POLL: Valley-PA Hospital via Storey Bridge

[somebody]

I see this as a cross town, all stops BUZ replacing the 370 and the eastern part of the 475/476.

Here's a link to a map (although it's pretty obvious): http://maps.google.com.au/maps?saddr=chermside&daddr=lutwyche+rd+to:Warner+St,+Fortitude+Valley+QLD+to:Tottenham+Street,+Brisbane,+Queensland&hl=en&ll=-27.442935,153.032684&spn=0.138938,0.209255&sll=-27.442965,153.036475&sspn=0.138938,0.209255&geocode=FbEhXv4dIg4fCSlf34QxsOKTazFwhN7zWqMCBQ%3BFaV7Xf4dIRkfCSmpu287yVmRazFN5q40VQfpwA%3BFfwJXf4dlx8fCSmlMgdU8lmRazGMhyU1RtY8RA%3BFYhhXP4d1SYfCSmTMSC_Z1qRazGzH3XndQr6QQ&mra=ls&dirflg=t&vpsrc=0&t=h&z=13

[SurfRail]

No offence, but what's with the obsession with forced transfers so close to the CBD?  No way would I support a 370 that does not go to the city, it is where most of its passengers will be going by that point.

There are a number of options for improving the 475, not the least of which is just improving the frequency of the current route, getting rid of the 476 variation and making some use of the Eastern Busway (even if it is just terminating downstairs at PAH).

There are also a number of options for better connectivity between the RBWH and Kangaroo Point.  One for instance would be a standalone route from RBWH to UQ, which could be made up of resources currently allocated to the fairly useless 393, and not require a reduction in or drastic redesign to other services.

[Golliwog]

There are also a number of options for better connectivity between the RBWH and Kangaroo Point.  One for instance would be a standalone route from RBWH to UQ, which could be made up of resources currently allocated to the fairly useless 393, and not require a reduction in or drastic redesign to other services.

Maybe even just extend route 29 up Kangaroo Point to RBWH?

[cartoonbirdhaus]

No offence, but what's with the obsession with forced transfers so close to the CBD?

Hardly the kiss of death: it's par for the course for many passengers on the Paris Métro, for instance. No-one screams blue murder about changing at Bastille from Line 5, or at Madeleine from Line 12. Ditto for the Bloor-Danforth line on the Toronto Subway. As long as there are decent interchange facilities (including easy pedestrian access), I like the idea of re-routing the 370 via the Valley and Storey Bridge. After all, the Valley is a major trip-generator in its own right.

[somebody]

No offence, but what's with the obsession with forced transfers so close to the CBD?  No way would I support a 370 that does not go to the city, it is where most of its passengers will be going by that point.

There are a number of options for improving the 475, not the least of which is just improving the frequency of the current route, getting rid of the 476 variation and making some use of the Eastern Busway (even if it is just terminating downstairs at PAH).

There are also a number of options for better connectivity between the RBWH and Kangaroo Point.  One for instance would be a standalone route from RBWH to UQ, which could be made up of resources currently allocated to the fairly useless 393, and not require a reduction in or drastic redesign to other services.

The whole 370 corridor to the CBD is served by the 333.  The only real limitation is that it doesn't serve areas such as Cathedral Square.  Perhaps you are infirm and it's too hard to walk to the 333 stop and you are heading to Cathedral Square?  Then you can interchange at RB&WH for a 375, 379, 334, 335, 346, 353 (OTOH).

Interesting suggestion about running the 475 into PAH.  Is there a turnaround facility there or must you use the one in the Tunnel between Dutton Park and Boggo Rd?

I don't see an issue with severing the CBD-Kangaroo Point bus link.  Those making that trip are better served by the ferry.  Although I'm open to counter points.

Maybe even just extend route 29 up Kangaroo Point to RBWH?

I'd wonder if the required roadworks would go down well.

[SurfRail]

No offence, but what's with the obsession with forced transfers so close to the CBD?

Hardly the kiss of death: it's par for the course for many passengers on the Paris Métro, for instance. No-one screams blue murder about changing at Bastille from Line 5, or at Madeleine from Line 12. Ditto for the Bloor-Danforth line on the Toronto Subway. As long as there are decent interchange facilities (including easy pedestrian access), I like the idea of re-routing the 370 via the Valley and Storey Bridge. After all, the Valley is a major trip-generator in its own right.

I have no familiarity with the Paris Metro (much as I would like to), but doubt the comparison obtains.  Unlike most cities, Brisbane has a highly focused CBD where most of the patronage will be going, particularly along one of the city's main roads feeding straight into town, so the opportunity for transferring should exist along the journey or at the CBD periphery.  I don't support making the majority of people change buses 2 km from their destination when it would be easier, and more efficient, for the fewer people who actually need to go somewhere other than the CBD to change buses.  Where are the forced transferees (ie majority) going to go?  Why shouldn't their needs be catered for?

Maybe even just extend route 29 up Kangaroo Point to RBWH?

I'd wonder if the required roadworks would go down well.

Not sure what you mean.  The 29 would involve a left turn out of the Gabba, travel up over the Bridge (with the option of connecting to Fortitude Valley Stn, but that would involve a time penalty) and then into RBWH via the same route taken by the 370, 375 and other Brunswick St routes.  Other than possibly optimising the signals at the Gabba, this appears to be possible now.

The 29 probably makes sense from a timetabling and operational point of view because it allows UQ Lakes buses to layover away from the fairly congested interchange without dead running, but there is also room around the RBWH if they wanted to invest a bit more into the service.

[somebody]

If they are going to the CBD, why aren't they using the 333?

Maybe even just extend route 29 up Kangaroo Point to RBWH?

I'd wonder if the required roadworks would go down well.

Not sure what you mean.  The 29 would involve a left turn out of the Gabba, travel up over the Bridge (with the option of connecting to Fortitude Valley Stn, but that would involve a time penalty) and then into RBWH via the same route taken by the 370, 375 and other Brunswick St routes.  Other than possibly optimising the signals at the Gabba, this appears to be possible now.

The 29 probably makes sense from a timetabling and operational point of view because it allows UQ Lakes buses to layover away from the fairly congested interchange without dead running, but there is also room around the RBWH if they wanted to invest a bit more into the service.

I mean in the other direction.  I'm not sure a bus can make that turn from Main St into the Gabba, and last I was there it looked like the island would be in the way, but looking at it in nearmap it doesn't look that way.

[Mr X]

No offence, but what's with the obsession with forced transfers so close to the CBD?

Hardly the kiss of death: it's par for the course for many passengers on the Paris Métro, for instance. No-one screams blue murder about changing at Bastille from Line 5, or at Madeleine from Line 12. Ditto for the Bloor-Danforth line on the Toronto Subway. As long as there are decent interchange facilities (including easy pedestrian access), I like the idea of re-routing the 370 via the Valley and Storey Bridge. After all, the Valley is a major trip-generator in its own right.

That's because in Paris, metro trains come every 30 seconds in peak hour and every 5mins in off peak. Interchanging is quick and easy in Paris.

Paris also has a very spread out "core" and is laid out vastly different to Brisbane. Lines in Brisbane go straight to the city-valley and terminate there (for the majority of cases). All the lines in Paris don't terminate in the one spot.

I have no familiarity with the Paris Metro (much as I would like to), but doubt the comparison obtains.  Unlike most cities, Brisbane has a highly focused CBD where most of the patronage will be going, particularly along one of the city's main roads feeding straight into town, so the opportunity for transferring should exist along the journey or at the CBD periphery.  I don't support making the majority of people change buses 2 km from their destination when it would be easier, and more efficient, for the fewer people who actually need to go somewhere other than the CBD to change buses.  Where are the forced transferees (ie majority) going to go?  Why shouldn't their needs be catered for?

I agree, there simply is no comparison. One is an underground metro designed for interchanging, the other is a shitty bus service in Brisbane.

[Bulimba30A]

I think the 29 might be an option here... see post in Eastern Busway thread

[cartoonbirdhaus]

I agree, there simply is no comparison. One is an underground metro designed for interchanging, the other is a shitty bus service in Brisbane.

You're right. If the various all-stops routes that run between the City and the Valley had a common interchange at the Valley end, and Class B ROW, it would be a different story, but don't count on something sensible like that happening! And Brisbane is heavily centralised. But aren't there plans for areas like the Valley, Bowen Hills, W/gabba etc to become development nodes in the future? (Yes, I have more questions than answers, and need to ease up on the pontification. Guilty as charged.)

[Mr X]

Woolloongabba and Bowen Hills are both UDAs under the ULDA and Woolloongabba will have the CRR station and densification on the GO Print site. I believe the SE Busway will eventually have the Gabba as a station before Mater Hill when it is realigned? Not sure.
Bowen Hills will have an upgraded Exhibition station (also part of CRR) and has increasing densities planned through the RNA site and the current industrial area.

Re class B ROW between city-valley, I have always thought it would be neat to build a busway from the QSBS to the Valley with a terminus station near the train station and an exit portal for the 19x and cityglider. Bus stations could be built at ANZAC square etc. and many of the Adelaide St services could use it. 

[jouzocha]

I mean in the other direction.  I'm not sure a bus can make that turn from Main St into the Gabba, and last I was there it looked like the island would be in the way, but looking at it in nearmap it doesn't look that way.

I thought that too, but after driving through there on Thursday, I think there is plenty of room for a bus to turn right from Main St into the busway - the traffic island finishes a good distance back from the intersection.  Long buses (14.5m & artics) might be a problem due to the length of the right-turn lane, but regular buses shouldn't cause an issue.

[somebody]

I mean in the other direction.  I'm not sure a bus can make that turn from Main St into the Gabba, and last I was there it looked like the island would be in the way, but looking at it in nearmap it doesn't look that way.

I thought that too, but after driving through there on Thursday, I think there is plenty of room for a bus to turn right from Main St into the busway - the traffic island finishes a good distance back from the intersection.  Long buses (14.5m & artics) might be a problem due to the length of the right-turn lane, but regular buses shouldn't cause an issue.

Even if that is right, I think clearances on the entry/exit at 'Gabba station would likely be insufficient.  Open to correction though.