Petition: Extend Kuranda Scenic Rail to locals with public transport prices!

[ozbob]

Petition

Extend the Kuranda Scenic Rail to locals with public transport prices!

https://www.change.org/p/queensland-rail-extend-the-kuranda-scenic-rail-to-locals-with-public-transport-prices

Cairns and Kuranda locals would like Queensland Rail to supply a train with local prices to alleviate the Kuranda range traffic.  As a rail system that has only supported tourists for many years, it does not reflect public need.

Young people are missing out on the history of this railway, the elderly are trapped in Kuranda as they won't drive the range, the wild life is also not being protected. There have been 3 Cassowaries killed on the Kuranda range in 3 months...and there are regular road accidents.

With a train often empty (including Covid restrictions), and lack of alternatives, a train targeted at locals would contribute to public transport options for locals and encourage movement and business economy.  But more than this, it would also add to the tourist experience, of seeing locals interact, travel and participate in their community. People who move to the area could also catch it and go to work in Cairns or Kuranda!

Looking ahead, there is the possibility to generate employment.  Cairns has grown, and the tablelands area requires less traffic on the road!

As it is one of the most beautiful rail transits in Australia, should it only be accessible to tourists?

Local health and well-being in the age of Covid 19 require the Queensland Transport Minister to re-evaluate Queensland Rail options for the 'Kuranda Scenic Rail' ASAP!

Please join our group action @ APT Kuranda - Affordable Public Transport Kuranda on Facebook for updates!  ** Note** State in your comments how often you would use the rail if this was an optimal service! thankyou!

[ozbob]

Facebook > https://www.facebook.com/groups/1712489639025541

[ozbob]

The Express --> Kuranda transport option gathers steam

The petition was started by Mercy Graham after she moved from Kuranda to Cairns for work due to the lack of public transport options. Mercy said she keeps watching the Kuranda Scenic Rail roll past empty every day and thought it was a waste.

"I decided to start a petition, to get some regular transport options between Kuranda and Cairns for locals," she said

"It needs to be an affordable option, at the moment Queensland Rail offers 20 per cent off for locals which is still about $40.00 one way."

In its first week, the petition had garnered over 1000 signatures and Mercy said they would like to get over 3000 signatures.

"With the train often empty and a lack of alternatives, a train targeted at locals would contribute to public transport options for locals and encourage movement and business economy," she said

"We are hoping for a couple of carriages or for some new services that would transport locals from Kuranda and surrounds to their workplace in Cairns.

"We want Queensland Rail to offer these services at the same rates that you would normally charge people to get on a bus, we are looking for public transport prices."

Mercy claims that many older people are afraid to travel on the range and that younger people are missing out.

"Some kids are excluded because they can't attend sporting events or access The Esplanade or the movies, while the train goes direct to Cairns Central," she said.

"It would allow Cairns people to come up for the day at their own leisure and also allows residents in Kuranda to spend more time in Cairns.

"Let's give it a test and see what people need."

Ms Graham said other options could be rolled out later if the train proved to be a success.

"If there was a late train, people in Kuranda could experience the bars and restaurants in Cairns and still get the train home, it would change the whole landscape," she said. 

"The Kuranda range is stifled and dangerous, a lot of locals are nervous to drive it."

Ranjini Rusch who runs the Affordable Public Transport Kuranda Facebook page said that traders still wanted the tourist trade but locals needed cheap and reliable transport between Cairns and Kuranda.

"The infrastructure is already there, it's a win win situation, it will take pressure of the range, it will allow people to commute, it will encourage more people from Cairns to visit Kuranda and it will also help the local cassowary population that is currently being decimated by traffic," she said

"The current transport options have disengaged Kuranda from the Cairns community.

"Everyone we have spoken to has been in favour of the idea."

Ms Graham and Ms Rusch said they both had fond memories of catching the train to Cairns to go to school nearly 30 years ago.

"We don't have easy access to Cairns or vice-versa," she said

"People have been talking about this for a while and because it's owned by Queensland Rail people have put it into the too hard basket.

"If we can spend billions on road infrastructure we can spend a little on maintaining the rail line."   

Mareeba Shire Mayor Angela Toppin said using the Kuranda Scenic Railway for public transport was a matter for the state government.

"This is entirely a matter for the Queensland government and Queensland Rail to consider in association with the costs and logistics for providing such a service to the public," she said.

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1327874923470020609

[verbatim9]

That train tales along time from point to point. Better bus frequency would be better.

I also think the Kuranda scenic rail should be electrified.

[red dragin]

I also think the Kuranda scenic rail should be electrified.

Why would you want to ruin such a spectacular trip with overhead wiring? Plus QR would need to purchase electric locos etc

[verbatim9]

Famous scenic railways are electrified in Switzerland. No issues there with electrification.

[red dragin]

They are a bit more than just a tourist railway doing two trips a day. Many of them require a mixture of diesel and electric motive power.

Kuranda would require two or three locomotives, which would be unique in their fleet.

Works fine with diesel now, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[ozbob]

Electrification for a short section will not happen.

I think there is some merit allowing locals access to the train at usual public transport fare rates and I have signed the petition. 

Believe or not, when Puffing Billy is running locals can access those services for transport.

The locomotives used on the services are usually 1720 Class Diesel Electric Locomotive with special liveries.



https://www.ksr.com.au/History/Pages/Rollingstock.aspx

[HappyTrainGuy]

Electrification hahahahaha

[ozbob]

Kuranda Scenic Railway | Freshwater station to Kuranda | Cairns, Queensland

2019

[Gazza]

Famous scenic railways are electrified in Switzerland. No issues there with electrification.

Hey Verbatim do you just suggest electrification no matter how quiet the line is or something?

[Gazza]

That all said the petition is pearl clutching a bit.
But it's not like locals are trapped on the mountain itself.

The train takes 2h, the shuttle bus local transport takes just over an hour
http://bowentransit.com.au/bus-services/cairns-kuranda

So its more like there is probably some local who likes trains and is trying to get it cheap rather than use the bus.

Ooooh this is an area i can speak to given i sometimes do business cases for attraction projects.

Fundamentally the Kuranda Scenic railway is a tourist attraction first, and a mode of transport second.
It is bad that trains are running empty at the moment, but to fix that it should be a temporary price point of say $20 to get some locals to go once or twice.

But if you priced at at public transport prices ($3-6) then you'll permanently devalue the attraction, people wont appreciate that its an expensive to maintain railway through a fragile environment that literally does require $40 to remain viable, and it'll never recover from such a hit.

It can definitely exist as a tourist attraction with minimal subsidy.
Can it exist as a lumbering heavily subsidised public transport service to a town of 3000? No, you'll kill it doing that.
Once the discount is in place, it will be politically impossible to remove it.

Better to weather the storm and maintain it as a premium experience you combine with skyrail.

[BrizCommuter]

Ludicrous idea. I don't think there is a passing spot along the line anyway for extra services, and the tourist trains are in the opposite direction to commuter travel. A bus would be faster and cheaper - and that already exists.

[red dragin]

Stony Creek station has a loop available, it's only about 400m long. Maybe with a RM2000 you might be able to run a commuter service, but the bus is quicker and cheaper to operate.

[ozbob]

I think they just want to be able to travel on the KSR trains.  The proposal has a fair bit of traction locally, good luck to them!

I think a few locals travelling at a reduced fare is not going to really matter to the overall operation.

Airport staff get reduced fares on the BNE Airtrain.  Doesn't cause any issues that I am aware of.

[Gazza]

I think they just want to be able to travel on the KSR trains.  The proposal has a fair bit of traction locally, good luck to them!

I think a few locals travelling at a reduced fare is not going to really matter to the overall operation.

Airport staff get reduced fares on the BNE Airtrain.  Doesn't cause any issues that I am aware of.

Why aren't they using the buses.

Are we really going to start subsidising another mode of transport (and in fact undermining the bus service) to coddle them?

[verbatim9]

They need to market the buses better. Maybe give the locals that have a Cairns residential address or Kuranda one a discount if they would like to use the train on occassions? It's a nice trip but it takes a very long time. It's not really suited for commuting. Electrification of the line should be an emissions goal. I am sure there are electric locomotives today that are equivalent to diesel locomotives that could be used?

[verbatim9]

^^Offer the discount a couple times a year

[Gazza]

They need to market the buses better. Maybe give the locals that have a Cairns residential address or Kuranda one a discount if they would like to use the train on occassions? It's a nice trip but it takes a very long time. It's not really suited for commuting. Electrification of the line should be an emissions goal. I am sure there are electric locomotives today that are equivalent to diesel locomotives that could be used?

The installation of the electrification system in itself produces emissions through the production of the new locos, masts, cables and systems, and emissions during construction.

On a quiet line, the pollution saved from removal of diesel is never able to offset the pollution created in the electrification process.

On a busy line, you do save a lot of diesel over time.

But the Kuranda Scenic Railway is only two trips per day, so you can imagine how long the benefit would take to accumulate.

[verbatim9]

It won't be a diesel line forever despite the cost based ratio for electrification.

[Gazza]

Yes it will.

Australia has thousands of kilometres of railway that will never be electrified.

At most we might see battery tech used on some, but you living in dreamland if you think there is someone out there that wants to pay for electrification to kuranda.

[ozbob]

Beautiful line ..

This video shows highlights of the climb up the famous Kuranda range behind QR's restored steam locomotive BB18¼
July 1999

[HappyTrainGuy]

With all due respect that's a complete and total load of bullsh%t for a electrification excuse that's just p%ssing money away. Especially when some of the rollingstock used - such as the rail motors - extends past Kuranda. The area is also prone to landslides. On top of that is higher mtce costs for the ohle and the electricial outlay/substations required for powering the overheads. Then comes the electric locomotives. The 3900 class that remain that aren't converted are instantly out due to dimensions and that's before you consider that aurizon still owns them. Not to forget the tunnel height clearances. Now comes spare locomotive parts and facilities to service/stow them. Then you have the recovery vehicles required for retrieving dead rollingstock. And I can just keep going and going. It's a pie in the sky dream if you think you can justify electrification of the line.

But please feel free to justify why it should be electrified.

[verbatim9]

There is not hundreds of km to to electrify. Thus its plausible to electrify a short important piece of infrastructure especially being a major tourist attraction. This will showcase to the world that we are serious of cleaning up transport emissions for commuting, long distance travel and tourism.

The fast rail map doesn't include Beaudesert either  :conf

That's because its just going to OOL, WTB and MCY Having all four Airports connected will ensure airfare and airport competition well into future for Se Qld.

Its not going to WTB, just the same as Kuranda isn't getting electric rail.

Time to separate fact from fiction

This will happen in time as pressure builds for further electrification of rail within the State including short tourists lines. Over time electrification will be cheaper than importing fuel for Transport.

[Gazza]

By what year do you expect to see electrification to Kuranda?

[JimmyP]

By what year do you expect to see electrification to Kuranda?

2550.

Honestly, the closest that the Kuranda line will get to being electrified will be a hybrid/battery loco type operation. But even that is years away at this point.

[Otto]

I also think the Kuranda scenic rail should be electrified.

I cannot agree with that.

When I stayed in Kuranda some 35 years ago, I remember being able to purchase a ticket at Kuranda station to commute down to Cairns for the day and return late afternoon. It certainly was a hell of a lot cheaper than the tourist tickets. From what I just read, that may no longer be the case. Pity.

[SurfRail]

I can definitely see the possibility of battery electric locomotives in the longer run (the DELs won't last forever), but OHLE is just fanciful - even if the wires eventually did make it all the way up to Cairns.

Leaving aside the investment needed, there would be next to no clearance for it for most the way up.

I see no reason why the bus service up to Kuranda can't be at least hourly, and why there can't be more frequent than current services to the Tablelands.  The bus will bring you "straight" (relatively speaking) down the range to the Smithfield shops.  Maybe it just needs to run from Smithfield to Kuranda - the service from Smithfield to the CBD is already pretty decent so no need to duplicate it.

[verbatim9]

I can definitely see the possibility of battery electric locomotives in the longer run (the DELs won't last forever), but OHLE is just fanciful - even if the wires eventually did make it all the way up to Cairns.

Leaving aside the investment needed, there would be next to no clearance for it for most the way up.

I see no reason why the bus service up to Kuranda can't be at least hourly, and why there can't be more frequent than current services to the Tablelands.  The bus will bring you "straight" (relatively speaking) down the range to the Smithfield shops.  Maybe it just needs to run from Smithfield to Kuranda - the service from Smithfield to the CBD is already pretty decent so no need to duplicate it.

I agree a bus service should be improved especially on Saturdays which is market day. Electric buses should be trialled on the 850 route as well. I wonder if that line is getting smart ticketing? "I am pretty sure". With electric buses, smart ticketing in place and real time arrivals patronage should improve over time.

[ozbob]

Petition update:

https://www.change.org/p/extend-the-kuranda-scenic-rail-to-locals-with-public-transport-prices-tmrqld-kurandaneedsatrain-qldrail-queenslandrail-kurandaneedsatrain-queensland/u/28114774

We have had some positive feedback from Local Government!

NOV 24, 2020 —

Thankyou again for keeping up the discussion and promoting this petition!

We have had contact from Michael Healy- ALP Cairns last week, who said he will discuss this issue with Craig Crawford - ALP Barron River. 

This morning Craig Crawford's PA Suzanne, called and our view on all the issues including the Barron River Bridge and the safety of Kuranda locals on the range were discussed.  We were told that our ideas will be put forward as a matter of discussion to QLD TMR in a meeting scheduled for mid December. 

Suzanne agreed that traffic as an issue must be addressed, and that train travel as an option to get people off the road makes sense, and that she will sign the petition!

It was made clear that waiting on this issue could prove to be too late. We can only hope that in the meeting, state government make the decision to provide funding for this issue, and include lowering prices of public transport on current rail travel before Xmas!

Keep signing and sharing - this is working!

Thankyou,

APT Kuranda

#KurandaNeedsaTrain

[achiruel]

The obsession with electrifying this service is bizzare. Yes, the DELs will reach EOL eventually. They could be replaced with battery-electric or hydrogen fuel cell locos in time. However the emissions of this line would be such a tiny proportion of GHG emissions in Australia it's barely even worth thinking about.

Attention would more beneficially focused on road transport and stationary energy, as that's where the overwhelming amount of reductions can be made. Together, these contribute over 60% of Australia's GHG emissions. Rail transport is about 4%, and the majority of that will be from main line freight locos. Electrifying a handful of scenic rail lines would be an absurd amount of investment for extremely minimal returns.

[ozbob]

The Kuranda Paper December 2020 / January 2021

LOCALS ASK FOR KURANDA SCENIC RAIL USE AT PUBLIC TRANSPORT PRICES!

Page 4  https://cebf246e-80cb-42a2-87eb-94c7cb7677f4.filesusr.com/ugd/f0cb2f_6df5fb505a4b45afbcc9d7c3f099fb77.pdf

LOCALS ASK FOR KURANDA SCENIC RAIL USE AT PUBLIC TRANSPORT PRICES!
Story by Mercy Graham and Ranjini Rusch

Recently, Affordable Public Transport (APT) Kuranda set up a petition managed by long-term local residents, Mercy Graham and Ranjini Rusch. A Facebook group was created in response to frustration around the Kuranda Scenic Rail trains being regularly empty, and with the idea to propose Queensland Rail and Kuranda Cairns Steam, who manage KSR, to review the provision of accessible and affordable transport between Kuranda and Cairns for locals.

There is awareness that Kuranda village has stimulated tourism revenue to the region, with an underlying belief that now is time for local and state government to address the social exclusion, danger to wildlife, and congestion of road traffic by finding viable alternative solutions to travelling on the Kuranda Range Road. By re-establishing the public rail commute between Cairns and Kuranda, and possibly the Tablelands region, many locals see it as a possible solution to current problems. Many positive comments were received in support of the return of public rail transport, expressing appreciation of the possibility to travel to TAFE, University, schools, health appointments, employment prospects, sporting facilities, gym, leisure and cultural activities, and allow general access to the Cairns CBD. Young people could utilise the skatepark, playgrounds, lagoon, movies and other activities not available in Kuranda. It would also free up the Range Road, while bringing many more local visitors to support small business, both in Kuranda and Cairns.

Those signing the petition (almost 2,000 on 18/11/20) believe it is such an obvious solution to the increase of traffic on the Range. The death of cassowaries, increase of roadworks, regular road accidents and now the uncertainty of repairs to the degrading Barron River Bridge in Kuranda, reveal there is no better time than now to do a feasibility study. In conversation with Mercy Graham, Mareeba Mayor Angela Toppin agreed that there is a real traffic issue on the Range Road, and she appeared open to ideas of rail access, but confirmed TMR (Department of Main Roads) would be the integral decision makers. There was confirmation of a recent conversation with TMR, previous to the APT petition, but that was mainly in regard to cassowaries and road traffic. Mayor Toppin then said Barron River MP Craig Crawford is usually quick to make contact on Kuranda topics, however APT is yet to receive a response from him on this matter.

Comparative QR prices Babinda – Gordonvale for a 36km adult fare is $20, while Kuranda to Cairns on Kuranda Scenic Rail is 37km, and currently a $76 return single fare. Although not the same terrain, prices should be affordable for family travel, and reflect the needs of public transport. A short term proposal would be for the scenic rail to offer two local carriages at public transport prices, like the previous 'silver bullet', and possible early morning and late afternoon commutes to allow people to utilise the rail service for work, or until long term solutions such as light rail, can be investigated.

The main purpose of the petition is to reignite interest in an affordable public rail network utilising the KSR. Recognising that many prefer the convenience of driving, there is still a belief that if a service was in place it would be utilised, particularly by those who for whatever reason, could not or do not want to travel the Range Road.

Other comments within the discussion have suggested the solution should rest with the Mareeba and Cairns councils, as Kuranda Cairns Steam, Skyrail and QR have a direct interest and monopoly over tourist transport to Kuranda, which has long revealed a conflict of interest.

The question is: shouldn't local councils be promoting all means of transport in the interest of their residents? QR own the tracks, but are not going to promote tourism for Kuranda unless it generates revenue. Tourism cannot be the only reason why a service is in operation. It is simply unfair, and does not address community needs. There is also the notion that as previous Minister for Fire and Emergency Services, Craig Crawford would be aware, extra options of transport are beneficial to isolated communities, in regard to safety and evacuation in a crisis.

With current long-term delays of international travel, and lack of tourist economy, now more than ever, governing bodies should reinforce public transport to keep commerce dynamic within the Cairns and Tablelands region. Locals supporting Locals.

Another issue that has been ignored, is in regard to youth access and safety. Young people need the autonomy of being able to participate in activities in the Cairns region without having to rely on lifts from family and friends. There has been recurring anger and criticism of the anti-social behaviour of young people in Kuranda, without the understanding that they are limited in their ability to contribute, or have meaningful participation within the community, due to travel distances, lack of available services and a focus on commerce in the village, rather than community. There are many Kuranda locals who believe the young people of Kuranda have been forgotten and blamed for their behaviour, without any real understanding of the marginalisation that has occurred. Improved transport options could be a meaningful solution to some of these problems.

The elderly are also limited in the ability to travel and many will not drive the Range Road, or when they do are tailgated by younger drivers, a danger to all on the road. Access to services is necessity for a community to thrive, and the infrastructure is already there, and currently represents an underutilised public asset. With thoughtful review it could improve the lives of many people. APT Kuranda hope to gain support for a full feasibility study. Thanks to all who have supported, signed and shared the petition. Please continue with social media coverage to promote the petition, before submission to the QLD Minister of Transport and Main Roads, Mark Bailey. Petition forms are available on APT Facebook group for anyone who would like to download and collect signatures. Thank you!

UPDATE: Mark Bailey asked QR to respond. "Locals, with I.D, can receive 20% off KSR fares until 11 December 2020. No other travel options have been considered at this stage and any changes to the timetabling and fare structures of public transport services across Queensland would require consideration by the Department of Transport and Main Roads."

Petition: www.change.org/Use_Kuranda_Scenic_Rail_for_public_transport APT Facebook group: www.facebook.com/groups/1712489639025541/?ref=share

[ozbob]

Update > https://railbotforum.org/yourls/i

[Gazza]

Why doesn't that post once mention the bus service?

[SteelPan]

Re Gazza

Back on Track should STOP supporting BUS transit, period - or, start a new site "Back on the Bus!"

Back on TRACK!

Also, newgen trains in North Qld would help pilot the way forward for a post 2035 introduction of "Sprinter" trains on the Darling Downs, after Brisbane/Toowoomba fastER rail.

[verbatim9]

The Kuranda line in its present state is just not suited for commuters. An improved electric bus service preferably integrated with smart ticketing in the future would be the way to go to and from Kuranda.  I would like to see the Kuranda tourist rail line electrified this decade though and light rail with in Cairns servicing Cairns Airport as well.

[achiruel]

You don't want any more train services to use the Kuranda line but you want to spend $$$ electrifying it and on overhead maintenance when there's far more important lines to electrify. I'm sure there's logic in there somewhere, but I can't spot it.

[Gazza]

Re Gazza

Back on Track should STOP supporting BUS transit, period - or, start a new site "Back on the Bus!"

Back on TRACK!

Also, newgen trains in North Qld would help pilot the way forward for a post 2035 introduction of "Sprinter" trains on the Darling Downs, after Brisbane/Toowoomba fastER rail.

You cant get a bus down every street, and in mountainous locations buses are often faster due to being able to climb steeper grades.

[ozbob]

Cairns Post --> New call for local access to Kuranda's ghost train $

KURANDA bridge safety concerns, traffic delays and the eye-watering cost to operate a near empty Kuranda Scenic Railway train has prompted renewed calls for a commuter train service between the rainforest village and Cairns.

In new figures released by Queensland Rail it has been revealed the twice daily tourist train service through the Barron Gorge National Park cost $1.5m per month to operate.

Pre-COVID the service was generating $1.2m per month in revenue. ...