New Generation Rollingstock

[BrizCommuter]

For information ..

https://twitter.com/RailExpressNews/status/1290059307833163776

Wow - that doesn't leave much competition!

[achiruel]

Siemens, Hitachi, CRRC, Hyundai Rotem, CAF...that's just off the top of my head. Still a fair bit of competition around.

[Matt]

2. reversible seating

I'd be interested in knowing what the problem with this is.  CityRail's earlier stock had it, but later stock just has fixed seating.

And oddly they have moved back to the reversible seating now, also scratch resistant windows area are a must

I agree, to me , the biggest pain when I train is finding a seat that faces the direction of travel, also, when I caught a train in the UK from Warrington to Liverpool return, there was not a single scratch on the windows in my carriage, thought it was a rough area, would they have scratch resistant glass.

[mufreight]

Well we are over a week into September and the first modified NGR is yet to appear in service, how much longer will passengers have to wait for the rectified lemons to be fully fit for service.
Perhaps they can also rectify the uncomfortable seating to make them more suited for the longer services to Nambour and the Gold Coast much less services to Gympie North

[mufreight]

Almost the end of September and the first modified NGR train set is yet to make an appearance, is this set going to be fitted out with a signalling system that will allow it to operate north of Cabolture with a single driver or will we again see there trains taken out of service for this equipment to be fitted.

[Arnz]

Almost the end of September and the first modified NGR train set is yet to make an appearance, is this set going to be fitted out with a signalling system that will allow it to operate north of Cabolture with a single driver or will we again see there trains taken out of service for this equipment to be fitted.

735 has already returned to the depot with the DDA refurbishments complete (notably installing a second accessible toilet and refurbishing the existing toilet) to little fanfare. 

A second driver only joins the train at Nambour for the Gympie North service if it's a IMU (instead of the scheduled ICE) operating the Gympie North service, as ATP requirements is mandatory north of Nambour.

NGRs are currently not permitted to operate revenue services north of Nambour, nor are the drivers trained on the NGRs north of Nambour at this time.

735 has not been fitted with ATP for north of Nambour running, and the project to upgrade Caboolture to Gympie North signalling from the existing ATP system to ETCS1 has not started, iirc.

It's been reported on the wider web that 719 has gone up to Maryborough as the second unit being refurbished to DDA standards.

[mufreight]

Well if 735 is back there is no sign of it either in service or out at Wulkaraka, and if it has not been upgraded with the nessicary for operation north of Cabolture does that mean that the "experts" in TMR have once again shown their inability to see beyond the ends of their noses due to incompetence or stupidity when wasting the public money.

[SurfRail]

^ Just how many trains are needed for Nambour (not Caboolture) to Gympie?

It's surely easier to just upgrade the lineside infrastructure to suit what will be happening elsewhere on the network in the coming years, instead of installing bespoke equipment of no use outside the Gympie North service.

[JimmyP]

I believe the plan is ETCS Level 1 north of Caboolture, but can't remember what dates I read for it. Unsure whether it still is the plan though, was a while ago that I read that.

If it is still the plan, it should use all the same on-train equipment as the ETCS Level 2, just a lower mode in use i'd imagine.

[Arnz]

Considering most of the ICE fleet has now been withdrawn and the 100/120 series IMUs have been popping up on the daytime GympieLander, chances are that the 3-crewed IMU100/120s north of Nambour being the 'permanent' replacements for the ICEs are higher than allowing NGRs (with or without ATP) north of Nambour.

There's currently no known time frame for the Caboolture to Gympie North ETCS1 signalling project, thus no chance of having the NGRs operate north of Nambour anytime soon.  Plus the social media consensus for the Gympie North travellers seems to be that "keep the NGRs out of the Gympie North runs" thus apart from the ICE, most prefers the older IMU100s.

[InclusionMoves]

I can confirm 735 was inspected by some disabled advocates a couple of weeks ago. Not me I refuse to do TMR work for free. But told its close to what was expected. Couple of question marks on some signage. Really small stuff.

Almost the end of September and the first modified NGR train set is yet to make an appearance, is this set going to be fitted out with a signalling system that will allow it to operate north of Cabolture with a single driver or will we again see there trains taken out of service for this equipment to be fitted.

735 has already returned to the depot with the DDA refurbishments complete (notably installing a second accessible toilet and refurbishing the existing toilet) to little fanfare. 

A second driver only joins the train at Nambour for the Gympie North service if it's a IMU (instead of the scheduled ICE) operating the Gympie North service, as ATP requirements is mandatory north of Nambour.

NGRs are currently not permitted to operate revenue services north of Nambour, nor are the drivers trained on the NGRs north of Nambour at this time.

735 has not been fitted with ATP for north of Nambour running, and the project to upgrade Caboolture to Gympie North signalling from the existing ATP system to ETCS1 has not started, iirc.

It's been reported on the wider web that 719 has gone up to Maryborough as the second unit being refurbished to DDA standards.

[timh]

Considering most of the ICE fleet has now been withdrawn and the 100/120 series IMUs have been popping up on the daytime GympieLander, chances are that the 3-crewed IMU100/120s north of Nambour being the 'permanent' replacements for the ICEs are higher than allowing NGRs (with or without ATP) north of Nambour.

There's currently no known time frame for the Caboolture to Gympie North ETCS1 signalling project, thus no chance of having the NGRs operate north of Nambour anytime soon.  Plus the social media consensus for the Gympie North travellers seems to be that "keep the NGRs out of the Gympie North runs" thus apart from the ICE, most prefers the older IMU100s.

My sister does the trip to Gympie semi-regularly and she says she vastly prefers the ICEs to the NGRs, purely for the seats

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

[ozbob]

I can confirm 735 was inspected by some disabled advocates a couple of weeks ago. Not me I refuse to do TMR work for free. But told its close to what was expected. Couple of question marks on some signage. Really small stuff.

Almost the end of September and the first modified NGR train set is yet to make an appearance, is this set going to be fitted out with a signalling system that will allow it to operate north of Cabolture with a single driver or will we again see there trains taken out of service for this equipment to be fitted.

735 has already returned to the depot with the DDA refurbishments complete (notably installing a second accessible toilet and refurbishing the existing toilet) to little fanfare. 

A second driver only joins the train at Nambour for the Gympie North service if it's a IMU (instead of the scheduled ICE) operating the Gympie North service, as ATP requirements is mandatory north of Nambour.

NGRs are currently not permitted to operate revenue services north of Nambour, nor are the drivers trained on the NGRs north of Nambour at this time.

735 has not been fitted with ATP for north of Nambour running, and the project to upgrade Caboolture to Gympie North signalling from the existing ATP system to ETCS1 has not started, iirc.

It's been reported on the wider web that 719 has gone up to Maryborough as the second unit being refurbished to DDA standards.

Thanks for the update IM.   

[ozbob]

ABC Facebook ...

[ozbob]

I think this might be the cab mock-up referred to in this RTBU document.

http://www.rtbu.com.au/_dbase_upl/36_2015-06-15_QRTcrew.pdf

[mufreight]

Almost mid November and still the first of the disability compliant NGR train sets is yet to enter service, where is set 735 Mr Bailey?

[mufreight]

Almost mid November and still the first of the disability compliant NGR train sets is yet to enter service, where is set 735 Mr Bailey?

[InclusionMoves]

Can't remember if I told you Mufreight or not but it had some small little signage issues when inspected by advocates. I wasn't there cause they wanted free advocates and like hell I will work for free. Totally agree thats not worthy of this hold up though.

Geoff

Almost mid November and still the first of the disability compliant NGR train sets is yet to enter service, where is set 735 Mr Bailey?

[mufreight]

The government has taken well past the 12 months that it was going to take to make the first NGR set disability compliant and still there is no disability compliant NGR set in service, train sets of a similar nature have been designed built, tested, certified and placed in service in less time, that over 12 months has passed for the modifications to make this FIRST set disability compliant, a pathetic effort on the part of the Transport and Main Roads staff who have had the responsibility of oversight of this project from day one that reflects badly on the workers at Downer Maryborough who have in the past served QR well.
It is obvious that anything railway related is beyond the expertise of TMR and it is past time to return to the times past where there was a Minister for Railways and a Commissioner who were directly responsible for the railways and problems like the epic of mismanagement that has been the NGR contract, the North Coast line duplication now after only 10 years is less than a quarter completed and now only proposes only extending the duplication not even to Landsbrough, another major rail fail under TMR administration.
Time for a replacement of Minister Bailey and the removal of Railways from TMR.   

[ozbob]

TMR look after the management of NGR trains.  No wonder it is off the rails ...

While rail remains in TMR it is rooted basically.

The Government doesn't care much either.  Their priority is get ' mates ' into DG positions so that they can have sycophantic foam parties!

Really is a sad mess.  The fools who let NGR fester into the mess it is, are still there bumbling away.  The Government lacks moral courage.

[JimmyP]

Last I saw on FB was that 735 had returned to Maryborough after being back in Brisbane for a while.

[mufreight]

We are aware that 735 has returned to Marybrough but the fact remains that under the oversight of Minister Bailey and TMR there is still no disability compliant NGR set in service.  This incompetent administration now is not only now over 12 months late with the 75 NGR set being fully in service has cost the Queensland taxpayers almost a Billion $ over the original price, so much for having them built overseas to save costs.
Obviously time for a new competent Minister to take charge and a spring clean of the incompetent management at TMR.

[JimmyP]

We are aware that 735 has returned to Marybrough but the fact remains that under the oversight of Minister Bailey and TMR there is still no disability compliant NGR set in service.  This incompetent administration now is not only now over 12 months late with the 75 NGR set being fully in service has cost the Queensland taxpayers almost a Billion $ over the original price, so much for having them built overseas to save costs.
Obviously time for a new competent Minister to take charge and a spring clean of the incompetent management at TMR.

I hadn't seen it reported here that 735 had returned to Maryborough. It obviously had some issues after the refit. It's a prototype, it happens.
While the delays are partially on the current gov (welcome to creating a new prototype.. these things happen. Once the processes for the refit have been understood and gotten used to, things get much faster fairly quickly. Same thing when building or refitting an aircraft), the trains were ordered by the Newman gov, so nothing to do with the current gov.

I've got no idea what you mean regarding 12 months overdue with 75 NGR trains in service. The final NGR train has been in service for some time now, over 12 months by memory, with only the units undergoing refit being unavailable for service. If you mean all 75 should have been refitted and in service by now, I have no idea where you got that from. By memory the original date for all 75 refitted units was 2022, it's now 2023/early 2024 by memory. Once again, these delays happen, but the program is progressing and will get faster as Downer bed in the processes.

[ozbob]

" The first upgraded trains will be back in passenger service in South East Queensland in 2020. "

* https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/projects/new-generation-rollingstock/accessibility-upgrades

No, they will not be in service in 2020.  Another deadline failed to be met. 

This project continues with obfuscation and delays, a hall mark of TMR managed rail fails.

[ozbob]

Couriermail --> New Generation Rollingstock overhaul blowout adds to rail fail woes

The first of Queensland's 75 trouble-prone new trains to be overhauled has been in the workshop for more than a year, blowing out the 2020 milestone for it to be back in service.

But transport bureaucrats overseeing the $335 million New Generation Rollingstock patch-up project insist the overall project to fix disability access issues will be finished as planned sometime in 2024.

The Transport Department's website shows the first of the NGR trains was to have entered the workshop for repairs in October 2019 and would be back in service by 2020.

But a spokesman this week confirmed it was now looking at early 2021 as "minor finishing works" were needed. ...

... "The disabled community has entered into this process transparently and any extensions or blowouts in timelines should be communicated in the same transparent manner.." Disability advocate Geoff Trappett said yesterday. ...

... Rail advocate Robert Dow said steps should be taken to accelerate the accessibility upgrades. "The NGR project has been a continuing saga of obfuscation and delay," he said.

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1337772040527335425

[mufreight]

Again the non compliant NGR trains have shown that TMR is incapable of administering anything railway related in a competent and effective manner.  Where is the first of these noncompliant trains that long suffering QR commuters were told would be in service late 2020.
Time for a new Transport Minister and for some heads to roll in TMR, everything rail related that TMR has had any connection with has been over time, deficient in meeting the standards of what is needed and hopelessly over budget.
Projects that should have been completed and in service that have fallen by the wayside, Beerburrum Nambour duplication which should have been completed by 1990 and would have taken some freight off the Bruce Highway now scaled back to not even being full duplication from Beerburrum to Landsbrough which is going to have little benefit either for passenger services or northern rail freight.
It is obvious that Minister Bailey is a fail as far as rail is concerned and that there should be a return to a Minister for Railways and a Commissioner for Railways directly responsible for all matters rail related from infrastructure to operations in place of an incompetent or totally disinterested Minister and an appointed board whose interest would appear to be their salaries while taxpayers are paying $500.000 a week in overtime for a substandard service.

[techblitz]

It's been reported on the wider web that 719 has gone up to Maryborough as the second unit being refurbished to DDA standards.

got a glimpse of the workshop on the cairns -  bris    and 719 is still there...

[mufreight]

Well it is the middle of January 2021 and still no compliant NGR set in service, where is it Minister Bailey?  You assured the public that it would be in service mid November 2020, obviously the oversight of anything related to railways is beyond the competence and expertise of the incompetent seat warmers in TMR.
It is becoming increasingly apparent that it is past time for a return to railways having their own minister, a commissioner who is responsible to that Minister instead of a board of failed political hacks and union officials and have the railways run as a railway that is again capable of meeting the needs of the people of Queensland.

[ozbob]

Rail Express --> Alstom completes acquisition of Bombardier Transportation

Almost a year since the purchase was announced, on January 29, Alstom formally completed the acquisition of Bombardier Transportation.

The now combined business comprises 75,000 people across 70 countries, with a combined revenue of €15.7 billion ($24.97bn). This brings the entity closer in size to Chinese manufacturer CRRC, the world's largest with €20.9bn in revenue in 2018.

"Today is a unique moment for Alstom and the mobility sector worldwide, with the creation of a new global leader centred on smart and sustainable mobility," said chairman and CEO of Alstom Henri Poupart-Lafarge. ...

... With Bombardier having significant production facilities in Australia, as well as elsewhere around the world, these will now form part of Alstom's footprint, the company said in a statement. ...

[red dragin]

Seen photos on a Facebook group of 729 arriving at Maryborough yesterday. Another photo also shows part of the maroon wrapped set sitting in the yard (photo is primarily of the three direction points).

[ozbob]

Completed an interview with Sky News re NGRs. 

Will go to air next week I think.

[ozbob]

SNC - Lavalin

New Generation Rolling Stock Technical Advisor

https://www.snclavalin.com/en/projects/new-generation-rolling-stock-technical-advisor

" ... SNC-Lavalin was engaged since 2013 as the Technical Advisor to the DTMR for the New Generation Rollingstock (NGR) project and has worked in partnership with the Queensland DTMR and other organisations to achieve delivery of the simulators and rollingstock assets.  We have since been engaged as the Technical Advisor for retrofit of the ETCS Level 2 Baseline 3 system onto the NGR fleet, as well as all aspects of acceptance and delivery of the accessibility upgrades. ... "

[ozbob]

SNC - Lavalin

New Generation Rolling Stock Technical Advisor

https://www.snclavalin.com/en/projects/new-generation-rolling-stock-technical-advisor

" ... SNC-Lavalin was engaged since 2013 as the Technical Advisor to the DTMR for the New Generation Rollingstock (NGR) project and has worked in partnership with the Queensland DTMR and other organisations to achieve delivery of the simulators and rollingstock assets.  We have since been engaged as the Technical Advisor for retrofit of the ETCS Level 2 Baseline 3 system onto the NGR fleet, as well as all aspects of acceptance and delivery of the accessibility upgrades. ... "

This has now been removed from SNC-L website ...

[ozbob]

NGR 735 has been finished and was at Wulkuraka when this made.

[ozbob]

Facebook ..

DDA upgrade of first NGR (735) now complete 'Queensland's government has finished overhauling the first of 75 New...

Posted by RAIL - Back On Track on Sunday, 28 March 2021

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1376249712135655426

[ozbob]

Commission of inquiry into New Generation Rollingstock Trains https://www.traininquiryngr.qld.gov.au

https://www.traininquiryngr.qld.gov.au/assets/custom/docs/coi-final-report-2018.pdf

Executive Summary Page v.

" Key issues that caused or contributed to the non-compliances include:
- the decision to require only one toilet on each train, located at the leading end of accessible
car B
- a lack of expert knowledge regarding the disability legislation within the project team and
QR technical experts and the failure to formally engage an accessibility expert
- the project team not advising senior decision-makers of compliance issues
- the absence of early, genuine consultation with the disability sector. ... "

[#Metro]

Disappointed Sky news being very prominent about 'Indian' built trains.

Built in India bit to a flawed Queensland design...

[achiruel]

Disappointed Sky news being very prominent about 'Indian' built trains.

Built in India bit to a flawed Queensland design...

They have several flaws besides accessibility as well. I think it's a fair point.

In my experience, Indian products are not of good quality.