Construction of a rail corridor running from Salisbury to Beaudesert delayed unt

[rtt_rules]

http://www.couriermail.com.au/questnews/east/construction-of-a-rail-corridor-running-from-salisbury-to-beaudesert-delayed-until-2026/story-fn8m0sve-1226506367376

Nice work Bob.

It cannot start until post CRR, but it shouldn't be delayed for much longer the CRR either. I know costly and I don't know how to fund, but perhaps the two CRR is winding down so opening 2 years later. SWRL can also be built progressively (but continously) over about 5-10 years to spread out the cost and allow for the build up more efficently. ie maybe extend at a rate one new station opens every year or so.

This line will also help with the current imbalance between Nth and Sth sides of Brisbane rail. Perhaps running into an upgraded Doomben/Hamilton line.

regards
Shane

[#Metro]

I think that it is a good idea - just look at all the huge demand in Sunnybank etc. Could start as a shuttle service. But intensity on existing lines first I think. Also, I think that there is a case for a class B ROW busway down mains road all the way to Browns Plains

[Set in train]

Also, I think that there is a case for a class B ROW busway down mains road all the way to Browns Plains

Yes, that was the plan in the 1997 IRTP and much earlier - it's why the Delfin estate in Macgregor (old tobacco factory site) is set back the distance it is from Mains Rd and why Sunny Park is built set back as it is.

However... the Mains/Kessels $300M+ pork barelling that does nothing for the actual local electorate creates the need for a very costly engineering option for the busway to run in its intended alignment - would need to be a tunnel under a 7 metre cut from existing ground level.

This topic (of the rail) was given great coverage by Sunnybank Hills local himself, Gary Hardgrave on his 4BC drive show. Bob's interview was superb.

The idea of passing loops for freighters and stations was mentioned as being required as the cheapest option as part of a shuttle service to Salisbury (closest station to the line diverging) or Yeerongpilly for quarter hour transfer. New platforms for the third track would need to be constructed of course.

There was also many calls and e-mails/SMS read about when would the Kippa Ring railway ever begin construction in earnest. Slick communication/lack of clarity is starting to upset the locals.

[somebody]

I'm still not convinced this line needs to go via South Bank.  It would be a better line via CRR.

[ozbob]

Thanks for the feedback Set In Train.  The interview was done live from a metro train between BoxHill and Richmond running express, arrived at Richmond just as the interview concluded.  Good to know it came across OK, hard to tell on board the train.  Was getting an odd look from some of the pax .. lol

[BrizCommuter]

It cannot start until post CRR, but it shouldn't be delayed for much longer the CRR either.

It may also have to wait until the track layouts at either end of CRR are optimised, which is not looking likely in Slasher Newman's cut price CRR.

[Set in train]

It cannot start until post CRR, but it shouldn't be delayed for much longer the CRR either.

It may also have to wait until the track layouts at either end of CRR are optimised, which is not looking likely in Slasher Newman's cut price CRR.

Great point! Big knock on effect. We might as well forget about this happening then? 

[Jonno]

What an unmitigated mess our Govts have created!!!  Yet they will all be out there claiming to be fixing congestion!!!!

[mufreight]

It cannot start until post CRR, but it shouldn't be delayed for much longer the CRR either.

It may also have to wait until the track layouts at either end of CRR are optimised, which is not looking likely in Slasher Newman's cut price CRR.

Don't think the cut backs on CRR will impact on this line. Something has to run via the CRR and if say its only Kuraby/BL trains then this opens a nice gap for say 4-6t/hr for SWRL route to run all to the city and pick the stations that BL trains no longer serve.

I think the SG shuttle was a doable option though to assist for next 10+ years.

A SG shuttle is possible if you are prepared to have 20.000 tonnes of freight more on the highway system each day, the impact would not only be on freight from or to the south that is currently being moved by rail but also freight to or from the north, the freight operators would not be inclined to bring freight to Brisbane by road then transfer it ti rail to continue its journey nort by rail, easier and more profitable for them to simply leave it on the truck.
A rail shuttle using the SG line is simply not a workable option without greatly increased freight costs.
The option of utilising the SG corridor and construction a NG line in the alignment is far more practical and gives a better outcome.

[Gazza]

I still maintain that I'd rather see it go straight to being a proper heavy rail service than something half baked and peak hour only etc. Same goes for that other stupid branch at Bethania.

Sorry, but I fail to why you'd use rail vehicles to provide a welfare service.

Yeah, we already have a crappy single track DMU shuttle service in Australia:

Why would anyone want to replicate that? List of the advantages over just improving buses (Including the 540)

[SurfRail]

Yeah, we already have a crappy single track DMU shuttle service in Australia:

You forgot Belair and Tonsley, neither of which are even the most direct routes to anywhere useful.

[somebody]

Yeah, we already have a crappy single track DMU shuttle service in Australia:

Is that Stony Point?  There is also Kiama-Bombaderry, Campbelltown-Goulbourn, and to a lesser extend the whole Hunter line - lesser because it does serve Newcastle.

EDIT: Correction, Campbelltown-Goulbourn is double track, and the Hunter Line is double at least to Musselbrook.  Musselbrook-Scone and Telarah-Dungog is single.

[Gazza]

Yeah, we already have a crappy single track DMU shuttle service in Australia:

You forgot Belair and Tonsley, neither of which are even the most direct routes to anywhere useful.

I thought those lines went all the way into Adelaide, and weren't shuttles.

[ozbob]

Stony Point is actually going very well.  Feeds into 10 minute frequency at Frankston also helps a bit ... lol.  Line is being progressively electrified.

[SurfRail]

Yeah, we already have a crappy single track DMU shuttle service in Australia:

You forgot Belair and Tonsley, neither of which are even the most direct routes to anywhere useful.

I thought those lines went all the way into Adelaide, and weren't shuttles.

Indeed.  And Tonsley is being electrified.

In fact, you don't even need diesels to run a welfare service.  All you have to do is go to Eagle Junction and (attempt to) change trains...

[colinw]

To see a 3rd rate welfare service, all you need to do is go to any random SEQ railway station or most bus stops.

If we're only going to run half hourly trains, why are we building any new lines at all?

[ozbob]

I am  outbound on EMU70, aiming for the 2.24pm 524 bus to get me and case up the hill at Goodna.  Miss it and it will be a wait ... lol  Barring track faults, bridge strikes, wombats p%ssing on junction boxes etc. should make it ... 

A 5'3" and 3'6" gauge day .... 

[colinw]

Regarding Beaudesert, Yarrabilba, and the entire area south of Salisbury, the (previous) Government's own plans clearly show the desired outcome.

While we're worrying about welfare DMU services and other such concerns, the plans for a motorways based on an assumed 45,000+ car journeys a day from Yarrabilba and higher numbers from Flagstone are proceeding apace, no doubt accelerated under the new regime in QLD.

Our discussions are are so far removed from the emerging reality in the area it isn't funny. Not even on the same planet.

Note in particular road labelled (1).  Current thinking is slightly different to this map, being a southern extension of the Gateway Motorway to the Mt Lindesay Hwy at Park Ridge, joining to a 4 lane Mt Lindesay Hwy south to at least Jimboomba if not Beaudesert.  There will also be a motorway standard road to Yarrabilba, bridging the Logan River just north & slightly west of Logan Village. The other links (East West from Beenleigh area, and the Bromelton arterial) will be arterial road standard but not motorways as such.

Any talk of rail for the area is a sop. There are no serious plans or intention to build any such thing.

Yarrabilba & Flagstone are going to be low density car dependent sprawl, with very little local employment.

[ozbob]

There are plans, but they were put on hold around 2010.  Eventually the rail will be needed, as the poor mugs scream they cannot afford the fuel, congestion and chaos ...

The plan is for a 3'6" line - ideally double to be put down in the corridor. CarDo will be long gone ...

[colinw]

There are plans, but they were put on hold around 2010.  Eventually the rail will be needed, as the poor mugs scream they cannot afford the fuel, congestion and chaos ...

The plan is for a 3'6" line - ideally double to be put down in the corridor. CarDo will be long gone ...

Hard to see how they could be put on hold any further, even the 2009/10 plan called for the railway no earlier than 2031 and probably around 2056, by which time the horse would not only be bolted but would in fact be long dead.

I do not expect to ride a local train to Beaudesert  (or west of Rosewood) in my lifetime, assuming I'm even still in SEQ which seems increasingly unlikely.

The rail options in the Mt Lindesday / Beaudesert transport network investigation were never anything more than a feel good sop, the road network I diagrammed above was and is the real agenda.

In any case, without CRR it is dead in the water. And I'm not betting on that happening any time soon.

[somebody]

If we're only going to run half hourly trains, why are we building any new lines at all?

Hear here.

[colinw]

If we're only going to run half hourly trains, why are we building any new lines at all?

Hear here.

Frequent Rail Service, QLD style: build a multi-billion dollar branch line. Run it infrequently. Legacy network up to & including the new junction then gets a (sort-of) turn up & go service, but the transit authority forgets to tell anyone because its not a BUZ.

Does anyone know the status of the Bromleton dual gauge project?  Looks half finished and abandoned when I last went down that way a few months ago. I'm assuming it is a dead & forgotten project, abandoned by the ARTC once Albanese had milked a feel good press release or two from it. Although if the Bromelton intermodal yard is not proceeding yet there's probably little need for it, not like there's any 3'6" traffic offering down there now the quarry has gone over to road and the relatively new SG siding to it has been disconnected.

Anyway, enough of this from me. I've clearly taken a cranky pill this afternoon. 

[somebody]

Is there anywhere else in the world constructing new suburban railway projects to run a train every half an hour?

You don't see that with Adelaide, Sydney's NWRL or even Auckland (who are talking about 10 minute frequency)!  Perhaps Wellington's Waikanae electrification extension.

EDIT: I probably should qualify the comments about Auckland.  They are talking about 10 minute frequency to everywhere but actually doing nothing better than 30 minute frequency.  Perhaps they will fix things up once the electrification project happens or if the CRL goes through.  Or perhaps they will talk about increased frequency but then actually do nothing like ConnSEQ2031 & IPS-CAB revamp in QLD did .

[HappyTrainGuy]

Love it how everyone assumes new lines would be 30 minutes without looking at the bigger picture

[colinw]

Love it how everyone assumes new lines would be 30 minutes without looking at the bigger picture

Come off it.  That is because they are.

Springfield: 30 minutes
Kippa-Ring: 30 minutes

As for big picture, in QLD there isn't one. Just short term decision making & expediency.

Cue usual defenders of the indefensible.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Where has Kippa Ring been mentioned as 30 mins? Springfield isn't even operational yet.

Big picture was in reference too capacity in certain sections of the corridors and other constraints. Sure lets build a new line out there and throw in more services for the Cleveland/Beenleigh/Gold Coast line with random patterns and lots of freight trains even if CRR isn't even finalised which would change all those options around.

[Jonno]

The plan currently is to created a congested hell!!!!

[somebody]

Richlands has already been built at 30 minutes.  Does more need to be said?

[colinw]

Springfield to be same frequency as Richlands is now as confirmed by the (previous) minister last year. Emerson hasn't said anything to indicate that the currently Government might be considering changing that, although hopefully sense will prevail.

Kippa-Ring - yes, I was being hasty there, although once again I'm fairly sure the previous minister indicated that Northgate - Petrie would have to wait for MBRL to open before those stations received 4TPH.

As for the comment above about just jamming in more trains on existing corridors, I don't think anyone on this board would seriously consider adding in new branches off the Beenleigh line was being viable without CRR.

I remain concerned that the two new branches under construction will just result in a half hourly Springfield to Kippa-Ring pattern, but would love to be proven wrong.

[ozbob]

The plan currently is to created a congested hell!!!!

[somebody]

Where has Kippa Ring been mentioned as 30 mins?

Where has it been mentioned as anything?  That is the difference between SEQ and everywhere else I am aware of.

[Gazza]

Big picture was in reference too capacity in certain sections of the corridors and other constraints. Sure lets build a new line out there and throw in more services for the Cleveland/Beenleigh/Gold Coast line with random patterns and lots of freight trains even if CRR isn't even finalised which would change all those options around.

At the moment, I'd rather see the current proposed duplications (And CRR) done first before any new lines/extensions are added to the network.

[#Metro]

Well of course there is going to be a road first! Duh!
What do you think, a rail-access only development, are you kidding!!

If a road goes in, it should (a) have a reserve for rapid transit and (b) be tolled during peak hours, even if these take the form of a HOT lane.

Personally, for now, I would spend the funds on a class B busway down the centre of Mains Road...

[somebody]

Blue Cow mountain = rail only access.  (barring over snow or helicopter)

Can't think of too many other examples.

[colinw]

Jimboomba Times -> 'Build it and they will come'

You get a mention in this article, Bob ...

"BUILD it and they will come."

That was what Beaudesert MP Jon Krause told Queensland Parliament in its latest sitting while advocating for the Salisbury to Beaudesert passenger rail project to be brought forward.

Investigated by the former State Government in 2009, the Salisbury to Beaudesert passenger rail line was proposed to meet development growth in Logan and the Scenic Rim.

Not slated to begin until after 2026, the project uses the existing interstate railway line, which already aligns with key development areas of Greenbank, New Beith and Flagstone.

Project cost estimates were between $1.2 and $1.8 billion and included 11 new stations from Acacia Ridge to Beaudesert.

Mr Krause is advocating for the project to be brought forward, telling Parliament plans to provide the service past 2026 were "wide of the mark".

"We will need to take pressure off the local road network, including the main roads, well before then," he said in Parliament last Thursday.

"The rail corridor is perfectly placed to do this. The Government should think innovatively - perhaps even look to the private sector - in order to put in place these transport services."

Mr Krause later told the Times the issue was one he would continue to push.

He said how the venture would be funded needed to be addressed, however it was an investment for the future.

"This is one of the factors - how we pay for this infrastructure when we're coming from a bad financial state for Queensland," he said.

"That's one of the issues which will obviously affect its implementation.

"But as I said, I'm advocating for it to be brought forward, and we're putting the budget back onto more even footing now by making the spending decisions so we can actually invest in this sort of infrastructure in the future."

RAIL Back on Track spokesman Robert Dow is also calling on the Government to look into the issue.

He said the rail corridor already existed and State Government roads funding should be redirected into more sustainable transport options such as these.

"It's about time the Government stepped up to the plate and seriously considered what the future transport task is going to be and how it's going to be achieved," he said.

"It's not going to be achieved by roads. Fuel prices are going to escalate, long haul car commuting is going to become very expensive - people are going to look for proper public transport options. Rail is what's needed to cover those distances."

A spokeswoman for Transport Minister Scott Emerson could not confirm whether the Salisbury to Beaudesert rail project was on the State Government's agenda.

When asked if rail transport was a priority for the Government she said, "the Newman Government's priority is to deliver its election commitments, particularly cost of living savings, and to tackle Labor's massive debt".

She said the major constraint for additional services on the Brisbane Rail network was the lack of a second river crossing.

[#Metro]

Project cost estimates were between $1.2 and $1.8 billion and included

I'm going to say no to this one for now. $1.2 billion would be better spent on rolling out the CFN, indeed we'd only need ~1/10th of this amount or even less to do it.

[colinw]

This project in its full form is definitely not a goer until

(a) CRR is built, and
(b) The Flagstone satellite city proceeds

An initial section as far as Greenbank will have considerable merit sooner, but again is contingent on CRR unless we force people to change.

If Flagstone does end up developing to the proposed size then it will be insanity not to have rail serving it, particularly as the standard gauge alignment is good enough along much of its length for sustained 140km/h running so combined with CRR it will potentially be SEQ's first Mandurah standard line.

Even then, the section beyond Flagstone to Beaudesert is somewhat questionable, and only warrants corridor designation & retention at this stage.

The good news is that the corridor is secure, so its not like we're going to lose the opportunity to build it if we need it in 10, 20 or 30 years time.

Oh, and if I hear any more suggestions from anyone of running commuter services on the existing interstate line I think will scream. Please don't stuff up our interstate freight artery with commuter spam cans. Build commuter rail in the corridor, but leave the freight line alone! Separation of freight & commuter tracks is the name of the game, not the reverse!