Daylight saving - discussion

[achiruel]

I really wish DST proponents would stop wheeling out this myth that it will reduce electricity consumption.

Maybe it works in Sydney and Melbourne. But there is no way in hell it will in subtropical and tropical Queensland. Probably the reverse.

[timh]

I really wish DST proponents would stop wheeling out this myth that it will reduce electricity consumption.

Maybe it works in Sydney and Melbourne. But there is no way in hell it will in subtropical and tropical Queensland. Probably the reverse.

That's what I keep saying. Proponents for DST say that the extra daylight at the end of the day (when you're awake and want to do stuff) means you can spend the daylight walking, socialising, exercising outdoors, feeling safe walking home, whatever. They seem to forget though that dst is loved in Melbourne coz they want ever last ounce they can get coz the place is quite often cold and miserable. As I've said before, why would anyone in Queensland want MORE sun at the end of a hot work day? Id rather they do the opposite so it gets darker sooner... It's too hot. And you're right, would simply increase electricity consumption due to AC

[verbatim9]

ABC Facebook Page-----> Introduction of Daylight Saving gaining momentum

[verbatim9]

ABC Facebook Page-----> Introduction of Daylight Saving gaining momentum

^^24K votes and counting

[Gazza]

69% Nice

[ozbob]

https://twitter.com/DaylightTimes/status/1179635644965900288

[achiruel]

ABC Facebook Page-----> Introduction of Daylight Saving gaining momentum

As with every other self-selected poll ever, the results are utterly meaningless.

Daylight Savings is simply not a sensible idea for Queensland. End of story.

[verbatim9]

9news.com.au-----> Should Queensland adopt daylight saving?

Should Queensland adopt daylight saving?

OCTOBER 03, 2019


If you've spent the last six months in Melbourne or Sydney snuggled up in an electric blanket with a cup of tea, the thought of a stroll in the soft sunlight of a balmy summer evening is understandably delightful.

People in NSW, Victoria, South Australia, Tasmania and the ACT will eagerly move their clocks forward an hour on Sunday night to mark the beginning of daylight saving time.

A sunset in Brisbane. (AAP)

But Queensland is huge, and as is the case with many things, the south-east corner has a different opinion to the rest of the state.

The state's sweltering north and west are not yearning for more hours in the afternoon sun – quite the opposite.

If you live in the tropics, where it didn't fall below 17C all winter, and you're staring down the barrel of long summer days exceeding 40C, the last thing you want is that skin-searing fireball hanging around any later than necessary.

Queensland last trialled daylight saving from 1989 to 1992. After the trial, Queenslanders were asked to vote in a referendum with the question: "Are you in favour of daylight saving?".

A 54.5 per cent "no" vote was returned. Unsurprisingly, the "no" vote was strongest in the north and west while the south-east returned a strong "yes" vote.

The sun sets in the Whitsundays. (AAP)A sunset in the outback Queensland town of Winton. (AAP)

The notion of splitting the state into two separate time zones was later rejected by Queensland Premier Anna Bligh in 2007, despite being lauded as a "pragmatic" approach by then Prime Minister John Howard.

Queensland Premier Annastacia Palaszczuk is personally in favour of daylight saving, however she, Labor and the LNP are in agreement that they won't prioritise another vote on daylight saving because they don't want to divide Queenslanders.

And as experts frequently cite the many benefits to daylight saving, including reductions in crime, reduced energy consumption, and an economic boost, is it time for Queensland to move forward?

[achiruel]

Once again, the media persists with this furphy that DST will reduce energy costs. It won't. The evident is that in tropical and subtropical regions, DST increases energy consumption.

Even for Australian states where daylight savings currently exists, it results in an increase in energy consumption. DST advocates need to stop pushing this lie.

https://voxeu.org/article/daylight-saving-saves-no-energy

[verbatim9]

Once again, the media persists with this furphy that DST will reduce energy costs. It won't. The evident is that in tropical and subtropical regions, DST increases energy consumption.

Even for Australian states where daylight savings currently exists, it results in an increase in energy consumption. DST advocates need to stop pushing this lie.

https://voxeu.org/article/daylight-saving-saves-no-energy

When I lived in the Southern States over the  summers  the electricity bill was considerably cheaper. You rarely use air con.  Plus lights were never used until 8-8.30pm. It also encourages an active lifestyle after work in the evenings with the ability to use parks and beaches without the security concern.

Singapore and Malaysia both have permanent Daylight Saving since the 70s. Even though they are in the equatorial zone the Government decided to make use of the best available light. Sunrise is around 7am with sunset at 7.30pm. Thus I don't agree with statements saying that Daylight Saving is not suited to Cairns because it's closer to the tropics.  It would actually suit that region as well due to tourism ensuring tourists make the most out of their day. If Cairns had Daylight Saving on 20 Dec, their Sunrise would be at 6.40am and Sunset at 7.50pm.

[verbatim9]

Once again, the media persists with this furphy that DST will reduce energy costs. It won't. The evident is that in tropical and subtropical regions, DST increases energy consumption.

Even for Australian states where daylight savings currently exists, it results in an increase in energy consumption. DST advocates need to stop pushing this lie.

https://voxeu.org/article/daylight-saving-saves-no-energy

When I lived in the Southern States over the  summers  the electricity bill was considerably cheaper. You rarely use air con.  Plus lights were never used until 8-8.30pm. It also encourages an active lifestyle after work in the evenings with the ability to use parks and beaches without the security concern.

Singapore and Malaysia both have permanent Daylight Saving since the 70s. Even though they are in the equatorial zone the Government decided to make use of the best available light. Sunrise is around 7am with sunset at 7.30pm. Thus I don't agree with statements saying that Daylight Saving is not suited to Cairns because it's closer to the tropics.  It would actually suit that region as well due to tourism ensuring tourists make the most out of their day. If Cairns had Daylight Saving on 20 Dec, their Sunrise would be at 6.40am and Sunset at 7.50pm.

I haven't experienced Daylight Saving in Cairns but have in Brisbane back in the early 90s. I also have been to Singapore recently during mid July. I enjoyed Daylight saving both in Brisbane at the time and the permanent offset that Singapore instigated. It works well.

[achiruel]

Once again, the media persists with this furphy that DST will reduce energy costs. It won't. The evident is that in tropical and subtropical regions, DST increases energy consumption.

Even for Australian states where daylight savings currently exists, it results in an increase in energy consumption. DST advocates need to stop pushing this lie.

https://voxeu.org/article/daylight-saving-saves-no-energy

When I lived in the Southern States over the  summers  the electricity bill was considerably cheaper. You rarely use air con.  Plus lights were never used until 8-8.30pm. It also encourages an active lifestyle after work in the evenings with the ability to use parks and beaches without the security concern.

Singapore and Malaysia both have permanent Daylight Saving since the 70s. Even though they are in the equatorial zone the Government decided to make use of the best available light. Sunrise is around 7am with sunset at 7.30pm. Thus I don't agree with statements saying that Daylight Saving is not suited to Cairns because it's closer to the tropics.  It would actually suit that region as well due to tourism ensuring tourists make the most out of their day. If Cairns had Daylight Saving on 20 Dec, their Sunrise would be at 6.40am and Sunset at 7.50pm.

So basically you're ignoring available research and pretending you somehow know better. 

[achiruel]

Once again, the media persists with this furphy that DST will reduce energy costs. It won't. The evident is that in tropical and subtropical regions, DST increases energy consumption.

Even for Australian states where daylight savings currently exists, it results in an increase in energy consumption. DST advocates need to stop pushing this lie.

https://voxeu.org/article/daylight-saving-saves-no-energy

When I lived in the Southern States over the  summers  the electricity bill was considerably cheaper. You rarely use air con.  Plus lights were never used until 8-8.30pm. It also encourages an active lifestyle after work in the evenings with the ability to use parks and beaches without the security concern.

You don't actually know if the electricity bill was cheaper because you never had the opportunity to live in southern states during summer without daylight savings. You clearly have a barrow to push and you're not interested in evidence.

[Gazza]

I think considerably cheaper compared to winter?

I would like DLS....light in the evening has more uses than light at 5am.

And if FNQ don't want it, why not have a split time zone?

FNQ clearly don't give a sh%t about being out of sync with the rest of the eastern seaboard as it is, so why would they care if SEQ is either?

[verbatim9]

Once again, the media persists with this furphy that DST will reduce energy costs. It won't. The evident is that in tropical and subtropical regions, DST increases energy consumption.

Even for Australian states where daylight savings currently exists, it results in an increase in energy consumption. DST advocates need to stop pushing this lie.

https://voxeu.org/article/daylight-saving-saves-no-energy

When I lived in the Southern States over the  summers  the electricity bill was considerably cheaper. You rarely use air con.  Plus lights were never used until 8-8.30pm. It also encourages an active lifestyle after work in the evenings with the ability to use parks and beaches without the security concern.

Singapore and Malaysia both have permanent Daylight Saving since the 70s. Even though they are in the equatorial zone the Government decided to make use of the best available light. Sunrise is around 7am with sunset at 7.30pm. Thus I don't agree with statements saying that Daylight Saving is not suited to Cairns because it's closer to the tropics.  It would actually suit that region as well due to tourism ensuring tourists make the most out of their day. If Cairns had Daylight Saving on 20 Dec, their Sunrise would be at 6.40am and Sunset at 7.50pm.

So basically you're ignoring available research and pretending you somehow know better. 

Once again, the media persists with this furphy that DST will reduce energy costs. It won't. The evident is that in tropical and subtropical regions, DST increases energy consumption.

Even for Australian states where daylight savings currently exists, it results in an increase in energy consumption. DST advocates need to stop pushing this lie.

https://voxeu.org/article/daylight-saving-saves-no-energy

When I lived in the Southern States over the  summers  the electricity bill was considerably cheaper. You rarely use air con.  Plus lights were never used until 8-8.30pm. It also encourages an active lifestyle after work in the evenings with the ability to use parks and beaches without the security concern.

You don't actually know if the electricity bill was cheaper because you never had the opportunity to live in southern states during summer without daylight savings. You clearly have a barrow to push and you're not interested in evidence.

The research you are referring to was back in the 2000 Olympics when they started Daylight Saving earlier in August. It was concluded that the energy saving was neutral from starting Daylight Saving earlier. Since then there has been research into the matter with Solar Voltaic panels, as it's shifts electricity generation to later in the afternoon aiding to peak demand.

The saving is based on my experience living in areas with and without out Daylight saving. The benefits I have experienced from it are clear and based on circumstantial evidence not speculation.

[verbatim9]

I think considerably cheaper compared to winter?

I would like DLS....light in the evening has more uses than light at 5am.

And if FNQ don't want it, why not have a split time zone?

FNQ clearly don't give a sh%t about being out of sync with the rest of the eastern seaboard as it is, so why would they care if SEQ is either?

If the had the zone change over 30km North of the Line of Capricorn it would be alright. I think just having it in Se Qld would be a logistical nightmare.

[verbatim9]

Should Queensland adopt Daylight Saving Time? #9Today

https://www.facebook.com/130834060284601/posts/2855642007803779/

[verbatim9]

Do you think Queensland should adopt Daylight Saving Time? #9Today

https://twitter.com/TheTodayShow/status/1180972527121649664

[James]

I have never quite understood many of the arguments against DST in SEQ.

DST opponents talk about "having trouble getting the kids to bed", the latest sunset occurs is just before 7pm during January, and around 6:45pm for any other month. Really shouldn't be an issue - if anything the opposite is the case. The sun is up at 4:30-5am during the summer months and the children soon follow, but it's not like there's much to keep children amused at 5am. This of course, ignores that children in Europe all get to bed just fine even though the sun doesn't set until after 9pm and twilight stretches until 10pm.

DST opponents also talk about it being "too hot in the afternoon" - well guess what, we're awake for that stage of the day anyway like it or not. 2pm, 3pm or 4pm, the heat is ridiculous either way. What it does allow, however, is to use the afternoon daylight to our advantage (getting to use it between 6-7pm, rather than between 5-6pm), and more importantly, makes the cooler daylight hours more accessible.

Particularly for outdoor activities like going to the beach, bushwalking and even gardening, the coolest time of the day is in the 2-3 hours after sunrise. Even if you kick-off your lawn mowing at 7am, you're almost out of this window.

Finally, DST opponents love the "blanket" analogy. "Only an idiot would think taking the bottom off a blanket and stitching it to the top would make a longer blanket." I prefer the new blanket analogy. "Only an idiot would use half the blanket and then complain about not having enough blanket!"

I fortunately have the flexibility to shift my work hours forward by one hour, ignoring the odd 4pm meeting. While the clocks haven't gone forward, I have, and I am looking forward to the 'later' sunrises and more daylight in the afternoon.

FWIW - since the advent of air conditioning, there's basically no net energy benefit from DST. Up here it is primarily a lifestyle debate, with some added bonuses (reduction in crime, encouraging physical activity) and drawbacks (increased stress around the time of the clock change).

[#Metro]

I'm not really fussed. But I think it is helpful to focus on the main benefits/disadvantages.

The argument that the peak load on the power network might shift with DST might be persuasive.

On the other hand- I don't like winter- should we wind the clock back then instead so that we can sleep in a bit and only get up when the sun is out?

[verbatim9]

The Queensland Network is conducting a Daylight Saving Poll-----> Should Queensland introduce Daylight Saving Time?

[verbatim9]

Golden Circle drink and canned fruit manufacturer endorses the positive aspects of Daylifght Saving.

Learn more at----> www. playlightsavings.com

"It's time to trade screen time for sunshine"

#DaylifghtSaving #Qld

[achiruel]

Golden Circle drink and canned fruit manufacturer endorses the positive aspects of Daylifght Saving.

Learn more at----> www. playlightsavings.com

"It's time to trade screen time for sunshine"

#DaylifghtSaving #Qld

Once again completely ignoring the issues in northern and north-western Queensland that introduction of DST will cause.

The state of Queensland is more than just the bit east of the Great Divide and south of Noosa.

[Cazza]

^But then again, most people are for it to be brought into SEQ only.

I see the point people make about how a separate time zone for SEQ could potentially have a negative impact on the economy, however, this is the case with the QLD/NSW border at Tweed. The border cuts the area in 2 and most of the locals don't seem particularly phased by it. Live in Tweed and realise you need a bottle of milk at 9:30pm for tomorrows breakfast? No worries, just head over to Coolangatta Woolies (which actually closes at 10pm, 6 days) and pick it up there.

At least with this new timezone, you won't be cutting streets in half, meaning that people who live a stones throw from each other won't have an hour time difference from one another.

[Gazza]

Once again completely ignoring the issues in northern and north-western Queensland that introduction of DST will cause.

How many people live in these areas compared to the rest?

SA sets its time zone to suit the fact most people in SA live around adelaide, not Ceduna

[HappyTrainGuy]

Haha. Kids playing around in the afternoon. I hardly see any kids playing in the afternoon at parks or in neighbourhood like you used to see. I do however see them all at Westfield and the shopping centres hanging around or they are playing computer/console games going by what I can hear.

[achiruel]

Once again completely ignoring the issues in northern and north-western Queensland that introduction of DST will cause.

How many people live in these areas compared to the rest?

SA sets its time zone to suit the fact most people in SA live around adelaide, not Ceduna

Queensland is the most decentralised state in Australia, and definitely way more decentralised than SA. Around 300k people in SA live outside Adelaide; in Qld it's more like 1.5 million. It's not a majority, but it's a fairly significant minority.

This also doesn't address the garbage we keep heading about DST using less energy, specifically in subtropical areas. There's simply no evidence this is the case. Also, the change it times leads to increased road crashes and certain health problems.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/29461606/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/11152980/

[aldonius]

Queensland is the most decentralised state in Australia, and definitely way more decentralised than SA.

Arguably Tasmania is more decentralised than Queensland if you do the correct thing and use SEQ as a whole for the capital region (which your numbers do) but your point stands otherwise.

[verbatim9]

Just on the topic of decentralization. Apparently new population statistics for Qld shows that it is now becoming more centralised in the South East. It's used to be 50/50 but not anymore as more people are moving than ever to Se Qld from other parts of the state. Plus interstate migration, which is centralising the population.

[verbatim9]

GoldCoast Bulletin----> Bulletin readers demand daylight savings after being asked what Gold Coast most needs

Bulletin readers demand daylight savings after being asked what Gold Coast most needs
A fierce debate has erupted about whether the Gold Coast should adopt daylight savings. HAVE YOUR SAY – VOTE IN OUR POLL

Gold Coast Bulletin
Subscriber only

October 10, 2019 12:52pm

GOLDCOASTBULLETIN.COM.AU1:00
The Daylight Saving Debate
Daylight Saving Time is a heated topic that is debated twice every year. So what are the arguments of those for and agai...

A HUGE debate has erupted online about the need for daylight savings after the Bulletin asked readers to name "the one thing the Gold Coast needs".

Popular responses also included better synchronisation of traffic lights and the return of NightQuarter.

But the one change most often nominated was daylight savings, kicking off a lively debate among followers of the Bulletin's Facebook page.

"That is a no brainer," Mary Couper said, but not everyone agreed.

"No daylight savings thanks," wrote Rose Anderson. "Grew up with it and hated it. Love living with no daylight savings."

Others wrote that the best way to enjoy daylight savings was to "move to another state".

Thank you for voting!
Yes 81.08%  (150 votes)


No 18.92%  (35 votes)


Ms Couper countered that families would be the big beneficiaries of the change.

"The longer evenings give families an opportunity to go to the beach or on a picnic when the heat if the day has gone," she said. "An opportunity for working parents to spend a bit more quality time with their children in the outdoors playing with them instead of in front of electronic devices."

Andrew Sacruz said the fact that it is always dark after work "leads to obesity, depression and more screen time."

But Joanna Doyle felt the introduction of daylight savings would "stuff kids' sleeping patterns and stuff people's life up."

Ryan Price had a simple solution to the problem, advising those in favour of daylight savings to "just put your clock forward an hour and pretend."

There was far more agreement about the need for better roads and public transport on the Gold Coast, with readers sharing their experiences of being stuck in congestion in just about every part of the city.

Comments about roads were not all about the M1. Nathan Smith got a lot of support when he called for "a decent, finished, three lane each way highway". In supporting the call, Rose Cloak revealed it took her 40 minutes to drive from Currumbin to Varsity Lakes train station yesterday morning. "Ridiculous", she said.

Readers were also keen on better beachside and dining options, while some called for better playgrounds for kids.

But one stand-out theme was a worry about the fast pace of development, which many believe is sapping the Gold Coast's character.

Dorothy Dot Middleton nominated "beautification" as the one thing the Gold Coast really needs.

"Where has the 'spirit' of the Gold Coast gone?," she asked. "What's happening in Surfers where the tourist dollar is so important. It's unsafe, no affordable parking for other communities on the GC to have a fun and affordable time out."

Belle Eldridge called for "a time machine to go back to the good old days. Live music venues, less traffic and tourists and a good old beach and laid back attitude."

Louise Layton appealed for "more green space" and "less concrete, glass and steel", while Barabara Smith said she would like to see "less land clearing to make way for more boxy houses."

But maybe the best suggestion of all came from Karen Holmes who suggested "a long weekend every weekend", a suggestion which would surely be popular!

[aldonius]

Just on the topic of decentralization. Apparently new population statistics for Qld shows that it is now becoming more centralised in the South East. It's used to be 50/50 but not anymore as more people are moving than ever to Se Qld from other parts of the state. Plus interstate migration, which is centralising the population.

Greater Brisbane has a bit over 2.4 million; SEQ has a bit over 3.6 million; Queensland overall is just under 5.1 million.

And yes, the south-east is growing faster. The last state redistribution increased the number of districts by four. It also created five new districts in SEQ, while abolishing one in SEQ and one in NQ.

[verbatim9]

Couriermail.com.au-----> Australian kids now need 'Playlight Savings' whether you live with daylight savings or not

Australian kids now need 'Playlight Savings' whether you live with daylight savings or not
Screen-addicted kids across Australia must adopt "playlight savings" for the sake of their health and wellbeing. VOTE, HAVE YOUR SAY

Shoba Rao and David Aidone, News Corp Australia Network
Subscriber only

October 8, 2019 10:59am

COURIERMAIL.COM.AU1:00
The Daylight Saving Debate
Daylight Saving Time is a heated topic that is debated twice every year. So what are the arguments of those for and agai...

Exclusive: Australian families are being encouraged to adopt "playlight savings" — whether they have daylight savings or not — and make the most of the extra sunlight hours to improve their health.

New research obtained by News Corp after being conducted on behalf of Golden Circle has found one in three kids do not spend time outdoors more than twice a week.

They spend just 5.5 hours outdoors each week on average, but spend 9.5 hours watching screens including TVs, smartphones, PCs and tablets instead.

Overall, 71 per cent of Australian kids spend less than an hour a day outdoors, and one in two families do not spend time outdoors with their kids more than twice a week.

Results
Do you think daylight savings should be in every Aussie state?
Yes
74%
No
26%
555 Voters
Kids in South Australia have the most screen time, including watching TV, being on the computer or playing video games with an average of 17.4 hours per week, followed by Queensland (14.8 hours per week), NSW (13.4 hours per week), Victoria (13 hours per week) and Western Australia (10.3 hours per week).

South Australian parents say the biggest barrier stopping their kids spending time outdoors is a lack of interest.

All other states say lack of time is what stops their kids spending time outdoors.

Parents enjoy spending time with their kids at local parks (78 per cent), in their backyard (63 per cent) or at the beach (63 per cent).

When kids are spending time outdoors, going to a park is most popular (67 per cent), followed by a trip to the beach (55 per cent) and free play such as playing with a pet (53 per cent).

The findings come as Australian Institute of Health and Welfare figures stated 25 per cent of kids and adolescents aged 2—17 and 67 per cent of adults were overweight or obese in 2017—18.

Family psychologist Dr Justin Coulson told News Corp spending time outdoors was critical for families to stay connected.

He said the research findings mirror all academic research he has seen, showing parents do not spend enough time with their kids outside.

"There's no doubt technology is interfering with our opportunities to be together and celebrate playlight savings," he said.

"The data that really blew me away was one in three kids don't spend time outdoors more than twice a week, that's an enormous percentage of kids not getting the fuel their bodies, minds and souls need."

Dr Coulson said every parent he speaks to wants more quality time with their kids, but even without daylight savings, it can still be done.

Daylight savings is in every state except Queensland, the Northern Territory and WA.

"Regardless of which state you live in, we've got more hours of sunlight everyday to be more intentional and spend more time with our families," he said.

Dr Ben Bullock, a lecturer from Swinburne University's Department of Psychological Sciences and the Centre for Mental Health, told News Corp the data was concerning but not surprising.

"The light helps keep our circadian rhythms stable, which helps with sleep. If we're getting quality sleep, about seven to nine hours a night, that boosts our concentration and mood significantly," he said.

Mr Bullock extra time in the sun raised vitamin D levels, which is important for strong bones, muscles and overall health.

'WE MISS DAYLIGHT SAVINGS'

Natasha D'Arcy relocated to Brisbane from Canberra nearly 10 years ago, where she and her husband Cameron started a family.

With two young boys — Wilbur, 6, and Victor, 2 — and a third child on the way, the 35-year-old wishes daylight savings had followed her.

Ms D'Arcy works from home, and it's often not until 6pm that her husband returns from work. She said the extra hour of daylight would help her family better connect during the week.

"By the time my husband arrives home it's not long until it's dark," Ms D'Arcy said.

"The extra hour would be great because it would mean we could go for a walk down, or head down to the park.

"When we're doing those activities that we have great conversation and family moments."

The couples do their best to limit screen time for their kids on the weekend.

"There are huge benefits when they're active. It's great for their mental health, it helps take the edge off and they eat and sleep better," she said.

'IT'S GREAT TO HAVE THE EXTRA TIME'

Elena Stepanova, from Forestville, said her family looks forward to daylight savings every year.

The Australian outdoor lifestyle lured the 36-year-old and her husband Dimitri from Europe eight years ago. With three kids — Anton, 12, Maya, 10, Yana, 6 — they try to spend as much time outdoors as possible.

"We're a very active family, and we try to spend as much time outdoors as possible," she said.

"It's really great to have the extra time. It means we can take the dog for a walk together, go down to the park after work, or even the beach."

"We also have a rule at home where if it's light outside, there's no TV. If there's sun and it's good weather, the kids have to go outdoors."

Ms Stepanova said she could see the difference in her children's wellbeing if they spent more time outside.

"Their mood is better, they sleep better; it's just clear they are happier and healthier," she said.

"They're like zombies if they spend too long in front of the screen. They get grumpy and super frustrated."

PLAYLIGHT SAVINGS TIPS FOR TIME-POOR FAMILIES:

1 — Commit to one day a week where you spend an extra hour outdoors as a family

2 — Get the kids involved in deciding what the family does so you get buy-in with them and make it something to look forward to eg Magic Monday, Fantastic Friday

3 — Decide on a simple activity eg dinner near the beach, a walk or kicking a ball in the park

4 — Once you get into the routine of the extra hour, look at other ways you can spend more time outdoors

5 — Make the effort to be richly rewarded with more quality time

Source: Dr Justin Coulson

[Gazza]

Haha i love this new direction the debate has taken with kids and screen time:

[verbatim9]

Couriermail.com.au----> Queensland's daylight saving debate is hurting us all

Lucy Carne: Queensland's daylight saving debate is hurting us all
LUCY CARNE

October 19, 2019 2:00pm
Subscriber only
It's that time of year: blooming jacarandas, afternoon thunderstorms and league players overdoing it on the off-season.

It's also, like clockwork, the time of year when an exhausted section of society are barely capable of dragging themselves through their daily operations.

They can be seen staggering through workplaces like zombie extras from The Walking Dead, with intravenous caffeine lines hanging from their veins, capable of only grunts for communication. For we are, thanks to our young progeny and pets, the people who rise at 4.30am.

Yes, it's that time of year when Queensland needs to talk about daylight saving. Again.

For the record, I am a proud born and bred Queenslander. But every morning as I lay in bed with humidity pressing down on me and birds hollering outside my window, I turn to the clock and read 4.45am and seriously consider moving to Melbourne.

I can get over their obnoxious cultural snobbery and questionable sense of fashion, I assure myself. I'll get an edgy haircut and wear clogs with socks. I'll even try and pretend to understand AFL if only, for the love of God, I can have one more hour of sleep.

I still ache for those balmy summer evenings when I lived in Sydney, where after work there was still plenty of light left to plop into the Clovelly Baths and soak up the sun on the warm cement.

In Brisbane, we currently commute home in darkness, courtesy of a 5.47pm sunset.

Results
Should Queensland have Daylight Saving Time?
YES
57%
NO
43%
428 Voters
In the mornings, my early-rising children who are in need of a 9am nap, are instead pushed off to start a full day of childcare.

It is cruel, exhausting, and damaging to productivity, family dynamics and personal health.

And for what? The farmers? The early rising dairy farmers of Victoria seem to cope.

The curtains? Who even draws curtains in the afternoons? It's not the 1950s.

These bizarre myths and outdated excuses need to end.

Prioritising north and western Queensland's opinion on the issue also needs to stop.

Of course they don't desperately need daylight saving time like southeast Queenslanders do.

On December 1 this year, the sun will come up in Brisbane at 4.44am. On that same day in Mount Isa, sunrise is at 5.52am.

That is more than an hour after Brisbane's sunrise. And even later than Sydney's that day at 5.37am.

So the majority of Queensland's population has to suffer debilitating pre-5am sunrises while regional Queensland selfishly gets a sleep in.

Surely given it's the Sunshine State, we should be allowed to enjoy our sunshine?

Mayor of the City of Gold Coast and prominent daylight saving supporter Tom Tate says it's time to let the people have their say.

He proposes a single question on the ballot paper at next year's Queensland state election asking 'Should we have daylight saving time?'

"I'm not saying give it to us, I'm saying let the people have their say," he tells me.

And the outcome? Two thirds in support, Mr Tate predicts. "Give us, the people who enjoy life, give us a chance to unite with the rest of the eastern states of Australia," he says.

"The curtains won't fade and the cows will still milk."

The benefits of switching our clocks forward an hour are obvious.

There is the boost to local hospitality businesses with more people socialising in the early evening.

With obvious concerns over obesity and skin cancer, there's the added benefit of exercising in the softer early evening light.

But it is far more than just convenience and leisure.

There is the financial benefit of using less energy. After all, daylight saving time first came about in Europe to save fuel in the first world war.

There is also the damage to businesses from being out of sync with the eastern states.

Some studies claim Queensland's refusal to join daylight saving costs $4 billion.

We are travelling interstate more than ever before. But to make a 9am meeting or conference in Sydney you would need to get up at 4am to catch a 6am flight out of Brisbane.

The support is clearly there: A 2017 poll of over 7000 respondents by The Courier-Mail showed 88 per cent of people wanted daylight saving. The Facebook group Daylight Saving 4 QLD has over 42,700 likes.

So why not give us a referendum, a trial, or simply put the clocks forward permanently for the whole year?

And yet gutless politicians, who are clearly too scared to tackle the issue, say daylight saving time is not a priority and people are tired of talking about it.

Yes, we are exhausted. But that doesn't mean we've given up and accepted it will never happen.

Now, 30 years after Queensland's daylight saving trial started, it's time we woke up.

Lucy Carne is editor of Rendezview.com.au

lucy.carne@news.com.au

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Why can't we just have #DaylightSaving already? Join the conversation #qldpol https://t.co/6EJbkBrcIr

https://twitter.com/couriermail/status/1185455147964604419

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First its Daylight Saving that separated NSW and QLD. Now its physical border closures that do. https://qt.com.au/news/how-qlds-border-lockdown-will-help-nsw/4019458/... #DaylightSaving #QLD #TweedHeads #GoldCoast #borderclosures #economy #Australia


https://twitter.com/verbatim18/status/1263146375161606154

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As a part of the Covid-19 recovery plan, Industry Groups call on the Queensland Government to adopt Daylight Saving to stimulate the Qld and Australian East Coast economy. https://t.co/6pD6veLcsw #DaylightSaving #Qld #LNPQld #QldLabor #QldGreens #timezones @InQldMedia

https://twitter.com/verbatim18/status/1273800031506624512

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In Queensland---> Wake-up call: Maybe it's time we opened the curtains, as well as the borders

Wake-up call: Maybe it's time we opened the curtains, as well as the borders
OPINION
As Queensland starts to emerge from the long, dark tunnel created by the coronavirus, some added sunshine would do us the world of good, writes Shane Rodgers

Shane Rodgers

At some point in the next month, Queensland will likely remove its border "germ wall" and re-join Australia. When this happens, we should seriously consider doing it properly.

I am talking about time zones, as in having the same one for the entire east coast. Yes, I'm also talking about daylight saving. The trouble is, if you mention that term in Queensland, people look at you as if you have used a bad swear word in church.

When you ask politicians about it, they tend to break into a cold sweat and nervously trot out a practiced line about concentrating on issues that unite us rather than divide us.

Sometimes they declare that the time we choose to live by in Queensland will not be dictated to us by "southerners" (i.e. fellow Australians who live outside the germ wall).

The result is six months of expensive business mess every year, fewer Queensland jobs, lost business investment and an under-activation of our tourism and recreation economy.

The problem is that we are having the wrong conversation. If you ask people if they want daylight saving, large numbers in the daylight-rich north will say "heck no". They are perfectly happy with way the sunshine falls now and there are some inconveniences for some groups when the daylight is back ended.

Fair enough.

The more pertinent question to ask is: "Are we prepared to wear some inconvenience in some areas to boost our economy and create jobs here?"

In other words, the discussion should not be about daylight saving. It should be able whether Queensland can really afford to be out of time-step with the larger economic states (regardless of how the clocks are set).

The answer is no – particularly in the economic conditions that lie ahead over the next few years.

Ai Group conducted a survey in 2018 and found that around one in 10 businesses currently operating in Queensland were less likely to place jobs and investment in the state due to the summertime differences.

About 17 per cent of national businesses not currently operating in Queensland were less likely to open branches here due to the time disparity.

That is no surprise. For the increasing number of companies operating across states, two different eastern time zones in summer is frankly an expensive pain. It is an even bigger pain for border communities.

The time mismatch impacts thousands of people daily. The Brisbane to Sydney air route is one of the busiest in the world. Money that might otherwise be spent in Queensland goes to southern accommodation providers and restaurants because early meetings inevitably mean travelling the night before rather than doing a day trip.

One in three businesses say the issue has a "significant impact" on their business and a similar number have to alter staffing to stretch over the time gap.

There is also the opportunity lost for our struggling tourism and hospitality industries. You don't have to spend much time in Melbourne and Sydney in summer to see that, at 8pm, there are people everywhere and the economy is fully activated.

At the same time in Queensland, many restaurants are already packing up the chairs and Netflix is being fired up for the night.
This is an easy issue for both sides of politics to shirk in a bipartisan way.

While polling in recent years suggests a majority of Queenslanders now support daylight saving time in summer, no party wants to be the first to jump. The majority is not large enough in a world of close elections and marginal seats, and it divides the north and the south at a time when friendships are already stretched.

The only way this issue gets onto the policy agenda is for both sides to accept that it is in the best interest of the state to put it on the program in a neutral, bipartisan way.

With the first Queensland four-year Parliamentary term kicking in at the end of October, the next few months are the only opportunity to get time zones into the policy melting pot any time soon.

All we need is an agreement by all parties to do a thorough economic assessment of the pros and cons for Queensland. That way it is part of the policy discussion mandate for the four-year term and we can debate it properly with plenty of election buffer built in.

If we miss this window, it will be many years before it opens again for a new mandate. It's time for a mature, objective conversation that asks the right questions.

Shane Rodgers is the Queensland-based national Head of Operations for national employer association Australian Industry Group. He is a former business executive, editor and journalist.

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The Toowoomba Chronicle---> Greg Johnson: It's time for daylight saving in Queensland

It's about to be a topsy turby time for those who live on the QLD border.

IT'S OCTOBER and that means one thing, daylight saving across the nation and New Zealand.

Well, except for Australia's most eastern state Queensland and too-far away WA.

On Sunday at 2am, those states and territories will push their clocks forward one hour and won't push them back for six months thus creating havoc for Queenslanders travelling, trading, communicating and commuting.

I feel sorry for the workers along the Qld/NSW border, from the coast to Goondiwindi, who will face six months of topsy-turvy start and finish times.

It's just so blessed inconvenient for us to be aligned with the nation for half the year and unaligned for the other half.

We had a daylight saving trial a generation ago at a time when Paul Keating was Prime Minister and Bill Hayden was Governor-General.

Long ago. The trial lasted three years and a referendum was held with the simple question, "Are you in favour of daylight saving?"

The result was tight with 55% saying no and 45% saying yes – defeated.

Ten years ago, Premier Anna Bligh, who shortly after moved to NSW presumably for the benefits of daylight saving, introduced a "community consultation process" under which 74,000 citizens would be canvassed.

That's a decent sample, all right.

Sixty-four per cent said they wanted daylight saving as well as a referendum.

They got neither, and I can only add what a funny little community consultation process that was.

It's estimated 90% of Queenslanders want to be aligned with the nation all year round and not just for six months.

The silent majority, Prime Minister Morrison's "quiet Australians," quake in fear at the thought of confronting an anti-daylight saving devotee – they can be quite nasty and even physical.

Sure, you'll hear about cows not milking, curtains fading, latitude/longitude and children not sleeping, but there's a whole range of new ones like "everyone down south hates it" and "I've got a cousin in Woop Woop and her kids cry at night" and "why don't you all move back to where you came from?"

But what if most of the supporters came from here, what should they do?

The two biggest misconceptions are, (a) daylight saving makes the days longer, namely 25 hours, and (b) daylight saving makes it hotter.

Please be assured, there'll still be 24 hours each day and temperatures will be unchanged.

Comforting for opponents is knowing that neither side of politics will ever introduce daylight saving, unless we get a Green parliament because "green" means less reliance on energy by cleverly using natural light instead.

Anyway, I reckon we should have a long overdue referendum and resolve the matter once and for all.

What do you think?

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Couriermail.com.au---> Calls for a border bubble for daylight savings

The success of the border bubble has inspired a new push to deal with one of Queensland's perennial problems - daylight savings.

There are fresh calls for a daylight savings 'border bubble' as the annual time zone nightmare clocks on for another year.

Queensland will awaken on Sunday one hour behind the times of the rest of the east coast amid predictions the disruption will cost the state's economy more than $4 billion in lost productivity.

'A no brainer': Demand for daylight savings on Coast

Coast businesses 'fed up' waiting for daylight saving change

It comes as a lobby group campaigns for a petition to gather 100,000 signatures calling for a fresh trial of daylight savings just four weeks out from a Queensland election where neither major party is keen to discuss the issue.

Daylight savings advocate and University of Queensland senior lecturer in human geography, Doctor Thomas Sigler, said as the coronavirus pandemic wreaked havoc with the economy, there had 'never been a better time' to reignite the debate.

"The Queensland economy needs a rocket and daylight savings is free – it doesn't cost a cent," he said.

"The industries hardest hit by the pandemic – tourism, hospitality, retail, are precisely the sectors that would benefit the most from daylight savings."

He said the advent of the border bubble to allow seamless movements between northern NSW and southern Queensland during the COVID-19 pandemic was proof the regions could work together under one time zone if there was no statewide adoption of daylight savings.

"We advocate for both positions, either Queensland-wide or just the southeast corner, whichever suits the politicians better."

David Jones from the lobby group DS4SEQ said the state had evolved since the 1992 referendum and it was 'ludicrous' to deny Queenslanders another say on the issue.

"Anyone born after 1974 or anyone who has moved to Queensland in the last 28 years has not had a say on this," he said.

"Southeast Queensland has a million more people than it did in 1992 and that's a million people whose views haven't been taken in to account."

He said the longitude of western Queensland – often the most vocal critics of daylight savings, was more in line with SA than the southeast which relied on ties to the rest of the east coast.

He said he did not expect either major political party to take the issue to the election, but believed the new four-year term of government would be the perfect platform to trial daylight savings again.

"They (political parties) have made a political football out of this, but with four-year terms there's no reason why you can't have a trial in the middle of a term and it wouldn't affect any election because the next one is still years away."

Chamber of Commerce and Industry Queensland general manager of advocacy and policy Amanda Rohan said different parts of the state had different views on DST.

"The vast size of Queensland means there are differing priorities for regions, including the impact and need for daylight saving on business needs and operations," she said.

Not surprisingly, a spokesman for the Premier said the government would not 'be changing its position on Daylight Saving'.