Regional Fast Rail discussion

[ozbob]

Costs of going to std gauge to great.  3'6" is fine, and 200 km/h is achievable at Tim mentions.

Current Australian rail speed record is held by Queensland Rail at 210 km/h, was set by Queensland Rail Electric Tilt Train during a trial run in 1998. 

[HappyTrainGuy]

Unofficially on a couple speed runs they went faster than that in testing.

[verbatim9]

I wonder if the specs can be changed on the remaining 50 Ngrs to allow for faster speeds up to 180kph and a few other tweaks inside of course. Like USB charging and a compliant disability internal fitout?

That will mean we could use them to all three centres, as well as the metropolitan network. Start planning for electrification to Helidon now and the have the Sunshine Coast line realigned with two tracks to Landsborough by mid 2024.

If the specs can't be changed easily? It's probably best to go out to tender for another 50-60 six car or 45 9 car sets from Alstom, Bombardier or another manufacter from South Korea or Japan?

P.s. If the tracks are built straight there is no need for tilting or leaning technology.

[verbatim9]

Lockyer Valley Regional Council has joined forces with neighbouring councils Ipswich City Council and Toowoomba Region in the next step toward passenger rail becoming a reality in our region.

The Ipswich to Toowoomba Passenger Rail Alliance will lobby to ensure our local communities are adequately included in the Federal Government's business case.

Together we have invited key industry representatives from universities, defence, health and tourism to join the Alliance.

We are excited to see where this alliance takes us.

Lockyer Regional Council---->https://www.facebook.com/128674850501905/posts/2654025251300173/

[ozbob]

[verbatim9]

https://twitter.com/peterachilles/status/1223203523942211584

[SteelPan]

The "2nd phase" [post 2030] of fastER rail Brisbane/Toowoomba, would be "sprinter" type corridors and trains, linking the main population centres of the Darling Downs, ie Toowoomba/Warwick. FastER rail to the the Downs will revolutionise Southern Qld, by taking a lot, A LOT, of cost pressures off the Coastal SEQ region and opening the way to "new generation" of opportunities for people to live and work.

[ozbob]

Rail Express --> Australia's faster rail future

Faster rail forms part of the federal government's strategy to deal with population growth and congestion. The National Faster Rail Agency's acting CEO Malcolm Southwell discusses his agency's work at AusRAIL Plus 2019.

Australia's major cities are a key driver of the nation's economic success and support the majority of the population in employment and economic growth. They are also growing, exponentially.

"Our population is expected to reach 33 million people by 2040, and most of those 6.6 new Australians will settle in our major capital cities," acting CEO of the National Faster Rail Agency (NFRA), Malcolm Southwell, said at the AusRAIL Plus 2019 event held in Sydney.

"Around 64 per cent of us live in cities and we're one of the most urbanised nations in the world. As such, we have issues with congestion, housing supply and affordability."

Congestion costs are also expected to rise. According to Infrastructure Australia's estimates, road and public transport congestion in the major cities will cost almost $40 billion by 2031, more than doubling from around $19bn in 2016.

Over 80 per cent of the estimated $21bn increase will occur in Greater Sydney, Greater Melbourne and south east Queensland.

A faster rail solution will go some way to alleviating population pressure in the cities. In comparison to other countries around the world, Australia has a relatively large land mass but low population density. While Australia has 3.2 persons per square kilometre, the US has 36. The UK has 275 persons per square kilometre, and Japan has 347.

"We're not just about building fast rail in the hopes that it works, we're taking an evidence-based approach," Southwell said.

"Professor Andrew McNaughton of the UK, who is working with the NSW government on their faster rail plans, has publicly noted that reducing transit times to one hour or less is a particular sweet spot for improved access to higher paying jobs in capital city CBDs and increased economic development in regional centres."

The Faster Rail Plan, which the NFRA is tasked with delivering, intends to better align future population growth by linking major cities and growing regional cities in order to take pressure off the cities and strengthen economic ties with regional areas.

With the December 2019 appointment of Barry Broe as inaugural chief executive officer of the NFRA, the agency is expected to ramp up its operations this year.

Southwell was acting CEO from the agency's creation in July 2019 until January 2020. He spoke at AusRAIL to update the rail industry on the NFRA's work to date and what to expect in the future.

So far, eight faster rail corridors have been identified, including: Sydney to Newcastle, Sydney to Wollongong, Sydney to Parkes (via Bathurst and Orange), Melbourne to Greater Shepparton, Melbourne to Albury-Wodonga, Melbourne to Taralgon, Brisbane to the Gold Coast, and Brisbane to the Sunshine Coast.

The NFRA will work in partnership with state and territory governments and private industry to develop the rail infrastructure necessary to accommodate a faster rail solution between major cities and key regional centres. It will develop proposals, examine routes and begin the process of corridor planning, acquisition and protection.

"We've started a conversation with states on the east coast about interoperability and standards of faster rail projects to avoid a repeat of issues around passenger services between jurisdictions," Southwell said.

An expert panel will provide advice to government on faster rail related matters including existing business cases, new potential faster rail corridors, future developments across networks and infrastructure requirements and priorities. The panel will advise on staging and delivery options.

The NSW government has appointed Professor Andrew McNaughton to lead the panel. He has more than 45 years' experience working on rail infrastructure projects, including the UK's High Speed project.

The first three of the overall eight faster rail business cases have now been completed, the agency confirmed in January. The business cases for Sydney to Newcastle, Melbourne to Greater Shepparton and Brisbane to the regions of Moreton Bay and the Sunshine Coast are now being reviewed by the agency. NFRA will provide advice to government on the findings and its recommendations for next steps in the coming months.

These corridors and the remaining five, which are "progressing well" according to the agency, were identified based on the intention to support growing population movements.

For example, the agency's first priority, to deliver faster rail between Geelong and Melbourne, will have major benefits for those living along the corridor, including quicker access to work and services in both locations, as well as greater choice around housing and less congestion.

"Geelong is one of the fastest growing regions, growing at a rate of around 2.7 per annum," Southwell said.

"Transport connectivity between Melbourne and Geelong is constrained by existing infrastructure and rail investment has not kept up with population growth. These constraints have a range of flow on effects, including hampering regional development and increasing road congestion.

The agency acknowledges, however, that better connectivity could, in some circumstances, result in regional towns becoming dormitory suburbs for larger cities.

"We're very much aware of these concerns and as part of our work we'll look for the opportunities where faster rail can actually work for the economy and job markets in these regional towns. We're actively talking to regional centres about the challenges and opportunities faster rail will bring to their economy."

Southwell is adamant that faster rail will resolve population pressures if regional centres are made attractive.

"For example, lowering operating costs for enterprises in regional towns will attract businesses to the area. Faster rail will provide these businesses will labour markets in the capital cities and provide opportunities for economic development in regional towns.

"That effect is evidenced here in Australia. In Geelong, rail was instrumental in maintaining the attractiveness of the city following the large and sudden downturn in the manufacturing sector. Research and modelling work have shown that the emergence of strong employment centres has been able to attract service jobs, and that was greatly facilitated by an increase in efficient rail services."

Faster rail services are capable of reducing travel time in the corridor even further, from an hour to closer to half an hour, and thus enable more commuters to travel along the rail corridor.

Another challenge the agency will need to soon resolve is cost.

"Studies conducted between 2010 and 2013 on a high-speed rail between Melbourne and Canberra, Sydney and Brisbane found that it would have an estimated construction cost of around $114bn in 2012-dollar terms.

"Noting current construction market pressures and inflation impacts, this figure will increase significantly in today's terms and could be as high as $150 to $200bn.

"Whatever the amount, this is a significant cost, and obviously needs to be considered against all the other projects making up a core share of taxpayer's funds."

The Australasian Rail Association says that it supports the utilisation of innovative financing and funding mechanisms such as "value capture" development opportunities along rail corridors to help fund faster rail infrastructure.

"It will be critical that the Agency, under Mr Broe's leadership, recognises the need to invest in existing and new lines to stretch government dollars and provide a faster rail service offering that meets the needs of the Australian population," ARA chair Danny Broad said.

"In addition to supporting the establishment of new fast rail lines as a means to decentralise Australia's population and support regional development, the
ARA highlights that optimising our existing networks cannot be overlooked," the ARA's Annual Report 2019 said.

"Faster rail can be achieved through upgrades and modifications to existing rail infrastructure, such as passing loops, new signalling systems and level crossing removals."

Meanwhile, the NSW government says it will examine a range of funding options and smart staging, as part of the Fast Rail Network Strategy, to ensure the fast rail network provides value for money.

Each funding option considered as part of the strategy will be assessed based on the estimated cost of the project in light of economic and other benefits to the community, and complementary revenue- generating opportunities.

The state government says that international experience shows that fast rail networks can be delivered in stages, with each stage delivering immediate benefits.

NSW's short- to medium-term focus will be on upgrades and the optimisation of existing rail routes, with dedicated track improvements such as junction rearrangements, curve easing, deviations, passing loops and level crossing removals on existing routes.

Its longer-term focus will be on a dedicated and purpose-built rail line, with new lines and routes, as well as new rolling stock.

According to Southwell, the national agency is cognisant that its work will affect the future of how people live.

"This is no simple task and requires debate and dialogue from all sides of the equation. We're still very new but through ongoing conversations with our key stakeholders, including those in regional communities, we acknowledge that consideration needs to extend well beyond just building a new rail line and a train station," Southwell said.

[verbatim9]

Hopefully Australian kids will be able to wave to a fast electric train with the Fast Rail project being rolled out across the country. #Sydney #Canberra #Newcastle, #Brisbane #Toowoomba #Sunshinecoast #GoldCoast  #Coolangatta, #Melbourne #Geelong #Ballarat #Bendigo @LiberalAus

https://twitter.com/verbatim18/status/1279232393321168896

[verbatim9]

@SEQMayors Remain focussed for the future #Fastrail #Seq #Sequeensland #Queensland #Brisbane #GoldCoast #SunshineCoast

https://twitter.com/verbatim18/status/1279236974952345600

[verbatim9]

Couriermail ---> Blueprint for fast rail plan to unlocked SEQ and create 8000 jobs

A revolutionary blueprint to connect Brisbane to the Gold Coast Sunshine Coast and Toowoomba by fast rail would bust congestion, create more than 8000 jobs and see billions injected into the economy.

A BLUEPRINT for fast rail that would connect Brisbane to the Gold Coast, Sunshine Coast and Toowoomba in as little as 45 minutes would create more than 8000 jobs at its peak as well pouring billions of dollars into the Queensland economy.

Project backers SEQ Mayors are meeting Federal Government ministers from today to brief them on the plan, as it calls on the Queensland Government to give the green light to a business case it says won't cost state taxpayers a cent.

The Courier-Mail can today reveal details of the plan that includes two pricing options - $16.9bn for a "60-minute region" or $28.8bn for the 45-minute option.

The blueprint argues southeast congestion is costing Queensland $6bn a year by 2031 and can only be unclogged with what would be the state's biggest infrastructure project to date.

As well as convincing commuters to finally ditch their cars to get in or out of the CBD, the scheme would unlock massive tourism and business potential, hooking up the southeast's four airports in Brisbane, the Gold and Sunshine coasts and Wellcamp in Toowoomba.

It would also lay the platform for any serious Olympics and Paralympics bid.

Waiting would add billions to the total cost, the mayors say, pointing to the mega-costs of Sydney and Melbourne's attempts at similar projects.

Under the 45-minute scheme, dedicated trains would travel at speeds of more than 160km/h, meaning trips times would be slashed.

Passengers from Ipswich would arrive in 21 minutes, Petrie 12 minutes, Loganlea 19 minutes, Toowoomba 52 minutes, Gold Coast Airport 45 minutes and Caloundra 41 minutes.

The 45-minute Fast Rail Network would generate 4464 jobs a year over two decades, with a peak of 8700 jobs.

The 60-minute option would generate 2619 jobs a year, peaking at 5000.

The mayors say the Commonwealth Government has committed $8 million to explore fast rail between Brisbane to Gold Coast, with another $15 million to explore passenger rail services between Brisbane and Toowoomba.

The North Coast Connect business case has also been completed and is currently sitting with the State Government for its consideration.

They are asking the State Government to commit to investigating fast rail alongside the Federal Government, the Council of Mayors (SEQ) and industry.

They argue while the $5.4bn Cross River Rail will help unchoke the inner city part of the City Train network, the New Generation rollingstock has an average running speed of roughly 6 km/h and a top speed of 140km/h, too slow to offer commuters in the outer rings of South East Queensland a reason to leave their cars behind and use public transport.

Council of Mayors (SEQ) Chair, Lord Mayor Adrian Schrinner said population growth was already outpacing critical infrastructure.

"Our governments need to find a balance between local projects that keep communities moving forward, while planning for the major infrastructure that creates economic uplift and jobs for years to come," Cr Schrinner said.

"A South East Queensland Fast Rail network is the obvious next step beyond Cross River Rail, but we all know these business cases take time. Now is the time to start exploring the possibility of fast rail.

"A Fast Rail network is a critical part of building a successful proposal to secure the 2032 Olympic and Paralympic Games, and supercharging our economic and tourism recovery in the coming decade.

"Business-as-usual won't be enough to reboot our economy, we need our governments to think big."

A State Government spokesperson said it was "already exploring fast rail but it will cost billions of dollars, so any proposal needs to be matched by a genuine Federal Government commitment to invest appropriately in it.

"There are a series of major rail projects like Cross River Rail that need to be completed before any serious conversation about fast heavy rail between the Gold Coast and Brisbane can be considered.

"The current track configuration of the Gold Coast Rail Line between Kuraby and Beenleigh limits the ability for express trains to pass all stops during peak periods.

"It needs to be fixed and the business case for that piece of work is underway now with the Federal Government.

"We're also developing business cases for a passenger line from Salisbury to Beaudesert and between Toowoomba and Brisbane with the Federal Government."

The State Government has already contributed to a fast rail business case now with Infrastructure Australia for fast trains between Nambour and Brisbane with a spur line to Maroochydore, the spokesperson said.

It was also assessing first stage tenders for the $550m Beerburrum to Nambour Sunshine Coast Rail Duplication upgrade.

"Early works will start on that next year and will support almost 350 jobs on the Sunshine Coast."

[Fares_Fair]

Anyone notice anything about Nambour? 

[kram0]

Great idea, but already the state government have excuses to delay a business case. Can't see it happening unfortunately. 

[ozbob]

Sent to all outlets:

Strong support for South East Queensland Fast Rail Network

2nd September 2020

Good Morning,

RAIL Back On Track strongly supports the SEQ Council of Mayors and their vision for a South East Queensland Fast Rail Network (1, 2).

Fast rail is not high speed rail, but rail services operating up to 200-250 km/h to connect the Sunshine Coast, Gold Coast and Toowoomba, with average speeds around 150 km/h.

The SEQ Citytrain network is over tasked and cannot provide fast rail services as is.  The Citytrain network is important for local transport and would continue to operate to fulfill this role on the Sunshine and Gold Coasts.  Fast rail operates in largely dedicated corridors with relatively few stops to reduce journey times by around 60% compared to present rail journey times.

This is the sort of vision that Queensland and Australia needs.  For too long the  fast rail dream has been just that, a dream.

Thanks to the SEQ Council of Mayors for driving the dream to reality.

Best wishes,

Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track https://backontrack.org

References:

1.  SEQ Council of Mayors: South East Queensland on board with fast rail network
https://seqmayors.qld.gov.au/news/DiMd8lEOXQ3fC2OPDtwn



2.  Couriermail: Blueprint for fast rail plan to unlocked SEQ and create 8000 jobs
https://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/future-seq/blueprint-for-fast-rail-plan-to-unlocked-seq-and-create-8000-jobs/news-story/88a8906316d4fc76e5b26c622ec5b69c';

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/railbotforum/status/1300923069611962368

[ozbob]

Strong support for South East Queensland Fast Rail Network 2nd September 2020 Good Morning, RAIL Back On Track...

Posted by RAIL - Back On Track on Tuesday, 1 September 2020

[Gazza]

Anyone notice anything about Nambour? 

Well yeah, obviously a high speed passenger line to the Sunshine Coast is going to go to Maroochydore because that's where the CBD and Airport is.

It's unrealistic to expect the Sunshine Coast to get two high speed branches when everyone else is getting just one.

[beauyboy]

I love how they think we can get from Petrie to Caboolture in 8 minutes. What are they smoking
I also love how the Council of Mayors have no reference to this report on their website!
https://seqmayors.qld.gov.au/

[Gazza]

I love how they think we can get from Petrie to Caboolture in 8 minutes. What are they smoking

https://seqmayors.qld.gov.au/

Thats 21km in 8 mins.
The Mandurah line Achieves 23km in between Warnbro and Mandurah in 13 mins, and that's with B-Series rolling stock.

It's not out of the question with better trains.

[BrizCommuter]

Don't see any mention of the NWTC?

[ozbob]

Don't see any mention of the NWTC?

The SEQ Council of Mayors CEO is well aware of the NWTC.  This is just broad brush stuff.

There is not much chance if the NWTC is not used of running the times touted agreed.

[timh]

Don't see any mention of the NWTC?

The SEQ Council of Mayors CEO is well aware of the NWTC.  This is just broad brush stuff.

There is not much chance if the NWTC is not used of running the times touted agreed.

That was my assumption as well, NWTC would have to be a given to achieve times like this.

If they're quoting $20bn that would be fair to say is eating up a fair chunk of it

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

[verbatim9]

Don't see any mention of the NWTC?

The SEQ Council of Mayors CEO is well aware of the NWTC.  This is just broad brush stuff.

There is not much chance if the NWTC is not used of running the times touted agreed.

That was my assumption as well, NWTC would have to be a given to achieve times like this.

If they're quoting $20bn that would be fair to say is eating up a fair chunk of it

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

Both Toowoomba and the NWTC would require some kind of tunnelling. Maybe the Gold Coast line as well. But there is already an existing tunnel underneath the Gold.Coast Airport for the train, so that is one potential cost out of the way. (OOL tunnel - This was built a few years back when the runway was extended).

[timh]

But there is already an existing tunnel underneath Gold.Coast Airport for the train, so that is one potential cost out of the way.

What where? Do you mean the tunnel that the M1 uses or is there some extra secret tunnel I don't know about?



Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

[verbatim9]

But there is already an existing tunnel underneath Gold.Coast Airport for the train, so that is one potential cost out of the way.

What where? Do you mean the tunnel that the M1 uses or is there some extra secret tunnel I don't know about?



Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

They did a train tunnel as well under the runway for future proofing. So just the approach to the tunnel and the cut and cover station at the terminal needs to be completed.

[Gazza]

It's not really a tunnel, all they did is pour the roof slab simultaneously with the road tunnel, so that in the future they can under mine without disrupting aircraft operations.

[timh]

Ah right cheers for the clarification Verbatim and Gazza. I've never seen anything on a map. Even though it's not a full tunnel I'm glad they did some kind of future proofing (seems to be rare in QLD)

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

[ozbob]

Yo.

https://www.publications.qld.gov.au/dataset/8b150038-4dd7-401c-9495-f1183efc9cf9/resource/810a8b46-8870-4054-abfd-655fb7e62553/fs_download/tugun-bypass-tech-paper-2.pdf

page 6-13.   There is a diagram there as well.

Gold Coast Airport Rail Tunnel Early Works
The rail tunnel under the Gold Coast Airport would be required to service the
proposed rail station adjacent to the existing terminal. Sufficient rail tunnel structure
must be provided to allow the tunnel to be completed in the future with no impact on
the obstacle limitation surface or the proposed main runway extension. Alternatively if
a tunnelling method can be proposed to allow construction of the tunnel structure to
take place under an operating runway in saturated sand, no current works would be
required.
Currently it is proposed that a slab would be constructed for the existing obstacle
limitation surface for the proposed runway/taxiway connection. This will provide
provision for a future rail tunnel to be constructed underneath the slab without
disruption to airport operations.

[red dragin]

QImagery shows the construction in October 2006.


https://imgur.com/gallery/JvcGjyo

[ozbob]

Rail Express --> Fast rail vision for South East Queensland

Mayors from South East Queensland are renewing calls for a fast rail network linking major cities in the region.

The collection of mayors, which covers 10 local government areas from the Sunshine Coast to the Gold Coast and out to Toowoomba, is advocating for a fast rail network that would operate at speeds in excess of 160km/h.

This would contribute to the collective's vision of a 45-minute region, where city to city trips could be completed in 45 minutes.

The Mayors argue that reducing travel times between the nodes of the region would boost economic growth and reduce reliance on private vehicles. A compromise 60-minute region could also generate similar benefits, but with a cheaper price tag.

The Council of Mayors estimate that a 60-minute region would allow for connections between the Brisbane city centre to hubs such as Loganlea within 22 minutes, Ipswich in 24 minutes, and Caboolture in 35 minutes.

The plan also targets rising congestion, and notes that in doing nothing, congestion will cost the region's economy $6 billion by 2031.

Fast rail would also tie together the region's four international airports in Brisbane, the Gold Coast, Sunshine Coast and Toowoomba, enabling increases in visitation and spending. With the region bidding for the Olympic Games in 2032, a fast rail network is seen as needed to move spectators during the event.

The Council of Mayors note that the current Citytrain network is no longer able to service the region's needs with an average running speed on the latest fleet, the New Generation Rollingstock of 60km/h.

"At these speeds, Citytrain is too slow to offer commuters in the outer rings of South East Queensland a reason to leave their cars behind and use public transport," write the Mayors.

Rail advocacy group Rail Back on Track welcomed the group's proposal, noting that current infrastructure was not up to scratch.

"The SEQ Citytrain network is over tasked and cannot provide fast rail services as is," said Robert Dow, administration for Rail Back on Track.

The Council of Mayor said that now was the time to act. '

"The Queensland Government has the option to kickstart the exploration of Fast Rail now and use it as a smart investment for the state's economic recovery – or miss this opportunity and know that the Queensland economy will pay a hefty price for it in years to come."

[verbatim9]

Couriermail --->Blueprint for fast rail plan to unlocked SEQ and create 8000 jobs

Brisbane Times ---> Ticket to ride at 160km/h as Queensland works on two Fast Rail cases

The Queensland government is working on two separate business cases for futuristic 160km/h Fast Rail links in the state's south-east.

The first business case is a proposed link between Maroochydore and Nambour on the Sunshine Coast and Brisbane.

The second proposes a link between Brisbane and the Gold Coast.

Under the Fast Rail concept, conventional trains with modifications would traverse railway tracks at speeds up to 160km/h, similar to Queensland's Tilt Train speeds.

The trains would be slower than the High Speed Rail concept being floated separately by federal MPs, an idea similar to Japan's 300km/h bullet trains.

The first $10 million Fast Rail business case, being promoted by Sunshine Coast federal MP Ted O'Brien, is being evaluated by Queensland's Department of Transport and Main Roads.

It has been developed by LNP federal ministers on the Sunshine Coast with a consortium of large developers including SMEC, Stockland, Urbis and KPMG, all of whom have major residential projects on the Sunshine Coast.

The state government has evaluated other Sunshine Coast rail line projects - worth $790 million - which would be upgraded and used in the Fast Rail concept.

The second $22 million business case examines a link between Brisbane and the Gold Coast.

This business case, established in February and expected to be finished in late 2022, has attracted $14 million in contributions from the Queensland government and $8 million from the federal government.

Transport Minister Mark Bailey said while considerable work was being done to evaluate Fast Rail, moving beyond business case concepts depended on substantial funding from the federal government.

"We all know Fast Rail technology is expensive," Mr Bailey said.

"That is why any move in that direction would need to involve a substantial federal government commitment."

Mr Bailey said the Queensland government was forced to fund Brisbane's $5.4 billion Cross River Rail project – which will provide better rail links between the Gold and Sunshine coasts – with no help from the federal government.

"Cross River Rail is a really important part of getting a faster rail network and we are building that now," Mr Bailey said.

"We have 20 per cent of it built already.

"So there is a lot of work being done in this space already.

"Getting the preparation work for the next phase [Fast Rail] is important, but Cross River Rail, when it opens, will cut travel time for people particularly on the Gold and Sunshine Coast lines by more than 10 minutes."

South-east Queensland's Council of Mayors has continually floated a faster rail network as important to remove congestion.

More than 18 months ago the Council of Mayors released a mass transit ideas forum where a suite of futuristic transport projects were canvassed.

Collectively those projects, some of which were under way, had a value of $64 billion.

However, there has only been road funding announced from the federal government since May 2019, with the likelihood of larger funding promises stalled by the delay in the South East Queensland City Deal in July 2020 and the COVID-19 pandemic.

^^The Federal Government is currently funding a business case for the Toowoomba alignment. Tony Moore hasn't mentioned this?

[achiruel]

I don't think 160 is fast enough. I reckon we need to be targeting a 200 km/h top speed in order to achieve the time targets mentioned earlier in this thread. Limited stops also, e.g. to SC: Roma St, Petrie, Caboolture, Beerwah, Caloundra, Kawana, Maroochydore. Suburban tracks can be built in the same corridor between Beerwah and Maroochydore, and pax from intermediate stations van interchange. There'll be more incentive to do so when the connecting service is that fast. Maroochydore local service can probably be a shuttle terminating at Beerwah. Suburban terminus (off-peak) to be extended from Caboolture to Beerwah.

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/9NewsQueensland/status/1301075005682397184

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/7NewsBrisbane/status/1301073945647480832

[SurfRail]

They are deluded if they think they are going to get a train from Brisbane to Caboolture on the existing alignment in less than 45 minutes, let alone beyond it.

[timh]

They are deluded if they think they are going to get a train from Brisbane to Caboolture on the existing alignment in less than 45 minutes, let alone beyond it.

Do you think the times are impossible even with NWTC? Would that sort of time require an entirely new alignment (ie a dead straight tunnel or something), or would other minor upgrades be needed? Or is it literally impossible?

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

[Arnz]

Brisbane to Caboolture in 45 mins alome is Tilt Train/Gympie North territory.  They'd have to be delusional even if it's a Brisbane to Caboolture only leg like the Tilt Trains

[red dragin]

Brisbane to Caboolture on the current route in 20 minutes requires average speed of 150km/hr.

Using the TGV acceleration rate, it takes ~90 seconds (and 2km) to hit 150km/hr, say three minutes and 3km to brake. On the 'back of a napkin' requires a sustained speed of 180km/hr between Brisbane and Caboolture. Nearly triple the tilt train average speed of about 66km/hr.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Brisbane to Caboolture in 45 mins alome is Tilt Train/Gympie North territory.  They'd have to be delusional even if it's a Brisbane to Caboolture only leg like the Tilt Trains

Tilts/rollingstock can be faster on the current alignment. Problem is they hunt down all stoppers and run slower as a result. Also with a few tweaks the track speed can be increased again. Problem is we still have a large amount of rollingstock speed limited.

[BrizCommuter]

They are deluded if they think they are going to get a train from Brisbane to Caboolture on the existing alignment in less than 45 minutes, let alone beyond it.

Do they really mean the northern edge of Brisbane?