Brisbane: Bus Electric Rapid Transit (' Brisbane Metro ')

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/team_schrinner/status/1269383865937694720

[kram0]

According to channel 7 news and the interview with the mayor, it seems the underground Cultural Centre station now won't happen for 'sometime'.

[verbatim9]

According to channel 7 news and the interview with the mayor, it seems the underground Cultural Centre station now won't happen for 'sometime'.

https://twitter.com/7NewsBrisbane/status/1269547636425547776


^^Wow! so it will go into service without the underground station for quite sometime

The reports are becoming clearer by the day.

[verbatim9]

^^This project from when it was first envisioned has been watered down so much

[verbatim9]

The cost and the construction time of the highly anticipated Brisbane Metro busway has blown out, but the Brisbane City Council insists we're getting a better deal. @harrytclarke #9News https://t.co/Wmu6HjFo47

https://twitter.com/9NewsQueensland/status/1269547617807216640

[timh]

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3113466485340739&id=216536401700443

Suspicions confirmed. Cultural Centre will be at grade.

From the renders, it seems like from the Melbourne street portal through to the Victoria Bridge will still be bus only, however it looks like there will still be an intersection with general traffic at Grey Street. This is a massive part of the bottleneck. While I'm pleased the project is going ahead, I still consider this a loss

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

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[verbatim9]

I guess BCC will revert to the original design making platform 2 an island platform and platform 1 a bit longer?

[ozbob]

Half baked projects, have long term consequences ...

[Derwan]

What do you do when you're at an impasse?  You "agree" to do nothing and pretend it's a good thing.

The Cultural Centre station is the biggest bottleneck on the entire route - worse than the city itself.  Without the underground station at the Cultural Centre, this truly will be "just a bus upgrade" rather than an anything that resembles a major infrastructure improvement.  (I won't use the word "metro" as we all know it's not that.)

I just wanna know how the bi-articulated buses will navigate the turn to/from the tunnel under the Convention Centre.  It was recently adjusted to allow for articulated buses.  Under the current design, at best, they'll have to slow to a crawl to get around. 

This is a major disappointment/setback for public transport in Brisbane.

[Golliwog]

The other issue with keeping it at grade is the queue distance between the tunnel portal lights and the Grey St lights (which are remaining?) How many Metro vehicles + buses will fit in that short space?

[nathandavid88]

Here is what the new info on Council's Brisbane Metro page says about the Cultural Centre:

Cultural Centre Precinct

The Cultural Centre Precinct is the centrepiece for Queensland's arts portfolio, hosting internationally and locally recognised performances and exhibitions. It provides a critical link between South Brisbane and the CBD, and is an important destination for tourists and visitors alike.

Brisbane Metro will deliver the following benefits in the Cultural Centre Precinct:

• an upgraded Cultural Centre surface station, with sufficient capacity to support efficient Metro and bus operations up to 10 years post completion of Stage 1 (my emphasis)
• significant public realm improvements on Melbourne Street and Grey Street, including a world-class gateway to the Cultural Forecourt
• improving cycling connections along Melbourne Street and Grey Street
• enhanced pedestrian amenity and safety in the Cultural Centre Precinct, and along Melbourne and Grey Street, by removing obstructions, widening footpaths, and the removal of general vehicle traffic on Melbourne Street between Victoria Bridge and Grey Street
• new landscaping to maximise shade and amenity in the precinct
• a new crossing on Grey Street between Queensland Performing Arts Centre (QPAC) and South Brisbane railway station
• a four-way signalised intersection at Melbourne and Grey Street, providing pedestrian movements in all directions, including between QPAC and the Queensland Museum, which is not currently possible
• relocating the Cultural Centre station lifts to improve public realm and maintaining equitable access.

Looks like leaving the Cultural Centre as is, is only a viable option for a decade's worth of use.

[aldonius]

The other issue with keeping it at grade is the queue distance between the tunnel portal lights and the Grey St lights (which are remaining?) How many Metro vehicles + buses will fit in that short space?

No general traffic under the rail bridge though. So the tunnel portal lights are only there for southbound bike/walk and via-West-End buses. And Grey/Melbourne only strictly needs two phases: north/south and east/west. The portal lights then just have to toggle shortly before the Grey St lights do.

[kram0]

Mark Bailey F%^ked this project up by getting involved and playing politics.

Council should not proceed until they are going to do it 'once, well'. 

Wouldn't the feds want to re-evaluate this project as they are tipping in $300m, and the cost/benefit ratio would not be the same now?

[verbatim9]

No doubt there will be min 45 second cycles at that intersection, unless that intersection will have priority approach installed for metro vehicles?

[SurfRail]

Can somebody please explain to me how a bus leaves the QSBS and crosses the Victoria Bridge under the new set-up?

Inbound I understand you would now enter by following the new tunnel alignment and turning right into the QSBS instead of KGS underneath Adelaide St.  Just how does a bus get back onto the bridge?  Every render I have seen shows these buses can only join the outbound bridge lane bound for the West End.

I can't recall the lane configuration of the bridge at the moment, but at one point it was 2 lanes in each direction, and in that situation I can't see where this could have worked.

[Derwan]

No general traffic under the rail bridge though. So the tunnel portal lights are only there for southbound bike/walk and via-West-End buses. And Grey/Melbourne only strictly needs two phases: north/south and east/west. The portal lights then just have to toggle shortly before the Grey St lights do.

The West End buses would need to occupy the current car lanes and Busway buses (including bi-articulated) would need to occupy existing bus lanes in order for them to be able to turn into and out of the portal.  It means an additional crossing point.

If the lights at Grey street turn green at the same time (for all outbound buses) one of those groups will have to stop at the portal traffic lights, backing up buses onto Grey street.

Ideally you'd want to change the portal so that buses to/from the busway could remain on the Eastern side (where the current car lanes are).  That would avoid the conflict.  But it would take a significant modification of the portal (again) for that to be possible.

[nathandavid88]

Can somebody please explain to me how a bus leaves the QSBS and crosses the Victoria Bridge under the new set-up?

Inbound I understand you would now enter by following the new tunnel alignment and turning right into the QSBS instead of KGS underneath Adelaide St.  Just how does a bus get back onto the bridge?  Every render I have seen shows these buses can only join the outbound bridge lane bound for the West End.

I can't recall the lane configuration of the bridge at the moment, but at one point it was 2 lanes in each direction, and in that situation I can't see where this could have worked.

Going by the render (which matches the redesign of the Victoria Bridge that included the new cycle lanes) buses don't have to enter the Adelaide Street Tunnel to enter the QSBS, there is still provision for them to enter via the Queen Street portal as well.


Victoria Bridge aerial by Brisbane City Council, on Flickr

With regards to how the bridge is arranged, on the Queen Street end, you have three lanes - two inbound (one to Adelaide Street, and one to the QSBS/right hand turn onto William Street). However, halfway down the Victoria Bridge, the two inbound lanes combine into one, and the one outbound land splits into two - one for buses going onto the busway (the "middle lane") and the outside lane continuing through to West End.


Cultural Centre at Grade by Brisbane City Council, on Flickr

Hope that helps answer your question.

[Derwan]

Going by the images, there will be two outbound lanes from the Cultural Centre, with the Busway buses in the centre lane (crossing West End buses into the portal).

Looks like a single inbound lane (i.e. controlled by lights at the portal).

[Derwan]

One outbound platform at the Cultural Centre.  What's the point of having two lanes from the middle of the bridge if they all have to stop at the one platform anyway?

Why not improve the existing outbound platform area for Busway buses and add a second platform for West End buses?

The current design will do nothing to alleviate the queue across the bridge in the afternoons.

[aldonius]

No general traffic under the rail bridge though. So the tunnel portal lights are only there for southbound bike/walk and via-West-End buses. And Grey/Melbourne only strictly needs two phases: north/south and east/west. The portal lights then just have to toggle shortly before the Grey St lights do.

The West End buses would need to occupy the current car lanes and Busway buses (including bi-articulated) would need to occupy existing bus lanes in order for them to be able to turn into and out of the portal.  It means an additional crossing point.

If the lights at Grey street turn green at the same time (for all outbound buses) one of those groups will have to stop at the portal traffic lights, backing up buses onto Grey street.

Ideally you'd want to change the portal so that buses to/from the busway could remain on the Eastern side (where the current car lanes are).  That would avoid the conflict.  But it would take a significant modification of the portal (again) for that to be possible.

Good point, I wasn't really thinking about the southbound West End buses. I think they'll be the ones waiting - there's far fewer of them and they're generally shorter too.

[verbatim9]

^^According to the renders but not exactly clear; there seems to be a stop for West end buses just past the Grey street intersection just before the rail bridge. Maybe the platforms will be solely used for metro vehicles?


I reckon that a 2/3 island platform would of been better and making platform 1 longer. The stops would have dynamic stopping patterns anyway to prevent unnecessary queuing.

[SurfRail]

Can somebody please explain to me how a bus leaves the QSBS and crosses the Victoria Bridge under the new set-up?

Inbound I understand you would now enter by following the new tunnel alignment and turning right into the QSBS instead of KGS underneath Adelaide St.  Just how does a bus get back onto the bridge?  Every render I have seen shows these buses can only join the outbound bridge lane bound for the West End.

I can't recall the lane configuration of the bridge at the moment, but at one point it was 2 lanes in each direction, and in that situation I can't see where this could have worked.

Going by the render (which matches the redesign of the Victoria Bridge that included the new cycle lanes) buses don't have to enter the Adelaide Street Tunnel to enter the QSBS, there is still provision for them to enter via the Queen Street portal as well.


Victoria Bridge aerial by Brisbane City Council, on Flickr

With regards to how the bridge is arranged, on the Queen Street end, you have three lanes - two inbound (one to Adelaide Street, and one to the QSBS/right hand turn onto William Street). However, halfway down the Victoria Bridge, the two inbound lanes combine into one, and the one outbound land splits into two - one for buses going onto the busway (the "middle lane") and the outside lane continuing through to West End.


Cultural Centre at Grade by Brisbane City Council, on Flickr

Hope that helps answer your question.

That's substantially clearer, ta.  It had escaped my notice the bridge was down to 3 lanes only.  (I can't fathom how it would have worked previously.)

I assume that would have to mean there'll be an island stop somewhere under the railway overpass for the busway only.

The whole thing is just a cluster-f****, as usual.  We can never have anything nice.

[Cazza]

I think the most concerning thing is that even though we are currently experiencing some of the lowest interest rates that most of us will ever see in our lifetime, as well as the need for so many new jobs to be created coming of the back of COVID, we still see politics coming before people. There has never been a better time to kickstart and undertake such crucial projects like these.

Council and State Government have given a big middle finger to literally everyone and proven that their ignorance and stubbornness is more important than coming to an agreement on such an important project.

Pettiness does not get parties voted into government. Getting sh!t done does

[Jonno]

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3113466485340739&id=216536401700443

Suspicions confirmed. Cultural Centre will be at grade.

From the renders, it seems like from the Melbourne street portal through to the Victoria Bridge will still be bus only, however it looks like there will still be an intersection with general traffic at Grey Street. This is a massive part of the bottleneck. While I'm pleased the project is going ahead, I still consider this a loss

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

What an absolute pathetic outcome! A Metro that has a world's worst at grade intersection!!! 

[verbatim9]

From an Active Transport perspective its an huge improvement. Be interesting what the renders will look like heading towards West end on Melbourne street? Will the segregated two-way Bikeway continue along Melbourne Street all the way to Boundary Street?

[aldonius]

From one of the renders, it's just regular painted bike lanes for Melbourne St once it crosses over.

[Jonno]

Should go back to original station plan (with better connection to railway platforms) and connection to Melbourne Street via  underneath the Convention Centre All very doable! 

PS it is all one big South Brisbane Station.

Could even build at ground connection from new station to railway platforms and convert the old portal to another entrance! One big station!!

[James]

This is a fuking disastrous outcome for Brisbane.

A grade-separated bus station is urgently required - the whole issue right now is the lack of grade separation and conflicting movements between West End and SE Busway services. While a longer platform and nicer environment is all fine and well, in the end it is just window dressing around here until the BRT system can be built properly.

At the very least, a third platform for West End services may have been able to prevent West End services blocking SE Busway services like they do currently, a big contributor to network congestion.

However, I do have a theory. Bids were submitted about 12 months ago - contractually BCC may have been obliged to either award a successful bidder or compensate tenderers. Better to award now and let Arup-Acconia continue with design work elsewhere on the network, and then if the LNP win the state election on 31 October, dig up the old plans and continue with a new Cultural Centre design as planned. If the ALP win, LNP council still gets their shiny new toy.

We live in hope!

[Golliwog]

A serious question though:

How exactly would you go about constructing the new grade separated station and connect it into the operational busway?

Moving the Cultural Centre platforms around to give a construction site in the middle of the busway to tunnel down could work from that side.

But how exactly do you connect into the side of a tunnel without closing it where you would be connecting into the busway south of the Melbourne St tunnel portal?

What would the operational impacts of that have been and for how long would the busway have not been functional?

[ozbob]

Sent to all outlets:

9th June 2020

Another Brisbane bus project gets watered down

RAIL Back On Track members express their extreme disappointment that the Brisbane Metro will not proceed with the new underground station at Cultural Centre (1).

This is a short sighted decision, since BCC's own modelling say the underground station will be needed within 10 years anyway.

Build it once and do it right!

If buses are to work well in Brisbane, they need to be given a clear run.

People would be pretty upset if a motorway had a set of traffic lights halfway along, yet the busway has this exact issue right at its busiest point, with tight turns and multiple sets of traffic lights at South Brisbane causing daily delays and congestion for bus passengers. Buses must have priority at traffic signals as for the light rail on the Gold Coast.

RAIL Back On Track has strongly supported the Brisbane Metro, it was to solve two fundamental issues: It would segregate buses fully from general road traffic, and would have reduced bus congestion by using larger electric bi-articulated buses instead of lots of smaller ones.

Since then, Member for South Brisbane Jackie Trad made it clear she didn't want the entrance to the station out the front of QPAC. Her stance was supported by Transport Minister Mark Bailey, and since then the project underwent several redesigns, until we have reached the conclusion announced recently ... No underground station at all!

As it stands, the Brisbane Metro is now only a small improvement to the status quo, and no decision maker should be congratulated for ripping the guts out of important features of the project in order to rush it through.

This is the latest knock to efforts to improve buses in Brisbane. Earlier this year the Northern Transitway was watered down. What was originally promised to be a busway tunnel to Chermside became painted bus lanes on the road. After objections from local business owners, it will now just be temporary bus lanes that only operate a few hours per day.

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

Reference:

1. https://www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3113466485340739&id=216536401700443

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1270008398344368135

[ozbob]

Facebook ...

[ozbob]

Brisbanetimes --> 'Wasted 4½ years': Labor questions Brisbane Metro planning

Brisbane Metro's planned centrepiece underground station at the Cultural Centre may not be built for a decade, lord mayor Adrian Schrinner says, but the opposition is questioning if it will be built at all.

On Sunday, Cr Schrinner announced that after nearly a year of disagreement between the state and the council on the size, location and shape of the underground station beneath the Cultural Centre, plans were on hold.

Instead of beginning work on an underground station, the council would upgrade the existing bus station at street level to accommodate the Metro's large electric buses, currently being manufactured by Hess.

Cr Schrinner admitted on Sunday that the upgrades to the existing station, proposed by the Acciona-Arup consortium selected as preferred tenderers for Metro's major infrastructure works, would be sufficient for Brisbane's bus needs for at least 10 years.

Opposition leader Jared Cassidy on Monday questioned why an underground station was needed at all, if upgrades to the street-level Cultural Centre bus stop could service so many trips so comfortably.

"We've wasted 4½ years and tens of millions of dollars on early works that never needed to be done," Cr Cassidy said.

"It makes a mockery of any public transport planning."

Cr Cassidy said he did not believe the underground metro station would ever be built, saying he believed the street-level upgrades were, ultimately, a better solution.

On Monday, speaking to ABC Radio, Cr Schrinner said the underground station plan was "all about future-proofing for the long term" the Cultural Centre precinct, but due to the high number of stakeholders - QPAC, QAGOMA, the Brisbane Convention and Exhibition Centre to name a few - the highly complex work was put on hold.

The $944 million turn-up-and-go public transport solution, first touted by then-lord mayor Graham Quirk in 2016, has undergone many changes since its first design.

Shifting from a Paris-style subway design, to a large bus network to, now, big electric buses running on the existing bus network, the metro is expected to go well over budget as its key infrastructure project at South Brisbane is paused.

Cr Cassidy questioned whether the council should continue with its 60-strong order for electric buses to be manufactured and delivered to run on the metro, saying high-frequency services without the underground station could just as easily be serviced by typical buses "at less than half the price".

"We don't know the costings now, it makes a dog's breakfast look like fine dining," Cr Cassidy said.

"It's taken us four years to land basically where we should have started."

Cr Schrinner said the final cost for Brisbane Metro will be confirmed through contract negotiations in the coming weeks, and said the council would release the final cost when it was confirmed.

"The reality is that the cost of the project is not getting cheaper as the result of this delay. It will cost more but I believe it will be a better project as a result," he said on Sunday.

The lord mayor said the council would be working flat-out to ensure the metro was operating by its original target of 2023.

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1270060433097908224

[pangwen]

Can somebody please explain to me how a bus leaves the QSBS and crosses the Victoria Bridge under the new set-up?

Inbound I understand you would now enter by following the new tunnel alignment and turning right into the QSBS instead of KGS underneath Adelaide St.  Just how does a bus get back onto the bridge?  Every render I have seen shows these buses can only join the outbound bridge lane bound for the West End.

I can't recall the lane configuration of the bridge at the moment, but at one point it was 2 lanes in each direction, and in that situation I can't see where this could have worked.

Going by the render (which matches the redesign of the Victoria Bridge that included the new cycle lanes) buses don't have to enter the Adelaide Street Tunnel to enter the QSBS, there is still provision for them to enter via the Queen Street portal as well.


Victoria Bridge aerial by Brisbane City Council, on Flickr

With regards to how the bridge is arranged, on the Queen Street end, you have three lanes - two inbound (one to Adelaide Street, and one to the QSBS/right hand turn onto William Street). However, halfway down the Victoria Bridge, the two inbound lanes combine into one, and the one outbound land splits into two - one for buses going onto the busway (the "middle lane") and the outside lane continuing through to West End.


Cultural Centre at Grade by Brisbane City Council, on Flickr

Hope that helps answer your question.

That's substantially clearer, ta.  It had escaped my notice the bridge was down to 3 lanes only.  (I can't fathom how it would have worked previously.)

I assume that would have to mean there'll be an island stop somewhere under the railway overpass for the busway only.

The whole thing is just a cluster-f****, as usual.  We can never have anything nice.

I think there are 3 platforms (although two are adjacent on the outbound side):
- 1 inbound platform - you can see it just behind the pedestrian bridge between the Museum and QPAC. As there is a single lane inbound here, presumably this will be used by all services
- Outbound platform 1 - opposite the inbound platform behind the pedestrian bridge in the render. Probably for the Busway and Metro services. There's a dashed merge line on the road just under the bridge which implies the Busway/Metro services cross over to the right hand lane and end up where the Metro bus is in the render (in the middle lane)
- Outbound platform 2 - basically where the Council bus is on the render. This is probably for West End services - they pass to the right Busway/metro buses and then cut left in front of them and enter their platform. Those buses will continue in the left hand lane down past the railway bridge

Having two separate outbound platforms and two outbound will *probably* make things better than now as West End buses are less likely to block up the flow.

[nathandavid88]

^^ While it looks a little unclear, I think you might be right (someone else picked this up over on the Skyscrapercity discussion as well). It does seem weird to have the stops right up against the traffic lights, but those shelters certainly do look like bus shelters

Here are some cropped sections from the Cultural Centre render, starting with the Main Cultural Centre Station: Click on the links to see a larger version.


https://imgur.com/vS6PXfn

The "West End Services stop":


https://imgur.com/rUicO3D

And the Victoria Bridge arrangement, showing the splitting/merging of lanes:


https://imgur.com/7w7UoGr

[ozbob]

Getting a lot of interest this post.

Presently 804 998 people reached 327 404 engagements ... that is a lot in a few hours.  No one is liking this latest setback too much at all.

>> https://www.facebook.com/RAILBackOnTrack/posts/3498689033478592

Facebook ...

[BrizCommuter]

That intersection is the most critical part of the Brisbane Metro project. Only in QLD! We now have a rail tunnel under construction between 2 bottlenecks and an upgraded busway with a bottleneck in the middle.     

[aldonius]

My best guess as to lane allocations and suchlike.



[attachment deleted by admin]

[verbatim9]

Adelaide Street was due for urban renewal in conjunction with the project. I hope it stills goes ahead. New widened footpaths were on the cards as well as new combined bus stops will pull in bays. As well as new landscaping and water features. Dynamic real time way finding was also meant to be installed along with new dynamic real time arrival information for buses