Salary packaging bus fares

[Derwan]

It looks like salary packaging of public transport is back!  But it only looks like bus fares.  It'll be available for more than just public servants - provided your employer does salary packaging through Remserv.  (Don't know if others will be able to provide it.)

News story here: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/eligible-commuters-to-enjoy-taxfree-bus-travel-under-new-scheme-20160310-gng1bb.html

Remserv info here: http://www.remserv.com.au/salary-packaging/what-can-i-salary-package/bus-travel-benefit

Looks like it's a special Go Card that will be used for the benefit - and it will only be for travel "to and from work" - although I don't know how they'll limit that.

[aldonius]

Looks like it's a special Go Card that will be used for the benefit - and it will only be for travel "to and from work" - although I don't know how they'll limit that.

I presume that the employer will have access to the journey history. Organisational process, not a technical restriction.

[Derwan]

I presume that the employer will have access to the journey history. Organisational process, not a technical restriction.

Yeah.  At the moment the info is only up for non-government employers/employees.  It'll be interesting to see how it works for public servants.  I know the HR areas aren't going to bother going through the Go Card histories of thousands of employees!

I'll be keeping an eye out for an email from Remserv. 

Strange that trains aren't included!

[SurfRail]

Further fracturing of the ticketing system.  Why not available for all fares?   

[ozbob]

Brisbanetimes --> Eligible commuters to enjoy tax-free bus travel under new scheme

... Transport Minister Stirling Hinchliffe enthusiastically welcomed the plan, urging the Federal Government to extend the concession to all public transport, not least because it will help lessen the fare price headache faced by the State.

The State is sitting on a fare review it commissioned last year, which is designed to help address public transport patronage and costs ...

[ozbob]

Sent to all outlets:

11th March 2016

Salary packaging bus fares - needs to include all modes

Greetings,

RAIL - Back on Track welcomes the return of salary packaging to public transport. The previous limitation of that benefit to private cars represents an indefensible financial penalty to anyone who doesn't drive to work.

However, we have one major concern - it seems this will only be available on buses [1, 2]. The strength of all transport networks lies in their integration. In the case of the TransLink network, the lynchpin of integration is the fare system.

A great many people catch trains, trams or ferries in their commute. Why on earth can't they also benefit from salary packaging?

We look forward to a future ruling from the Australian Tax Office that salary packaging will be permitted across all modes of travel.

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

References:

1. http://www.remserv.com.au/salary-packaging/what-can-i-salary-package/bus-travel-benefit
2. http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/eligible-commuters-to-enjoy-taxfree-bus-travel-under-new-scheme-20160310-gng1bb.html

[ozbob]

Twitter

Robert Dow ‏@Robert_Dow 3h

Latest: Salary packaging bus fares - needs to include all modes

> http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=12094.msg170598#msg170598 ...

#qldpol @StirlHinchliffe @TransLinkSEQ @TMRQld


==================

Twitter

Stirling Hinchliffe  ‏@StirlHinchliffe

Absolutely @Robert_Dow we all need to lobby the Federal Govt to reform tax laws so all commuters can benefit - encouraging efficient PT.

[verbatim9]

Its about time and at least its a start in the right direction. Other countries allow tax deduction for PT use to and from work.

[ozbob]

[SurfRail]

I remember the bad old days from 2012 to 2015 where his government squibbed on literally everything transport related.

No fare review
Fare increases
No bus network review for Brisbane
Decimated local bus services elsewhere
No upgrades not already programmed by the previous government
No new public transport infrastructure projects commenced
Cancelled TripTracker and implemented an inferior system instead

[Derwan]

Scott Emerson is a dick!  The LNP raised fares twice by 7.5% - around 3 or 4 times inflation - and only reduced and froze fares because of the scrapping of the carbon tax.

The Bligh and Newman governments were as bad as each other when it came to public transport fares.

We finally have a fare review underway and it sounds like things will be shaken up significantly.  We don't know whether fares will go up or down - I'm hoping down for the majority.  (Otherwise what's the point?)

In the meantime, the bus fare salary packaging will offer some relief to some people.  Unfortunately what it will likely do is push more people onto buses when they have a choice between bus and train.  This will cause further delays to buses and create the need for more buses - adding to road congestion.

Someone really stuffed this one up, whether it's the ATO, Remserv or the QLD Government.  Salary Packaging should be across all modes.

[techblitz]

nevertheless he may still be vindicated if any of the following 2 scenarios eventuate.....
the fare review is cancelled/backburnered......and/or so much as 1 commuter ends up paying more than what they are now.....
this is why its best just to ignore him....dont do any pointless emerson polls or media releases until the fare review proposals are released.It can still turn out bad for either red or blue....

[ozbob]

The LNP lacked the courage to do a proper fare review. There will always be winners and losers out of a structural reform process.  It will be what is the outcome for the majority and how that will drive patronage that is the real determinate of success.  The 9 and free does not work, the data in estimates last year confirmed that.  It is strange that Sydney has come to the same conclusion with respect to their 8 and free.  The only two jurisdictions with that failed fare structure.

And important part of the review is setting up a transition structure for next generation ticketing as well.  Emerson is just bleating in the dark.

[Derwan]

A comment on Brisbane Times:

The old rule allowing travel (that has been removed) for public servants was a different area of FBT law (inhouse benefit).

Looking at the current law, it will only apply to buses because they are a motor vehicle (the particular exemption Remserv are relying on only covers motor vehicle travel). Remserv have a fairly strict arrangement to limit travel to buses and only to/from work (otherwise it is not exempt under FBT law).

The rules aren't different to Remserv or any particular employer, so any employer could offer, but would need to acquire and issue their own go cards to employees and ensure employees only use the go cards for buses to/from work (or for work travel).

[ozbob]

Agree Derwan, this ' salary sacrifice ' for bus only is madness ...   

Australian Government & Bureaucracy is really very incompetent.  It is absurd that it applies to motor vehicles but not other public transport vehicles. 

The administrative complexity is going to be considerable for all smart card jurisdictions. 

[ozbob]

Media Statements
Minister for Transport and the Commonwealth Games
The Honourable Stirling Hinchliffe
Friday, March 11, 2016

Queensland leads the nation with tax-free bus travel

In an Australian first, eligible bus commuters in South East Queensland will soon be able to salary sacrifice their travel to and from work.

Minister for Transport Stirling Hinchliffe said the new Bus Travel Benefit smartcard developed by TransLink could see regular bus commuters save hundreds of dollars a year based on their annual earnings.

"This is the first time in Australian history a dedicated smartcard will be made available for eligible employees to use to salary package their travel to and from work by bus," Mr Hinchliffe said.

"Salary sacrificing is something thousands of Australians are already benefiting from in salary packaging schemes, but with this new scheme eligible Queenslanders will be able to significantly save a lot on their annual bus travel to work."

Mr Hinchliffe said the Palaszczuk Government supported the benefit to encourage more employees to choose public transport but called on the Australian Government to extend tax concessions for public transport users.

"This is a fantastic initiative, but I urge the Australian Government to extend this benefit to employees who travel on rail, tram or by ferry," Mr Hinchliffe said.

"The tax ruling should be expanded because many commuters use more than one mode of public transport for their journey and all eligible users should benefit from the scheme.

"Federal tax rules allow employees to salary-package a car, and if we're serious about encouraging more people to choose public transport, trains, trams and ferries must be part of the tax ruling."

The Bus Travel Benefit smartcard will be just like the standard go card but travel funds will be sourced from pre-tax income deposited into a special account, by an employer or salary packaging provider, for use on bus travel between the employee's place of residence and work.

The benefit at this stage applies for bus travel only and will be available in Queensland via private sector employers and salary packaging providers who have gained a ruling from the Australian Tax Office.

The Palaszczuk Government is supporting the rollout of the new Bus Travel Benefit smartcard later in the year as a way to help bus travellers to maximise their income. The product is currently in pilot testing and is due for launch in the second half of 2016. Visit www.translink.com.au (external site) to keep up to date with the latest on the product launch.

[ozbob]

Twitter

Robert Dow ‏@Robert_Dow now Brisbane, Queensland

The public transport network in SEQ is being destroyed by crass politics & bumbling bureaucracy .. the hallmark is anti-integration #qldpol

[SurfRail]

I don't think this is actually something to criticise at a local level.  The problem is very clearly one at the Commonwealth's end and they are the people we should be getting up.

I'd rather see this happen, even if it is only for buses at present, than not happen at all.

[ozbob]

Exactly.  We outlined that view earlier today. 

There is no denying though that the network is becoming more fragmented.  This just exacerbates it.

[Derwan]

I'd rather see this happen, even if it is only for buses at present, than not happen at all.

I agree as well.  Introducing this actually highlights the issue with tax law (assuming the BT comment is correct).  An employer can apply for an FBT exemption for a motor vehicle but not public transport.  It's basically a loophole that it can be applied to buses.  The tax law needs to be changed to allow for all types of public transport - and this initiative will hopefully highlight that.

Fortunately for me, I became a bus person in January. 

That's got me thinking though.  When I was living in Boondall, I'd catch the train to South Bank and then a bus to Woolloongabba.  This resulted in in the train leg being charged (3 zones) but not the bus leg (within the same zones).  For the reverse trip, the bus leg would be charged for two zones, then the train leg would have the extra added for the 3rd zone.

Under the salary sacrificing initiative, it simply wouldn't be worth doing it for the bus leg.  A separate card would need to be used for the train leg, effectively increasing the cost of the whole trip.

So this won't even help everyone who uses buses and have access to salary sacrificing - not if they need to use other modes as well as bus.

[ozbob]

Twitter

Robert Dow ‏@Robert_Dow now Brisbane, Queensland

. @TurnbullMalcolm You are aware of this PM?

> http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=12094.0 ...

Needs to be ALL modes don't you think? #auspol #qldpol

[#Metro]

Looking at the current law, it will only apply to buses because they are a motor vehicle (the particular exemption Remserv are relying on only covers motor vehicle travel). Remserv have a fairly strict arrangement to limit travel to buses and only to/from work (otherwise it is not exempt under FBT law).

I don't get it. If someone takes an electric car, is that exempt also? What about Qurks metro on rubber tyres - does that qualify for salary packaging if it runs on the busway (a road).

The mind boggles. Why does it matter what kind of wheel you took to get into the CBD?

The CityCat has diesel motors and is a motor vehicle? What about that??

[SurfRail]

Every single public transport vehicle is motorised.

The ATO ruling must be particularly narrow.  Remember they aren't concerned with anything other than revenue, so idiotic results do abound.

[#Metro]

There is a public rulings process:

https://www.ato.gov.au/General/ato-advice-and-guidance/ato-advice-products-(rulings)/public-rulings/public-rulings-process/

Not sure what rules the current salary packages manage to get under?

Digging up this info would be good for the Fares Review Panel IMHO. State Gov can get public servants to figure out how it happened.

[newbris]

Should be able to salary sacrifice bicycles as well.

[ozbob]

Should be able to salary sacrifice bicycles as well.

Agree with this.  I even mentioned it to a radio journalist yesterday as very reasonable, in view of the bus fare salary packaging move.

[aldonius]

There were a number of arguments floating around a couple of years ago that with the end of car manufacturing here, salary-sacrificing transport spending should be abolished altogether. I have a lot of sympathy for that viewpoint.

I mean if you allow PT and bikes you better allow walking too. At this stage, the cost of transport is new shoes every couple of years, which is about two orders of magnitude below a car.

[ozbob]

I expect that would be the sensible thing to do Aldonius, stop it all.   However ...

[ozbob]

http://translink.com.au/tickets-and-fares/ticket-types/business/bus-travel-benefit

go Bus Travel Benefit (coming soon)

[#Metro]

It is like, I am watching the entire TransLink integrated ticketing and fares being dismantled before my very eyes. 

[ozbob]

Yep.  I think I will put on an extra Lotto ticket tonight!   

[ozbob]

I am starting to wonder if TransLink is even needed ... they are unable to do much except political will and begging tricks.

The authorities have moved heaven and earth on this in a few days.  But unemployed still do not have concession fares - ALP Policy Sept 2014.  This shows the real priorities huh?

It is getting rather farcical.  More sub types of go cards than zones almost.  The average punter is still being shafted though.

Queenslander!

[#Metro]

It is like they are already in Caretaker mode after just 1 year.

They're very careful now. Farting could trigger an election. 

Can't continue like this forever. Something will give in the end.

They should have proportional representation in the Parliament. It is effectively multi-party now already, complete

with Katter, Independents cross-bench and equal opposing sides. Just needs a few greens to make it complete.

[ozbob]

So, settle back and hope that your personal Rocket Bus is on the way hey?   

What a fuking mess it is ...

[ozbob]

I am starting to wonder if TransLink is even needed ... they are unable to do much except political will and begging tricks.

The authorities have moved heaven and earth on this in a few days.  But unemployed still do not have concession fares - ALP Policy Sept 2014.  This shows the real priorities huh?

It is getting rather farcical.  More sub types of go cards than zones almost.  The average punter is still being shafted though.

Queenslander!

A comment on RBoT face book

" Why was this move even considered when unemployed people do not currently get a travel concession? Instead the state government hand out another tax break, showing exactly what their priorities are. "

[techblitz]

I am starting to wonder if TransLink is even needed ... they are unable to do much except political will and begging tricks.

they are basically there to record the data and stats and pass customer complaints to operators...thats about the extent they have with current staff levels.....
Really those stats that they process should give them ample scope to implement proper & accurate timetables,plan routes effectively and set effective and fair(unemployed concession) fare structures.......yep ozbob....lack of staff/dept funding is the hinderance....

[ozbob]

Yope ... TransLink was gutted by the Newman Cut Mob, has never recovered.   The mess just compounds daily now ...

Western bus mess just another sign TB.  They can't say we haven't tried ...

[newbris]

There were a number of arguments floating around a couple of years ago that with the end of car manufacturing here, salary-sacrificing transport spending should be abolished altogether. I have a lot of sympathy for that viewpoint.

I mean if you allow PT and bikes you better allow walking too. At this stage, the cost of transport is new shoes every couple of years, which is about two orders of magnitude below a car.

Source: http://movingforward.discoursemedia.org

Yes, if we are anything similar to this Canadian example, the subsidys should begin with encouraging walkers and cyclists and then work upwards from there, not the other way around. Every 1% extra we can get walking or cycling will result in massive public spending savings. On the level above the same can be said for getting people out of cars and onto public transport.

Car commuting is massively subsidised without needing salary sacrificing thrown in as well. We are throwing money down the drain with our short sightedness.

[ozbob]

Sent to all outlets:

19th July 2016

Bus Travel Benefit Smart Card

Greetings,

RAIL Back on Track welcomes the Australian Taxation Office ruling that bus commutes can be included in salary packaging arrangements. It has been a long-standing perk for car drivers so we welcome the levelling of the playing field here, even if for buses only at present.

However, there is still more work to be done. The Australian Tax Office ruling appears to discriminate between public transport modes. Why does it matter whether one gets to work on a vehicle that has rubber tyres, versus a vehicle with steel wheels or perhaps a propeller?

We welcome Transport Minister Hinchliffe's calls to extend the arrangements to all of modes of public transport. We support the Queensland Government's attempts to get Federal Government support to broaden the tax ruling to include rail, ferries and trams particularly.  It is absurd and discriminatory to not do that.

Nevertheless, this ruling, together with the Queensland Government's excellent work on much needed and long awaited whole-of-system SEQ fare reforms will bring down the cost of public transport for all workers who use public transport.

The Queensland Government must be congratulated for taking decisive action to fix South East Queensland's diabolical fare system, which was the perverse result of years of petty and crass politics in Parliament.

For those who are currently out of work, we reaffirm our support for extending concessions to unemployed and health care card holders. Queensland is the only state that does not extend concessions to this group.

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org


Reference:

Government has had tax ruling, which could lower bus travel costs, for six years
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/government-has-had-tax-ruling-which-could-lower-bus-travel-costs-for-six-years-20160718-gq8fwp.html

[ozbob]

Sent to all outlets 19th July 2016

11th March 2016  resent 19th July 2016

Salary packaging bus fares - needs to include all modes

Greetings,

RAIL - Back on Track welcomes the return of salary packaging to public transport. The previous limitation of that benefit to private cars represents an indefensible financial penalty to anyone who doesn't drive to work.

However, we have one major concern - it seems this will only be available on buses [1, 2]. The strength of all transport networks lies in their integration. In the case of the TransLink network, the lynchpin of integration is the fare system.

A great many people catch trains, trams or ferries in their commute. Why on earth can't they also benefit from salary packaging?

We look forward to a future ruling from the Australian Tax Office that salary packaging will be permitted across all modes of travel.

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

References:

1. http://www.remserv.com.au/salary-packaging/what-can-i-salary-package/bus-travel-benefit
2. http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/eligible-commuters-to-enjoy-taxfree-bus-travel-under-new-scheme-20160310-gng1bb.html

Sent to all outlets:

19th July 2016

Bus Travel Benefit Smart Card

Greetings,

RAIL Back on Track welcomes the Australian Taxation Office ruling that bus commutes can be included in salary packaging arrangements. It has been a long-standing perk for car drivers so we welcome the levelling of the playing field here, even if for buses only at present.

However, there is still more work to be done. The Australian Tax Office ruling appears to discriminate between public transport modes. Why does it matter whether one gets to work on a vehicle that has rubber tyres, versus a vehicle with steel wheels or perhaps a propeller?

We welcome Transport Minister Hinchliffe's calls to extend the arrangements to all of modes of public transport. We support the Queensland Government's attempts to get Federal Government support to broaden the tax ruling to include rail, ferries and trams particularly.  It is absurd and discriminatory to not do that.

Nevertheless, this ruling, together with the Queensland Government's excellent work on much needed and long awaited whole-of-system SEQ fare reforms will bring down the cost of public transport for all workers who use public transport.

The Queensland Government must be congratulated for taking decisive action to fix South East Queensland's diabolical fare system, which was the perverse result of years of petty and crass politics in Parliament.

For those who are currently out of work, we reaffirm our support for extending concessions to unemployed and health care card holders. Queensland is the only state that does not extend concessions to this group.

Best wishes,
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org


Reference:

Government has had tax ruling, which could lower bus travel costs, for six years
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/government-has-had-tax-ruling-which-could-lower-bus-travel-costs-for-six-years-20160718-gq8fwp.html