Route 199 Bowen Hills and 60 Hamilton Portside CityGlider (CONCEPT)

[#Metro]

Currently the 60 runs at 12bph in peak. You could dial that back to 6bph to ensure every ferry meets a bus and there is sufficient starting capacity, and then shift 6bph to North Shore. So in peak you'd have 12bph on the common section which is fine.

So both branches run at high frequency and supply is matched to demand.

This is your 'interlining' proposal?

Out of curiosity, I had a look at the Henrus map in a broader view. I'm wondering if the high crossing is a result of poor Route 230 bus service because route 230 - almost every single stop - shows high boarding and literally jumps out of the map.

Further, I am curious about whether demand for river crossing would drop (or increase?) if the 230 service was BUZzed or Glider-ed.

Either way, there is a clear need for bus 230 Bulimba improvements. One possibility is to send the CityGlider to Portside and extend the 230 just 2 km (5 min) from its terminus in the Valley to end at Teneriffe Ferry.

[aldonius]

Hi Aldonius,

Where is the stop level boarding data?

You were close, but not quite there. It's here:

https://www.data.qld.gov.au/dataset/go-card-transaction-data

(Henry's map derives from it in part.)

Currently the 60 runs at 12bph in peak. You could dial that back to 6bph to ensure every ferry meets a bus and there is sufficient starting capacity, and then shift 6bph to North Shore. So in peak you'd have 12bph on the common section which is fine.

I'm not sure if 6bph would be quite enough for the West End side, but it probably would. Big loss aversion moment to literally halve frequency though!

[#Metro]

What about just BUZzing the 230 and extending that to Teneriffe Ferry stop? Its only a 2 km (5 min) extension.

I'm not sure if 6bph would be quite enough for the West End side, but it probably would. Big loss aversion moment to literally halve frequency though!

Interlining is sensible, however, I would like an explanation of how that would be sold to BCC... 

[Gazza]

'm not sure if 6bph would be quite enough for the West End side

The Gold Glider services can run through to West End though and interline.

Out of curiosity, I had a look at the Henrus map in a broader view. I'm wondering if the high crossing is a result of poor Route 230 bus service because route 230 - almost every single stop - shows high boarding and literally jumps out of the map.

But I mean the 220 corridor stops on Richmond Rd pop out in green as well but I don't think that would be a glider.

One thing on that map is that a green dot is at most 1000 monthly boarding's, but a grey dot is at least 10000 monthly boardings.

So one grey dot is worth 10 green dots.

I think the 230 would do well from Hawthorne south, and would pick up some outbound demand along that corridor too, by virtue of the better frequency.

At the northern end it's a toss of the coin, but I think from the Oxford St commerical hub the ferry and Blue Glider will always regin supreme because its so much more direct and 10-20 mins faster.

The map below tells the story, but look at the sheer directness compared to the 230. Personally, If I lived there I would choose the more direct route, even if the 230 was a BUZ.

[Cazza]

But some would prefer a direct route rather than a double change. Either way, the 230 should be a BUZ to feed the ferry and provide a frequent route to/from the peninsula/inner Wynnum Rd/East Brisbane. Plus, not all patronage is heading into the CBD. Many transfers can be made at Woolloongabba and Mater/South Bank/Cultural Centre Stations are all big destinations in their own right. With how bad the traffic is along Wynnum Rd during peak hour and the sheer lack of bus priority, no wonder the ferry/60 option is so busy (but in saying that, traffic along Ann St isn't that great either).

[Gazza]

One other thing I might add. If the Gold Glider goes in, I would predict a change in behaviour at Apollo Rd and passengers there might start choosing to cross the river and get on the Glider for a quick trip into town.

Overall, post CRR and Brisbane Metro you might reconsider how the 230 and 235 work overall and there are a number of options.
Eg Servicing Morningside, Terminating at Wooloongabba, or turning up Main Avenue up the Storey Bridge.

But some would prefer a direct route rather than a double change

Who has to double change?

[verbatim9]

They have done extensive research on PT and Green double river crossings in that area. They have been extensively rejected by State and Local Governments.

Except for a small area in Bulimba the density is just not there to.warrant it. I also assume they have taken ABS census data into account on how much car ownership is in the area..

[Cazza]

Who has to double change?

Yeah I was meaning anyone transferring from the 230 but I didn't really think about getting the ferry from Apollo Rd to Teneriffe.

[Cazza]

TMR also conducted a "Transport and Congestion Study" for the Bulimba Peninsula a few years ago, whatever that means...

https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/projects/bulimba-peninsula-transport-and-congestion-study

Where to next for the Bulimba Peninsula

A lot is already happening around the Bulimba Peninsula. The Queensland Government recognises that it needs to respond where it can and support BCC as it seeks to address these challenges.

Some works to improve on known traffic hotspots are already underway, such as the upgrades to Wynnum Road.

The Queensland Government is committed to continuing to work with BCC and other stakeholders to improve outcomes for residents and visitors within the Peninsula.

We would like to thank all the stakeholder and community members who were involved and crucial to the development of this study.

I mean, provide more frequent transport services and bus lanes down Wynnum Road would be a good start.

[SurfRail]

^ https://seqtransit.henrus1.com/

Currently the 60 runs at 12bph in peak. You could dial that back to 6bph to ensure every ferry meets a bus and there is sufficient starting capacity, and then shift 6bph to North Shore. So in peak you'd have 12bph on the common section which is fine.

So both branches run at high frequency and supply is matched to demand.

^ The only annoying thing is there probably isn't a way to have a common inbound stop for both services at the Gasworks - you'd have to pick either the existing Cityglider stop or Stop 9 in front of Energex.  That's no different to now of course.

[SurfRail]

They have done extensive research on PT and Green double river crossings in that area. They have been extensively rejected by State and Local Governments.

Except for a small area in Bulimba the density is just not there to.warrant it. I also assume they have taken ABS census data into account on how much car ownership is in the area..

That's replacing the existing ferry connections with bridges though, which I don't think anybody is suggesting.  The main issue with that is cost due to the need to keep the river navigable downstream of the CBD, which requires high spans.

I would take the 230, chop off the bit outbound from the Bulimba ferry, and link the rest of it to the 235.  (I'm reticent to ever suggest bandaid patches like this of course, the whole system needs to be burned to the ground and started again from scratch - in particular, we need to get past the obsession with branding things over just delivering competent service.)

[#Metro]

Has the Bulimba report been released?

[Gazza]

They have done extensive research on PT and Green double river crossings in that area. They have been extensively rejected by State and Local Governments.

Except for a small area in Bulimba the density is just not there to.warrant it. I also assume they have taken ABS census data into account on how much car ownership is in the area..

Dont really care. I didn't even mention bridges so don't sidetrack the discussion please.

[#Metro]

I would take the 230, chop off the bit outbound from the Bulimba ferry, and link the rest of it to the 235.  (I'm reticent to ever suggest bandaid patches like this of course, the whole system needs to be burned to the ground and started again from scratch - in particular, we need to get past the obsession with branding things over just delivering competent service.)

That's an interesting idea. Another possibility is to revive the loop-back to Morningside (?) train station.

They have done extensive research on PT and Green double river crossings in that area. They have been extensively rejected by State and Local Governments.

Except for a small area in Bulimba the density is just not there to.warrant it. I also assume they have taken ABS census data into account on how much car ownership is in the area..

A green bridge makes sense - those transferring CityCat passengers could just walk or scoot over. And that high-voltage transmission line between Bulimba an Teneriffe (which probably should have been removed in the 1980s) could make the river crossing in cables and ducts attached to the new bridge. That suggests that perhaps Energex would be happy to pay some of the cost.

Forever grateful to RBOT members who assisted with mapping.

[SurfRail]

^ There's a reason those cables are so high - any footbridge would be the same height.  The ferry is going to be staying there for the foreseeable future.

[#Metro]

What about a bridge that opened up in the middle?
The cable would have to go underwater or very high above.

https://youtu.be/fXvX61ZkoJU