New Generation Rollingstock

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/ozbob13/status/1053137048729612289

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/ozbob13/status/1053135958671994883

[red dragin]

https://twitter.com/ozbob13/status/1053137048729612289

They seem to be missing more bits. I thought agistment was meant to fatten them up? 

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/QueenslandRail/status/1054153213060898816

^ you would think Queensland Rail would be overjoyed to share the contractual on-time running with the NGR trains, not exclude them like a leper.

Is this campaign of welcome for the NGRs even more bullsh%t?  Seems so to me ....

[SurfRail]

Has everybody forgotten these things do not comply with statutory requirements?

[not_available]

Has everybody forgotten these things do not comply with statutory requirements?

Not me.
NGR 739 is in service as well

[ozbob]

Has everybody forgotten these things do not comply with statutory requirements?

No, I haven't.  Been asking about a rectification plan but I never get a response.

Once all the 75 NGRs in service they will represent about 56% of the fleet in operation.

[#Metro]

^ Would be very interesting to see the calculation then , with more than half of the services excluded.

[ozbob]

^ Would be very interesting to see the calculation then , with more than half of the services excluded.

Amazingly dumb stuff now.  Yes, could backfire on them because to be correct the NGR services would have to be excluded from contractual calculations, so that it becomes a smaller number of services with older units  .. uh .. oh  ...  . 

But no doubt if a failed NGR causes delays with non-NGR services that would be expunged as being beyond Queensland Rail's control. Contractual on-time running is a meaningless parameter now.

It is clear to me that the methodology Queensland Rail uses to determine these on-time running values should be audited by an independent agency with the abilities to do that properly.  I mean can anyone trust Queensland Rail any more?  I can't I assure you.

[#Metro]

There are already independent agencies, three in fact:

1. Translink, who is the regulator
2. The Auditor-General, who has general oversight
3. The CityTrain response unit

There is also the minister, who theoretically supervises the organisation.

The contract isn't worth anything, as IMHO QRs implicit guarantee of contract renewal negates its effect.

[ozbob]

" Hey Rupert? Why are you 20 minutes late for school? "

" Errrr  I am not late Mrs Browning.  I had a contractual delay - my shoelaces broke. 

They were imports from overseas, so I cannot be held responsible ... "

"Ok then Rupert, of course.  So you wiil be marked as being on-time ... "  said Ms Browning.

Students are never late for school in Queensland, trains are never late, you only think they are late.  The proof is that contractually they are on time. 

Hey, how can you doubt that?

[ozbob]

There are already independent agencies, three in fact:

1. Translink, who is the regulator
2. The Auditor-General, who has general oversight
3. The CityTrain response unit

There is also the minister, who theoretically supervises the organisation.

...

" Independent ... "

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/MarkBaileyMP/status/1054141319721844736

[SurfRail]

Real rail fan probably means "credulous gunzel rivet counter who doesn't ask inconvenient questions".

[not_available]

https://twitter.com/MarkBaileyMP/status/1054141319721844736

I guess 738 is in service now as well... maybe...

703 704 705 706 707 708 709 710
711 712 713 714 716 717 718 719 720
721 722 723 724 725 726 727 728 729 730
735 736 738 739

31... i'm missing 2... probably in the 730 - 736 gap

[red dragin]

Real rail fan probably means "credulous gunzel rivet counter who doesn't ask inconvenient questions".

Ouch 

[#Metro]

Independent

I believe it is an offence to direct or obstruct the Auditor-General, and of course they would be ideal for investigating the NGR. IIRC, the Auditor-General used to sit on the QR board.

In Victoria, the Auditor-General has reviewed the private contracting arrangements with the train operator twice now.

[Stillwater]

I am finding it hard to get my head around this .... so, when the NGR trains are fully operational, on-time running performance will be assessed on less than 50 per cent of the train fleet?

[ozbob]

I am finding it hard to get my head around this .... so, when the NGR trains are fully operational, on-time running performance will be assessed on less than 50 per cent of the train fleet?

Yes.  Appalling hey?  That is why I am devoting a fair bit of time to this at present.

We have suggested that they need to report now two sets of on-time running, NGRs and non-NGRs.  I am sure there is no other railway operating that would do this to this degree, that is misrepresent on-time running in such a way.   The only reason it has come out it in the daylight is because Kelmeny Fraser Journalist at the Couriermail stumbled upon it last week and Mr Nick Easy confirmed it was happening.

At that point Queensland Rail updated their website:

" Sometimes incidents beyond Queensland Rail's control may delay our services (force majeure). Such incidents may include severe weather activity, onboard medical emergencies, security incidents, vehicles striking level crossing boom gates, and third party rollingstock faults including the New Generation Rollingstock fleet which is not owned or maintained by Queensland Rail. Because these incidents are out of Queensland Rail's control, they are not included in the contractual results.  "

They have been doing this since December 2017 obviously.  Duplicitous deception in my book.  A transparent outfit would have declared that from the outset.   

I have very little faith or confidence left in Queensland Rail.  I doubt that they can actually recover.  Contractual on-time running is a meaningless metric in my view.  The only metric that has some basis in reality is customer-impact. 

Really sad it has come to this.  The best thing is for a new operator to come in and sort out the network properly.  This will not happen under the present incompetent regime so expect worse outcomes for a few years yet. 

[Cazza]

Should we change the topic title to "New Generation Laughingstock"?

[ozbob]

Should we change the topic title to "New Generation Laughingstock"?

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/ozbob13/status/1054246106924601345

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/ozbob13/status/1054250030339485696

[ozbob]

Real rail fan probably means "credulous gunzel rivet counter who doesn't ask inconvenient questions".

Ouch 

Real rail fan c. 1958.  Bobby Dow onboard one of his favourite  Beyer Garratts at Fyansford   

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/MarkBaileyMP/status/1054134374831075329

[ozbob]

Letter to the Editor Queensland Times 23rd October 2018 page 17

Be more honest with passengers

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/ozbob13/status/1054649864791846912

[ozbob]

Couriermail --> Rail union's $50m demand for more screen time

A PALASZCZUK Government union deal to spend $50 million on extra CCTV screens for the state's new train fleet is a waste of taxpayer dollars as it merely duplicates existing screens in the driver cabin, transport sources say.

The Courier-Mail can reveal about 300 extra screens being installed on the $4.4 billion New Generation Rollingstock trains replicate existing dash-mounted CCTV screens just a few steps away.

Details of the works come as an inquiry into NGR design flaws quizzes top transport officials and politicians.

As previously reported, the extra screens were approved by the Palaszczuk Government after its election in 2015 at the insistence of the Rail Tram & Bus Union.

But transport sources with knowledge of the project say the extra screens were ordered purely so train guards could remain visible to the public by standing in the driver cabin door.

The trains were designed as driver-operator only, meaning guards would be abolished, but the powerful rail union later struck a deal with Labor to save their jobs.

It involved installing extra screens on the driver cabin rear wall so guards can continue to poke their heads out of the door to blow their whistles.

This is despite the driver cabins already being fitted with dash-mounted CCTV screens beaming identical images of the full length of the train platform.

It is understood that transport officials had resisted the move, arguing guards could have simply sat in the empty rear driver cabin and viewed the existing screens.

But the unions wanted extra screens mounted to the rear wall so guards could stand in the doorway, sources say.

"The whole idea of 21st Century rollingstock is you don't need a guard," one source said.

"They just stand there doing nothing. It's a make-work scheme for the union."

Transport Minister Mark Bailey defended the $50 million upgrade.

"This added visual capability will allow guards to see the entire length of the train from the cab doorway, even on curved platforms, providing better sight lines and improving safety for passengers and staff," he said.

Guards on NGR trains cannot help disabled people board because of their position in the last carriage.

Station platform staff now do the job, and on some stations, also give the all-clear by blowing a whistle.

The RTBU did not respond.

A QR spokesman said it was standard procedure to conduct a visual check prior to departure.

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1054752209626251264

[ozbob]

Sent to all outlets:

24th October 2018

NGR botch and the impacts continue to get worse ...

Good Morning,

Yet more uncertainty about the New Generation Rollingstock (NGR) trains.

Couriermail --> Rail union's $50m demand for more screen time

Modifying the cabs for the guards is one thing, but where are the details of the rectification plan (costs and timelines) to make the NGR trains compliant under the DDA DSAPT?  The State of Queensland is breaking the law operating the NGR trains without the protection of an exemption, they have trampled on the Disability Sector long enough. It is time for the NGR rectification details to be made public, and the real costs of this monumental botch rectification made clear in the public domain.

Concerning the matter of the NGR trains and any rollingstock issues and the impacts on on-time running with them being removed from the contractual on-time running metric.  We feel compelled now to issue this warning notice.

=================================

Notice:    Warning re contractual on-time running metrics

https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=13378.msg215482#msg215482

Last week it was discovered that Queensland rail is not including delays due to mechanical issues ( rollingstock faults ) with the New Generation Rolling stock trains.

Queensland Rail updated their website at https://www.queenslandrail.com.au/aboutus/ourperformance/service-punctuality-and-reliability when this was discovered by a Couriermail journalist, as follows:

Quote:

" The on-time running of Citytrain services is a priority for Queensland Rail. We make every effort to ensure our services adhere to the published timetable.

Our on-time running performance targets are the most stringent in Australia. We aim to have more than 95% of our peak period services arrive on-time. All services, including peak and off-peak, are measured on time when they arrive within three minutes and 59 seconds of their scheduled time (5 minutes and 59 seconds on interurban services; ie Gold Coast, Rosewood and Nambour).

Sometimes incidents beyond Queensland Rail's control may delay our services (force majeure). Such incidents may include severe weather activity, onboard medical emergencies, security incidents, vehicles striking level crossing boom gates, and third party rollingstock faults including the New Generation Rollingstock fleet which is not owned or maintained by Queensland Rail. Because these incidents are out of Queensland Rail's control, they are not included in the contractual results. However Queensland Rail recognises delays, regardless of their cause, affect customers, and this is reflected in the customer impact figures. "

So since the introduction of New Generation Rollingstock trains in December 2017, the contractual measurement has become increasingly less representative of the overall network performance. When all 75 NGR trains are in service, they will represent around 56% of the operating train fleet, so the contractual on-time running measurements are now largely meaningless.

==================================

Day 755 of #railfail today.  We once had a rail network that was not beset with calamity.  A succession of mediocre Governments and a bumbling bureaucracy to match, have delivered failure.  Well done!

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1054762926744039424

Facebook ..

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1054839014996361216

[ozbob]

Sources are telling me that the rectification costs for the NGRs for compliance is at least $200 million. 
I have always thought it might in the order 200 to 300 million $.

When you add to the cost of the screens, $50 million, and the shed extension etc. for Maryborough $10 million. 
Then additional costs are in the order of at least $260 million.
The cost of the NGR trains themselves was $13 million per train for an overall cost of $975 Million.

So the cost is now increased in effect by 260/975 x 100 = 27% !



(And Queensland Rail doesn't love them enough to treat them same as the rest of the train fleet for OTR).



It's time for another round Annie ..    Ha Ha Ha!

[ozbob]

 

https://twitter.com/mistertraveller/status/1055282039081975808

[Whippa]

703 704 705 706 707 708 709 710
711 712 713 714 716 717 718 719 720
721 722 723 724 725 726 727 728 729 730
735 736 738 739740

[SurfRail]

^ Confident I've been on 737 recently

[not_available]

703 704 705 706 707 708 709 710
711 712 713 714 716 717 718 719 720
721 722 723 724 725 726 727 728 729 730
733 735 736 737 738 739 740

Beat me to it

^ Confident I've been on 737 recently

I'll add it in anyway.
Thought I saw 731 as well, but not overly confident that it was. EDIT 733 added

[tazzer9]

Any reason why the side destos are never on/working on roughly half of the NGR services I see.   Is it a driver thing, is it related to a certain destination glitching (like m sets)

[brissypete]

Any reason why the side destos are never on/working on roughly half of the NGR services I see.   Is it a driver thing, is it related to a certain destination glitching (like m sets)

I have noticed that they appear to turn off when the train is out of a station, as the side desto on while stopped then disappears as the train speeds up. Or maybe it's just me.

Sent from my G8141 using Tapatalk

[tazzer9]

They must not know when they have reentered a station then.