Direct Sunshine Coast Rail Line (was CAMCOS, North Coast Connect)

[#Metro]

I'm cool with a one-station spur link to Caloundra as an initial stage.

We've discussed it before on the forum. It's not perfect but it is an improvement.

It has merit, and the Springfield Line was built more or less like this.

[RowBro]

I'm cool with a one-station spur link to Caloundra as an initial stage.

We've discussed it before on the forum. It's not perfect but it is an improvement.

It has merit, and the Springfield Line was built more or less like this.

Hopefully not just one station. There needs to be one at Aura too.

[Fares_Fair]

The athletes village will be in Maroochydore.
Maroochydore is where it needs to go.

[RowBro]

The athletes village will be in Maroochydore.
Maroochydore is where it needs to go.

Of course. We definitely need to continue to advocate for it! At the end of the day though, if it comes to it and it's only built to Caloundra (for now) it would still be a great step in the right direction.

[Fares_Fair]

No, it would be an increased traffic disaster for the already congested Nicklin Way.
Anyone who lives here would know that.

[RowBro]

No, it would be an increased traffic disaster for the already congested Nicklin Way.
Anyone who lives here would know that.

If such a scenario were to happen, we'd definitely have to advocate for a high frequency bus connection between the train station and Maroochydore. I agree. It definitely isn't the ideal solution and I by no means support only extending to Caloundra. I'm just stating that in a circumstance where that was the only thing the Government was willing to fund for now, it would be a good step towards a proper rail link to Maroochydore.

[Stillwater]

Caloundra in the first stage might be politically pleasing (helps a mate), but would cause its own problems congestion-wise. It should be resisted as a compromise. Caloundra hardly has free-flowing traffic at the best of times.

DSCL to Caloundra only would be like designing a pair of pants with no material at the back to cover one's arse.

If the federal budget was a house, the DSCL project clings to the windowsill by its fingernails.

[Gazza]

No, it would be an increased traffic disaster for the already congested Nicklin Way.
Anyone who lives here would know that.

Since you have local knowledge, why would a part rail extension increase Nicklin way congestion?

Note, obviously i want it all the way to Maroochydore (For the benefit of the public)
The link wont be used by athletes from the village during the games since they always get their own buses with appropriate security measures etc.
But of course the housing left behind after the games will need PT to serve it.

[ozbob]

I have grave doubts that the DSCL will be done by 2032.  Be lucky to be finished by 2040.

That is the reality of pushing it back out in the forward estimates.

[ozbob]

Caloundra in the first stage might be politically pleasing (helps a mate), but would cause its own problems congestion-wise. It should be resisted as a compromise. Caloundra hardly has free-flowing traffic at the best of times.

DSCL to Caloundra only would be like designing a pair of pants with no material at the back to cover one's arse.

If the federal budget was a house, the DSCL project clings to the windowsill by its fingernails.

You have such a nice way with words Mr Stillwater!   

[Stillwater]

Sunshine Coast Mass Transit Action Group's reaction:

https://www.facebook.com/SCMassTransit

[JimmyP]

I don't think length correlates with construction time though, you can have multiple works packages a longer project.
Just a matter of how busy the industry is. Hopefully with CRR winding up they could have crews go onto this and LCGFR.

I respectfully disagree.
I work in the Engineering Construction industry.
Both Springfield line and Redcliffe Peninsula line took 3 years to build (construction time only - not planning) around 13km of track, both at 4.3km/year.

MBRL was 6 years total including planning time, from when Prime Minister Julie Gillard signed off on it in 2010 to opening in October 2016.
The first tranche of Federal money is due in 2026 FY.

You reckon this mob could build 37km of track in less than 6 years at 6.2km/year.
B2N heavy rail works haven't even started 4 years after it was first funded.

It would take a miracle of manpower and skill.

While I don't disagree with the general sentiment, the Charmichael Rail Line for the Adani mine up north was 87km built in 19 months. Granted, diesel only line, mostly single track and block worked safeworking, but it does show the construction works can be done quickly when need be.

[Fares_Fair]

I don't think length correlates with construction time though, you can have multiple works packages a longer project.
Just a matter of how busy the industry is. Hopefully with CRR winding up they could have crews go onto this and LCGFR.

I respectfully disagree.
I work in the Engineering Construction industry.
Both Springfield line and Redcliffe Peninsula line took 3 years to build (construction time only - not planning) around 13km of track, both at 4.3km/year.

MBRL was 6 years total including planning time, from when Prime Minister Julie Gillard signed off on it in 2010 to opening in October 2016.
The first tranche of Federal money is due in 2026 FY.

You reckon this mob could build 37km of track in less than 6 years at 6.2km/year.
B2N heavy rail works haven't even started 4 years after it was first funded.

It would take a miracle of manpower and skill.

While I don't disagree with the general sentiment, the Charmichael Rail Line for the Adani mine up north was 87km built in 19 months. Granted, diesel only line, mostly single track and block worked safeworking, but it does show the construction works can be done quickly when need be.

Probably not a very good comparison for the reasons that you fairly outlined.
But I take your point.

However 12.6km Redcliffe Peninsula Line took 3 years to actually do the construction work.
13.6 km Springfield Line took 3 years to do the construction work.
Even the 13km Beerburrum to Beerwah works are scheduled to take 3 years construction time (by 2025).

This project also includes almost 700m of tunnel at Sugarbag Road, Caloundra.

I'd love to be wrong on this.

[HappyTrainGuy]

MBRL was still having issues sorted out months after it had opened...

[ozbob]

Sunshine Coast News --> Federal Treasurer reveals future of $1.6b rail project funds

... The rail line was seen as a vital piece of new infrastructure in the lead-up to the 2032 Olympic Games, in which the Sunshine Coast region will play a key role by hosting several major events.

Mr O'Brien has now raised concerns over possible delays for the project.

"We know that more delays means higher costs, especially in a highly inflationary environment ... What's more, a delay puts our deadline for the 2032 Games in jeopardy," he said.

"The next step is to make sure the federal and state government get on with it and don't delay because we know more delay means higher costs."

The project has been under discussion for more than 20 years and uses the Caboolture to Maroochydore Corridor Study (CAMCOS) corridor (now the Direct Sunshine Coast Line).

Sunshine Coast Council includes heavy rail along the CAMCOS corridor in its overall vision for transport upgrades for the region.

[aldonius]

So the problem with staging it is that Maroochydore-area people will drive down the coast to the Caloundra railhead instead of heading inland to the Bruce?

Sounds like an incentive for all involved to get the second stage done ASAP. Maybe a Nirimba station with a big park-and-ride (if TMR can be convinced to put a new interchange in).


Look. We're talking 37km of corridor here. It's getting done in stages. Even if they're back-to-back, it's getting done in stages.

[Arnz]

A suggested alternative is Stage 1 is the SCUH / Birtinya area, as that is a major employment hub with the SCUH and SCUPH, with the surrounding Medical Offices, as well as being a location for a number of universities and the TAFE for Nursing Students.

Yes, this will still mean spending the $$ on the Tunnels through Little Mountain, but simultaneously splits the expenses with the route between Birtinya (a few bridges required including the Mooloolah River) and Maroochydore Town Centre being put in a hypothetical STage 2.

[Fares_Fair]

So the problem with staging it is that Maroochydore-area people will drive down the coast to the Caloundra railhead instead of heading inland to the Bruce?

Sounds like an incentive for all involved to get the second stage done ASAP. Maybe a Nirimba station with a big park-and-ride (if TMR can be convinced to put a new interchange in).


Look. We're talking 37km of corridor here. It's getting done in stages. Even if they're back-to-back, it's getting done in stages.

Yes, it will be.
That's TMR stated policy (in estimates) due to the size of the contracts.

[Gazza]

So if there was a situation where people driving to the railhead en masse caused congestion, isn't that a "good" problem to have.   

It at least would give them a bit of a kick in the bum in terms of making the need for the full route apparent, and could spurn some interim bus upgrades, and spurn the case for light rail.

Giving the project to multiple contractors needs to happen way more often in Qld.

Bundling it up as one big package means it's really only the big tier one companies that can do it.

If you split it up, it means something like a station and car park could be done by a local builder who can manage a project of that size.

Or earthworks too. One firm could do the easy bit from Beerwah to Caloundra. Another firm with more specialised equipment could do the bit north which involves tunneling and bridges over the river.

[Arnz]

So if there was a situation where people driving to the railhead en masse caused congestion, isn't that a "good" problem to have.   

It would really only be a 'good' problem to have had a past State Government (Labor or Liberal) had went ahead with the CoastConnect Busway, where lanes from the Nicklin Way would've been basically been bus lanes with upgraded Bus Stations along the route.  The 'CoastConnect' busway would've given priority to the buses (especially to Route 600 travellers), as well as reduced the chances of Peak Hour/School Pickup 'bunching' where 2x 600 buses come at once because one is running 15 minutes late.

The Kawana Shoppingworld Bus Station (on the Nicklin Way) is what the stations along the CoastConnect busway would've basically looked like.

[ozbob]

Sunshine Valley Gazette 2nd November 2022 page 22

https://www.sunshinevalleygazette.com.au/read-paper-online

Feds honour rail commitment – for now

Feds honour rail commitment – for now
by Jeffrey Addison, Sunshine
Coast Commuter Advocate

At least it wasn't cut, and for that I'm grateful, especially since Queensland lost just over $1 billion in Federal Budget cuts.

Thankfully, Federal Labor has honoured the Coalition's $1.6 billion rail commitment. It starts in the final year of the forward estimates (2026).

I'm not sure they can build 37km of rail and 700m of tunnel in that remaining timeframe, before the Olympics. But at least it's there. Here's what happened...

The Budget tale of two tweets

Australian Treasurer Jim Chalmers handed down the first Labor budget since 2013.

In summary, we are in for hard times. His words, not mine.

The promise of a $275 reduction in our electricity bills, made repeatedly by (now) Prime Minister Anthony Albanese has vaporised.

It's been replaced by the admission that electricity prices will increase 56% over the next eighteen months.

Gas prices are expected to increase by around 50% in just the next year.

In good news, there are indexed increases to pensions, extra paid parental leave and additional childcare subsidies.

On the day before the October 25 budget I reissued a Twitter message I first sent on 31 May as a thank you to the new Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government Minister, Catherine King, MP for Ballarat.

'Thank you for honouring the $1.6 billion federal commitment for 37km CAMCOS rail from Beerwah to Maroochydore. Sincerely appreciated.'

I didn't receive a response when it was first tweeted in May, so, given that it was the day before the budget I thought I would send a gentle reminder.

It started on the eve of the May 21 federal election when the MP had stated that an incoming Labor government would honour the Coalition's promise of $1.6 billion, being 50% of the cost of the 37km Beerwah to Maroochydore (formerly known as CAMCOS) rail project.

I wanted to honour her for being true to her word.

Within a few minutes of my tweet being reissued, it was liked by the Minister's Twitter account.

I read into this that the $1.6 billion would be in the budget as committed and went onto ABC Sunshine Coast radio's Drive program hosted by Annie Gaffney, to let the world know on Monday afternoon.

Come Tuesday night, budget night and I rushed home from looking for the local Paynters Creek platypus, to witness the infrastructure announcements by the Treasurer.

As 7:30pm came and went, so did the budget speech but without the words I expected to hear.

I downloaded all the budget documents, and there's a plethora of them, searching for the words that would confirm the Minister's like.

I didn't find any.
Not one.
So, at 9:43pm on Tuesday 25 October I tweeted.

'Dear Minister, The #SunshineCoast region is wondering where the $1.6 billion for the 37km Beerwah to Maroochydore #rail project is?

No mention of it in tonight's budget speech.

No mention of it in budget papers.

Has it been consigned to beyond forward estimates?'

When I awoke the next morning I had my answer, with the Minister replying at 5:58am.

'The money remains in the budget. First appears in last year of forwards as realistically it will take time to do.
We will work with the QLD a state Government on business case and actual costs of the project.'

Subsequent information reported $50 million towards this project listed in the final year of the forward estimates, 2026.

With the Olympics Games due in 2032, the race is on.

[ozbob]

Couriermail --> Crucial Sunshine Coast rail link route remains under a cloud $

The future route of the Sunshine Coast Rail remains a mystery as political games and delays plague the long-discussed project, despite the tight deadline to get it delivered ahead of the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games.

Federal Labor's October budget did not specifically list funding for the Sunshine Coast, which sparked some concern, but Infrastructure Minister Catherine King has since confirmed the project is continuing.

But political games still dominate the cost, timing and route of the project, despite it being a key part of the region's Olympics bid.

The former Morrison government's budget did not see significant money flowing for the Sunshine Coast Rail until 2025-26, and Ms King has also confirmed there is no money allocated until that year, meaning there can be little to no delay if it is to be delivered before the Games. ...

[ozbob]

https://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/future-seq/queenslanders-push-for-improved-transport-between-city-hubs/news-story/868c3f42411a6ec596e09b6cd6255f30

... Queenslanders are overwhelmingly pushing for improved rail on the Sunshine Coast and a revamped M1 above all other projects, according to a survey by The Courier-Mail.

The survey asked more than 3000 Queenslanders what they believed the most important project was across the state, with a third of all respondents saying the duplication of the Gold Coast section of the M1, while another third said passenger rail to the Sunshine Coast CBD.

Meanwhile, one in 10 people looked to improve the Brisbane Metro extension to Capalaba while 9 per cent looked to improve public transport to Toowoomba.

As the population booms in south east Queensland, Dr Michael Kane, head of public policy at RACQ, said it wasn't surprising that transport was at the top of the list as the region expands. ...

[300LA]

Couriermail --> Crucial Sunshine Coast rail link route remains under a cloud $

The future route of the Sunshine Coast Rail remains a mystery as political games and delays plague the long-discussed project, despite the tight deadline to get it delivered ahead of the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games.

Federal Labor's October budget did not specifically list funding for the Sunshine Coast, which sparked some concern, but Infrastructure Minister Catherine King has since confirmed the project is continuing.

But political games still dominate the cost, timing and route of the project, despite it being a key part of the region's Olympics bid.

The former Morrison government's budget did not see significant money flowing for the Sunshine Coast Rail until 2025-26, and Ms King has also confirmed there is no money allocated until that year, meaning there can be little to no delay if it is to be delivered before the Games. ...

I don't really understand all the jumping up and down about this project being not yet funded. As far as TMR is concerned, it's only in the planning phase, and thus is still a while off detailed design completion.

Unless I'm mistaken, the business case the feds have 'funded' was the LNP fast rail proposal which didn't involve either QR or the State Gov.

I'd love to see design wrapped up and construction starting asap, but projects of this scale inherently take time to deliver.

[Fares_Fair]

Couriermail --> Crucial Sunshine Coast rail link route remains under a cloud $

The future route of the Sunshine Coast Rail remains a mystery as political games and delays plague the long-discussed project, despite the tight deadline to get it delivered ahead of the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games.

Federal Labor's October budget did not specifically list funding for the Sunshine Coast, which sparked some concern, but Infrastructure Minister Catherine King has since confirmed the project is continuing.

But political games still dominate the cost, timing and route of the project, despite it being a key part of the region's Olympics bid.

The former Morrison government's budget did not see significant money flowing for the Sunshine Coast Rail until 2025-26, and Ms King has also confirmed there is no money allocated until that year, meaning there can be little to no delay if it is to be delivered before the Games. ...

I don't really understand all the jumping up and down about this project being not yet funded. As far as TMR is concerned, it's only in the planning phase, and thus is still a while off detailed design completion.

Unless I'm mistaken, the business case the feds have 'funded' was the LNP fast rail proposal which didn't involve either QR or the State Gov.

I'd love to see design wrapped up and construction starting asap, but projects of this scale inherently take time to deliver.

It was being delivered in 2006 - but then it got stopped in 2007.
The second major rail project to the Sunshine Coast to be stopped dead in its tracks.
Back then it was just a $1 billion project.

Sorry, you are mistaken. 
The Morrison government revealed a $3 million funding contribution, with an expected $3 million in matching funding to come from the state, allowing $6 million for 'investment planning' on heavy rail into Maroochydore.
This planning will kick-off in 2022.
(Source: Sunshine Valley Gazette December 22, 2021 p26, by Jeffrey Addison)

[Gazza]

I think the concern is if pressure isn't kept on the government they will let the timeline slip

[Fares_Fair]

I think the concern is if pressure isn't kept on the government they will let the timeline slip

This DSCL (CAMCOS) business case is not due to be completed until the end of 2023.

[300LA]

Couriermail --> Crucial Sunshine Coast rail link route remains under a cloud $

The future route of the Sunshine Coast Rail remains a mystery as political games and delays plague the long-discussed project, despite the tight deadline to get it delivered ahead of the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games.

Federal Labor's October budget did not specifically list funding for the Sunshine Coast, which sparked some concern, but Infrastructure Minister Catherine King has since confirmed the project is continuing.

But political games still dominate the cost, timing and route of the project, despite it being a key part of the region's Olympics bid.

The former Morrison government's budget did not see significant money flowing for the Sunshine Coast Rail until 2025-26, and Ms King has also confirmed there is no money allocated until that year, meaning there can be little to no delay if it is to be delivered before the Games. ...

I don't really understand all the jumping up and down about this project being not yet funded. As far as TMR is concerned, it's only in the planning phase, and thus is still a while off detailed design completion.

Unless I'm mistaken, the business case the feds have 'funded' was the LNP fast rail proposal which didn't involve either QR or the State Gov.

I'd love to see design wrapped up and construction starting asap, but projects of this scale inherently take time to deliver.

It was being delivered in 2006 - but then it got stopped in 2007.
The second major rail project to the Sunshine Coast to be stopped dead in its tracks.
Back then it was just a $1 billion project.

Sorry, you are mistaken. 
The Morrison government revealed a $3 million funding contribution, with an expected $3 million in matching funding to come from the state, allowing $6 million for 'investment planning' on heavy rail into Maroochydore.
This planning will kick-off in 2022.
(Source: Sunshine Valley Gazette December 22, 2021 p26, by Jeffrey Addison)

Exactly. Which is also stated on TMR's website.
https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/projects/beerwah-to-maroochydore-rail-extension-planning

I'm not familiar with how far the previous project progressed in 2006-07. But standards have since changed and a redesign is required.

TMR's status is listed as 'planning', which is prior to design stage.  Hence why I believe the Fed Gov 'funding' was related to the other business case.

[Fares_Fair]

I can tell you that the $6 million Investment Planning was intended to produce construction documentation for the project.
It is to include design.
It builds on the original corridor study - plus updated refinements.

That's why it's more than just a Business Case.

[ozbob]

Sunshine Coast News --> What will the Qld Govt do? War of words erupts over heavy rail funding challenge

The Queensland Opposition has thrown down the gauntlet to the Government, by reiterating that, if elected, a Coalition Government would in fact provide the second half of the required funding for the Beerwah to Maroochydore heavy rail line.

But Member for Caloundra Jason Hunt has hit back saying he has always "strongly" supported the heavy rail, but adds that it must be done right, "which is why our state government is currently conducting a jointly funded study into the project".

The project cost has been set at $3.2b (although some suggest delays will see the final cost keep creeping up), with the Australian Government agreeing to pay half those funds in the October Federal Budget. ...

[HappyTrainGuy]

Can we stop talking about the 2006 project. All I keep remembering is the 160kph quad alignment.

It should also be noted the 2006 alignment was based on rough plans from the 90's when QR wanted network realignments and more tilt trains... but we won't talk about what happened to that funding or plans. There were a lot of realignments. Just not many in the area where up to 70-90 minutes was planned to be taken off the transit time from Gympie to Brisbane. The Berajondo derailment was also on a section of track that was planned to be realigned but never was.

[ozbob]

Glasshouse & Maleny Country News --> Deadline looms to keep our region on track

THE Beerwah to Maroochydore rail extension could take nine years to construct and with a state government-commissioned investment study not expected to be completed until next year, experts are questioning whether it can be completed for the 2032 Olympics.

The project, which has been mooted for decades is now officially called the 'Direct Sunshine Coast Line'.

While the Federal Government has committed $1.6 billion in funding, the state government has refused to commit financing beyond the $6m investment study, which was announced in early 2022. The Department of Transport and Main Roads has now confirmed that study will be complete until 2023.

Sunshine Coast Commuter Advocate Jeff Addison said while he welcomed the Federal Government's $1.6bn co-funding commitment towards the DSCL; based on his calculations, time was running out for it to be operational by 2032. ...

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/ozbob13/status/1599880780968505345

[Gazza]

So the most similar projects would be:

The 47km RRL in Melbourne, which commenced in 2009 and opened in 2015

The 70km Mandurah line commenced design in 2003 and opened in 2007

I think it would take more like 4-5 years. There's not a direct correlation between the length of the project and the construction time, because bigger projects get more worksites.

Eg the Darwin to Alice Springs railway was 1400km but it didn't take 40 years to build, in fact it took only 2 years.

So a 9 year construction period is not accurate.

[Stillwater]

With Minister Bailey using terminology for the DSCL being 'from Beerwah to the Coast', it could be assumed that the line will strike out to Caloundra (the coast) in Stage 1 and would stop there. Remember the ALP now holds the seat of Caloundra. Given the politics of any transport issue on the Sunshine Coast, a state government promise to fund the line would be in the lead up to the state election due on 26 October 2024. (Think sod-turning ceremonies, glossy brochures and fly-throughs shouting Rail To Caloundra, brought to you by Jason Hunt MP.) If the line gets built at all, Caloundra is the likely destination, whereas something like Kawana would make better sense (hospital and health precinct). Given the circumstances, heavy rail to Maroochydore would be like mounting an expedition to colonise Mars.

[ozbob]

Beerwah to Maroochydore rail extension, planning

https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/projects/beerwah-to-maroochydore-rail-extension-planning

[ozbob]

I think the biggest issue with DSCL is funding.  Queensland seems unable to mount coherent funding cases for rail, other states do well.

Crikey they couldn't even swing a few bucks for CRR.

DSCL is dependent on the upgrade of the Sunny Coast line north of Beerburrum.  Look how long that has being going around in circles.

I think it is a fair call, that it may not be operational by 2032. We are not just talking about construction time per se, but the entire scope of the project.

[Gazza]

DSCL is dependent on the upgrade of the Sunny Coast line north of Beerburrum.

But Beerburrum to Beerwah is happening?

[ozbob]

^ we hope so Gazza ... 

[Arnz]

Surely the alternative if 'polytics' plays a part in DSCL again is putting some pressure on the government to dust off the "CoastConnect" busway plans which mean dedicating bus lanes alongside the Nicklin Way and Alexandra Pde/Aerodrome Road.  The Caloundra railway spur would be a 2-station line at best - Baringa (aka Aura, aka the 'huge' Caloundra South development) and Caloundra, maybe 3 stations if funding can squeeze in a  station at Pelican Waters.

Source: https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/projects/coastconnect-caloundra-to-maroochydore-quality-bus-corridor

The SCRC is 'delivering' the Mooloolaba upgrade project from Brisbane Road to Walan Street.  Surely the bus queue jumps/transit lanes may apply in the Mooloolaba area.

Source: https://www.sunshinecoast.qld.gov.au/Council/Planning-and-Projects/Infrastructure-Projects/Mooloolaba-Transport-Corridor-Upgrade