Cross Border Commission 90 min interval Bus Varsity Lakes to Byron Bay

[verbatim9]

Cross Border Commission Varsity Lakes to Byron Bay Translink Bus running every 90 mins 6 am till 7pm EST  7am till 8pm EDT?

[verbatim9]

Would be worth while for NSW to throw some money at. The bus could service the Qld side Express Varsity Lakes or Robina via the Freeway to (Airport 20mins max) Coolangatta, South Tweed, Casuarina Freeway to Byron shire?

Total travelling time en route 80-90min

Comparable to traveling to Noosa with PT from BNE! ?

[SurfRail]

I can't make head or tail of this.

Is it proposed?  Is it an unsolicited proposal?  Is there really a need for this given the density of bus services already available between SEQ and Byron?

It is far more important to spend money on the existing routes all through the Northern Rivers (eg the 603, 605, 640 etc).

[verbatim9]

Unsolicited Idea better connection to the Airport and major shopping precinct for Northern NSW and a Express link to Coolangatta Airport for those that use it on the Southside of BNE to the coast

[Arnz]

As long as "parochiality" exists, Queensland would not want to subsidise NSW PT services and vice-versa. 

XPT (CountryLink/NSW TrainLink) services uses ARTC owned standard gauge track interstate in Melbourne and Brisbane.  Hence the interstate services.

[ozbob]

I am not sure what this thread is about.   

[verbatim9]

Potential of services

[ozbob]

Ah ... got it.  Thanks.

As Arnz has suggested dual jurisdiction, might be a bridge too far for TransLink and Transport for NSW.


https://www.google.com.au/maps/dir/Varsity+Lakes+QLD/Byron+Bay+NSW/@-28.3604557,153.2260558,10z/data=!4m14!4m13!1m5!1m1!1s0x6b910338cd26908d:0x502a35af3deddb0!2m2!1d153.4223528!2d-28.0859948!1m5!1m1!1s0x6b9062852d3e762b:0x40609b49043f2d0!2m2!1d153.6123788!2d-28.6441616!3e3

[verbatim9]

80km each way can commuter  busses manage that distance economically ? At the moment 4 hours with PT from Robina to Byron Bay almost inaccessible!

[ozbob]

It is not the distance, it is getting cooperation from both jurisdictions to deliver it.

[James]

Snowball's chance in hell of getting cross-border cooperation. We saw how much of a disaster funding was for the Tugun Bypass, and that was with Labor governments in BOTH Qld and NSW. Getting cooperation on transit would be even harder. The fact Byron is out of range of PT beyond the TrainLink (NSW) network is a sign that there simply isn't the demand there for a state-run PT service.

Really, we need to think about improving transit closer to home/where improvements will be cheaper or easier to implement. We can't even get a bus on roads with city views and apartment blocks after 6pm on Sundays or 8pm on any other night of the week (or if the services do exist, they're hourly). I think throwing up needless foam into the forums is detracting from the overall quality of discussion. As Bob has mentioned, politicians (both government and opposition), media and the general public do read this forum, and I think we need to be conscious that we suggest considered ideas (e.g. integrating the Tweed area to become part of TransLink) rather than crazy ideas.

Perhaps time for a sandbox forum where we can let our go? I love a good foam party.... maglev buses to Caboolture, tilting trains from Roma St to Nerang in less than an hour and triple decker buses running between Oakey and Goodna station every 15 minutes stopping at the Rosalie shops! Woo hoo!

[#Metro]

Snowball's chance in hell of getting cross-border cooperation. We saw how much of a disaster funding was for the Tugun Bypass, and that was with Labor governments in BOTH Qld and NSW. Getting cooperation on transit would be even harder. The fact Byron is out of range of PT beyond the TrainLink (NSW) network is a sign that there simply isn't the demand there for a state-run PT service.

Europe does co-operation much better. Their trains run in multiple countries, no trouble! Makes cross-border relations here look a bit silly.

[verbatim9]

Snowball's chance in hell of getting cross-border cooperation. We saw how much of a disaster funding was for the Tugun Bypass, and that was with Labor governments in BOTH Qld and NSW. Getting cooperation on transit would be even harder. The fact Byron is out of range of PT beyond the TrainLink (NSW) network is a sign that there simply isn't the demand there for a state-run PT service.

Europe does co-operation much better. Their trains run in multiple countries, no trouble! Makes cross-border relations here look a bit silly.

I agree overseas they seem to get it right. You never know a project like this may even attract Federal funds in the future. Remember it's a bus service to give people independence from private vehicles and combat congestion. Its not a huge infrastructure project far from a pipe dream.

[SurfRail]

Really, we need to think about improving transit closer to home/where improvements will be cheaper or easier to implement. We can't even get a bus on roads with city views and apartment blocks after 6pm on Sundays or 8pm on any other night of the week (or if the services do exist, they're hourly). I think throwing up needless foam into the forums is detracting from the overall quality of discussion. As Bob has mentioned, politicians (both government and opposition), media and the general public do read this forum, and I think we need to be conscious that we suggest considered ideas (e.g. integrating the Tweed area to become part of TransLink) rather than crazy ideas.

Indeed.

Unfortunately, the political reality is that even simple, logical steps like proper cross-border ticketing to allow go card to be used on Surfside's entire network is unachievable.  I have some corro from Aunty Gladys' office when she was still in charge of Transport saying that they had no interest in it.  I've been writing to transport ministers on both sides of the border since Paul Lucas and nothing happens. 

The Cross Border Commissioner seems to only be concerned with taxi demarcation issues when it comes to transport.

[James]

I agree overseas they seem to get it right. You never know a project like this may even attract Federal funds in the future. Remember it's a bus service to give people independence from private vehicles and combat congestion. Its not a huge infrastructure project far from a pipe dream.

There are two reasons to introduce a PT service:
1. Coverage (social need) - there is a need to provide access to basic services (e.g. health services, retail and limited recreational services) for people who are unable to access these facilities via other means (e.g. those without cars, those too immobile to walk).
2. Patronage (economic need) - there is demand for these services because they are cheaper to use (after taking into account fares, transit times and other costs).
There is no social need for a service between Robina and Byron - anybody making this trip is doing it for a leisure (or unusually, a business purpose) and as such, the individual should bear the costs of making this trip. There is no economic need for a service between Robina and Byron aside from on the odd day or two where the highway becomes congested, and even then, you likely wouldn't get people abandoning their cars due to this occurring at holiday times when people want their car/local PT is non-existent.

With this potential service failing these two tests, a service is not required. You can still have independence from a private vehicle - just pony up and pay $60 to travel by Greyhound to/from Byron. There are 5 services a day, plenty to choose from and at speeds which are quite competitive with the car. Your proposed service would only have 8 services per day anyway, some of which would connect with services at low demand times.

[verbatim9]

Just questioning the (anti  social need) The Tweed and Byron shire has a population catchment of 120,000 plus Tourists

[SurfRail]

With this potential service failing these two tests, a service is not required. You can still have independence from a private vehicle - just pony up and pay $60 to travel by Greyhound to/from Byron. There are 5 services a day, plenty to choose from and at speeds which are quite competitive with the car. Your proposed service would only have 8 services per day anyway, some of which would connect with services at low demand times.

Plus the Premier services, plus the various other non-stop services from Brisbane, and from Surfers, and from OOL.  For the size of the town, it has to have amongst the best regional long-distance bus services in NSW.

What's missing is better local services like along the Tweed Coast, or between Mullumbimby, Byron and Ballina, or Ballina, Bangalow and Lismore.  These are patchy at best, and the study into bringing back the Murwillumbah line concluded the best thing that could be done would be to spend the money on getting some of these up to half-hourly headways well into the evening - certainly more useful than resurrecting the railway for a once-daily train to Sydney.

[Arnz]

Snowball's chance in hell of getting cross-border cooperation. We saw how much of a disaster funding was for the Tugun Bypass, and that was with Labor governments in BOTH Qld and NSW. Getting cooperation on transit would be even harder. The fact Byron is out of range of PT beyond the TrainLink (NSW) network is a sign that there simply isn't the demand there for a state-run PT service.

Europe does co-operation much better. Their trains run in multiple countries, no trouble! Makes cross-border relations here look a bit silly.

Sadly though, this is a "STRAYA!!!!" issue due to the issues mentioned previously, with the Tugun Bypass highlighted as 1 major example.