New Generation Rollingstock

[ozbob]

7 News and 9 News will be interviewing me later today on NGR.

BREAKING!  Just heard on 4BC Radio that the importation of NGR trains has been suspended pending rectification of design flaws.

#railfail hits another low point!

Also completed an interview with ABC Television at Goodna rail.

I have also suggested that the Queensland Government consider urgently ordering 6 SMU260 / 6 IMU160 from Maryborough (they are presently building sets for Transperth < say no more !)  Who knows when the NGR trains will be available for service.  75 NGR sets is not enough in any case.

I think we have big problems looming, particularly in April 2018 for the Commonwealth Games .. 

[ozbob]

I am delighted the media has interviewed Mr Geoff Trappett today!

It has taken a while to get the attention but today was a great opportunity to drive this home.

Thanks for the interest ABC, 7 News and 9 News.

Sent to all outlets:

19th February 2017

New Generation Trains - accessibility Issues

Good Morning,

To add to the rail fail concerns is the delayed New Generation Rollingstock trains.  We have raised our concerns a number of times now, to be largely ignored, which is the standard modus operandi of the failing transport  bureaucracy  in Queensland.  Now we have the disability sector adding to the clamour of despair:

===========================================

https://www.communityrun.org/petitions/all-aboard-if-you-can-make-qrs-new-4b-trains-accessible

To: Deputy Premier and Minister for Transport and Main Roads the Hon Jackie Trad

All aboard. If you can! Make QRs new $4b trains accessible

SIGN THE PETITION
GTContact Campaign Creator
Campaign created by
Geoff Trappett

All aboard. If you can!  Make QRs new $4b trains accessible

Four billion dollars' worth of new Queensland New Generation Rollingstock (NGR) trains will not be fully accessible to passengers with disability. Citizens with disability in Queensland call on the now Labor state government and its recently appointed Deputy Premier and Minister for Transport and Main Roads, the Hon Jackie Trad to follow through with the Premier's mandate to fix train transport. She can make a start on this by suspending work on NGR and commencing real negotiations with disability groups not stalling tactics. Thereby ensuring taxpayer funds are used for fully functional accessible solutions not stop gap lowest price liabilities. Liabilities that will degrade SE Queensland as a destination of choice for tourism and reduce its standing as an inclusive region.

Why is this important?

People with disability (PWD) in Queensland need your support to ensure their citizen rights are upheld. Based on the specifications publicly available there will be many groups of PWD (vision impairment, physical disability, intellectual disability and autism) that will be disadvantaged in both boarding and exiting the trains. Taxpayer funded public transport that by its very nature is meant to be a driver for inclusion of citizens into community will instead exclude.

In 2013 the Newman government Department of Transport and Main Roads awarded a tender for NGR. The 75 newly designed trains are due to begin service on the South East Queensland passenger rail network later this year, and the remaining fleet rolled out by late 2018. The current design has a number of access issues.

1. The corridor linking a carriage purpose-designed with accessible seating and a toilet is too narrow for most manual and motorized wheelchairs causing some PWD to have to leave the train and re-enter through a different door in order to use the bathroom. A time consuming exercise, potentially dangerous whilst raining, all whilst the train stays to a timetable.

2. The toilet space does not meet the relevant size standards set out in legislation. Meaning it is simply inaccessible to some PWD who use a wheelchair for mobility and a danger to use for others.

3. The location of the guard (who assists a PWD with boarding and exiting the train) will be at the rear instead of in the middle of the train. This is a change from years of the guard being located in the middle of the train so as to intentionally align the guard with the purpose built accessible boarding area on existing station platforms. The new rear location presents potential safety concerns for a PWD being left behind on a platform due to not being seen from a guard location at the end-of-the-train – concerns that are real and potentially life threatening on an unmanned station late at night.

These trains are meant for 30-plus years of service, meaning potential generations of PWD missing out on community inclusion. The roll-out will coincide with the implementation of the National Disability Insurance Scheme (NDIS) in Queensland. The NDIS has been designed to be the foundation of a new era of participation for PWD, and accessible public transport is key to participation in jobs, education, training, social life.

The Queensland Government is currently consulting on "Towards an all abilities Queensland" which will become the new state government plan for disability in Queensland. Its proposed vision is that "Queenslanders of all abilities can live the life they choose." Given the $4b train design it begs the question, can PWD choose to use a train in Queensland?

If you feel PWD should be able to choose to use a train in Queensland please support this petition. If you would like to make an individual contribution make sure to also email the Deputy Premier (deputy.premier@ministerial.qld.gov.au) and cc myself (geofftrappett@inclusionmoves.com.au) to explain to her exactly how this issue would deny your citizen rights.

===========================================

Hey ho, off to mediocrity we go!

Best wishes
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

[petey3801]

Pointless calling for more 160/260 deliveries unless people seriously think this is going to go on for another 2-3 years, cause that's how long it will take to get any more 160s built!
These 'problems' that the CM keeps bringing up are quite a beat up in reality. There are other issues at play that will take a bit more time, but things like visibility aren't a major problem. Drivers already lose sight of stopping marks 5-10m before stopping, another couple metres is just going to take some getting used to. Also, the required cab modifications are quite minor in reality apart from the guard CCTV on the cab wall which will be retrofitted to early deliveries.

[ozbob]

9 News --> Qld govt halts train orders over flaws

Queensland Rail will stop shipments of new trains from India in response to problems with its multi-billion dollar New Generation Rollingstock program.

Deputy Premier Jackie Trad on Wednesday said she'd told the Bombardier-led consortium responsible for building the trains not to send any more until design problems have been fixed.

"I have made clear that the Queensland government will not be accepting trains from Bombardier in India until all of the design issues have been resolved," she told reporters in Brisbane.

Numerous design flaws have been identified with the NGR trains, including problems with brakes and driver visibility, as well as disability access and air conditioning.

The Courier-Mail on Wednesday reported every platform at each of Queensland Rail's 143 Citytrain stations would need to be modified to deal with a spate of design flaws in the NGR trains.

Queensland Rail has so far received 13 of the 75 trains ordered from the consortium, with a further two currently in transit.

Ms Trad put the blame for the debacle on the Newman government, which awarded the contract to Bombardier.

"In 2014, Tim Nicholls and Scott Emerson were crowing about the fact that they had secured half-price trains, manufactured abroad, and everyone knows you get what you pay for."

She said the Labor government was working "around the clock" to fix the problems but was locked into the contract with the consortium.

However, she said the government had not paid yet any money to the consortium and wouldn't until the issues were fixed.

Mr Nicholls deflected any of the blame on Wednesday, saying the trains were "ordered under the supervision and guidance" of the director-general of the Department of Premier and Cabinet.

The opposition leader also pointed out Department of Transport boss Neil Scales had come out in support of the trains last year, saying only minor adjustments were needed.

[ozbob]

Pointless calling for more 160/260 deliveries unless people seriously think this is going to go on for another 2-3 years, cause that's how long it will take to get any more 160s built!
These 'problems' that the CM keeps bringing up are quite a beat up in reality. There are other issues at play that will take a bit more time, but things like visibility aren't a major problem. Drivers already lose sight of stopping marks 5-10m before stopping, another couple metres is just going to take some getting used to. Also, the required cab modifications are quite minor in reality apart from the guard CCTV on the cab wall which will be retrofitted to early deliveries.

I don't think it is pointless.  It is a good opportunity to talk up local production and point out that same trains (essentially) are presently being build for Transperth at Maryborough.  The Government is fixated on jobs, jobs and jobs!  Build locally .. 

I realise it would take a while ... 

[petey3801]

It is pointless telling the Gov to order trains from Maryborough to 'fix' the current issues when the trains from Maryborough won't be built until well, well after the NGRs have entered service and, quite likely, finished entering service (ie: last one already delivered and commissioned). Why have new build trains coming in with less features than the trains that have just been built and commissioned, instead of tacking on to the back of the NGR order for more units? Yes, you would be hard pressed finding anyone interested who thinks the trains shouldn't have been built here in Aus, but that ship has long, long sailed (and, it wasn't just the LNP gov that caused it, EDi pulled out of the contract bid before it was finished.. can't win something that you're not contesting!). No point crying over spilt milk! Campaigning for any other new trains after the NGR to be built here is a good idea, but saying they should put out a contract to build more 160/260s in Maryborough, knowing full well they won't be ready for another 2-3years (minimum) is actually pointless.

[ozbob]

Hot hot topic NGR today ...

Just completed an interview with ABC Radio Brisbane Drive Emma Griffiths.

[ozbob]

It is pointless telling the Gov to order trains from Maryborough to 'fix' the current issues when the trains from Maryborough won't be built until well, well after the NGRs have entered service and, quite likely, finished entering service (ie: last one already delivered and commissioned). Why have new build trains coming in with less features than the trains that have just been built and commissioned, instead of tacking on to the back of the NGR order for more units? Yes, you would be hard pressed finding anyone interested who thinks the trains shouldn't have been built here in Aus, but that ship has long, long sailed (and, it wasn't just the LNP gov that caused it, EDi pulled out of the contract bid before it was finished.. can't win something that you're not contesting!). No point crying over spilt milk! Campaigning for any other new trains after the NGR to be built here is a good idea, but saying they should put out a contract to build more 160/260s in Maryborough, knowing full well they won't be ready for another 2-3years (minimum) is actually pointless.

In your opinion, not mine.  It is useful because it highlights the fact that local train production was overlooked and hopefully will not happen again.

Victoria is building their trains in Victoria.

http://www.premier.vic.gov.au/1100-jobs-with-65-new-trains-built-in-victoria-for-victoria/
1,100 Jobs With 65 New Trains Built In Victoria, For Victoria

... Bombardier in Dandenong are currently delivering Victoria's VLocity Regional Trains and Melbourne's E-Class trams, with more than $811 million invested in new VLocity and E-Class orders since 2015, and the option for further contract extensions in the future. ...

The fact that the Government has halted the delivery of the imported train sets can hardly be described as a successful outcome for all parties sadly.

I do not think it has anything to do with Bombardier per se, I guess they are just building to the specifications that were developed for the NGR sets.  Guess these specifications will now be altered.  And there will be an re-evaluation of the trains under the new specifications.

The question does arise? Will the first 15 NGR have to be significantly modified?

[ozbob]

The next question is how long will the introduction of NGR trains into revenue service now be delayed? June 2017 is now gone. 

What is the next date December 2017?   June 2018?  In any case, maintaining adequate rail services (peak) for SEQ is now going to be very difficult.

I think more emphasis has to put on encouraging more out of peak travel from peak.

[ozbob]

Couriermail --> Train blame: 'You get what you pay for'

QUEENSLAND will stop accepting problem-riddled New Generation Rollingstock trains until the makers can fix a plethora of design faults.

Deputy Premier and Transport Minister Jackie Trad made the announcement this morning as she criticised the former Newman Government for signing off on the trains, declaring: "You get what you pay for."

"Since becoming Transport Minister again I have become very concerned about the New Generation Rollingstock (NGR) contract," she said.

"The Queensland Government will not be accepting trains from Bombardier in India until all of the design and engineering issues that are still outstanding have been resolved between the consortia and Queensland Rail."

It follows revelations in The Courier-Mailthat not a single train delivered over the past year has successfully passed testing, with continuing issues around brakes, driver cab comfort and sight from the windshield.

Ms Trad conceded the design changes would push up the project's $4.4 billion price tag and said there was no "hard deadline" on when problems would be fixed or when they could be deployed for passengers.

She said the extra price depended on the complexity around the changes, adding that Queensland Rail had not yet "quantified" all of the design and engineering issues that needed to be fixed

"But we are trying to mitigate and make sure that we keep the price as close to the original specs as possible," she said.

Ms Trad revealed there were also issues with disability access because doorways between carriages were not big enough for wheelchairs and did not meet Australian standards, meaning people with disabilities would not be able to easily use bathroom facilities.

There were also issues with the air-conditioning and ventilation system.

"I think all of the issues, and there are quite a number of issues across the whole spectrum — design, comfort, the brake systems — all of those issues are being addressed and I want to reassure Queenslanders that they are being addressed to the highest possible Queensland standards," she said.

She said the previous LNP Government had locked in the contract.

"In 2014 Tim Nicholls and Scott Emerson were crowing about the fact they had secured half-price trains manufactured abroad and everyone knows you get what you paid for."

She said she had instructed Queensland Rail and the Department of Main Roads and Transport to "work around the clock" with the Bombardier-led consortium Qtectic to resolve the issues.

Ms Trad said Queensland would accept two more currently in transit that would arrive next month, but that would put the NGR facility at Wulkuraka, Ipswich, at capacity at 15 and no more would be accepted.

[#Metro]

I don't think the design issues are related to the fact they are built abroad. Planes and cars are made overseas and don't seem to have half the issues that QR has.

Vehicles are built to standards and specifications. Somebody has drawn up plans for a vehicle that are non-compliant it seems.

So I think it is much simpler than that - it is the "Queensland" disease. Something that has been around in Queensland for many decades.

It is the process of cutting corners to save "headline costs" and the idea that we can "come back later" and fix things.
You can see this philosophy where:

-  busways are built with gaps in it (e.g. North busway)
-  train platforms where only half or the middle section rebuilt
-  Indooroopilly Railway Station (no bus interchange, platforms)
-  building the Gold Coast line with single track sections
- suggesting the Springfield line be single track (we stopped that one)
- Skipping construction of an Ellen Grove station
- trying to cut corners with Cross River Rail to reduce "headline costs"
- The "Cleveland Solution"
- Proposal for "seven car trains"
- cutting driver training in QR because it reduced costs (completely forgot about cost/BENEFIT)
- buying the super basic Go Card model (cheap) but then not being able to add any other modules on (more $$$)
- Redcliffe line signalling (again, because it's cheaper)

Somebody on the QLD Gov't side would have had to approve the drawings and plans. Given the cost ($4-5 BN), there needs to be an investigation into NGR just like there was with QR timetabling.

Let me guess - TMR had a hand in this too?

Auditor General seems to be a good choice in this case.

[ozbob]

^

.....

The Newman Government kicked QR out of the project essentially.  Left it with TMR/TransLink and they have botched it.  Bombardier build to the specifications. 

All the more reason for Public Transport Queensland - with of course a key heavy rail division.  Enough of this shambles ...

Bombardier build trains and trams all over the world.   The Queensland factor is it here!  Dodgy design !!

You forgot to mention Darra.  This is another TMR grand effort of woeful design and functionality.  They really do not have much idea.  The sooner rail is taken from TMR the better!

[ozbob]

[Stillwater]

We can see where this is heading - to the courts.  It is a replay of the hospital payroll scandal where IBM provided a product built to the specifications and it was found wanting.  Bombardier can't continue to build trains and not get paid for them.  They will be seeking extra money for the remedial works.

Jackie Trad says she is working to fix the NCR faults, but she, again, is ignoring the culture within her own department.  Clearly there have been cover-ups, or instances of people living on denial, believing that if things can be hushed up a bit longer and work things out behind closed doors, we can save the day.  That was the thinking with Redcliffe Peninsula Line and the driver shortage AND THE THINKING STILL PERVADES THE ORGANISATION.

The Minister must address the fundamentals, corporate and cultural.  Bring on Public Transport Queensland.

RailBOT has been banging on for the past year about potential problems with the NGR trains and it took a Request for Information application from the CM to uncover the issues.  Hardly 'transparency in government' is it?

[#Metro]

We can see where this is heading - to the courts.  It is a replay of the hospital payroll scandal where IBM provided a product built to the specifications and it was found wanting.  Bombardier can't continue to build trains and not get paid for them.  They will be seeking extra money for the remedial works.

Have to agree here. This is QLD Health Payroll on steel wheels. Again.

Seems that nothing was learned from the payroll scandal. It is not just QR that has "Bad culture" it is TMR and Parliament as well.

One for the Auditor General I think.

https://www.qao.qld.gov.au/audits/program

We welcome suggestions from members of the public about our proposed or any new potential performance audit topics, as well as contributions to performance audits that are currently in progress. When suggesting new topics, or contributing to an open audit, the submissions need to relate to public sector entities or money being spent on public services. Any contribution can be made confidentially and your personal information is protected by the Information Privacy Act 2009.

[ozbob]

The question also has to be asked is the DG TMR being told the full story?

He has been reported as saying there were only minor issues last year with the NGR trains and would be sorted.

Hello?  The Government has suspended delivery of the trains!

[ozbob]

[ozbob]

9 News ran an item on NGR,  tweeted it then removed it.  It had a typo ' breaks ' for brakes .. might reappear.

[#Metro]

Time to move to WA, NSW or VIC i think!

#FleeQLD

[ozbob]

ABC Radio Brisbane

Drive with Emma Griffiths

New Queensland trains put on hold

>> http://www.abc.net.au/radio/brisbane/programs/drive/indian-train-deal/8316240

As it stands, hundreds of services have been cancelled, there has been a driver shortage and plenty of disappointed commuters.
Now, a multi-billion dollar order for new trains has been put on hold after a long list of design and engineering problems has seen the order halved.

Duration: 21min 21sec
Broadcast: Wed 1 Mar 2017, 4:00pm
Published: Wed 1 Mar 2017, 6:56pm

Yours truly, Mr Andrew Powell, then Ms Jackie Trad.

Despite Mr Powell's comments, QR was sidelined and their concerns dismissed according to my advice.  The project is botched, face facts.

[techblitz]

talk about easy bonus political points for one nation....they have been screaming for more regional jobs as well as reduction in outsourcing/overseas contracts.....

[ozbob]

Queensland Parliament Hansard

Ministerial statements

https://www.parliament.qld.gov.au/documents/hansard/2017/2017_03_01_DAILY.pdf

New Generation Rollingstock

Hon. JA TRAD (South Brisbane—ALP) (Deputy Premier, Minister for Transport and Minister for
Infrastructure and Planning) (2.09 pm): The $4.4 billion New Generation Rollingstock project is the
largest single investment in trains in Queensland and involves 75 new passenger trains for South-East
Queensland. There are currently 13 NGR trains in Queensland with two more to arrive in March 2017,
this month. Three of these trains are currently undergoing on-track testing, which is the final stage of
testing before they are commissioned and able to safely carry passengers on our network.
This is a project that we need to get right. These new trains are a critical part of the future of our
public transport network, and I am not convinced that this project is on track. There are delays that
should not be there and there are defects that should not be there. That is why more than two weeks
ago one of my first meetings upon returning to the transport portfolio was with the NGR supplier, Qtectic,
and its key contractor, Bombardier. At that meeting, I raised my issues with these companies and
expressed the government's concerns about the progress of the project.

To date, the state has only made one $60 million payment to Qtectic for the completion of the
Wulkuraka maintenance centre. Importantly, the government has ensured that no payments are to be
made for any of the NGR trains until we are confident they meet all requirements and our standards. I
have also written to the consortium to place on hold the delivery of any future NGR trains from India to
Queensland. To be clear, we will not pay for the trains or accept the delivery of more trains until our
concerns are addressed.

Queenslanders should be very clear about the genesis of this project. This is a project that was
delivered by the LNP. The detailed design was undertaken on their watch, under their stewardship. The
contract to build these trains was awarded under their watch. In January 2014 it was the member for
Clayfield and the member for Indooroopilly who went out crowing about getting these trains for half
price from India. They got half-price trains from India. By going overseas, they said they could deliver
these trains for less. By going overseas, they said they could get them for half price, but everyone
knows that you get what you pay for, and we are now seeing the consequences of the LNP's decision
to send work offshore. In contrast—

Opposition members interjected.

Mr SPEAKER: Thank you, members. We have been here for quarter of an hour.

Mr Nicholls interjected.

Mr SPEAKER: Thank you, Leader of the Opposition. I can hear you. You will have ample
opportunity to question the minister about that later today.

Ms TRAD: In contrast, the Palaszczuk government has shown our confidence in Queensland
manufacturing. In Maryborough, Downer EDI have been awarded a share in a $400 million contract for
maintenance work which will support 200 local jobs. This government is determined to fix the trains and
I am determined to get the job done. Queenslanders can have confidence that these trains, when they
enter service, will be safe and will meet Queensland's high standards. I expect the best and
Queenslanders deserve nothing less.

[#Metro]

^ Let's put steam trains on the Doomben line! STEAM!! 

[ozbob]

Queensland Parliament Hansard

Private members' statements

https://www.parliament.qld.gov.au/documents/hansard/2017/2017_03_01_DAILY.pdf

Maryborough Electorate, Manufacturing Industry

Mr SAUNDERS (Maryborough—ALP) (2.50 pm): The peanut gallery is very active today. I
wonder what was in the Kool-Aid they drank today. I am proud to be the member for Maryborough and
proud to be in the Palaszczuk government because we are delivering local manufacturing jobs in
regional Queensland. I am happy to stand on the record for my electorate, and the Palaszczuk
government is delivering. We are delivering day in and day out in manufacturing in regional
Queensland, especially with Downer rail. Members of the previous government should hang their heads
in shame for the $4.4 billion worth of new generation rolling stock from India. They exported the jobs
from Maryborough in Queensland to India. How do they feel about that? They are the greatest exporters
in Queensland! They have exported all of our industries and exported jobs—

Mr SPEAKER: Pause the clock.

Mr Nicholls interjected.

Mr SPEAKER: Thank you, but I am on my feet, Leader of the Opposition.

Mr SAUNDERS: In 2014 the member for Clayfield and the member for Indooroopilly were
trumpeting this, and I remember it quite well because I was in business in Maryborough when they were
trumpeting the half-price trains and that they were saving the taxpayers. I remember standing in my
shop in Maryborough and seeing that people were very disappointed. One of the quotes that will always
stay in my memory to the day I die was when the former LNP member for Maryborough said that Ipswich
needs jobs too. Shame! She said that Ipswich need jobs when they were talking about the rolling stock
going to Ipswich.

Judging by the number of issues that the Palaszczuk government has had to work through to get
the LNP trains on the track, it is very clear—and I back the words that the Deputy Premier said—that
you get what you pay for. Building these trains in India hurt people in our community and certainly hurt
people in Maryborough. Downer and Maryborough have a very proud history of building trains for
Queenslanders. In fact, 299 was the first train ever built—it was called Walkers in those days—for
Queensland Rail. That train, 299, is still in Maryborough and it is being restored at the moment. Downer
is one of the great companies and the management, the unions and the workers get on so well and
they build fantastic trains that are world class—so much so that the Western Australian government
gets it to build its trains, but the LNP government in Queensland could not. They think they are good
enough in Western Australia, but they were not good enough for this LNP government. Those opposite
are the traitors of Maryborough. They sold the great city of Maryborough out and we will never, ever let
them forget it. We will never let them forget it.

(Time expired)

Member for Maryborough fuming over deal to build trains in India not his city (the famous Walkers) #9News pic.twitter.com/pYzweO5vb1

— Shane Doherty (@ShaneDoherty9) March 1, 2017

[#Metro]

Look what I found:

QTECTIC http://www.qtectic.com/

JOINT STATEMENT
Treasurer and Minister for Trade
The Honourable Tim Nicholls

Minister for Transport and Main Roads
The Honourable Scott Emerson

A multi-billion dollar contract to deliver 75 new trains in South East Queensland will save taxpayers more than $11 million per train.
Treasurer Tim Nicholls and Transport and Main Roads Minister Scott Emerson said Bombardier NGR Consortium has been contracted to design, build, finance and maintain the new trains under a 32-year contract valued at about $4.4 billion.

"Under this deal we are delivering 75 six-car trains at almost half the price of what the previous Labor government paid for its rollingstock," Mr Nicholls said.

"The contract will deliver the new trains over the next five years and maintenance for a 32-year operational period, at a fixed price, so there are no hidden surprises for taxpayers.

"This project is a perfect example of the Newman Government delivering on its election promises by providing better infrastructure and better planning, working with the private sector to deliver cost-effective projects."

Mr Emerson said this was the largest single public transport investment by any Queensland Government and would expand the existing fleet and replace old rollingstock.

"This project will provide almost 500 full-time local jobs, including 150 full-time new ongoing maintenance positions at the modern, purpose-built maintenance facility at Wulkuraka in Ipswich West," Mr Emerson said.

"This investment will increase the capacity of our rail fleet by about 30 per cent and will mean more trains more often.

"Unlike the previous Labor government we have been able to deliver new trains for less by paying around $13.7 million per six-car set compared with Labor who paid almost twice that amount.

"All new trains will be fitted with modern features to increase passenger comfort and safety and will be compatible with the existing rail network and the new Underground Bus and Train network."

Bombardier Transportation Senior Adviser Dan Osborne said Bombardier was pleased to continue its long-term relationship with Queensland.

"We're continuing to support the state's rail system, as we have done since the 1970s," Mr Osborne said.
Arrival and testing of the first of the new trains will begin in late 2015.

[ENDS] 29 January 2014

Media contact:                     
Treasurer:                             Maree Lacey 0409 947 957
Minister Emerson:               Stephanie Shield 0418 186 625

[ozbob]

^ Let's put steam trains on the Doomben line! STEAM!! 

The answer to #railfail bring back steam @QueenslandRail
At least for a peak run or two hey? :-)
>> https://t.co/dnIF7WZZee
Stepping out ..

— Robert Dow (@Robert_Dow) March 1, 2017

Departing Indooroopilly >>
> https://t.co/gJP0G3CguJ
Yee haa!!

— Robert Dow (@Robert_Dow) March 1, 2017

[#Metro]

It is worth looking into the Victorian arrangements. The trains are made in China and locally assembled in Victoria with local content.

Personally, I think it matters that the train works and does what it says it does not what its "nationality" is.

Indeed the whole idea of "product nationality" is fraught because stuff comes from all over the world in any good or service.

It also invites us to judge the merit of a good on not its quality but who made it as a proxy for quality, something that I

think is "PHON" type thinking.

Melbourne to get 65 new trains for the Cranbourne-Pakenham line
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/melbourne-to-get-65-news-trains-for-the-cranbournepakenham-line/news-story/42367b822eb54906d7f9eb8ea45f7dbf

The Andrews Government today announced the winning tender to build 65 new high-capacity trains in Melbourne's east had been granted to the China-backed consortium Evolution Rail.

The winning bid — which includes the Chinese state-owned CRRC — has promised 1100 local jobs will be created with a 60 per cent local build.

Premier Daniel Andrews hailed it as "trains for Victorians built by Victorians".

But the Herald Sun has learnt the international consortium will import all of the carriage shells from overseas for the project.

It is also worth looking at what the Victorians paid - essentially double the cost.

New Trains
https://www.ptv.vic.gov.au/projects/rail-projects/new-trains/

The 2016-17 State Budget includes $875 million for the purchase of 28 additional high-capacity metro trains and $105.2 million for five additional six-car X'Trapolis trains.

This is on top of the 2015-16 State Budget which included a $2 billion investment in new trains and trams for the network.

$1.3 billion for 37 new, high-capacity metropolitan trains with a 50 per cent local content requirement
$257 million for 21 new VLocity regional carriages to be built at Dandenong
$90 million for five new X'Trapolis trains to be built in Ballarat
$75 million to extend the life of more than 70 Comeng trains in the existing metropolitan fleet

$1.3 billion / 37 = $35 million each train
$90 million / 5 = $18 million each train <---- Interesting that this is quite competitive

Suppliers need to be chosen on known merits, not on their location or nationality as proxies.

We can look further into this as a labour audit appears to have been performed.

Queensland Government orders investigation of jobs on Bombardier consortium project
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/queensland-government-orders-investigation-of-jobs-on-bombardier-consortium-project-20150410-1mii75.html

The Bombardier Consortium will construct the trains in India at Bombardier's train manufacturing plant at Sivla after they are designed in Milton.

So the design specifications are done locally and approved by the Queensland Government locally.

It should be very easy to work out whether the design was faulty in Milton of whether the design was not adhered to in India as the files for the drawings need to exist, right??

So just pull out the files on this one and have a look. What instructions were sent to India??

Indeed, one would expect the Queensland Government to have these files as someone (QR or DTMR) would have had to go through the drawings and specifications and check that the measurements, widths, heights, lengths etc were all what they asked for.

[ozbob]

9 News --> Qld trains at standstill over design flaws

The Queensland government will not accept the remaining 80 per cent of its trains to be built under contract in India until safety and design issues are fixed.

But the Australian Manufacturing Workers' Union is urging for the job to be returned to local workers as a political blame game erupts over the $4.4 billion New Generation Rollingstock contract.

An ailing Queensland Rail was again thrown into the spotlight for all the wrong reasons on Wednesday when it was revealed its 143 Citytrain stations would need to be modified to accommodate flaws in the NGR trains.

The problems include issues with brakes, driver visibility, disability access and air conditioning.

Deputy Premier Jackie Trad laid the blame squarely at the feet of the former LNP government for outsourcing the manufacturing to India, saying "you get what you pay for" by securing "half-price trains".

But Opposition Leader Tim Nicholls deflected responsibility onto senior public servants.

Mr Nicholls said the trains were "ordered under the supervision and guidance" of Department of Premier and Cabinet director-general Dave Stewart.

"We have also seen Jackie Trad's current director-general Neil Scales say (last November) these trains are fit for purpose," he said.

Ms Trad, who was appointed Transport Minister last month following the resignation of Stirling Hinchliffe, said she had "made clear" the Bombardier-led consortium was not to send any more trains until the design issues had been fixed.

The Queensland government contracted the consortium to build 75 trains, 13 of which have arrived and another two are in transit.

AMWU state secretary Rohan Webb said Queensland workers should be responsible for delivering the remaining 80 per cent of the fleet.

"The absolute tragedy in this whole story is we have manufacturing facilities across Queensland, from Townsville through to Rockhampton, through to Maryborough, through to Brisbane, laying idle," he said.

"We've got the facilities, we've got the skills, we've got the know-how, we've got people looking for work."

Mr Webb conceded the local sector could not compete on price but current problems meant the government was already looking at a cost blow-out.

"At the end of the day I don't think there's any price you could put on the safety of the Queensland travelling public in regards to ensuring we have the right infrastructure," he said.

The 75 trains are scheduled to increase QR's fleet by about 30 per cent and also replace some older models.

The government has not yet paid any money to the consortium.

Read more at http://www.9news.com.au/national/2017/03/01/11/15/qld-govt-halts-train-orders-over-flaws

[#Metro]

But the Australian Manufacturing Workers' Union is urging for the job to be returned to local workers as a political blame game erupts over the $4.4 billion New Generation Rollingstock contract.

Is the AMWU suggesting that they can have them built at similar cost or 2x the cost?

That could mean $4.4 BN project turns into a $9 BN project, the trains costing more than the construction of the Cross River Rail project

that they are supposed to be running through.

It is worth looking at the Ballarat option. At $18 m/train that is not too different and could be competitive.

[ozbob]

The high capacity trains will cost more, they have more carriages and advanced signalling etc.

The advantage of the Victorian approach is that it does support local industry, there might be a little more cost but you have much better local control of project, and the money is returned in large part to the local economy.

Bombardier and others are skilled at this approach.  The LNP in Queensland just went for the lowest cost option without proper consideration of the other factors.  This NGR botch is going to burn them a lot more than the ALP.  Just wait ...

PHON will point the bone and say " see, the mean majors don't like regional communities, look what they did with the NGR trains! " and so on ..

[#Metro]

The LNP in Queensland just went for the lowest cost option without proper consideration of the other factors.

I think that they cut elements from the design to reduce the headline cost, just like they did with BaT and redcliffe line signalling.

What Mr Powell is talking about having guards roam the train is rubbish, guards are not there to provide security services as their primary role.

If they were able to get the guards compartment removed from the design (I can imagine public servants within QR or DTMR would have been up in arms internally about a decision like that) then that implies they could have or would have removed other components as well.

There must be a paper trail and design drawing files. These should be released in an audit / investigation.

[red dragin]

Regarding wheelchair access between carriages, is it possible to fit down the aisle with 2-2 seating on narrow guage?

That is, inter carriage doorway excluded, could you even get from the front of car 1 to car3/4 through the seats?

[Stillwater]

Will it cost $11m per NGR train to fix the problems?  That is the saving the LNP touted at the time the contract for the new trains was let.  Just what will be the saving to the suffering taxpayer once this drama is played out and extra dollars will have to be thrown at the problem.

[petey3801]

Regarding wheelchair access between carriages, is it possible to fit down the aisle with 2-2 seating on narrow guage?

That is, inter carriage doorway excluded, could you even get from the front of car 1 to car3/4 through the seats?

Not likely, which is why the carriage with the toilet is all sideways seating (apart from the small section between the doors and the end of the car at the opposite end from the toilet).

[James]

Oh dear. I'm lost for words. It just gets worse. I can't believe it. This is a disaster.

Could it get any worse?

[SurfRail]

It can always get worse.  Cold comfort I suppose.

[petey3801]

And, as usual, made out to be much worse by politics and the media than what it really is. Not much room left out at Wulkuraka until the first few units enter service anyway!

[#Metro]

Oh dear. I'm lost for words. It just gets worse. I can't believe it. This is a disaster.

Could it get any worse?

Latest:

Queensland Rail driver-in-charge stood down over drug charges
ONE of Queensland Rail's top train drivers is accused of masterminding a marijuana trafficking network in the state's north.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/crime-and-justice/queensland-rail-driverincharge-stood-down-over-drug-charges/news-story/319d77c0532a1cf0dd1cf48992f27b00

[ozbob]

"Rail fail": Queensland trains at a standstill over design flaws. @MaxFutcher https://t.co/qjuRkEA32b #7News pic.twitter.com/8KzuJRdRY3

— 7 News Queensland (@7NewsQueensland) March 1, 2017

[ozbob]

And, as usual, made out to be much worse by politics and the media than what it really is. Not much room left out at Wulkuraka until the first few units enter service anyway!

Yep, according to one report 15 trains has maxed out the storage at Wulkuraka