Freight Curfews : Where are they?

[Fares_Fair]

Hello All,

Where are freight curfews currently ?
Are they in force on the North Coast Line (NCL)?

Regards,
Fares_Fair.

[Stillwater]

QR discusses the problem here, FF:

http://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/public_submissions/published/files/86_qr_limited_SUB.pdf

This is good background too:

http://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/public_submissions/published/files/82_smasuniversityofwollongong_SUB.pdf

This probably the best at looking at the problem:

http://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/~/media/af53e52d-d3ef-4e57-a3c6-cb2d650cef2c/pdf_icrcs_stage_3_technical_pre_feasibility_appendix_b.pdf

[mufreight]

curfews on freight services are an act of desperation, they add significant cost to the movement of freight by rail as well as with time sensitive freight drive that freight onto road transport, again an additional cost borne by the community to which one must add the social costs.
The acceptance of the reality of these costs to the community has now somewhat belatedly seen the Southern Freight Line beeing built in Sydney and also the new lines being built in Melbourne for regional passenger services which will also improve the freight corridor there.
It would seem that there is a restriction on the times for freight services on the NCL to keep them clear of commuter services but there are a number of longer distance passenger services which use paths bordering on peak and affect peak timetabling.

[#Metro]

Rails market share of at about 30 per cent on the Brisbane - Cairns corridor is about
triple that on the Brisbane - Sydney and the Sydney Melbourne corridors.

Rail's superior performance on the Queensland North Coast line was only made
possible the by track upgrades of the 1980s in connection with Main Line Electrification, the
Queensland Main Line Upgrade program of the 1990s and subsequent track upgrades.
Without these upgrades, there would now be many more trucks on the Bruce Highway and a
higher cost of living in Far North Queensland.

Work is nearing completion to duplicate Calboolture - Beerburrum on an improved
alignment and should proceed without delay to Landsborough. Further upgrading of the
Queensland North Coast line including track straightening from Landsborough to at least
Maryborough West is now needed and should receive some Federal funding.

Some good points. 

I wonder- do trucks pay to drive on the roads and does this cover their maintainence? I'm sure there are charges of some kind to run trains on the rail network- it isn't free; Is there a charge like this on roads?

[Fares_Fair]

QR discusses the problem here, FF:

http://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/public_submissions/published/files/86_qr_limited_SUB.pdf

This is good background too:

http://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/public_submissions/published/files/82_smasuniversityofwollongong_SUB.pdf

This probably the best at looking at the problem:

http://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/~/media/af53e52d-d3ef-4e57-a3c6-cb2d650cef2c/pdf_icrcs_stage_3_technical_pre_feasibility_appendix_b.pdf

[Fares_Fair]

curfews on freight services are an act of desperation, they add significant cost to the movement of freight by rail as well as with time sensitive freight drive that freight onto road transport, again an additional cost borne by the community to which one must add the social costs.
The acceptance of the reality of these costs to the community has now somewhat belatedly seen the Southern Freight Line beeing built in Sydney and also the new lines being built in Melbourne for regional passenger services which will also improve the freight corridor there.
It would seem that there is a restriction on the times for freight services on the NCL to keep them clear of commuter services but there are a number of longer distance passenger services which use paths bordering on peak and affect peak timetabling.

[Stillwater]

Freight operations won't just impact on the NCL into the future.  We have positioned our freight handling facilities at Acacia Ridge and South-west Brisbane, also at the Port of Brisbane.  Produce from North Queensland is carted to Rocklea.  Freight from the north and west has to pass through the Brisbane suburban rail system, further restricting passenger services.  Maybe it is time to start thinking about relocating the Rocklea markets, currently in a flood zone, to somewhere on Brisbane's northside.  The produce loads can be broken down there and distributed around Brisbane by truck.

[Golliwog]

A valid point, although perhaps it could be looked at to have 2 distribution centers? One on the southside and another on the north. So long as they're on one of the rail corridors, trains can easily get to either one, or travel between the two, and it removes some of the hassle and road traffic caused by the limited number of river crossings.

Either way, into the future I can see a need for dedicated freight tracks through Brisbane, and out to the port.

[#Metro]

So many projects, so little money. :-(
It is a good idea. 

[Stillwater]

Selling markets would allow for redevelopment.  The private company operating the markets says it would consider moving for $300 million.  What is it worth to guarantee Brisbane's supply of fresh produce in a flood?

[#Metro]

I would not pay them 1c.

If they haven't moved on their own volition what that means is that the cost of moving is greater than the revenue cost of loss and they are quite happy to take and wear the risk of being flooded again.

That area should not be developed for residential or otherwise (it can't be developed for such purposes anyway).
It should be floodplain IMHO, and therefore a large open park with trees, picnic areas and bikepaths that can go underwater and not have a problem.

Let the council re-zone land elsewhere in the city for markets and let a competitor set up shop there. No need to pay private business anything.

[ButFli]

Selling markets would allow for redevelopment. 

...in a flood zone.

Guarantee Brisbane's fresh supply of produce in a flood? We were without fresh produce for what, a couple of days? Mostly because the shops were shut. I'm sure we can handle that once every 35 years or whatever it is.

Back OT, can I ask how much of the produce sold at Rocklea arrives by train? I am guessing none.

[Mozz]

Spoke to a contact at the Markets - apparently they used to receive produce via rail however he says that these days none as it's too difficult - will try to find out what the difficulties are but we can probably guess on at least some of them.

[Jonno]

Sorry but why should there be curfews on freight?  There is no curfew on trucks.  Why are we continually lumping regulations or controls on rail (zero harm, full cost revovery, etc) whilst the exact opposite is happening on long-haul road freight.   It is time for the road transport industry to implement zero harm.  We would then see some major changes to the way freight is moved.

[Fares_Fair]

Hi Jonno,

Because then, according to the reports I have read, the Government doesn't have to spend money on additional infrastructure.
It's a delaying tactic.
That appears to be the choice our current State government has made.

Regards,
Fares_Fair.

[petey3801]

I don't think there is much in the way of freight curfews in Brisbane at the moment. Freight trains run through peak hours (particularly Pacific National Queensland), in peak directions... If the freight companies are willing to pay the money for a peak path, they've got it!

[ButFli]

If the freight companies are willing to pay the money for a peak path, they've got it!

If they aren't disrupting passenger service, why shouldn't they?

[mufreight]

The NCL between Beerburrum and Gympie has capacity restraints due to the single track infrastructure, this impacts on ALL rail services through that section with the greatest impacts on the commuter passenger services operating between Beerburrum and Nambour, another choke point is the double track section between Petrie and Lawnton where the third line finishes which due to the commuter services that terminate and originate at Petrie adversly affects the numbers of train paths avaliable from Northgate to Petrie..