Article: Locals vie for Rail Jobs

[ozbob]

From Courier Mail 8th June 2009 page 14

Locals vie for Rail Jobs

Locals vie for Rail Jobs

Two local bidders are among three to have been shortlisted for a multi billion-dollar tender to supply up to 200 new trains for Queensland commuters.

The trains will be added to the state's rail network between 2012 and 2020, boosting the southeast's 220 peak-hour services.
Shortlisted bidders for the $2 billion project include United Group Rail / Rotem, Downer EDI / Bombardier and Mitsubishi / CAF.

QR Passenger chief Paul Scurrah said regardless of which group was awarded the contract, jobs would be created in Queensland.

[ButFli]

How is it that Downer EDI can bid for this new contract? Aren't they still struggling to fill the last one in a timely fashion?

[Derwan]

How is it that Downer EDI can bid for this new contract? Aren't they still struggling to fill the last one in a timely fashion?

The contract starts after EDI's current contract ends.  I think one of the reasons the new contract went to tender was the apparent slow delivery rate.  By forcing EDI to compete with other suppliers for the contract, they are likely to commit to a higher delivery rate.

No doubt price was another big factor - but again the competition may force EDI's hand to offer a better deal.

Even if EDI Rail is chosen, putting the contract to tender is likely to benefit SEQ by providing trains more quickly and at a reduced price.  (Let's just hope the quality isn't sacrificed!)

[mufreight]

Why EDI should not be awarded any further contracts,
Local content of about 35%.
In service unreliability to date worse than that for 30 year old EMU's
Late deliveries at this time believed to be about 4 sets behind.
Price with other builders believed to be offering prices about $3 million per three car set lower.
Alternative builders may well set up in Queensland and build here for both NG operators QR and Westrail and also possibly for Adelaide as it is believed that the electrification there will be 25Kva AC making most equipment in rollingstock built for Adelaide the same.

[O_128]

Sorry EDI if a 30 year piece of crap can be more reliable than a brand new train than something is wrong. I would hope that whoever is investigating the tenders looks interstate and overseas for a more price competive train. Screw Queensland jobs considering we are funding them then we are the ones out of pocket by up to 3 million a set and we are 4 sets behind

[stephenk]

Sorry EDI if a 30 year piece of crap can be more reliable than a brand new train than something is wrong.

Language! 

The EMUs are in better shape than many other trains of their age. However things could be done about door reliability, broken seats, flickering lights, and dodgy motors.

[Dean Quick]

You are kidding yourselves If you think that new sets that are cheaper but untested and untried for local conditions are going to be any more reliable or in fact any better than the sets we currently have!!!

[mufreight]

Sorry Dean but no, I and others who are currently in the industry are not kidding.
When a builder/equipment supplier such as Hitachi who have been building AC NG rollingstock for more than 40 years for the Japanese market where reliability in intensive service borders on a religion supplies equipment then it can be taken as read that it has been extensively tested and is reliable as for being lower cost again the scale of the market and competition are the reason for lower cost.

[ozbob]

Hey,  I like our EMUs!  Superb, and still going strong after 30years.  With a bit of TLC good for a while yet!

But a point will be reached eventually where replacement will be more economical than major makeovers, hence the EOI I expect.  Nothing wrong with testing the market, sound business sense.

[stephenk]

You are kidding yourselves If you think that new sets that are cheaper but untested and untried for local conditions are going to be any more reliable or in fact any better than the sets we currently have!!!

Most new trains are built in kit form using tried and tested components. This scale of economy reduces the cost of new trains, and increases reliability. In fact in Japan, the current train of thought (bad pun) is to build new recyclable trains designed to last 20-30 years, rather than building new trains designed to last 40 years and having to refurbish them (which costs $$$) on multiple occasions throughout their lifetime. Bring on the tenders!

[O_128]

buying trains form japan will be much cheaper due to economies of scale. japans metro is also one of the only metros int he world with such high reliability and quality of sets. Plus i can imagine that with Japanese type design they would somehow mange to fit an extra 20 seats per set. Also with the next trains due do we really need 3 wheelchair spots int he aisles no disabled persons ever uses them they prefer to stay in the vestibules

[stephenk]

buying trains form japan will be much cheaper due to economies of scale.

Exchange rate is poor at the moment though.

japans metro is also one of the only metros int he world with such high reliability and quality of sets.

Hong Kong, Singapore, Moscow, and Santiago also have very reliable and frequent metros. Even the NYC subway has an impressive mean distance between failures on some rolling stock.

Plus i can imagine that with Japanese type design they would somehow mange to fit an extra 20 seats per set.

Quite the opposite. Japanese commuter trains tend to have less seats so as to increase standing capacity (longitudinal seating only). The Yamanote Line in Tokyo has some cars with seats that retract during the peaks, resulting in 100% standing space. The cars also have 6 doorways per 20m car side to reduce station dwell times.

Also with the next trains due do we really need 3 wheelchair spots int he aisles no disabled persons ever uses them they prefer to stay in the vestibules

So what if a group of disabled people want to use a train?

[Dean Quick]

I have been to both Singapore and Santiago and I was very impressed by their metros. Would new sets from Japan be much cheaper at the moment with a lopsided exchange rate?
Having come from a southern state railway as a maintainance fitter, I have had experiance with components that failed miserably under local conditions-heat and dust being the main two issues. These same components had,apparently,worked fine in their country of origin! My point was that many foreign trains will work fine in their local conditions but may/will fail under our harsher climate and conditions

[stephenk]

I have been to both Singapore and Santiago and I was very impressed by their metros. Would new sets from Japan be much cheaper at the moment with a lopsided exchange rate?
Having come from a southern state railway as a maintainance fitter, I have had experiance with components that failed miserably under local conditions-heat and dust being the main two issues. These same components had,apparently,worked fine in their country of origin! My point was that many foreign trains will work fine in their local conditions but may/will fail under our harsher climate and conditions

Are conditions harsher in Brisbane? London and NYC have a larger temperature range, Singapore and Hong Kong have more rain, NYC and Stockholm have regular snow and ice, Santiago has terrible air pollution.