New Generation Rollingstock

[ozbob]

Where are the new trains? Time they were out and about ? ?@StirlHinchliffe @TMRQld @QueenslandRail #qldpol pic.twitter.com/guJzm4l8nQ

— Robert Dow (@Robert_Dow) September 1, 2016

[mufreight]

First trials of the NGR sets is taking place between Wulkaraka and Rosewood this morning, all going well how long untill the first one is in service?

[ozbob]

Hello hello NGR 701 outside shed at Wulkuraka pic.twitter.com/DNEnzAcQ72

— Robert Dow (@Robert_Dow) September 13, 2016

[ozbob]

NGR 701 on the mainline at Karrabin 14th September 2016

[ozbob]

NGR 701 at Ipswich pic.twitter.com/VmmzfPRfdS

— Robert Dow (@Robert_Dow) September 14, 2016

[ozbob]

Surprised to see NGR 701 turn up at Ipswich station!

Lucky break, the train from Karrabin was late so had to wait for the 11.07am down ex Ippy and so managed to grab a couple of happy snaps just before we departed Ipswich.  Winning!   

[tazzer9]

Didn't know it had the fancy new lightweight bogies.  It does look very nice, they definitely put effort into the external looks.

[aldonius]

Ye gods. Two whole minutes from when the boom gates go down until when the train actually goes through.

[ozbob]

Ye gods. Two whole minutes from when the boom gates go down until when the train actually goes through.

That was the first time the train had run onto the mainline. (You can just make out the western access line for WMC and where it joins the main line from the platform at Karrabin). It was speed restricted for the first section.  The train actually stopped just past Karrabin I assume for a brake test.  The crossing would be activated for a more normal speed approach.  I didn't observe the train later but I expect it would be up to normal speeds as it appeared at Ipswich presumably from Rosewood in a normal time frame.

[ozbob]

Didn't know it had the fancy new lightweight bogies.  It does look very nice, they definitely put effort into the external looks.

Yes they are good looking units.  I noticed the plastic wraps were still on the seats in the carriages.

I expect we will start seeing the NGRs pop up on the network regularly now as they do more trials.  Things tend to happen slowly with the first units.

I heard that the Gold Coast line may see a few soon as well.  Probably want to test high speed running.

[ozbob]

NGR 701 at Ipswich station







Photographs R Dow 14th September 2016

[Derwan]

Someone else got a few snaps.  Public post on Facebook so no issues posting here.

https://www.facebook.com/maureen.kathage/posts/624145284429122?pnref=story

[kram0]

They look really smart and by the time all the issues are ironed out they will be a great peice of infrastructure. We should double the order size and plan for the future.

[petey3801]

Yep, first run was at 20km/h, gradually getting higher as the brake tests were passed at each stage. They are currently fitted with water drums to mimic different loads for the testing. One should head north soon after the 6 day Cab line closure. And yes, agree they should be quite good units once any teething issues are sorted out and also agree the order should definitely be extended.

[tazzer9]

I would be waiting at least two years before we increase the order size.   There may be a more long term issue with them that we may not become aware of for a while.     Especially because of the use of the new lightweight bogies, that may end up being a source of early repairs.   Look at how badly normal bogies crack when used with substandard steel.

[#Metro]

What was the reason for having two doors per side and not three?

[tazzer9]

Probably due to stations like gaythorne with extreme curvature.

[verbatim9]

What was the reason for having two doors per side and not three?

For slower boarding and disembarking during peak The doors maybe wider though ?

[kram0]

Aren't these train based off the same platform as Adelaide's new electric trains only built in India? They have been in service for 18 month now. Any issues anyone is aware of?

[petey3801]

Waiting two years = the production line having already been finished up, meaning much more $$ required to restart, plus a lot more more lead time on the next lot. Extending the order likely needs to be done within the next year or so. Unsure about the bogies, they don't look much dofferent to the current 160/260 bogies, but I haven't had a good look at them either. I believe the current order only has options to go up to 99 units anyway.

[tazzer9]

maybe not two years, but wait long enough so they have a good run in.   The doors actually seem smaller than the current, i'm surprised they didn't make the doors wider.

[kram0]

They are wider, it probably just seems narrower than the current fleet.

[BrizCommuter]

What was the reason for having two doors per side and not three?

The Queenslander effect. 3 doors would be progress.

[tazzer9]

Even if they are wider, they haven't increased by an amount that could speed up boarding.

[HappyTrainGuy]

You can speed up boarding by telling people to move along the bloody platform.

[#Metro]

The Queenslander effect. 3 doors would be progress.

Does blue team have something to do with this fiasco also?

[verbatim9]

Aren't these train based off the same platform as Adelaide's new electric trains only built in India? They have been in service for 18 month now. Any issues anyone is aware of?

The internal fitout of the Queensland ones seem to be different to the ones in Adelaide from the open day.

[mufreight]

What was the reason for having two doors per side and not three?

The Queenslander effect. 3 doors would be progress.

Raising platform levels to carriage floor height has been proven the reduce dwell times for loading by 20%, yes three doors would speed up loading but at the cost of seats and with many trips of well over the hour the gain in only some services would slow up the loading times on those wit trains with only two doors, raising platform levels reduces the dwell times for all trains.

[tazzer9]

I'm not to phased about only two doors.   Currently our trains ran near empty for the majority of the day.   At best,  these trains will become full 4 times per weekday. 

[ozbob]

I'm not to phased about only two doors.   Currently our trains ran near empty for the majority of the day.   At best,  these trains will become full 4 times per weekday.

That is certainly not the case on the Ippy and Rosewood lines.  Out of peak loadings are good and once the new fare structure is rolled out expect to grow even more.

[petey3801]

3 doors per side would be problematic at a number of (curved) platforms, which are highly unlikely to be fixed anytime in the near to medium term future.

[tazzer9]

I'm not to phased about only two doors.   Currently our trains ran near empty for the majority of the day.   At best,  these trains will become full 4 times per weekday.

That is certainly not the case on the Ippy and Rosewood lines.  Out of peak loadings are good and once the new fare structure is rolled out expect to grow even more.

The current off peak loadings on the Ipswich and caboolture lines could be fixed by running a train every 15 minutes on the express stopping pattern like they should already be doing.  I bet they would rather have 2x the number of trains and seats than being able to board the train 2 seconds faster.


The platform curvature at gaythorne, eagle junction and park road would prevent having a door in the centre. 

[ozbob]

It is pointless continuing to bleat about 15 minute trains and express pattern on the Ippy.

It is not going to happen for years.  There simply is not enough trains.

The precursor for it to occur is 15 minute Kippa-Ring <> Springfield Central.  Then an express pattern will be achievable but it will still be at 30 minute frequency.  Eventually it might go to 15 minute but it will be many years yet.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Current rate 4tph on the caboolture line is over kill. Everything comes from Petrie-Citybound. And even then everything comes in steady predictable waves due to the pure lack of feeder buses and walk up patronage. The only way to get a frequency boost is to have more feeders or something that's going to inject more passengers. It just so happens they have got lucky with the MBRL coming along.

4tph Kippa Ring and 2etph Caboolture would be the most that section of track will ever need. And Caboolture would only get a worthy upgrade once the line further north gets up and running.

[tazzer9]

It is not going to happen for years.  There simply is not enough trains.

Last time I went out on the ipswich and rosewood line, there were 4 trains in redbank, 2 in Ipswich yard and another that was being used for driver training. 
Peak hour is where we don't have the trains, and thats is why we are getting these new shiny things.

4tph on both the ipswich and caboolture lines would end up with surprisingly good patronage.   I know of many people who don't use the train in those area's because of the perceived lack of frequency.  (This includes a QR employee)  And all the off peak caboolture trains i used to catch to work were still mostly full by lawnton.  I doubt that everyone then got off at petrie.  In peak the caboolture line gets a very good frequency due to the demand so there would still be some translation into off peak frequency, also due to the demographics this section is likely to have more off peak travel.

[Arnz]

If the line beyond Beerburrum does get duplicated/realignment in the medium term (5-10 years), there would probably be a medium term chance of CAB going 4TPH (2x CAB, 2x Landsborough 1xNambour).

Forget about CAMCOS in the medium term, it's the new Redcliffe saga.  You'd likely to see Maglev Buses to Caboolture before any form of CAMCOS is built.

[BrizCommuter]

It is pointless continuing to bleat about 15 minute trains and express pattern on the Ippy.

It is not going to happen for years.  There simply is not enough trains.

The precursor for it to occur is 15 minute Kippa-Ring <> Springfield Central.  Then an express pattern will be achievable but it will still be at 30 minute frequency.  Eventually it might go to 15 minute but it will be many years yet.

There are plenty of spare trains off-peak. There are just no drivers for them.

[ozbob]

I was using trains in a more general sense.  Crews etc.  The system is geared to the peaks at present.  Until the 75 (hopefully more) NGR are all out about there will no frequency changes.  Things could happen a bit faster if they concentrated on a more balanced approach, that is, run better counter peak frequency for a start.  Would also help with decentralised stabling.  We have a number of empty stabling movements counter peak on the Ippy ( which is VERY frustrating when one of the counter peak revenue services is cancelled - we all watch empty trains fly past whilst waiting up to an hour, very brainless stuff and it is how you really p%ss people off).  It would not take much to turn some of these into revenue services.  All the crap spruiked about decentralisation is just that.

The other day the 12.07pm and 1.07pm down services ex Ippy were cancelled due to a train fault.  There is no reserve.  [ Plenty of trains in stabling at Ippy ]

Without more crew it is a stalemate. 

[petey3801]

Caboolture line (at least to Petrie) could quite easily sustain 4tph all stations during the day, going by my observations on Caboolture trains throughout the day. After the evening peak has died down is a different story, but during the day there are quite a number of people traveling on the Caboolture line outside of the peaks.
15min Kippa Ring to Springfield and 30min Ipswich to Caboolture express would work quite well for the foreseeable future. Of course, more feeder buses certainly wouldn't hurt though!
One problem at the moment though is certainly the lack of trains, which isn't so much a problem in the off-peak, but during peak it is unlikely that sort of service frequency would be able to be kept up in the counter-peak direction.
I have hopes that once enough NGR stock is in service, so by 2018, we should get exactly that sort of frequency levels.

[verbatim9]

^^Will the ETCS rollout with mirrored and camera platforns along with NGR minimise extra crew as the trains would be basically more Automated requiring drivers only (No guard)? Freeing up crew for four trains per hour?