On the Buses

[City Designer]

No it isn't. As with previous years a very limited service runs with only core routes running hourly.

Sunshine Coast: 600, 605 (every 90 to 120 minutes), 607, 610, 615 (every 90 to 120 minutes), 620, 631
Gold Coast: 700, 704, 705, 740, 750, 777

[verbatim9]

No it isn't. As with previous years a very limited service runs with only core routes running hourly.

Sunshine Coast: 600, 605, 607, 610, 615, 620, 631
Gold Coast: 700, 704, 705, 740, 750, 777

Call Translink

[Cazza]

Just a friendly reminder to anyone wanting to go Boxing Day shopping at DFO today, you cannot, I repeat, CANNOT get public transport there. Apparently the traffic congestion around the centre will be too much for buses (yet they haven't pulled 90% of the buses off Coro Dr during the evening peak or even bothered to put bus lanes or priority anywhere ) so buses simply will not service the centre. I mean I'm no qualified traffic demand researcher, but isn't the way to reduce traffic congestion to provide alternatives to driving in the first place? But surely a 1.2km walk to the nearest open bus stop on the 590 route is adequate hey?

https://translink.com.au/updates/73756

On Sunday 26 December, the following stops near the Skygate shopping mall will be closed due to Boxing Day traffic congestion.

During this time, if you travel on route 590, please use the alternative stop on Qantas Drive shown below.

[timh]

Just a friendly reminder to anyone wanting to go Boxing Day shopping at DFO today, you cannot, I repeat, CANNOT get public transport there. Apparently the traffic congestion around the centre will be too much for buses (yet they haven't pulled 90% of the buses off Coro Dr during the evening peak or even bothered to put bus lanes or priority anywhere ) so buses simply will not service the centre. I mean I'm no qualified traffic demand researcher, but isn't the way to reduce traffic congestion to provide alternatives to driving in the first place? But surely a 1.2km walk to the nearest open bus stop on the 590 route is adequate hey?

https://translink.com.au/updates/73756

On Sunday 26 December, the following stops near the Skygate shopping mall will be closed due to Boxing Day traffic congestion.

During this time, if you travel on route 590, please use the alternative stop on Qantas Drive shown below.

A good argument for the Skygate railway station. It's still probably a post-2036 thing though.

Sent from my SM-G780F using Tapatalk

[Paul B]

I recall either 2017 or 2018 trying to use the 590 from Toombul when it was running half hourly. The lineup must have been 100+ people
Drivers frantically calling control to try to get a sweeper but to no avail

[#Metro]

Mega fail!

Of course, no way to avoid the congestion by using PT... lol.

They couldn't use traffic control or temporary bollards?

[verbatim9]

It's like that on Anzac Day and Labour Day at Skygate as well. Worse because they are the only non-exempt stores allowed to open in Qld except for the Port Douglas area.

Cycling there from Toombul Station is quite doable and takes around 15mins. It's a segregated cycle path all the way.

[verbatim9]

Just a friendly reminder to anyone wanting to go Boxing Day shopping at DFO today, you cannot, I repeat, CANNOT get public transport there. Apparently the traffic congestion around the centre will be too much for buses (yet they haven't pulled 90% of the buses off Coro Dr during the evening peak or even bothered to put bus lanes or priority anywhere ) so buses simply will not service the centre. I mean I'm no qualified traffic demand researcher, but isn't the way to reduce traffic congestion to provide alternatives to driving in the first place? But surely a 1.2km walk to the nearest open bus stop on the 590 route is adequate hey?

https://translink.com.au/updates/73756

On Sunday 26 December, the following stops near the Skygate shopping mall will be closed due to Boxing Day traffic congestion.

During this time, if you travel on route 590, please use the alternative stop on Qantas Drive shown below.

A good argument for the Skygate railway station. It's still probably a post-2036 thing though.

Sent from my SM-G780F using Tapatalk

I have a feeling Skygate station will be fast tracked and built within the next 4 years.

[verbatim9]

I recall either 2017 or 2018 trying to use the 590 from Toombul when it was running half hourly. The lineup must have been 100+ people
Drivers frantically calling control to try to get a sweeper but to no avail

Another reason to ensure the Gold Glider runs from Woolloongabba to Skygate via Hamilton Northshore. The traffic approaching Skygate from the South is significantly less than from Toombul.

[#Metro]

They should just deregulate the trading hours, this is a joke!!

Hope this won't be on public view come Olympics. What will the reviews be like " nice city, everything closed at 5 pm"

[Jonno]

Just a friendly reminder to anyone wanting to go Boxing Day shopping at DFO today, you cannot, I repeat, CANNOT get public transport there. Apparently the traffic congestion around the centre will be too much for buses (yet they haven't pulled 90% of the buses off Coro Dr during the evening peak or even bothered to put bus lanes or priority anywhere ) so buses simply will not service the centre. I mean I'm no qualified traffic demand researcher, but isn't the way to reduce traffic congestion to provide alternatives to driving in the first place? But surely a 1.2km walk to the nearest open bus stop on the 590 route is adequate hey?

https://translink.com.au/updates/73756

On Sunday 26 December, the following stops near the Skygate shopping mall will be closed due to Boxing Day traffic congestion.

During this time, if you travel on route 590, please use the alternative stop on Qantas Drive shown below.

A good argument for the Skygate railway station. It's still probably a post-2036 thing though.

Sent from my SM-G780F using Tapatalk

Another example of how poor our city and transport planning is!  Development should have to show how 60%+ of trips will be by foot, bike or public transport...this include freight trips as well. Current approach is for a made-up low assumption will be by foot, bike or public transport (and there is a bus stop somewhere around the development) so rest must be by motor vehicle and we'll add 20% more to cover margin of error!   If we keep planning for driving then we keep getting congestion! 

[Paul B]

I thought gliders are only added to corridors with already good frequent services.

[HappyTrainGuy]

They should just deregulate the trading hours, this is a joke!!

Hope this won't be on public view come Olympics. What will the reviews be like " nice city, everything closed at 5 pm"

DFO is federal land. They do not have the same restrictions elsewhere. Dfo itself might have limitations they impose for shops there as half of the area seems to open at 10am or something compared to Woolworths there which is open 24/7 and some of the other businesses that share the same building also have longer trading hours. The problem there was the access. The only 2 roads in and out meet at the same point. More cars than parking spots. Chermside used to have this problem aswell. They got around it by installing more entrances. Paid parking at dfo also slowed down the speeds. Traffic backed up to Nudgee road and traffic backed up to Qantas drive and right turning traffic just continued on as there was no chance of turning right. Traffic from Toombul direction tried to avoid the congestion first by sneaking around the back way but met by a wall of traffic.

Having gliders going there would have the same problem. They would have got stuck in the same traffic jam. And a train station wouldn't help numbers in the slightest. It's the airport line and airport fares would apply. Not translink fares.

[#Metro]

Airport fares don't have to apply, they can do a Green Square NSW and pay a shadow toll to the operator for each touch on/off.

[HappyTrainGuy]

That was sorted prior to construction. And quite cleverly too. Especially after it went into administration. Once they got their finances in order after westpac turned them into a profit they wanted to renegotiate the revised "shadow" fee.

From what I remember no such clause was written into the QR/Queensland Government/Airport line contract. It's effectively their line until it transfers to state government. Something that everyone seems to forget when the dfo station keeps getting brought up since the line was built.

[timh]

That was sorted prior to construction. And quite cleverly too. Especially after it went into administration. Once they got their finances in order after westpac turned them into a profit they wanted to renegotiate the revised "shadow" fee.

From what I remember no such clause was written into the QR/Queensland Government/Airport line contract. It's effectively their line until it transfers to state government. Something that everyone seems to forget when the dfo station keeps getting brought up since the line was built.

This is why when I mentioned Skygate station above, I said it would be a post-2036 thing, when the BOOT agreement finishes. Won't happen under the current contract

Sent from my SM-G780F using Tapatalk

[HappyTrainGuy]

I know  but others seem to quickly forget that point and it keeps getting traction like a Polly and 7 car trains.

[ozbob]

Queensland Parliament

https://documents.parliament.qld.gov.au/tableOffice/questionsAnswers/2021/1580-2021.pdf

Question on Notice

No. 1580

Asked on 1 December 2021

MR S MINNIKIN ASKED MINISTER FOR TRANSPORT AND MAIN ROADS (HON M BAILEY)

QUESTION:

With reference to the future SEQ TransLink bus fleet—
Will the Minister provide the forecast total fleet size and the number of buses in the fleet that will
be zero-emission for each year between 2025 and 2050?

ANSWER:

I thank the Member for Chatsworth for the question.

The Palaszczuk Government has made a commitment that, from 2025, all new urban buses in
South East Queensland will be zero emissions buses. Implementation of zero emissions buses
for regional Queensland will begin between 2025–2030.

Currently, there are 2493 TransLink-funded buses in South East Queensland.

As each diesel bus is retired, it will be replaced with a zero emissions bus. Based on the existing
fleet replacement profile, the cumulative number of zero emissions buses for each year
commencing 2025 financial year is set out in the table below.

Financial Year Number of Zero Emission Buses (Cumulative)
2024–25 190
2025–26 350
2026–27 549
2027–28 779
2028–29 991
2029–30 1135
2030–31 1276
2031–32 1434
2032–33 1584
2033–34 1691
2034–35 1796
2035–36 1886
2036–37 1963
2037–38 2055
2038–39 2149
2039–40 2238
2040–41 2319
2041–42 2412
2042–43 2431
2043–44 2493
2044–45 2493
2045–46 2493
2046–47 2493
2047–48 2493
2048–49 2493
2049–50 2493

The Department of Transport and Main Roads is working with delivery partners across the State
to identify opportunities to accelerate the rollout of zero emission buses on the network.

[Cazza]

Some positive news today:

Spring Hill Loop - Weeknight and weekend services coming (https://translink.com.au/updates/78821)

From Monday 24 January the free Spring Hill Loop (route 30) will have more services on weeknights and weekends.

You can catch the free loop service between Brisbane City and Spring Hill:

- 6am to 9.30pm on weekdays
- 7.56am to 9.30pm on Saturdays
- 8am to 7pm on Sundays
These new weeknight and weekend trips are part of a two-year trial in conjunction with Brisbane City Council.

Plan your trip now with TransLink's journey planner, or call us anytime on 13 12 30 for more information.

Except the online timetable hasn't been updated yet so trip planning is a slight challenge.

Edit: Saturdays will run to a 20 min frequency but Sundays to a 19 min frequency. This appears to be due to the timetabled time to run the route with the required 4 min layover in between (15 mins to run it on a Sunday but 16 on a Saturday).

[verbatim9]

This was an election commitment by Grace Grace. Apparently they will be all electric services.

[Cazza]

Probably not by next Monday (unless I've completely missed something) but definitely in years to come.

[verbatim9]

Probably not by next Monday (unless I've completely missed something) but definitely in years to come.

That was the intention. The electric trial was meant to include the Spring Hill loop. They allocated money for it.

[verbatim9]

It's good that the buses are running again tomorrow to a Saturday timetable.

[Paul B]

on a lot of hourly routes, the Saturday timetable is very similar to the mon-fri one.

[verbatim9]

Central Ward update

Dear Central Ward Residents

We have just received updated information about public transport routes in our area tomorrow.

Unfortunately due to the ongoing flooding impacts across the city, buses in service will be operating on a reduced timetable, NOT a Saturday timetable .

It is unlikely the high frequency 196, 199, 470 and the Blue Glider services will resume in the morning.


Please continue to check the Translink Website for up to date timetable information – translink.com.au

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/TransLinkSEQ/status/1500622301360005124

[aldonius]

Gotta say, the Saturday timetable is NOT sufficient for UQ St Lucia, which is back in full swing as of today. Big queues everywhere.

[Cazza]

Not trying to downplay UQ (as we all know how busy it can get), but the Saturday timetable is not sufficient for anywhere really.

KG inbound stop this morning had 20+ waiting for a 345 around 8am, reports of another 345 around 7.30am crush loads, saw an inbound 390 full by Windsor Road, a 61 (eastbound) coming into Roma Street full, with a large number of people alighting and boarding again here, reports of a 184 being full by York St (and aside from some getting off at Coorparoo Junction) skipped every stop into the Gabba, saw an I/B 212 (which normally struggles to get more than 20 on board for most service) displaying a Sorry Bus Full desto at Mater Hill, an outbound 372 running this morning (even though it's a Saturday timetable and the website clearly states it does not run today...) and that's just what I've seen/heard this morning. My inbound 345 also terminated at KGS because the driver though the Vic Bridge was still closed...

This is all before you take into account that many areas (including the entire Eatons Hill/Albany Creek region, which has a bus every 10 mins or more during most of the AM peak) cannot make it into the CBD by 8:30am, with most areas having just 30 min or hourly peak frequency and some areas not having any sort of service at all! They say "extra services have been added". But they have not updated the online timetables or journey planners to reflect this. The only extra service I can confirm have seen today was an outbound 390 leaving Queen St at 7:10am (just 11 mins after the 6:59am service). It's almost a blessing it was running nearly 20 mins late and made the gap between 6:59am and 7:48am services slightly more consistent and logical. I did see a number of back to back inbound 111s, 120s, 150s, 180s and 222s this morning through South Bank and Mater, but cannot confirm whether they were bunching or extras. It would help if they were actually timetabled.

The workers are back, schools back, uni's (pretty much) back, yet for some reason, TfB aren't back. I understand that Sherwood depot went under and road closures, diversions and staff availability have made things difficult. But the sheer lack of reliable, basic and correct information (including the main page still being updated and changed at 12:30am the morning of... How is anyone supposed to be able to plan journeys around this??), really haphazard service coverage and completely inadequate service frequencies and resource allocation to cater for the spike in demand today (that really should be no surprise to anyone) has made this such a frustrating and exhausting experience for everyone.

It really does show just how poor the network is in terms of coverage/frequency vs population/demand and that it seems to me that people making these decisions don't really understand how the network is actually operating on the ground. Thursday Tomorrow can't come soon enough!

Edit: it appears the heavens have answered our calls.

[#Metro]

Light Rail running in a mix of Priority A and B is perfect for out to Eatons Hill. Can travel as fast as a train with similar station spacing and very good peak capacity but much more flexible with where the corridor can go and doesn't eat available train paths from across the region.

More expensive than line haul bus but won't flood the CBD with buses and will integrate with buses to form network patterns not possible with direct bus only systems.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Bahahahahaha. Rightio mate. FYI, the 2009 express train + inbound 338 got you to Eaton's Hill faster than the outbound 359 bus from Roma Street. Also this area isn't heavily Brisbane city focused making PT hard to establish. PT in Albany creek and Eaton's hill is sh%t house because it's all brisbane focused. Not enough services going north. Not enough services servicing locally and not enough services servicing Chermside/Prince Charles.

[#Metro]

Also this area isn't heavily Brisbane city focused making PT hard to establish.

I've heard a parade of barely believable excuses as to why "PT won't work here". Not just this corridor, but generally.

Culture, car-ownership, wealth/income, urban 'shape', habit.

The generalised transport cost equation is where the money is at. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalised_cost

* Walk from the origin (or connecting service)
* Wait for the vehicle
* Ride in the vehicle
* Walk to the destination

Density plays a role, but we already know what to do and how to adapt PT to function even at very low density. Follow the Perth model.

Application of a commuter railway to low density > https://www.bitre.gov.au/sites/default/files/2019-12/2009_infrastructure_colloquium_peter_martinovich.pdf

This area is a PT blackspot and the road is an arterial that is congested.

A fast and well connected linehaul PT with rapid transit spaced stops working with a cross-town bus network would do well in this corridor.

We need to stop thinking of Light Rail as as an expensive bus subsitute, and more like a more flexible version of heavy rail with a lower cost

and with a wider selection of corridors available than for heavy rail.

Northwest LRT Concept https://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=14508.0

[HappyTrainGuy]

You are going off track on an area you don't know about again. Having right of way is just beyond a stupid idea and has no direct benefit. Congestion is created because there is no other alternative to access infrastructure and services. There are suburbs with large density that has no pt services. You also have industrial areas where work hours are different than your normal 9-5 so there are more cars on the road over a longer period eg workers finish when school finishes and then you have trucks leaving the area too. PT can work in the area but it needs a full redesign. I don't want to know if this bus goes here or do I have to catch that bus because it's after 4pm during a school term or I don't get a bus because it is a school term. And then there's the frequency of hourly or 2 hourly with buses not running after 6pm (if you live in Eatons Hill and work at Strathpine shops to get home you have to travel via Roma street after 6). As I said there are too many different directions people want to travel with coverage provided by buses from another council (Albany Creek and Eaton's Hill are MBRC) in areas that people go to live with larger properties only to have developers come in. The same applies to the west and north of Strathpine where the peak hour bus frequency is 60 minutes. What use PT when your local bus is hourly during peak hour (wonder why park and rides keep expanding from Strathpine-Lawnton...).

Just look up the 338, 357 and 359 and see how you need to know all 3 bus routes just to travel between particular areas as they all swap between each other ie the 359 replaces the 338, 338 replaces the 359. And then the span of hours. It's a Fkn mess. This stems from Translink, brisbane city council and Thompsons. The same issue applies to Bald Hills. Just check out how the 326/327 operate and how the 338 during school terms, only without a cold front and if the wind is under 7 knots from the north north west will bypass Brendale industrial estate when workers are finished so it can go to Bald Hills.

Just look at this crap. This is what locals have to put up with. The 357/359 all swapping routes and destinations. It's worse than the 335 bypassing Chermside shopping centre during peak hour because they became 339 rockets.
https://translink.com.au/sites/default/files/acquiadam-assets/timetables/210712-357%2C359.pdf

You do not need all this fancy expensive voter right of way infrastructure. You just need a bloody PT network that you can easily use and gets you to where you want to go.

Just look at these terms and conditions about catching a bloody bus! This is why people avoid PT.

Please note
Route 338 observes all cityxpress stops along Gympie Rd, between Aspley Hypermarket and Chermside Interchange.
Explanations
- Bus does not travel via this location.
A During school terms, service travels via Craigslea High School. During school holidays journey times may vary by
approximately 8 minutes.
B During school terms, service travels via Eaton Hill and Albany Creek State Schools.
During school holidays, service arrives at Chermside approximately 10 minutes earlier.
C Service travels via Aveo Albany Creek Retirement Village.
D Service commences from Queen Elizabeth Dr (outside shopping centre).
* Public holidays - generally, a Sunday timetable will operate on most gazetted public holidays.

C Service travels via Aveo Albany Creek Retirement Village.
E Service travels via Aveo Albany Creek Retirement Village. During school terms, service travels via
Eaton Hill State Schools.

https://translink.com.au/sites/default/files/acquiadam-assets/timetables/180122-338.pdf

[#Metro]

Just confirming HTG, you don't want to see PT prioritised in this corridor, but want it to run in mixed traffic.

[HappyTrainGuy]

You don't always need dedicated infrastructure when you have a properly designed public transportation network. No terms and conditions to read a timetable. No last buses departing strathpine at 5.30pm. No more alternating 338/357/359 terminus locations. Buses heading to strathpine at decent times. Remember the Translink review had more coverage buses terminating at Enoggera. Want to go to the city then catch the train or transfer onto another hf route to the city.

[#Metro]

You don't always need dedicated infrastructure when you have a properly designed public transportation network. No terms and conditions to read a timetable. No last buses departing strathpine at 5.30pm. No more alternating 338/357/359 terminus locations. Buses heading to strathpine at decent times. Remember the Translink review had more coverage buses terminating at Enoggera. Want to go to the city then catch the train or transfer onto another hf route to the city.

So that's a No to prioritisation then.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Correct. No need for expensive right of way infrastructure when you can even get 3 buses to terminate at the same location. Trouts road would make any additional right of way for buses redundant anyway.

[#Metro]

I think Priority B is a good way for services to bypass congestion on the roads at a reasonable cost compared to Priority A busways or heavy rail. Priority B is used extensively in Melbourne and on the GC and ACT with trams and light rail, and it works well.

The priority is important to maintain high speed and reliability.

The more I get to see LRT projects on the GC, Newcastle, Sydney, Melbourne, the more I am convinced of the merits of getting Priority B and the capability of LRT to provide high quality rapid transit.

The western parts of Melbourne, which barely have any trams or LRT at all, and are almost all buses are a very different transport proposition to the rest of Melbourne and the areas that have trams in Priority B.

The same really goes for the rest of the busway network in Brisbane. I am starting to doubt that after 20 years that the busway
network will ever be "complete". The costs of busways are really the same as that for heavy rail and without the urban shaping benefits of rail and the capacity of buses.

There is also the 25% increase in patronage on the GC LRT corridor that happened even though the tram frequency is more or less the same as the combined bus corridor that it replaced.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Concentrate on fixing the current issues rather than these maglev trains from Geebung in the sky ideas.

[#Metro]

Concentrate on fixing the current issues rather than these maglev trains from Geebung in the sky ideas.

When PT is prioritised, it actually costs less to operate. Less staff hours, fewer vehicles, and more passengers are attracted (higher farebox). The customer experience is also much better.

Generally if a project is built, its benefits outweigh its costs. It is favourable to do.

Now that LRT has taken off in places like Canberra, Gold Coast, Newcastle, Adelaide, cities that are much smaller than Brisbane, we certainly can consider it.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Hahahaha. You can you even get fewer vehicles out this way. Costs less to operate but still doesn't attract users to make it a viable use of infrastructure expenditure which you seem to be glossing over the points I've made with the promise of build it and they will come. And costs less to operate is a very big statement given the 338 has a 0.5bph frequency (the 336/337/338 are the only buses that still operate to a frequency of 1 bus every 2 hours). Quick let's lrt the 314!! Why??? Because Newcastle did!! As per my original comment fix the network first. Then you can start addressing other infrastructure requirements and upgrades if the patronage and demand is there. There are far more corridors that deserve lrt. LRT in Eatons Hill, Brendale and Albany creek will not work. You could even argue 345 isn't worthy of LRT because of the topography and corridor requirements to enable it.