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Author Topic: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding  (Read 1952 times)

Online Cazza

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Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« on: June 02, 2017, 06:18:13 PM »
The Spring Hill Loop is a free shuttle running from the city to Spring Hill and return.
Timetable: https://translink.com.au/sites/default/files/assets/timetables/161212-30.pdf

Every time I have seen it running up Creek St towards Spring Hill, it always seems to be full to capacity. It runs very frequently at every 11 mins all day but even with this frequency, it is always full. Does anyone have any patronage numbers to go off? Would it be worthwhile increasing the frequency to say every 7-8 mins?

Offline aldonius

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2017, 08:25:28 PM »
Every eleven minutes? Hilarious. Looks like the route takes ~17 minutes to run plus ~4 minutes break/recovery time. So one bus doing the loop will give a 22 minute natural frequency, two buses gives 11m. So yeah, the next step would be to go to a 7-7-8 pattern with three buses.

More generally on Spring Hill, I think that there needs to be a route going between RBWH (as a convenient turnaround/interchange point) and city-south loop (Edward, Alice, George, Turbot) via Water St.

Offline MaxHeadway

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2017, 02:35:02 PM »
Would there be enough demand for the 30 on weekends—at least during the day—through Spring Hill?
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Online Cazza

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #3 on: November 18, 2017, 05:05:35 PM »
A full time route into Spring Hill is something like that should definitely be looked at, especially handy for all of the hospital workers and patients in addition to the high density housing. I think something closer to 20 mins would be recommended as 30 mins is a bit of a wait, especially since you could walk from Spring Hill down to the City in around 15 mins.

Although, just like Aldonius has said, running a full time route from the City to RBWH via Spring Hill would probably be the best bet to go for.

What could happen is that the 321 down Gregory Tce should be re-routed via Water St and then have it run at least every 30 mins as a shuttle between the City and RBWH (in addition to the Toombul terminators).

Offline SurfRail

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #4 on: November 18, 2017, 10:53:59 PM »
Reroute one or more of the routes that otherwise would go through the Valley from the RBWH.  That corridor is oversaturated and Spring Hill is underserved.
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Offline achiruel

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2017, 10:21:57 AM »
The 301 already partly services Spring Hill (it travels via St Paul's Tce rather than Ann St as the 300 does). Unfortunately it only runs hourly most of the day, and every 45 minutes on Saturday and every 90 minutes on Sundays. What absurd frequencies!

The 321 services Spring Hill also, via Gregory Tce and Boundary St, but once again the frequency is woeful (hourly off-peak, 25, 30 or 35 minutes peak, hourly Saturdays, nothing on Sundays or at night on any day.

Perhaps the 375 should service Spring Hill? It might then have a purpose for it's existence other than to duplicate the 370, and it already runs at good frequency in the daytime on weekdays, at least.




Online Cazza

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2017, 12:24:35 PM »
Either way, a bus full time service down Water St like the current P331 etc. do would help greatly, especially as it will save upwards of 10 mins instead of servicing the saturated Valley corridor.

The 375 probably is the best option as it is close to a BUZ service already. The second best would probably be the 370.

Offline #Metro

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #7 on: December 27, 2017, 07:36:54 PM »
^^ the entire BCC bus network has to be totally reviewed, but they have been stalling on this for many years because Translink can never say no to renewing BCC's contracts. This in turn links back to red team and their ties to RTBU who ran a "what would you miss" campaign against bus reform in 2013. Jackie Trad even signed a pledge not to change the network.
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Offline achiruel

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #8 on: December 27, 2017, 07:47:28 PM »
Chances of bus reform happening with the current #railfail fiasco continuing are close to zero. Can't really expect people to transfer to a train if it might never turn up, or only runs Monday to Thursday etc.

Offline #Metro

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #9 on: December 27, 2017, 08:05:05 PM »
Quote
Chances of bus reform happening with the current #railfail fiasco continuing are close to zero. Can't really expect people to transfer to a train if it might never turn up, or only runs Monday to Thursday etc.

That's exactly the line BCC has been spinning for years.

They want to put obstacles in the path of progress.

They just need to get on with it.

Negative people... have a problem for every solution.
Posts are commentary and are not necessarily endorsed by RAIL Back on Track or its members. Not affiliated with, paid by or in conspiracy with MTR/Metro.

Offline techblitz

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #10 on: December 27, 2017, 10:18:50 PM »
Quote
They want to put obstacles in the path of progress
there is an obstacle to the path of progress....its called QR

Offline James

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2017, 10:35:46 PM »
Sadly, I think large-scale bus network reform is shot until Brisbane Metro is up and running, which won't be for another 3 years. The appetite, both political and within the decimated TransLink, simply isn't there.

To address the matter at hand, any number of routes (334, 346, 353, 360/361/364, 370, 375, 379) could be re-routed through Spring Hill. Bizarrely, my personal preference at this time would be to re-jig the 346 and 353. They're roughly every half-hour combined during the off-peak and every 15 minutes in peak, but they're not high patronage routes like the 375, so it's less likely to offend everybody when the service gets re-routed. My next preference would be the 379, again for the lower patronage.

Until there's a proper HF going RBWH - Valley (likely integrated with another service, there still needs to be two routes of decent quality (370/375) going through here. If the route proves to be faster travelling this way, perhaps more buses should look into travelling this way. Going via the Valley is a real pain, even in a car.
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Offline #Metro

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #12 on: December 28, 2017, 12:36:00 AM »
Quote
Sadly, I think large-scale bus network reform is shot until Brisbane Metro is up and running, which won't be for another 3 years. The appetite, both political and within the decimated TransLink, simply isn't there.

The regulator is hopeless because it does not have termination of contract powers. Or if it does it never exercises them.

So it really is "do whatever you please" despite whatever the contracts say.

That is how things like Zillmere-UQ Rocket buses got approved.

Kicking the can down the road and treading water has become the norm sadly.

Which is infuriating when you think of all the good that someone like Alannah MacTiernan (Red Team) has done in WA.
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Offline tazzer9

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #13 on: December 28, 2017, 11:48:55 AM »
The only reason the metro is even going ahead is because of the lack of bus reform.  It wouldn't be needed if we just had a normal operator willing to make a few people change buses or modes at hubs. 

Offline achiruel

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #14 on: December 28, 2017, 01:55:33 PM »
Quote
Chances of bus reform happening with the current #railfail fiasco continuing are close to zero. Can't really expect people to transfer to a train if it might never turn up, or only runs Monday to Thursday etc.

That's exactly the line BCC has been spinning for years.

They want to put obstacles in the path of progress.

They just need to get on with it.

Except prior to #railfail it was just that, spin. Now it is a lot of basis in reality. There is absolutely no point in enforcing bus<->rail transfers with the current shambolic state of the rail service.

Some examples are given on the recent weekend where we had hourly services on most lines (two-hourly on the Sunshine Coast!). Do we really expect people to wait around for an average of 29 minutes for a connection to their next mode of transport? Because that's effectively what you're offering them.


Offline techblitz

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #15 on: December 28, 2017, 02:56:21 PM »
with QR in its current state....Brisbane transport are better off distancing themselves from QR/translink as far as possible.
BT only needs to work on its duplication eg: ocr,gympie,mains etc and rejigging of routes where demand has increased/decreased......not its rail feeding because at this stage it would be detrimental for Public transport to entrust QR with more passengers....

Offline #Metro

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #16 on: December 28, 2017, 03:38:31 PM »
Timed connection. And there are a lot of reforms that don't depend on rail, like extending BUZ 196 to Yeronga or cleaning up old Cleveland road corridor.

You'll have to reduce and simplify anyway when metro comes in, though I suspect they run it on top of the existing mess like Sydney did with their Metro bus network.
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Online Cazza

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #17 on: December 28, 2017, 04:15:53 PM »
You'll have to reduce and simplify anyway when metro comes in, though I suspect they run it on top of the existing mess like Sydney did with their Metro bus network.

Sydney's bus network is still a mess. I'm thinking of redoing it the same way you've done to Brisbane's. Just look at the duplication down Anzac Pde or Spit Rd (with the introduction of the B-Line, there are still plenty more routes to the Northern Beaches that don't need to be around).

Patronage across services is inconsistent, a direct reflection of the amount of duplication down some corridors.

Offline Arnz

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Re: Spring Hill Free Loop (Route 30)- Overcrowding
« Reply #18 on: December 28, 2017, 06:58:49 PM »
with QR in its current state....Brisbane transport are better off distancing themselves from QR/translink as far as possible.
BT only needs to work on its duplication eg: ocr,gympie,mains etc and rejigging of routes where demand has increased/decreased......not its rail feeding because at this stage it would be detrimental for Public transport to entrust QR with more passengers....

Even ignoring the long standing BCC v State Governent rivalry 8n the PT arena, they won’t change on their views on their duplication anytime soon.  They had the long standing view of one seat to the City/people don’t like change (even between their own bus services).  So don’t expect that to change until the Metro SuperBuses is up and running.

I do suspect when the Metro gets up, they’re just going to move one problem to another (e.g Merivale) by moving all the hourly milk runs to the terminus points of the Metro and not providing enough spaces for those buses.

Rgds,
Arnz

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