Richlands to Springfield Central - Stage 2

[SurfRail]

Ahh ok.

Still, taxis are real competition for the market.  Perhaps people won't make the decision on rational grounds in a lot of cases.  Putting 4 people in a cab and heading to the Gold Coast is likely cheaper than using the train and also much faster except when the traffic is jammed up.

It would probably have to be more than 4 - wouldn't be common either.

Interestingly, it is often cheaper to get a limo from Coolangatta to Surfers than a cab for 4 people...

[somebody]

Looks that way.  Estimated fare Airport -> Ormeau = $122 taxi, and $23.18 go card on the train in peak.  Still, a number of people would gladly pay the extra $10 or so each to get the door to door service and not have to wait up to 29 minutes for it.

[Arnz]

If word got out that the govt was going to force its biggest through traffic passenger load (and one with most bags) to change trains in the city via a non cross platform change) to suit some operational ideology, they will either run the trains or plan to fix the track. Currently there is no issue and post CRR I doubt this (the train route) will change until nth side fly over is built.

Without looking at the figures, I doubt most people heading to the GC uses BNE those days, taking into consideration much of Queensland's traditional target market (South East Asia) have a lot of international LCC service now serving the Gold Coast Airport (OOL) for the past few years, such as Jetstar, AirAsia and Scoot to Japan, Malaysia and Singapore respectively.

Also, if a platform transfer only requires taking only one set of escalators/stairs down to the CRR, that's not going to hurt those using the service either.

[somebody]

My experience of using the service is that there isn't very much through Central traffic.  More than 50% is getting on or getting off.

[Arnz]

I'll say it again, "should the press get hold that the govt plans to force what I'm guessing what is Brisbane's largest through traffic train users with luggage etc to be forced to even do a cross platform change

And I'll say what I've said in the past when we last revisited this topic.  Other cities in the world does cross platform transfers to get to their destination, heck even Hong Kong requires a short walk down the street for those requiring the Island line, which is not connected to the network. 

Why should Queensland be the exception?

[Old Northern Road]

The Caboolture and Ipswich lines are by far the 2 busiest lines and have far more through patronage than the Gold Coast/Airport lines. Compare how busy pm peak Petrie/Caboolture trains that come from Richlands/Ipswich are to the ones that originate at Roma St.

Once (or if) CRR is built Gold Coast passengers would simply need to change trains at Eagle Junction and assuming the wait at Eagle Junction isn't too long it will probably be a faster trip as you will no longer have to travel through the torturously slow bit between Park Road and Bowen Hills. It currently takes 27mins for Gold Coast/Airport trains to travel between Park Rd and Eagle Junction while travelling via CRR should be at least 10mins faster.

It makes far more sense to have the Sunshine Coast and Gold Coast lines paired together as they are the lines that require the IMUs.

[SurfRail]

^ And ultimately the throughrouting will occur via the NWTC, which precludes any airport connection anyway.

[somebody]

BTW, The media picked up about the Glen Waverley line in Melbourne which was to run Richmond-Flinders St only in peak at least in a recent change.  While it ran the story, the change went through and has remained since.  It will probably happen in the same way here.

[Old Northern Road]

There would be more Caboolture line passengers continuing through to the Ipswich line (to Milton, Toowong, Indooroopilly mainly) than there would be Gold Coast passengers continuing through to the Airport. And your numbers are way off. According to latest Translink figures the entire Gold Coast line only gets around 8000 boardings per day. Doesn't mention the Airport line but at best I'd imagine it would get around half that number.

Luggage Racks aren't needed on the Airport line as there is always more than enough room on the floor. I'm pretty sure the eventual plan is to have IMUs on the Ipswich/Rosewood line anyway. Changing at Eagle Junction will be no problem as it currently has ramps as well as lifts plus I think there are plans to build escalators.

And it will actually be more than 10mins faster. It will be 10mins faster travelling from Yeerongpilly to Albert St compared to travelling from Yeerongpilly to Central on the current route plus it will most likely be a couple of minutes faster from Albert St to Eagle Junction.

All the CRR documents had the Airport line paired up with the Ipswich/Rosewood line and Gold Coast line paired with the Caboolture/Nambour line initially and paired up with the CAMCOS line by 2031 (or when it's built). I'm fairly sure Airtrain would have been consulted.

[somebody]

I predicted from the Airport line numbers, the level of tourism attracted to the GC and my own observations that up to 1mpa use the Airport line to travel to the GC.
...
Simon, 50% getting off in city. So you telling me 50% of GC users ride through the city and people want to say F_em, they can change trains.

What are these figures?  I seriously doubt that 1mpa travel Airport - Gold Coast on the train.

And I said >50% getting off at Central.  There are also people travelling Airport-Roma St and Gold Coast-Valley, among others.

[colinw]

When I use Airtrain it is always to/from Coopers Plains. It is not uncommon for me to be the only through airport passenger in my carriage.  At Roma St & Central the vast majority of passengers get off, then a completely new bunch with bags, etc., get on at Central for the trip to the Airport.

From actual observation, through Gold Coast - Airport passengers would be lucky to be even 10% of airport numbers.  It is predominantly being used from the city, and frankly would be better off being a quarter hourly 3 car shuttle from Roma St platform 3 using dedicated sets with sufficient luggage space.

The Airport - Gold Coast thing is a nice operational convenience for Queensland Rail, but in no way reflects the actual demand or usage patterns of the service.

Now, can we please talk about the Springfield line (which this thread is meant to be about), not the stupid bloody Airport line! 

[mufreight]

It is now running into seven weeks waiting for a response from TMR and the Ministers office in respect of points raised about both the station at Ellengrove and the failure to provide adequate parking at Springfield and Springfield Central.
It would seem that the attirude of both Government, the Minister and TMR is that if they do nothing and do not respond to any awkward questions raised by members of the public that they will simply go away.
Unfortunately for them some will persist with their questions and will in future times publicly remind these public servants, bureaucrats, politicians and their spin doctors of their failings and shortsightedness.   

[Gazza]

It would seem that the attirude of both Government, the Minister and TMR is that if they do nothing and do not respond to any awkward questions raised by members of the public that they will simply go away.

Well, I did warn you that you should fix up your letter to remove stuff which was obviously wrong (Eg Ellen Grove station with 1000 parks for the bargain price $5 Mil) or else the department would just laugh it off as a crazy rant.

And look what happened, you predictably got ignored.

[Old Northern Road]

Unless there is some major development planned to be built around Ellen Grove within the next 5 years then I agree that the station doesn't need to be built at the moment. If the train is travelling at 130/140 km/h then stopping at the station will add an extra 2 minutes to the trip. Not to mention the amount of money it would cost to keep the station open as I imagine QR is going to continue it's wastful practice of having virtually every single station on the network manned.

I'm sure if there was room to build a car park at Springfield Central that they would have changed their minds by now.

[mufreight]

Unless there is some major development planned to be built around Ellen Grove within the next 5 years then I agree that the station doesn't need to be built at the moment. If the train is travelling at 130/140 km/h then stopping at the station will add an extra 2 minutes to the trip. Not to mention the amount of money it would cost to keep the station open as I imagine QR is going to continue it's wastful practice of having virtually every single station on the network manned.

I'm sure if there was room to build a car park at Springfield Central that they would have changed their minds by now.

On both points that you have raised, watch this space, you may well be surprised and proven wrong.   

[petey3801]

Was just having a look at the Trackstar Alliance website, and according to this document: http://www.trackstar.com.au/index.php?s=file_download&id=46 (meetings from a community meeting in October), even the upgrade to the Centenary is going to be half-baked! The current Logan Motorway/Centenary Highway Interchange is not going to be upgraded properly by the looks of it, with the duplication of the highway ending at Johnson Rd, Camira...

Queensland, the land of the half baked project...

[Gazza]

^Isn't it pretty typical (in Qld) for the through route to drop down to 1 lane at interchanges?...Eg Logan at the Gateway, Clem 7 at Airportlink, Southern Cross Way at the northern end where it meets the new Gateway...The M3 reducing to 2 lanes at 8MP.

Doesn't happen elsewhere in Aus though.

Quick question too, but what is the significance of lowering the Springfield Link Bridge?

[petey3801]

^Isn't it pretty typical (in Qld) for the through route to drop down to 1 lane at interchanges?...Eg Logan at the Gateway, Clem 7 at Airportlink, Southern Cross Way at the northern end where it meets the new Gateway...The M3 reducing to 2 lanes at 8MP.

Doesn't happen elsewhere in Aus though.

Quick question too, but what is the significance of lowering the Springfield Link Bridge?

Yeah, pretty much typical of the QLD way!

In regards to the SL Bridge, it was supposed to be lowered (before the current government changed the scope) in order to make it somewhat flatter. Currently it is a fairly steep uphill grade going from the Springfield side (where the station will be) to the Springfield Lakes side.

[ozbob]

From The Satellite click here!

Darra to Springfield stays on track

Darra to Springfield stays on track
13th Dec 2012 3:31 PM

COMPLETION of the Darra to Springfield rail extension is drawing so close, Springfield residents can almost hear the sound of the train arriving.

Construction on the project's $475 million second stage continues to stay on track with an expected completion date for the end of next year.

Just recently, the 900m rail bridge, crossing the Logan Motorway Interchange was completed, marking another milestone for the project.

Member for Inala Annastacia Palaszczuk (pictured) said it was an exciting time for residents watching the final stages of the project take shape.

"A few months ago we saw the installation of the large, white pillars which were set to be the base of the rail bridge," she said.

"Today, we see the bridge completed and the overhead wires getting installed ready for use at the end of next year."

With peak hour travel time estimated at 40 minutes from Springfield to the city, Ms Palaszczuk said the project would appeal to many and take up to 2500 cars off the road every day.

"Fewer cars on the road can only mean less congestion and less headaches in the morning for local residents," she said,

"But the project isn't just about the 9.5km of track or the seven new rail bridges.

"It also includes a new bus interchange and road improvements to the Centenary Highway."

[ozbob]

From the Queensland Times click here!

New railway line is on track

New railway line is on track
Kieran Banks 10th Jan 2013 3:00 AM

THE Springfield train line is taking shape with services due to commence this year, but concerns linger about a potential car park shortage.

The train line and stations are visibly coming together, with significant construction milestones being reached.

A spokesman for Transport Minister Scott Emerson said the foundations had been laid at Springfield station, located opposite Woodcrest College.

The arches for the elevated platforms at Springfield Central station, adjacent to the Orion Town Centre, have been installed.

These will form the structure of the station.

The rail alignment is also well under way - 6000 sleepers, 8km of track, 80 overhead masts and 5700 metres of signal and power cable have been installed in the 2km section of rail between Richlands station and the bridge over the Logan Motorway Interchange.

The 900m long, 15m high elevated bridge carrying the rail line over the Logan Motorway Interchange is also substantially complete, with the last concrete poured prior to Christmas.

Construction on the 9.5km extension to the Darra to Richlands line began in October 2011.

Public transport advocacy group Rail Back on Track spokesman Robert Dow said the major issue facing Springfield commuters was getting to the station.

Mr Dow said 100 car parks were not enough considering the poor bus feeder services.

Richlands train station has 650 car parks which are often all taken during the morning peak hour.

Mr Dow said many commuters would drive from Redbank Plains to Ipswich stations rather than Richlands so they could get a park.

He said leaving Springfield and Springfield Central with fewer car parks wouldn't relieve the stress placed on Wacol and Gailes stations.

"If they think anyone is going to walk up to the train station they are dreaming," he said.

[petey3801]

2478H/2484H are sitting stabled on a ballast train at Ellen Grove currently. Some ballasting has been completed on the new Down Line between there and the Logan Motorway overpass.

[ozbob]

2478H/2484H are sitting stabled on a ballast train at Ellen Grove currently. Some ballasting has been completed on the new Down Line between there and the Logan Motorway overpass.

[colinw]

2478H/2484H are sitting stabled on a ballast train at Ellen Grove currently. Some ballasting has been completed on the new Down Line between there and the Logan Motorway overpass.

Grrr!  If we weren't so damn stupid in this state, we could be extending the Richlands trains to Ellen Grove by mid year, with Springfield opening a few months later.  Similar to when the Helensvale - Robina extension opened back in the '90s - Nerang first, followed by Robina a bit later.

Although something might melt at QR if they had to redesign a timetable twice in a decade year.

[SurfRail]

2478H/2484H are sitting stabled on a ballast train at Ellen Grove currently. Some ballasting has been completed on the new Down Line between there and the Logan Motorway overpass.

Grrr!  If we weren't so damn stupid in this state, we could be extending the Richlands trains to Ellen Grove by mid year, with Springfield opening a few months later.  Similar to when the Helensvale - Robina extension opened back in the '90s - Nerang first, followed by Robina a bit later.

Although something might melt at QR if they had to redesign a timetable twice in a decade year.

Won't be a redesign anyway, as Springfield will apparently be getting zero new services which don't already run to and from Richlands.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Different set of circumstances if you compare the two. The Gold Coast line was built from station to station over a longer distance with the stations opening a year apart. Helensvale 96, Nerang 97, Robina 98 with each station having their own set of cross overs and OH relays (they differer from the ones on the surbans IIRC). The true providing of services has also changed between Queensland Rail and the local feeder bus network as the Gold Coast revamped its own network and extended/added dedicated rail feeder buses... something us Brisbaneites haven't really considered before along with QR adjusting the timetable accordingly.

[ozbob]

Richlands to Springfield Extension

Photos taken of the work associated with the Richlands to Springfield extension, due to open later in 2013.

--> http://gallery3.qrig.org/index.php/members-gallery/qrig/Richlands-to-Springfield-Extension

[ozbob]

Twitter

Robert Dow ‏@Robert_Dow

Richlands parked out ... http://t.co/eWgwL25x

===============

Went for a run on the 462, 8 pax on board ... 

[Gazza]

Overheads are now going up south of the Logan Motorway / North of Springfield Station :


http://sphotos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/208349_10151183887301105_2014485138_n.jpg

No overheads south of Springfield yet.

[somebody]

Richlands parked out ... http://t.co/eWgwL25x

Bl00dy free parking!

[mufreight]

Gailes, 157 cars parked alongside fence at 7.05am today and the boneheads say that there is sufficent parking avaliable at Richlands, Gailes, Wacol and Darra and clain that the 300 spaces that will be avaliable at Springfield and Springfield Central will be sufficent.
Due to the lack of provision for parking the Springfield line is destined to be underutilized, it is by far more cost effective to provide parking at rail stations and get cars off the highways than to construct more highways to accomodate them.

[ozbob]

From the Queensland Times click here!

Shortfall sparks talk of private parking station

Shortfall sparks talk of private parking station
Kieran Banks 28th Jan 2013 1:00 AM

A MASSIVE shortfall of car parks at the Springfield train stations under construction is sparking rumours of a private enterprise building a paid car park.

Bundamba MP Jo-Ann Miller had heard reports of a private car park from her constituents, but a spokesperson from Transport Minister Scott Emerson's office said they had not had any proposals from private companies.

Mrs Miller is calling for the station to be equipped with 1000 parks each, up from the 100 scheduled to be available when the station opens later this year.

"Constituents have told me that not having enough car parks will turn them off going to the Springfield stations. They will continue to drive through to Richlands," she said.

"What they want is many more car parks at the station - up to 1000."

The spokesperson from Mr Emerson said the department was currently in discussions with Springfield Land Corporation and Ipswich City Council to find a solution for commuters.

The parking problems are expected to impact the Orion Shopping Centre adjacent to Springfield Central station.

A Mirvac representative said the shopping centre would monitor the car parks to ensure it didn't become an option for commuters.

"We share the community's excitement in welcoming the rail link for the Springfield community," the representative said. "We share the community's concerns regarding the adequacy of the 100 car parks for the station and have expressed these concerns to the government.

"Orion will implement parking control measures ahead of the station opening and will monitor the use of the centre car park by commuters."

The representative said the Orion car parking was provided for the convenience of the retail customers and was not intended for all day parking.

"Parking control measures are intended to ensure customers can find a park close to where they want to shop and they are not crowded out by commuters or local workers."

[somebody]

 

[Jonno]

What a god almighty policy, planning, transport and urban design failure...and this development wins awards??

[somebody]

What a god almighty policy, planning, transport and urban design failure...and this development wins awards??

At least the additional car parks are to be provided on commercial terms.  If that happens.

[#Metro]

A commercial car park is quite possible, would be 5 or 10 bucks per day I imagine. Pity govt won't pull finger out and just build a larger car park, like perth, and charge $2, plenty of demand.

[Gazza]

Doesn't Nambour have a commercial car park next to it anyway?

[Arnz]

The commercial car park at Nambour is part of the nearby shopping centre theatre (Centenary Square)

Found the rate: 
$5 for 60 mins or less
$8 for 61mins - 120 mins.
$11 for more than 3 hours.
$7 for weekend/earlybird rates.

http://secureparking.com.au/car-parks/australia/qld/sunshine-coast/centenary-square

[ozbob]

From the South West News 30th January 2013 page 7

Station carparks fall short

[minbrisbane]

I love how none of the articles mention feeder buses as an option...

[ozbob]

I love how none of the articles mention feeder buses as an option...

Has been mentioned, the problem with Springfield is needs both feeder bus and adequate park n' ride.  Similar to Mandurah line in that respect.

Springfield is a good location to start charging for park n' ride down the track as feeders become established. 

Adequate feeder bus is years away ...  Springfield area is only 14% developed at this point ..