High Speed and Fast Rail

[frereOP]

Now where is Stage 2 of the HST study for the Melbourne-Brisbane corridor?

Well, it's only 6 months since the release of the interim report and the final report was due 12 months later.  Be patient.

What I worry about is that a change of government at the federal level will see the "economic rationalists" come back to power and simplify the debate to the "How much will it cost to build and operate and how much revenue will it generate?  Oh, that much, we can't afford it." scenario.  Warren Truss already expressed these sentiments within hours of the release of the interim report. 

What these narrow minded views really mean is that we don't want to spend the money now because taxes and charges might have to go up and we are happy to defer the real cost of our inaction to our kids and grandkids.

We are paying now for the lack of foresight in the past by our own forebears to invest in the future and we have water shortages, electricity blackouts, public transport inadequacy, long hospital waiting lists, traffic congestion etc.  Tax cuts driven by short term political expediency at the expense of investment in the future is a legacy I would never want to leave for our descendents.

[ozbob]

From Expatica.com click here!

France and Italy to start work on high-speed rail link

France and Italy to start work on high-speed rail link

France and Italy on Monday signed an agreement to build a high-speed rail link between Lyon and Turin, the largest such project in Europe, despite opposition on the Italian side of the border.

The line, which is due to be completed by 2023, would allow high-speed trains to link Paris and Turin in just over four hours, compared to seven at present.

The Lyon to Turin connection would be cut back from just over four to just under two.

Work will begin with the digging of a 57-kilometre tunnel (35 mile) tunnel under the Alps to link the border areas.

The 8.5 billion-euro ($11.2 billion) tunnel will funded by France, Italy, and the European Union, with Italian Deputy Transport Minister Mario Ciaccia saying he hoped the EU would pay 40 percent of the cost.

The new line will take account of human and environmental impact studies on the Italian side of the border where violent protests took place last year, French Transport Minister Thierry Mariani said.

Last week some 40 people were arrested, with 26 of them detained, following violent protests in July over the project.

"A minority cannot upset a shared decision, along with a national and EU programme," Ciaccia said, vowing to stand by the agreed timetable for building the link.

Early work to clear the way for the line started last summer in Italy's northern Susa Valley amid a strong police presence as protesters sought to break through barriers erected around the controversial site.

Susa Valley residents fiercely opposed the plan, saying construction of tunnels would damage the environment.

[O_128]

In other new Queensland has engaged New south wales in war after it was discovered that northern NSW residents were using Queensland Infrastructure. "It's not right letting all these bloody foreigners use our system theres no seats for anyone else" says advocate Lex Bell. Premier Bligh has today announced the construction of a 300m high wall to stop NSW people entering the state.   

We are a pathetic country. Two different countries and collaborate on a rail line yet two states can't.

[ozbob]

Canberra Times --> ACT joins Hunter in push for fast train

[ozbob]

Newcastle Herald --> Hunter push for high-speed rail

[frereOP]

In other new Queensland has engaged New south wales in war after it was discovered that northern NSW residents were using Queensland Infrastructure. "It's not right letting all these bloody foreigners use our system theres no seats for anyone else" says advocate Lex Bell. Premier Bligh has today announced the construction of a 300m high wall to stop NSW people entering the state.   

We are a pathetic country. Two different countries and collaborate on a rail line yet two states can't.

John Williamson in an interview on 612 ABC last week said "stateriotism" was one thing he didn't like about Australia and as far a parochialism is concerned, Queensland is the worst of all the states (well,SA might be up there too I think).  The only thing that really benefits from "stateriotism" is "State of Origin" rugby league, and that a concept that is 20 years past its use-by date!

A wall eh?  300m high to stop NSW people getting in?  ROTFLMAO

[O_128]

In other new Queensland has engaged New south wales in war after it was discovered that northern NSW residents were using Queensland Infrastructure. "It's not right letting all these bloody foreigners use our system theres no seats for anyone else" says advocate Lex Bell. Premier Bligh has today announced the construction of a 300m high wall to stop NSW people entering the state.   

We are a pathetic country. Two different countries and collaborate on a rail line yet two states can't.

John Williamson in an interview on 612 ABC last week said "stateriotism" was one thing he didn't like about Australia and as far a parochialism is concerned, Queensland is the worst of all the states (well,SA might be up there too I think).  The only thing that really benefits from "stateriotism" is "State of Origin" rugby league, and that a concept that is 20 years past its use-by date!

A wall eh?  300m high to stop NSW people getting in?  ROTFLMAO

Its written badly on purpose, Courier mail style 

[frereOP]

I asked the question before but I don't think I got an answer.  Expressed in today's dollars, how much did the existing Melbourne-Sydney-Brisbane rail line cost to build?

Had people known how much it would really cost at the time, would it have been built at all, or would we still be riding Cobb and Co coaches?

[cartoonbirdhaus]

As far a parochialism is concerned, Queensland is the worst of all the states (well,SA might be up there too I think)

And WA—which probably wins the #1 spot in the parochialism stakes, slightly ahead of even Qld.

[colinw]

IMHO, the curse of parochialism infects this whole cobbled together mess of a country. Even our most two popular football codes have their roots in intense rivalry & even hate between suburbs, let alone regions or states.

Now, getting this thread back on track, and to demonstrate just what a regressive & irrelevant backwater this country reallly is ...

Railway Gazette International -> Demonstration high speed freight train links Lyon and London

21 March 2012



Freight TGV trainset operating Carex demonstration service at London St Pancras station.

EUROPE: The vision of a network of high speed freight trains carrying express parcels and other premium consignments across Europe moved a step closer on March 21, when a demonstration train from Lyon Saint-Exupéry and Paris Charles-de-Gaulle airports arrived at London's St Pancras International station.

The trial run was organised by members of the EuroCarex consortium, which includes SNCF, Eurotunnel, Air France, the French post office La Poste, FedEx and airport operators in Paris, Amsterdam, Liège and Lyon. The UK element was co-ordinated by Eurotunnel subsidiary GB Railfreight and High Speed 1 Ltd, which holds the concession to operate the high speed line between London and the Channel Tunnel. Loading and unloading was handled by SNCF Geodis subsidiary Geoparts Rail Solutions.

The aim is to start commercial services in 2017, with a London terminal probably located near Barking. Discussions are underway with Alstom and Siemens for a fleet of 25 trainsets.

Operations would start with premium express traffic, but the consortium envisages that it could be expanded to handle more traditional freight in future.

The original Cargo Rail Express project was launched in 2006, following a UIC-led study into the European express freight market. In 2008 the reformed EuroCarex consortium signed a memorandum of agreement aiming to start commercial services in March 2012, and opened negotiations to acquire an initial fleet of eight dedicated high speed freight trains at a cost of €625m. These were to be designed to carry modular loads similar to airfreight containers, but the project was delayed by the economic downturn.

In the absence of dedicated rolling stock, the demonstration run to London was operated by set 951, one of the three dedicated TGV trainsets which La Poste has been using to carry mail between Paris, Mâcon and Cavaillon since 1984. This has a capacity for 120 tonnes of parcels, equivalent to seven articulated lorries or seven Boeing 737 aircraft.

The train left Lyon Saint-Exupéry at 16.42 on March 20, arriving at St Pancras the next morning following a stop to load extra cargo at Roissy-Charles-de-Gaulle.

Greeting the arrival of the train in London, French MP and EuroCarex Chairman Yanick Paternotte said 'I am delighted that today's test over the European high speed rail network clearly shows the interest which strategic players in the logistics field - airports as well as rail operators - have in linking their infrastructures to key European economic centres.'

EuroCarex believes that its Express Rail network of high speed freight trains could provide next-day delivery between European hubs with a carbon footprint lower than the current mix of air and road, offering a viable alternative to rising fuel prices and the environmental constraints which limit the number of night flights.

[colinw]

Railway Gazette International -> Portugal: High Speed Programme Axed

23 March 2012

PORTUGAL: The Ministry of Economy & Employment announced on March 21 that the country's high speed programme had been 'definitively abandoned'.

This followed a ruling by the Court of Auditors that the concession awarded to the ELOS consortium to build the eastern section of the Lisboa - Madrid route between Poceirão and Caia should be rescinded.

According to the ministry, the court had found the contract to contain 'illegal clauses', citing 'irregularities' in both the concession and the process by which it had been awarded by the previous administration. From the government's perspective, the ruling puts an end to the controversy over high speed in Portugal, and it would examine the judgement in detail to determine the legal and financial consequences in terms of 'defending the public interest and that of Portuguese taxpayers'.

While abandoning the high speed project, the government said that its priority is to concentrate on developing 1 435 mm gauge freight routes from the ports of Sines and Aveiro to the rest of Europe 'to improve the competitiveness of Portuguese exports'. Developing these freight projects would involve working with the Spanish and French governments as well as European institutions, said the ministry.

[ozbob]

Today in Travel --> New High-Speed Train to Debut in Italy

[Jonno]

http://www.railexpress.com.au/archive/2012/april/april-25th-2012/ara-weighs-into-debate-over-2nd-sydney-airport?M=7aab4e3c-2e5d-46be-94dd-985c02ce4ad5

ARA weighs into debate over 2nd Sydney airport
by Rail Express — last modified Apr 24, 2012 01:33 PM

The Australasian Railway Association (ARA) says the current debate over a second airport for Sydney should also factor in a high-speed rail network connecting Australia's east coast cities.

Courtesy Central Japan Railway Company
By Jennifer Perry

ARA chief executive Bryan Nye says a second airport for Sydney and high-speed rail (HSR) are not an "either or" proposition but both should be "on the table".

"I've read the government report on the need for a second Sydney International Airport and it's clear that airport capacity constraints need to be addressed to meet expected growth in international flights," Nye said.

"However, what is missing from the current debate is the impact and benefit of a HSR network connecting our East Coast cities."

The ARA says "decades of debate" are threatening to destroy the chances of Australia securing a HSR  network and the desperately needed alternative to Sydney's only airport.

The ARA maintains however, that the viability of HSR is not reliant on the need for a second Sydney Airport.

According to the ARA, a "do nothing" approach will see Sydney, Melbourne, and Brisbane-Gold Coast grow into mega cities crippled by congestion and governments will continue to struggle to provide the necessary infrastructure to support them.

Domestic flights are clogging Sydney flight paths. The route between Sydney and Melbourne is the fifth busiest in the world providing 7.9 million passenger journeys a year. A further 1.1 million passenger journeys are made by air annually between Sydney and Canberra.

According to Nye, world experience shows that a 350 km/hr HSR link between Sydney and Melbourne with a travel time of 2hrs 50 min would see 60% of travellers change to rail.

"The Sydney to Canberra distance would see HSR become the dominant mode of transport on that leg," he continued.

"This shift to rail would free up the desperately needed air paths and runway slots into and out of Sydney airport."

The ARA claims that HSR can provide alternative solutions for an early construction of a second Sydney airport.

According to Nye, a 30 minute HSR trip could provide access to an alternate airport within a 200km radius of Sydney and could also provide overflow capacity through the existing Canberra and Newcastle Airports.

"Australia has the population to support a high-speed rail network. The European and Asian experience shows that people are willing to travel by high speed rail up to one hour for work and three hours for recreational journeys," Nye concluded.

[somebody]

Only a small % of flights are actually contestable by HSR.

[Mozz]

Only a small % of flights are actually contestable by HSR.

Simon - am interested in what this means? I thought that if the Sydney Melb route is around the third most travelled air route in the world then HSR between the two cities would be significantly contestable. 

[somebody]

Only a small % of flights are actually contestable by HSR.

Simon - am interested in what this means? I thought that if the Sydney Melb route is around the third most travelled air route in the world then HSR between the two cities would be significantly contestable.

You can fly to a lot of places from Sydney, besides Melb, CBR, BNE, Gold Coast, Newcastle, Coffs Harbour, Ballina, Wagga Wagga and Albury (did I leave anything out?  Would HSR serve all those places?)  There are 950 flights/week SYD-MEL, but compare that to SYD's total flights which are about 50-60/hour OTOH.  Quick calcs are SYD-MEL flights account for about 8/hour.  I guess that is in the mid teens %.

[somebody]

Even if you can get 30% of the airport's traffic on to rail, if you believe growth will continue you've only pushed out the second airport by 5-10 years.

[SurfRail]

You can fly to a lot of places from Sydney, besides Melb, CBR, BNE, Gold Coast, Newcastle, Coffs Harbour, Ballina, Wagga Wagga and Albury (did I leave anything out?  Would HSR serve all those places?)

As far as I can tell, Ballina would probably be the only one of those places without an HSR stop based on the current feaso work, which is looking at around 15 or fewer stops over the entire 6 and a bit hour route.  (Maybe Wagga would be excluded depending on the route taken, but I can't see a direct Canberra to Albury route happening.)

Brisbane or Gold Coast to Melbourne would probably still continue to be primarily an air-travel market.  I expect the rest is all well and truly up for grabs, leaving Sydney, Brisbane and Melbourne (and even Coolangatta) to focus on the overseas market.

[somebody]

Less than Maglev would have real trouble competing with flying for SYD-MEL and SYD-BNE too.

[SurfRail]

Less than Maglev would have real trouble competing with flying for SYD-MEL and SYD-BNE too.

Really?  3 hrs end to end on either run is going to be very attractive to a lot of people.  No airport parking or other Macquarie Bank price gouges, no or limited security theatre, probably cheaper fares by the time it has been built, better business facilities.   

It will by no means replace air travel completely, but it will certainly make a very big dent.

The technology exists to deliver those travel times with steel rails now - in Europe and most other places there is little practical use in running that fast regularly because of the limited distances and concentrated population.

[Fares_Fair]

I was talking to an ex-serviceman yesterday morning on the train.
He was heading down to Adelaide for the ANZAC service there.

He said he was on holidays in Japan and the train they took went up to 290km/h and took 2 hours to get to the destination.
He told me it would have taken 5 hours to drive by car.

[somebody]

3 hours is still longer than what it takes to fly, check in to baggage claim, and you'd have real trouble doing 3 hours without a whole new alignment through the cities, which means tunnelling really.

Then would the fares be cheaper than airfares without needing to be subsidised?

I'm also not sure how parking would be any different between flying and HSR?

I think it needs to be around 2 hours, 2.5 hours max.  Otherwise the high value customers will still want to fly.

[Gazza]

3 hours is still longer than what it takes to fly, check in to baggage claim, and you'd have real trouble doing 3 hours without a whole new alignment through the cities, which means tunnelling really.

Bear in mind CBD access from the airport needs to be factored in. Less relevant for Sydney I guess because the airport is quite central, but it matters for BNE and MEL.

The ability to conduct business on a train is better too.

But this all belongs in the HSR thread.

[ozbob]

The Guardian --> Italy's Ferrari of the railways gets off to a flying start

[O_128]

The Guardian --> Italy's Ferrari of the railways gets off to a flying start

Heading to Italy in december, very,very excited to use these.

also our HSR system looks cheap when its costing 33 billion to build a line from leeds to london. thats only 300km. Makes our system look affordable.

[#Metro]

also our HSR system looks cheap when its costing 33 billion to build a line from leeds to london. thats only 300km. Makes our system look affordable.

I actually think some of these construction projects may be worthwhile purely because these countries have very depressed economies, with all the financial troubles the private sector is not doing so well and is laying off lots of people making labour rather cheap, and you need to get cash into the system, it might make a lot of sense despite the high cost.

In Australia, we're in the opposite situation. Mining and other sectors are going gangbusters, there is very low unemployment and wages are relatively high.

With all the problems that we have in Australia, HSR is the last thing on my mind. The Eastern Busway was ~ 500 million (0.5 Billion) to construct. The Leeds to London situation is TWICE this cost per kilometre. And we all know that if the Eastern Busway wasn't built (and they just routed everything via Deshon Street, hur hur  ) we'd be able to spend that $500 million on SATURATING Brisbane with CFN services. It is enough to run 10 additional BUZ services for roughly the next decade or so... so that Bulimba 230 and 235, 400 and 450, 350 and 359, 4 x GCL routes all done!

[colinw]

I'd argue that Newcastle - Sydney - Canberra would be viable right now. Melbourne I'm not so sure.

I've only ever ridden two true high speed routes - Madrid to Barcelona and Madrid to Toledo.

The Barcelona route is at the upper end of viable distances, a bit over 600km. That is a similar distance to Brisbane to Rockhampton.  An express takes about 2 hour 30 with 1 intermediate stop at Zaragoza.  An all stations train has about 5 intermediate stops, and takes about 2:50.  Service is hourly.

At that distance it is still viable, and has fairly well wiped out air travel other than people flying into Madrid and connecting onward.  An AVE station is being established at Madrid Barajas airport, and soon it will be possible to change from air to HSR for your onward journey to destinations within Spain.  The combined population served by Madrid to Barcelona is similar to Sydney / Canberra / Melbourne.  Madrid & Barcelona are both similar sizes to Sydney & Melbourne. Zaragoza is a bit smaller than Canberra. When I rode the line, there seemed to be about an equal mix of people riding the thing the whole way and people doing Madrid <-> Zaragoza or Zaragoza <-> Barcelona journeys.  Based on what I saw there, I'd say that a Sydney to Canberra line would do very well indeed, but Sydney to Melbourne might be just a bit too long to be viable. With TGV / AVE style trains, Sydney to Melbourne would be over 4 hours - possibly a bit too much to compete with air.

The Toledo line is a completely different setup.  It is a 70km point to point sprint, which replaced an all stations electric commuter line.  Service is about hourly, and seems to be mainly targetted at the the tourist market, Toledo being a world heritage site and one of Spain's major tourist attractions.  When I rode the line, the trains were packed, but the main accent I was hearing was American English. It is primarily a tourist oriented service, and with a secondary role as a commuter train.  In SEQ terms, it would be equivalent to having a point to point 270 km/h train from Roma St to Surfer's Paradise, marketed primarily at tourists but also serving commuters.

[somebody]

Madrid - Barcelona was also previously the #1 busiest air route in the world.  It's now #11.

I bet that MAD-BCN doesn't have so much trouble getting through the city fringes as what would apply to a SYD-MEL service too.

[colinw]

I bet that MAD-BCN doesn't have so much trouble getting through the city fringes as what would apply to a SYD-MEL service too.

The urban form of Madrid makes it comparatively easy to put in new corridors.  It is arranged as a series of distinct urban hubs, each centred on a suburban rail or metro station, with some big empty areas in between even relatively close to the inner city.  New rail corridors can reach open ground within a few km of the main city stations of Atocha & Chamartin.  High speed operation begins maybe 10km out of central Madrid, but even a couple of km out the train is already doing 160.  In Brisbane terms it would be equivalent to a high speed train to Sydney leaving on the suburban line via South Brisbane & Salisbury and being able to 160km/h by around Moorooka and hit the full 300+ by Browns Plains.

In Barcelona they AVE follows an existing suburban rail line into the city, and the corridor was wide enough to fit the AVE tracks. However, closer in to Barcelona some extensive tunnelling was required which was quite expensive, and again with the new extension toward France tunnelling was required to get beyond Barcelona Sants.  There are basically no above ground rail lines anywhere in central Barcelona.

The AVE also required some long tunnels to get through the middle of Zaragoza.

[Gazza]

^What are the check in procedures like on the TGV and AVE? Those countries have a higher terrorism risk than us, so their security procedures would be the benchmark.

[O_128]

^What are the check in procedures like on the TGV and AVE? Those countries have a higher terrorism risk than us, so their security procedures would be the benchmark.

Domestic there isn't really any security, international was different.

[Golliwog]

^What are the check in procedures like on the TGV and AVE? Those countries have a higher terrorism risk than us, so their security procedures would be the benchmark.

Eurostar was ticket and passport check, then just a basic bag scan/metal detector. All one after the other so only the one real queue. Can't remember how long it took us to get through but not long at all.

[petey3801]

^What are the check in procedures like on the TGV and AVE? Those countries have a higher terrorism risk than us, so their security procedures would be the benchmark.

Eurostar was ticket and passport check, then just a basic bag scan/metal detector. All one after the other so only the one real queue. Can't remember how long it took us to get through but not long at all.

When I travelled on the Eurostar, it only took us 5-10mins max to get through security/customs (which was, as has been said, baggage x-ray and a metal detector, then passport control for customs) then we went up to the platform and got a few photos before jumping on the train.

In France on the TGV it was, quite literally, rock up to the station, get a ticket and board. If you already had a ticket, just rock up, hop on and off you go. Same for Germany.
International between Euro countries (ie: France to Germany) was just like any normal domestic run, no security, no passport checks etc.

In Germany, a number of the High Speed lines (300km/h) aren't even fenced! I've taken a photo on the side of a highway of an ICE where I could walk onto/over the tracks if I felt like it, nothing to stop me from doing so!

[colinw]

^What are the check in procedures like on the TGV and AVE? Those countries have a higher terrorism risk than us, so their security procedures would be the benchmark.

RENFE AVE uses an Airport style scanner at the point where you pass through from the station to the platform.  That applied even to short haul routes like Toledo.  Fairly similar procedure to domestic air travel in Brisbane - bags, backpacks, etc. go through the scanner.  Also empty your pocket & put phones, etc. through on a tray.  I haven't used the TGV so can't talk about that.

[petey3801]

Petey, yes Europe still operates on the princple of commonsense and self preservation. Something Australia has lost or loosing.

Tell me about it! Be an idiot and get yourself injured/killed in Europe, it's your own stupid fault! In The Netherlands, they don't even sound the horn on the train at level crossings, let alone when moving the train from stationary!

[ozbob]

From the Goulburn Post click here!

Procrastination threatens high speed rail

Procrastination threatens high speed rail
23 Apr, 2012 09:13 AM

DECADES of debate are threatening to destroy the chances of Australia securing a High Speed Rail (HSR) network and the desperately needed alternative to Sydney's only Airport, says Australasian Railway Association CEO Bryan Nye.

He said the "do nothing" approach will see Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane and Gold Coast grow into mega cities crippled by congestion and governments will continue to struggle to provide the necessary infrastructure to support them.

"I've read the government report on the need for a second Sydney International Airport and it's clear that airport capacity constraints need to be addressed to meet expected growth in international flights," Mr Nye said.

"However, what is missing from the current debate is the impact and benefit of a high speed rail network connecting our East Coast cities.

"World experience shows that a 350km/hr high speed rail link between Sydney and Melbourne with a travel time of two hours and 50 minutes would see 60 per cent of travellers change to rail.

"The Sydney to Canberra distance would see high speed rail become the dominant mode of transport on that leg "This shift to rail would free up the desperately needed air paths and runway slots into and out of Sydney airport."

High Speed Rail can provide alternative solutions for an early construction of a second Sydney airport.

"A 30 minute high speed rail trip could provide access to an alternate airport within a 200km radius of Sydney," Mr Nye said

"It could also provide overflow capacity through the existing Canberra and Newcastle Airports." Goulburn Mulwaree Council is advocating strongly for a HSR link through the region, saying improved transport access will bring people closer to employment markets.

[ozbob]

Breaking Travel News --> High Speed Rail and second Sydney Airport - debate continues

[#Metro]

The Australasian Railway Association is losing credibility. Even with 100% mode split away from aircraft, the number of slots freed up at Sydney Airport from a Sydney-Canberra HSR would be negligible. The ARA needs to get off the fantasy and look at more practical and realistic proposals and fight harder for urban and regional passenger rail.

http://blogs.crikey.com.au/theurbanist/2012/04/11/would-hsr-to-canberra-solve-sydneys-airport-woes/

First, a Canberra-Sydney HSR service would cater for 250 km of what is essentially unnecessary travel.  It would not replace an existing inefficient or environmentally damaging mode. It wouldn't even satisfy some existing unmet demand. (Note that Sydney-Canberra passengers currently only account for 3.1% of all passengers through Kingsford-Smith).

"World experience shows that a 350km/hr high speed rail link between Sydney and Melbourne with a travel time of two hours and 50 minutes would see 60 per cent of travellers change to rail.

"World experience" is not a good predictor. Speed and travel time savings over existing modes and current demand plus density at terminals would be more appropriate.

60% of 3.1% is only 1.8% - which is like NOTHING!! You would still need a second airport at Sydney, even with HSR to Canberra, PLUS you have added an interchange to that as well!

Why would you spend TENS OF BILLIONS to construct this concrete fiesta when there are more urgent rail needs closer to home?

The great paradox is this - I don't doubt the ARA's good intentions, but if this proposal gets the green light, it will cause more damange to rail and public transport than one could imagine because it would lock up so much funds that could be spent elsewhere, particularly on urban and interurban rail projects (Sunshine Coast Line anyone?).

[somebody]

However, replacing 737-800s with A330-300s on SYD-MEL can reduce congestion in Sydney by 5% or more, quite easily.  It's just that the charging rates for air services do not encourage this.

But it could be worse, we could be in the US.

[verbatim9]

Seeing Bob Carr taking a HSR trip in China wander if The China HSR consortium is putting in a bid to build Some of the rail infrastructure and trains for the proposed Australian East Coast Hsr project!?