuter]

Any data reporting that manages to have bus as 100% reliable, leads one to have not much faith in the other data either ...

The load survey is probably more accurate than the Tracker figures ..

The Q3 2009-10 tracker used two sets of figures. The patronage figures on page 4 are obtained from ticketing, and cover all day patronage. The patronage figures on page 14 are from the quarterly QR passenger load survey which is a head count during the am and pm peak. The latter figures were used in the blog for rail patronage. Sadly, the TransLink trackers for Q4 2009-10, and Q1 2010-11 did not state the % change from the previous year for the QR passenger load survey. Good ol' TransLink transparency!

[somebody]

I still don't follow how you got the 4.4% reduction in patronage.

[BrizCommuter]

I still don't follow how you got the 4.4% reduction in patronage.

Page 14 of Q3 2009-10 Tracker.

[BrizCommuter]

A Christmas & New Year message.
http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2010/12/free-christmas-new-year-public.html

[BrizCommuter]

More Airtrain bashing.
http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/01/airpain.html

[BrizCommuter]

Brisbane vs Perth vs Melbourne
http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/01/brisbane-vs-perth-vs-melbourne.html

[BrizCommuter]

Faremaggedon II
http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/01/faremaggedon-ii.html

[BrizCommuter]

http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/01/get-kicked-on-route-66.html
Overcrowding still occurring on the Inner Northern Busway.

[BrizCommuter]

http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/01/soon-theyll-be-popping-up-near-you.html
Are any of the 305,000 extra seats a week going to materialise near Chez BrizCommuter?

[#Metro]

BrizCommuter is hilarious!
http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/01/cross-river-rail-delayed-until-2020.html

Keep up the good work! I like how it gets straight to the point, frank and fearless!
What would your plan be for Brisbane?

[#Metro]

3) As planned for the Sunshine Coast Line in the draft 2011 timetable, Gold Coast services may have to made less express as well in the future (a train with no standing passengers crossing the Merivale Bridge will be a waste of track capacity). This will slow down journeys to and from the Gold Coast.

WOW, the effect of slowing the Gold Coast trains to increase capacity- I don't think it is possible, track capacity over the bridge is already saturated IMHO, but even if it could work, touching the GC line express is just electoral suicide.

[#Metro]

CRR delayed, rail capacity at it's limits by 2016, and the SE Busway also bursting at the seams. It looks like the basket case that is public transport in Brisbane is only going to get a lot worse over the next 9 years! Time to move to Melbourne or Perth?

Yes, you are not the only one thinking!!

[Arnz]

3) As planned for the Sunshine Coast Line in the draft 2011 timetable, Gold Coast services may have to made less express as well in the future (a train with no standing passengers crossing the Merivale Bridge will be a waste of track capacity). This will slow down journeys to and from the Gold Coast.

WOW, the effect of slowing the Gold Coast trains to increase capacity- I don't think it is possible, track capacity over the bridge is already saturated IMHO, but even if it could work, touching the GC line express is just electoral suicide.

Gold Coast is also LNP/Federal Coalition territory (except for a hinterland seat).  So like the Sunshine Coast (also a LNP/Federal Coalition area), even if the neutering of Gold Coast expresses does happen (eventually), it's not gonna help Labor's chances of gaining any seats in traditional conservative areas.

[BrizCommuter]

3) As planned for the Sunshine Coast Line in the draft 2011 timetable, Gold Coast services may have to made less express as well in the future (a train with no standing passengers crossing the Merivale Bridge will be a waste of track capacity). This will slow down journeys to and from the Gold Coast.

WOW, the effect of slowing the Gold Coast trains to increase capacity- I don't think it is possible, track capacity over the bridge is already saturated IMHO, but even if it could work, touching the GC line express is just electoral suicide.

Most am peak direction Gold Coast services passing through Park Road have either no standees, or only a few standees. At 4tph, this is space for nearly 2,000 passengers per hour!

[BrizCommuter]

http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/02/signalling-case-study-paris-rer.html
Quite a contrast to Brisbane.

[#Metro]

It is branched!  Is it just 2 tracks with junctions?
How do they manage that?

Maybe getting good metro frequency on QR CityTrain is possible...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:RER_A.gif

[somebody]

http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/02/signalling-case-study-paris-rer.html
Quite a contrast to Brisbane.

30tph!  Let's buy some.  I would doubt that would be achieved on either CityRail or CityTrain (the latter especially) due to the dwell time considerations with the current rolling stock of course.  You'd probably achieve 24tph with greater reliability than either can achieve 20tph currently.

[BrizCommuter]

http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/02/signalling-case-study-paris-rer.html
Quite a contrast to Brisbane.

30tph!  Let's buy some.  I would doubt that would be achieved on either CityRail or CityTrain (the latter especially) due to the dwell time considerations with the current rolling stock of course.  You'd probably achieve 24tph with greater reliability than either can achieve 20tph currently.

Even with the same signalling, 30tph would not be possible in Brisbane without reducing dwell times (doors flow), and eliminating infrastructure limitations (grade junctions, single and triple tracks, lack of reversing capacity).

It is branched!  Is it just 2 tracks with junctions?
How do they manage that?

Maybe getting good metro frequency on QR CityTrain is possible...

There are just two tracks through the core section. The track map (along with other Paris RER Lines) is at
http://carto.metro.free.fr/documents/CartoRerIdf.v2.1.pdf

[somebody]

30tph would not be possible in Brisbane

That's what I said.

[railguy83]

The same would be achieveable in Brisbane if each Brisbane corridor had its own pair of tracks, think CA-IP, FG-BE, AP-GC, SC-RI, DO-CL, that would be 10 tracks through the core of the system, and we only have 4 from Roma Street to Bowen Hills. That is where our problems are at, too much line sharing.

If you delay CRR and just shove a new tunnel from RS-BH, there would be great opportunity to increase overall network capacity.

IMHO

[somebody]

The same would be achieveable in Brisbane if each Brisbane corridor had its own pair of tracks, think CA-IP, FG-BE, AP-GC, SC-RI, DO-CL, that would be 10 tracks through the core of the system, and we only have 4 from Roma Street to Bowen Hills. That is where our problems are at, too much line sharing.

If you delay CRR and just shove a new tunnel from RS-BH, there would be great opportunity to increase overall network capacity.

IMHO

Don't see the point.  CRR is needed to increase capacity and speed for Merivale Bridge routes.  This would do no such thing, but it would increase capacity for Ipswich & trains from the north.  This isn't where the efforts need to be directed.

[#Metro]

Some sharing is not too bad and can probably be lived with. How many more train paths would be freed up if 2 new tunnels through the CBD would be built?
Probably expensive- but isn't CRR taking all of the Beenleigh and Gold Coast trains off, leaving just Corinda via Sth BNE and Cleveland Trains?

Still, would probably cost heaps.

It would be nice to think 4 tracks on the Ispwich line could be fully used- a bit of a conflict where the Merivale Bridge meets the Ips line.

[Stillwater]

What is the recent cost per 100 metres of the road tunnels going in around Brisbane?  That would be some guide.  And what is the distance of the current tunnels - Roma Street-Central-Fortitude Valley?  What happens at Bowen Hills and between there and Fortitude Valley?

[BrizCommuter]

http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/02/tunnel-vision.html
Should the Clem7 be renamed the Joe7. $1.3m in debt. Don't worry about that!

[#Metro]

How can Brisbane City Council happily hand over $770 million to a private company so that it can make private profits for itself, and yet handing the same amount of money over to QR or the state government for a rail upgrade of, say Doomben line, would be not their responsibility.

[somebody]

How can Brisbane City Council happily hand over $770 million to a private company so that it can make private profits for itself, and yet handing the same amount of money over to QR or the state government for a rail upgrade of, say Doomben line, would be not their responsibility.

Where are the votes?

[#Metro]

The votes are all on the trains, buses and ferries.
Something like 50% + people use public transport to get to work in the CBD, around 13% use PT in Brisbane
it is a demographic that just cannot be ignored!

That's where the votes are!!!

[somebody]

The votes are all on the trains, buses and ferries.
Something like 50% + people use public transport to get to work in the CBD, around 13% use PT in Brisbane
it is a demographic that just cannot be ignored!

That's where the votes are!!!

Not everyone works in the CBD.

50% using PT to get to work in the CBD is a pretty poor showing.  It's over 70% in Sydney, and they have a target to raise it to 80%.

[#Metro]

Yes, but I think 50% of the jobs in Brisbane are in the Brisbane CBD.

I agree that not everyone works in the CBD, but the truth of that statement does not necessarily mean that 50% + people use PT to get work in the CBD is not also true.

Sure, Sydney might have aims to get it up to 70%, but they have mega-trains and John Bradfield's legacy of designing a really good (by Australian & NZ standards at least) rail system.

Point is, lots of votes in the Western Suburbs. Where are the votes for the Doomben line? People who live in Hamilton etc and currently get terrible Doomben service AND do not want a tunnel portal outside their house or bright fluorescent pink or purple smokestack ventilation shaft outside their house.

I have a feeling that not all options have been considered. If congestion is the problem, why not explore congestion tolling as an option? You don't need to pour heaps of concrete for that one...

[somebody]

Yes, but I think 50% of the jobs in Brisbane are in the Brisbane CBD.

I'd be surprised.  I take you are counting jobs in Ipswich as not part of Brisbane, but I'd still be surprised.  50% might be CBD + UQ St Lucia + Milton + QUT Kelvin Grove + Fortitude Valley + Bowen Hills + RB&WH + RCH + PAH + South Brisbane + South Bank + Woolloongabba.

I agree that not everyone works in the CBD, but the truth of that statement does not necessarily mean that 50% + people use PT to get work in the CBD is not also true.

Don't follow?  What do you mean?

Sure, Sydney might have aims to get it up to 70%, but they have mega-trains and John Bradfield's legacy of designing a really good (by Australian & NZ standards at least) rail system.

Oops.  I said it is already over 70%, and they are looking for 80%.

Point is, lots of votes in the Western Suburbs. Where are the votes for the Doomben line? People who live in Hamilton etc and currently get terrible Doomben service AND do not want a tunnel portal outside their house or bright fluorescent pink or purple smokestack ventilation shaft outside their house.

I have a feeling that not all options have been considered. If congestion is the problem, why not explore congestion tolling as an option? You don't need to pour heaps of concrete for that one...

A possibility.

[somebody]

The other point about Sydney is their bus system is nearly as effective as ours, in spite of the lack of infrastructure.

[#Metro]

Sorry, update, it is even higher!!!

Currently the City of Brisbane accounts for over 75% of the jobs within greater Brisbane. More than 50% of employed residents in surrounding shires work in the Brisbane City area (Pine Rivers 61%, Logan City 51%, Ipswich 54% and Redland Shire 50%). As with population, the regional plan aims to generate employment outside Brisbane; however, the prominence of Brisbane as the regional employment hub will continue, and the demand for longer distance commuter trips will impact on the transport system in Brisbane.

Source: Lord Mayor's Mass Transit Report 2007, page 14.

Note: I have to check what proportion that is in the CBD