Cross River Rail Project

[v6hilux]

This could be a game changer;

"Brisbane to bid for 2028 Olympic Games"
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/brisbane-to-bid-for-2028-olympic-games-20150226-13p86l.html

The CRR project is "shovel ready"!

[colinw]

Let me get this straight ... "team blue" has been screaming at the top of their lungs that there's no money, we're up to our eyeballs in debt, we're all going to be ruined, and now a mayor from that same team wants to spend millions bidding an event that will cost multi-billions if we win it.   

[ozbob]

2028 Olympic Games --> http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=11297.0

Hopefully the bus network is sorted by 2028, don't hold your breath hey?   

[ozbob]

Cross River Rail needs to be reconfirmed and moves made to kick start it now IMHO. 

[colinw]

+1.  Enough of this nonsense, it needs to proceed.  With sufficient rollingstock to support it, and a transition to ATP + driver only operation.

[Derwan]

Economist Adrian Hart urges Abbott Government to invest in infrastructure

"One of Australia's leading infrastructure economists has encouraged the Abbott Government to quickly change its decision not to invest in rail infrastructure."

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/economist-adrian-hart-urges-abbott-government-to-invest-in-infrastructure-20150303-13tkni.html

Given the pressure on Abbott's leadership, he may be in a position to reconsider some of his contentious policies.

[ozbob]

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/kurilpa-riverside-project-to-be-revisited/story-fnn8dlfs-1227249572935

... Ms Trad said while the LNP's BAT tunnel (buss and rail tunnel) was now off the table with the scrapping of asset privatisation plans and the change of government, Labor remained committed to building a second rail river crossing as well and was lobbying the federal government to chip in funding.

This comes despite the Federal Government's push for state's to sell assets to fund such infrastructure into the future.

"We know this was the number one public transport infrastructure project that Infrastructure Australia said needed to be built in order for Brisbane to grow into the future," she said.

"What the LNP did was it took Cross River Rail off the agenda so they could mate Tony Abbott elected down in Canberra. Well we are not going to give up on a second river crossing. Labor is committed to continuing to lobby the Federal Government to make sure that we can build a second river crossing to stop the rail crisis that will hit the southeast corner in 2016." ...

[ozbob]

Is this a good time to point out that we are in year 2015 already?  Just sayin' ... 

[Stillwater]

This is a recipe for disaster.... just keep lobbying Canberra for big infrastructure money.  The alternative is to hit motorists with extra costs and walk a tightrope as they switch to PT on one hand without the PT system falling over before you can improve it using the money you have extracted from those motorists. 

The solution must include a congestion tax for Brisbane.  The request to Canberra should also be along the lines of a 3x3 tax on fuel sold in Queensland (3 cents a litre for 3 years, collected by the Feds as a surcharge on fuel excise sold in this state and reimbursed to Qld by the Commonwealth.)  The constitution allows for this.

Are we to believe that Ms Trad's strategy for the next three years is to say, effectively: "I'd like to build you this or that -- and God knows that Queensland needs it -- but Tony Abbott won't give me the money to build it for you."

Canberra-bashing is elevated to an artform in Queensland, going back to the days of Joh Bjelke-Petersen, don't you worry about that!  And Ms Trad's position is really no different to that of Jeff Seeney and Mr Emerson, the previous LNP Transport Minister.

On this matter, Queensland does not need a politician meddling in transport.  We now will have had three plans for augmented rail capacity across the Brisbane River, with much renting of clothing and gnashing of teeth for eight years.  Does Ms Trad propose to make it 11 years of anguish -- past the point at which the experts tell us the problem will be worst?

What sort of a signal does that send to the business world and to those who want to invest in Queensland?

Queensland takes eight years, probably more, nutting out a problem that would take less than half the time to solve in states such as Victoria or WA.  This issue calls for a statesman, not a politician.

[#Metro]

The state needs proper taxing powers. This is getting silly. Waiting is a real cost, and these projects are delayed for so long they reduce the benefits the longer the wait.

In addition, I would like to see the bus network fixed up first. No need to wait for Canberra for that and it is more or less cost-neutral as well.

Heavy infrastructure is mind-blowingly expensive and takes a long time to bring to completion (5-10years). Bus route adjustments, superbuses and modernised stop spacing are orders of magnitude cheaper and faster to complete.

[ozbob]

Brisbanetimes --> BaT tunnel scrapped as government looks for different cross river rail line

[ozbob]

Sent to all outlets:

19th December 2014

Real concerns with the Bus and Train Tunnel - the BaT

Greetings,

Increasingly experts who are not under the thumb and 'group-think dogma' of the Newman Government are finding the courage to question the charade that is the BaT.

This project needs a comprehensive and rigorous evaluation, outside the politics of Queensland.  It is a fact that Cross River Rail was exhaustively evaluated by Infrastructure Australia and stacked up.  The BaT has not had this rigorous analysis.

Interesting reading:

1.  Is Southeast Queensland becoming a 'failed state' on infrastructure and planning?
--> http://www.linkedin.com/pulse/20140904031848-82138563-is-southeast-queensland-becoming-a-failed-state-on-infrastructure-and-planning?trk=mp-reader-card

2. Submissions by Phillip Stewart (see below).

Latest  --> here! PDF 0.7 MB

First --> here! PDF 1.1 MB

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

=============================



Media release 14th September re-released 19th December 2014

SEQ: Will the BaT fly?

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport passengers has said there is growing concern with the lack of detailed public information on operational aspects of the Bus and Train (BaT) tunnel.

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"Our members have attended consultation sessions for the BaT. They have expressed concerns with the lack of detailed operational information on how this tunnel will work, particularly the bus aspects."

"From the outset there has been concerns from transport planners that the concept is flawed (1)."

"These concerns are not being addressed.  What future proofing is there for the bus component? Clearly single unit buses will not be able to meet the eventual passenger demands. This is a once in a generation opportunity and to paralyse future transport options for Brisbane and south-east Queensland on political whimsy is seriously flawed."

"Brisbane bus issues can be fixed by implementing proper network review, and establishing proper bus priority on the surface network. Why waste billions of dollars?"

"If the BaT goes ahead as it is seem to be planned for, the end point will be a conga line of buses in the bus component similar to the Victoria Bridge bus conga lines.  Really, is this getting anywhere for the longer term?"

"Eventually electric bi-artic buses, or even a rubber tyred metro system will need to operate in the bus component of the tunnel to handle the pax loads. This means there be multiple transfers for bus passengers, the bus network will be forced to operate as a trunk and feeder model. Meanwhile, rail passengers will have seamless rides into the new underground stations."

"A serious question is:  Why is there no combined bus and train tunnel anywhere in the world?"

"The answer is obvious.  No other jurisdiction has been as stupid as Queensland appears to be."

"Questions on the planned operational aspects need comprehensive and detailed explanations before wasting billions of dollars!"

References:

1. Bus and rail tunnel all show and no substance: transport expert
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/bus-and-rail-tunnel-all-show-and-no-substance-transport-expert-20131118-2xrab.html#ixzz3DDY3F0p7


Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

=================

Good afternoon,

As stakeholders interested in public transport I have sent you a copy of my submission in response to the Revised Reference Design for the Queensland Governments proposed Underground Bus and Train (BaT) project.

I have also included a copy of my original submission to the EIS. I am an experienced professional in transport systems and have spent most of the last 10 years working in rail and public transport planning. The attached submission, together with my original submission, highlight a number of flaws in the BaT project that raise serious questions about the effectiveness and justification for the project.

I am a firm believer that if you want to deliver a quality project then you need to start with two fundamental questions

1.       What transport outcomes and services do we need in the future?

2.       What infrastructure is required to deliver those services?

When you ask these two questions you will end up with a project that that delivers the right outcomes for the people of SEQ.

These important principles have been completely ignored in the EIS and continue to be ignored in the Revised Reference Design.

The project shows considerable obvious flaws that need to be scrutinised and questioned to ensure that Queensland doesn't end up with another white elephant infrastructure project.

I hope that you will take the time to consider the issues I have raised and examine the EIS documentation for yourself.

Please also feel free to forward this email and attachment to any other people who have an interest in this project and also in ensuring that the State Government doesn't waste billions of dollars of taxpayer money on its pet white elephant.

Kind Regards,
Phillip Stewart

===============

Submissions:

Latest  -- here! PDF 0.7 MB  http://backontrack.org/docs/bat/Stewart2bat.pdf

First -- here! PDF 1.1 MB  http://backontrack.org/docs/bat/Stewart.pdf

Twitter

Robert Dow ‏@Robert_Dow 2 minutes

BaT has gone belly up! Flawed project, no great surprise is it? > http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=9972.msg150602#msg150602 ... #qldpol #qldvotes

[ozbob]

Sent to all outlets:

6 March 2015

Queensland Needs Project Certainty

Greetings

RAIL Back on Track welcomes announcements regarding the cancellation of the flawed BaT project. We also welcome the proposed extension of the Gold Coast Light Rail project and proposals to extend the Eastern Busway.

However, the unstable policy environment is a serious cause for concern.

Our members know that Queensland Governments suffer from a long history of half-baking key projects and inertia. Key signs include the issuing of voluminous announcements, expensive video-graphic animations, mountains of studies and high-gloss reports. But the proposal is ultimately pushed out into the never-never of time and the funding-abyss.

Queensland has problems today. These problems need to be solved today, not in 20 or 30 years.

The Cross River Rail project is a case in point. First it was Cross River Rail, then it was Lord Mayor Quirk's bus tunnel and extremist proposal for ripping up the Cleveland Rail line and replacing it with trams, then it was BaT with its grossly inferior financial statistics, lack of Park Road interchange, and hi-waste bus tunnel, and now we are back to square one again. Around six years has been wasted in the process.

The constant chopping, changing and cancellation of projects wastes massive amounts of time, money, years of public servant efforts and creates an uncertain, volatile risk environment for project suppliers and contractors. This increases costs.

It is worth restating that infrastructure is very expensive and has long lag times from conception to completion. RAIL Back on Track's new bus network is low cost and can be rapidly implemented with no new major infrastructure. We will be releasing a briefing for both the Transport Minister and Shadow Transport Minister, and media in the coming weeks outlining our positions on transport in SEQ.

Queensland needs certainty for plans to move forward. Perhaps it is time four-year fixed parliamentary terms are given serious consideration?

Enjoy your commute!

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

[ozbob]

Sent to all outlets:

7th March 2015

The BaT is dead!

Good Morning,

The BaT is dead! And a good thing that is.  There are very good reasons why it should not proceed, we pointed out the reasons months ago - see below.

Bus network reform will deliver a functional public transport network at minimal cost.  We will have more to say about that next week when we release our bus network proposal for Brisbane.

The reality is this.  Previous Governments, TMR and TransLink have failed our community with absurd reactive public transport policies.  SEQ is slowly grinding to a halt.

A rail solution consistent with Cross River Rail is the correct thing to do as it has future enabling effects for the entire SEQ rail network.

Improving the signalling system for our trains including Automatic Train Protection, and bus network reform for Brisbane, are now the priorities to get the overall public transport network into a much more efficient, functional, connected and cost efficient state.  This will drive massive patronage shifts from the congested roads to a more sustainable public transport system.

Cross River Rail is many years away at best.  We must now do the obvious or  SEQ ends up in terminal gridlock, parts of it already are.

Best wishes
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

Sent to all outlets:

19th December 2014

Real concerns with the Bus and Train Tunnel - the BaT

Greetings,

Increasingly experts who are not under the thumb and 'group-think dogma' of the Newman Government are finding the courage to question the charade that is the BaT.

This project needs a comprehensive and rigorous evaluation, outside the politics of Queensland.  It is a fact that Cross River Rail was exhaustively evaluated by Infrastructure Australia and stacked up.  The BaT has not had this rigorous analysis.

Interesting reading:

1.  Is Southeast Queensland becoming a 'failed state' on infrastructure and planning?
--> http://www.linkedin.com/pulse/20140904031848-82138563-is-southeast-queensland-becoming-a-failed-state-on-infrastructure-and-planning?trk=mp-reader-card

2. Submissions by Phillip Stewart (see below).

Latest  --> here! PDF 0.7 MB

First --> here! PDF 1.1 MB

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

=============================



Media release 14th September re-released 19th December 2014

SEQ: Will the BaT fly?

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport passengers has said there is growing concern with the lack of detailed public information on operational aspects of the Bus and Train (BaT) tunnel.

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"Our members have attended consultation sessions for the BaT. They have expressed concerns with the lack of detailed operational information on how this tunnel will work, particularly the bus aspects."

"From the outset there has been concerns from transport planners that the concept is flawed (1)."

"These concerns are not being addressed.  What future proofing is there for the bus component? Clearly single unit buses will not be able to meet the eventual passenger demands. This is a once in a generation opportunity and to paralyse future transport options for Brisbane and south-east Queensland on political whimsy is seriously flawed."

"Brisbane bus issues can be fixed by implementing proper network review, and establishing proper bus priority on the surface network. Why waste billions of dollars?"

"If the BaT goes ahead as it is seem to be planned for, the end point will be a conga line of buses in the bus component similar to the Victoria Bridge bus conga lines.  Really, is this getting anywhere for the longer term?"

"Eventually electric bi-artic buses, or even a rubber tyred metro system will need to operate in the bus component of the tunnel to handle the pax loads. This means there be multiple transfers for bus passengers, the bus network will be forced to operate as a trunk and feeder model. Meanwhile, rail passengers will have seamless rides into the new underground stations."

"A serious question is:  Why is there no combined bus and train tunnel anywhere in the world?"

"The answer is obvious.  No other jurisdiction has been as stupid as Queensland appears to be."

"Questions on the planned operational aspects need comprehensive and detailed explanations before wasting billions of dollars!"

References:

1. Bus and rail tunnel all show and no substance: transport expert
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/bus-and-rail-tunnel-all-show-and-no-substance-transport-expert-20131118-2xrab.html#ixzz3DDY3F0p7


Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

=================

Good afternoon,

As stakeholders interested in public transport I have sent you a copy of my submission in response to the Revised Reference Design for the Queensland Governments proposed Underground Bus and Train (BaT) project.

I have also included a copy of my original submission to the EIS. I am an experienced professional in transport systems and have spent most of the last 10 years working in rail and public transport planning. The attached submission, together with my original submission, highlight a number of flaws in the BaT project that raise serious questions about the effectiveness and justification for the project.

I am a firm believer that if you want to deliver a quality project then you need to start with two fundamental questions

1.       What transport outcomes and services do we need in the future?

2.       What infrastructure is required to deliver those services?

When you ask these two questions you will end up with a project that that delivers the right outcomes for the people of SEQ.

These important principles have been completely ignored in the EIS and continue to be ignored in the Revised Reference Design.

The project shows considerable obvious flaws that need to be scrutinised and questioned to ensure that Queensland doesn't end up with another white elephant infrastructure project.

I hope that you will take the time to consider the issues I have raised and examine the EIS documentation for yourself.

Please also feel free to forward this email and attachment to any other people who have an interest in this project and also in ensuring that the State Government doesn't waste billions of dollars of taxpayer money on its pet white elephant.

Kind Regards,
Phillip Stewart

===============

Submissions:

Latest  -- here! PDF 0.7 MB  http://backontrack.org/docs/bat/Stewart2bat.pdf

First -- here! PDF 1.1 MB  http://backontrack.org/docs/bat/Stewart.pdf

Twitter

Robert Dow ‏@Robert_Dow 2 minutes

BaT has gone belly up! Flawed project, no great surprise is it? > http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=9972.msg150602#msg150602 ... #qldpol #qldvotes

[ozbob]

^

Fairfax radio news have followed up, thanks   

[ozbob]

Parliament of Australia Hansard

http://bit.ly/1KIC5Pt

========================

Ms BUTLER (Griffith) (10:52): The 2008 Inner city rail capacity study found that the demand for train services during morning peak times in Brisbane will reach between 70,000 and 80,000 people by 2016. By 2026, modelling suggests that this will have increased to well over 100,000 people each and every day. If nothing is done, the rail network is anticipated to be at capacity, but there is a solution. The solution is not the solution that my colleague Anthony Albanese, the member for Grayndler, referred to as the Bombay solution, which was to just rip out seats in trains to fit more people in, as the previous LNP government attempted in Queensland. That is not the solution. It is also not the second-rate BaT tunnel—bus and train tunnel—that Campbell Newman proposed when the LNP was in government in Queensland. The solution is the Cross River Rail project, which is a project that would allow an extra 17,000 people to travel on the Brisbane rail network in the peak period.

The Cross River Rail project would have taken 14,000 cars off the road. Brisbane commuters lose about 11 million hours annually stuck in traffic, and I have been one of them myself. Congestion is really costly; it causes long travel times, heightened pollution and increased vehicle running costs, and all of those things affect the productivity of a city like Brisbane. Cross River Rail would have opened up more services from Brisbane's northern and western suburbs, as well as the Sunshine Coast and the Gold Coast.

It is an investment in Brisbane's future and it is shovel-ready. The feasibility study is done, thanks to the $20 million in funding from the previous federal Labor government back in 2009, when the former member for Griffith was the Prime Minister. The preferred route is done, the environmental impact study is done, and it was ticked off by the Queensland Coordinator-General. The Bligh Labor government in Queensland took the project to Infrastructure Australia in 2011 for independent analysis. In the 2011-12 financial year, Infrastructure Australia recommended the project to the federal government as ready to proceed, with a positive benefit-cost ratio of 1.41.

So what happened? Unfortunately, Tony Abbott happened. The Prime Minister happened. There had been an agreement reached between Commonwealth and the Newman government in Queensland to fund Cross River Rail. The announcement was ready to go, but the Commonwealth money—notwithstanding that it was in the budget—was pulled by the Abbott government on the week that it had been due to be announced by the then Premier, Campbell Newman.

Tony Abbott, when he was Leader of the Opposition, actually said that it was not the federal government's place to fund urban rail projects. You wonder why this government bothers having an infrastructure ministry. Why not just have a roads ministry, if this this government does not believe in funding rail. He said that the federal government should stick to its knitting—and the knitting is roads. How unbelievably short sighted, for someone who wants to be known as the infrastructure prime minister.

Research commissioned by the Australasian Railway Association in its 2014 study, TheValue of Action versus the Cost of Inaction, found that investing in rail to reduce road congestion in Brisbane would achieve the same reduction in congestion at only 57 per cent of the cost of road-based strategies. It was the former Labor government that lifted infrastructure investment from 20th in the OECD to first. This current government ought to have a commitment to infrastructure that includes rail infrastructure. It ought to put its funding and support behind urban rail, because urban rail reduces congestion, and reducing congestion aids and improves the productivity of our cities.

We have all seen the Grattan Institute research about the amount of time it takes for working people to get to the places where the jobs are, which tend to be in the CBD. Rail projects can assist with reducing that congestion and can help connect working people to jobs, which is what we need.

Thankfully, the former LNP state government has been replaced with a new Labor government, led by Premier Palaszczuk, and we have a wonderful new Queensland Minister for Transport and Infrastructure in the Deputy, Premier, the Hon. Jackie Trad MP, who is also within my electorate of Griffith. We now have a minister and a deputy premier in Jackie Trad who is prepared to stand up for the people of Brisbane. She understands just how important rail infrastructure is. She understands that the government ought to commit to ensuring that we have good, productive rail infrastructure.

The people of Queensland will not cop a failure to support the infrastructure needs of the future. The people of Queensland are very clear about what they want when it comes to the way that Queensland should work. A really good example is the comprehensive rejection of asset sales at the last election. I call on this federal government to start supporting rail infrastructure. (Time expired)

[colinw]

And there is the root cause of the whole problems.

In Australia, trains and tunnels are not vehicles and infrastructure for carrying people. No, not at all.

In Australia, they are instruments used to bludgeon your ideological opponents around the head.

[Stillwater]

We should use this statistic: "Research commissioned by the Australasian Railway Association in its 2014 study, The Value of Action versus the Cost of Inaction, found that investing in rail to reduce road congestion in Brisbane would achieve the same reduction in congestion at only 57 per cent of the cost of road-based strategies."

[hU0N]

But it's not a great statistic.  I mean, in a growth economy, the congestion reduction achieved by new road based infrastructure is, in the long run, 0%.  So this statistic implies nothing except that we could achieve this same 0% reduction 43% cheaper by building rail infrastructure.  You could also achieve a 0% reduction by building a 2ft gauge trolley next to the main line at a saving of say 75%.

It's not that it's wrong per se, infrastructure (even railways) ALWAYS has a 0% effect on congestion in the long run; but a better statistic would be the productivity improvement at full congestion for a road expansion vs a similarly priced rail expansion.  This statistic would actually show an improvement in a metric that people value, and it would actually capture the advantage of rail over roads.

Also, it would steer the conversation away from congestion as a metric.  This would be helpful because congestion is a road specific phenomenon (trains and busways by definition get full, not congested - unless they are incredibly poorly managed), and using a road specific metric only entrenches the roads first nature of the debate.

[Stillwater]

A start on construction of a new rail crossing of the Brisbane River won't occur before the 2022-23 financial year, according to the 2015 Major Projects Report published by the Queensland Major Contractors Association.  The report highlights the 'triple whammy' effect of a downturn in the mining sector, a slowdown of government investment in major infrastructure projects, as well as more prudent spending by private enterprise.

Report: http://www.qmca.com.au/files/documents/QMCA_MPR2015_Final_2_LOWRES.pdf

The report makes some heroic assumptions about which projects are 'probable' and 'expected'.

For CRR/BAT, or whatever it will be called now, circumstances have reduced its status from Australia's No. 1 top priority infrastructure project, funded and ready to proceed, to a feasibility study.  We must plan for major infrastructure projects far more efficiently and effectively in Queensland.

On the rail crossing, we are following a familiar path.  With critical capacity constraints occurring on the Merivale Bridge from 2018, we are on track to only START to address the problem six years later, with the final solution probably being delivered 10 years after it was due.

That is 10 years of chaos on the railways in SEQ.  The new government must articulate its plan for managing the issue.  Regrettably, the most likely thing we will be told is 'we are seeking funding from the feds', which is a Claytons solution really.

BrizCommuter's words ring true.  "It is critical for the new ALP government to get things moving, as funding needs to be sourced,  redesign will be required, and construction will need to start before they quite likely loose government in 3 years time. If things are not beyond the point of no return in 3 years, then we will probably just see a game of ALP vs LNP tunnel design ping pong going on for years and years. In the mean time, Brisbane's rail network will just get more congested, and network expansion to locations such as Flagstone and Caloundra/Maroochydore will be inhibited."

[ozbob]

Observations elsewhere suggest that Queensland Rail might be moving on improved signalling for the suburban network.  This will deliver some increase in capacity and hopefully improved reliability. It will not deliver the potential capacity increase of a second rail river crossing but will give some gains.

The other thing that must happen is proper bus network reform to allow a lot more cross connections and so forth.

There is plenty of unused capacity on the rail system out of peak of course, and I expect that there will be more aggressive fare structures to promote out of peak use.

Unless there are dramatic changes federally, I expect a second rail crossing is many years away if ever.

[#Metro]

BaT could return, better get 4 year fixed terms!

[#Metro]

It seems like even Sir Joh and Whitlam managed to co-operate on funding?

"The new bridge is aligned along Merivale St, hence the name, 'The Merivale Bridge'."

"The project was financed jointly by the Commonwealth and State Governments as part of the overall scheme for the electrification of Queensland's rail network."

"...The long awaited, Cross River Rail Link"

Video 13m:50s

[Stillwater]

New signalling certainly would tweak capacity on the tracks.  Going forward, what about the capacity of the Central Station concourse, platforms, gates and other facilities to cater for additional passengers during peak periods?  Chances are we won't have CRR for another 10 years.  (We have spent eight years of stop-start planning for the thing, with no resolution.)

CRR train stations down George Street would have drawn passenger movements away from Central.

What sort of impression is Queensland making on private enterprise that wants to do business with government in this state?  Most probably, it will take 11 years of planning for a major project (CRR), even before we START to build it, and we will deliver it, most probably, 10 years after it was needed.  (That is assuming it will ever be built.)

And now we are saying we could deliver an Olympic Games in 2028?  The IOC would look at the CRR fiasco and weep -- they would be asking whether Queensland can deliver what it says it can do.  If past practice is anything to go by, Queensland would get the 2028 games, then apply to the IOC to defer them until 2031 (the magic date by which all the transport woes were to have been fixed).  Or the state would stage those Olympic events for which facilities have been provided and stagger the rest out over 2 years.

That is the way we do transport in this state -- plan big with the glossy brochure, launch and video drive-through, fail to deliver on the promise, scale back, delay, redesign something for the 'here and now' (with no 'future-proofing' capacity built in), blame Canberra for the problems and re-scoping; build in stages on a financial drip-feed and finally deliver years after it was required.  The cycle repeats in another five years, as we go back to fix the inadequacies built into the project just completed.

At its busiest, Central Station barely caters for the numbers of people using it now, let alone in 10 years time.  It is a basement railway station not in keeping with the scale of a 21st Century city.  In practical terms, its passenger throughput capacity must be improved, or the pressure relieved by building CRR version 3, the BAT, or whatever.

[ozbob]

Not looking good is it ... 

[#Metro]

What sort of impression is Queensland making on private enterprise that wants to do business with government in this state?  Most probably, it will take 11 years of planning for a major project (CRR), even before we START to build it, and we will deliver it, most probably, 10 years after it was needed.  (That is assuming it will ever be built.)

What a waste of time and money! Messed up the bus network reform, messed up the rail projects!

I don't think this is because of the public servants - far from it. It is the very unstable political climate and politicians promising heaven will descend on Queensland.

Uncertainty like this has the potential to jack up costs a lot because plans can be scrapped, rescoped, redrawn etc.

4-year fixed terms will give some greater degree of stabilisation. As will some measure of taxing power (i.e. % cut from federal income tax, broadened land tax or some other state tax.)


I guess what can be done now is to do what Melbourne is doing and rip out seats from the fleet. Bus reform may also mean that less people have to drive to train stations as well. 

[ozbob]

I think I need to work on a plan to move to Emerald.  Puffing Billy is more frequent and reliable than much of the PT system in broader SEQ.  Generally steam hauled too for bit of a bonus ..   

[v6hilux]

Brisbane City Council has released a report;
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/brisbane-traffic-increasing-report-shows-20150317-1m1kgq.html

No mention of Beaudesert Rd or other key outer roads in that article, but surely this is more ammunition to get the CRR going to make rail more reliable and help gets cars off roads. Look at what happened the other day with the Bowen Hills OHW incident.

The actual report; http://www.brisbane.qld.gov.au/sites/default/files/congestion_reduction_unit_-_key_corridors_performance_report_-_jul_-_dec_2014_-_collateral_-_report_-_final_-_mar_2015.pdf

[ozbob]

^ thanks, discussion on this in roads >> http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=4767.msg154235#msg154235

[mufreight]

The recent system failure as a consequence of the overhead problems at BOWEN HILLS which brought the entire electrified network to its knees points to the need for an alternative routing through the CBD which Cross River Rail would provide.
It also points to the need for the separation of the power supplies between Albion and Roma Street, had the pairs of tracks through had this separation and Cross River Rail been in place the disruption could have been minimized.

[v6hilux]

I agree with ^,

The the whole Sydney electrified rail network has the OHW sectorised, including multiple sub-sectors within the all sectors. In my previous role as freight train Driver in Sydney, with electric locos up front, if I went a bit hard and "pulled the power" (it tripped out), providing I had enough speed and momentum (and stored air), I knew it was possible to roll ahead past the isolation gaps into the next sector and resume powering.

[ozbob]

Brisbanetimes --> BaT tunnel axing 'very disappointing'

[v6hilux]

Brisbanetimes --> BaT tunnel axing 'very disappointing'

We need to let this infant die! It was a corrupt LNP Paradigm! Can no one please ever utter or type this "Bat" sh%t ever again PLEASE. Campbell Newman might not be dead, but his toxic ideas should be laid to rest FOR EVER - PLEASE!

[ozbob]

The BaT is dead!  Gone belly up ..

[ozbob]

Bus network reform will deliver the B of BaT > http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=11047.msg154297#msg154297

North Quay and Victoria bridge can be made bus only.  [Cue screams of protest ... ]

It is time our elected representatives showed some real courage and starting acting in the best interests of the community.

CRR is back on.  Rail capacity improvements: core, north and south are needed not the lopsided nonsense pedalled by BaT compromises ...

[v6hilux]

Here, Here!

[dancingmongoose]

Brisbanetimes --> BaT tunnel axing 'very disappointing'

I think he's missed the fact that BaT has been replaced with CRR. If the BaT was gone with no alternative, yes that would be disappointing (aside from it's obvious pitfalls) because we do need a second rail crossing to help relieve congestion on both the rail and road networks. So I see his point but we can (hopefully) rest assured that a superior solution is set to be implemented

[techblitz]

if anyone has just watched abc24 you will have seen the prime minister re-iterate that heavy rail funding is solely responsibility of the states and suggests asset recycling to raise funds

[ozbob]

if anyone has just watched abc24 you will have seen the prime minister re-iterate that heavy rail funding is solely responsibility of the states and suggests asset recycling to raise funds

Abbott is on limited tenure ...

[#Metro]

Ugh, this is getting silly.

States should be funding their infrastructure, with taxing powers/block appropriation. None of the Commonwealth business nonsense. It delays major projects by years, it encourages cost inflation (as you can cost-shift to someone elses' budget) and opens the field to two levels of gov't to politicking (i.e. projects prioritised by marginal vote value rather than need - WasteConnex and East-Waste link examples).

Railways are mentioned in the Australian Consitution, under section 51:

The Parliament shall, subject to this Constitution, have power to make laws for the peace, order, and good government of the Commonwealth with respect to:

(xxxii)  the control of railways with respect to transport for the naval and military purposes of the Commonwealth;

(xxxiii)  the acquisition, with the consent of a State, of any railways of the State on terms arranged between the Commonwealth and the State;

(xxxiv)  railway construction and extension in any State with the consent of that State;


The word 'road' is not mentioned once in the constitution...

http://www.aph.gov.au/About_Parliament/Senate/Powers_practice_n_procedures/Constitution