Ticket Inspections Significantly Delaying Citytrain Services

[Cam]

I'm on the 10.10am Caboolture service from Ipswich. We have just waited at Graceville for 6-7 minutes whilst tickets & Go Cards were checked by inspectors. There was an announcement that there would be a delay whilst tickets were checked. The service was already 5-6 minutes late. It left Graceville 12 minutes late.

This is the first daytime service between peak hours I have caught in more than a year. Does this happen regularly? Why should ticket inspections delay services - particularly when the service is already late? The all stations service is slow enough from Ipswich to Brisbane without adding further delays. I'm glad I don't regularly catch off peak rail services.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Are you talking about the raids they do on passengers where they all board the same train at once? Instead of having 2 people walk the entire train over x amount of stops they stop the train and all board. That way no one can jump off the train before the ticket inspectors get to them. I'll see if I can find that video I have where about 5 people rushed to the door (Including dragging their bikes ) when they saw ticket inspectors. I had quite the laugh lol.

[Cam]

Are you talking about the raids they do on passengers where they all board the same train at once? Instead of having 2 people walk the entire train over x amount of stops they stop the train and all board. That way no one can jump off the train before the ticket inspectors get to them. I'll see if I can find that video I have where about 5 people rushed to the door (Including dragging their bikes ) when they saw ticket inspectors. I had quite the laugh lol.

Yes - although I only saw 1 inspector on the front carriage that I was in. At least one person alighted after hearing the announcement and before the inspector reached him. I'm all for ticket inspectors checking tickets & Go Cards but paying passengers should not be inconvenienced. The sooner the Ipswich Line becomes a tiered service, the better. Inspectors will have plenty of time to check tickets between Darra & Indooroopilly (assuming a stop at Indooroopilly) on the express services from Ipswich.

[somebody]

Never heard of this before, but there are other options to catch people doing so, such as station inspections.

[Fares_Fair]

I'm thinking of a new advertising slogan.
This is the 3rd delay this week for Sunshine Coast / Caboolture line.

"TransLink .... another day, another delay. Make the most of it."   

Regards,
Fares_Fair

[colinw]

Sounds like argument in favour of fully gated stations to me.  This is a classic case of letting operational convenience override passenger convenience.

[Gazza]

I have had this happen a couple of times and I bloody well hate it. Once was on a Ferny Grove train around 8pm at Bowen Hills, the other occasion was on an Ipswich train also around 8pm at Indooroopilly, they also ran a sniffer dog through.

I accept the need for ticket inspections, but making people late is absolute bullsh%t, I guess because it's off peak they think time doesn't matter.

Worthy of some media attention I think.

[somebody]

Sounds like argument in favour of fully gated stations to me.  This is a classic case of letting operational convenience override passenger convenience.

The ones at Toowong are hardly ever manned outside of peak times, at least when I've been there.

[Zoiks]

I have never seen a 'raid' as has been described. But the other morning 2 ticket inspectors got off a north bound train (platform 2) at Eagle Junction, wondered over to platform 1 and start checking go cards. I saw no less then a dozen people sneak back and touch their go card against the reader before the inspectors got to them.

[HappyTrainGuy]

I personally don't mind it. When they did it to me they waited for the train to arrive at the station. Some blocked the exit and others waited in the middle. Two inspectors got on each carriage and quickly checked for tickets and go cards. If you couldn't produce a ticket/go card they kicked you off the train and the ones on the platform then delt with you/wrote them up. They got through half the carriage in about 30 seconds but then some passengers started back chatting the inspectors or going through their bag/pockets/wallets/jackets trying to find that elusive paper ticket/trying to make up excuses before they kicked them off. If passengers do the right thing in the first place it should only take a minute or two. Add in the bad apples and it starts to take longer. About a quarter of the carriage I was on got kicked off. Just went to show just how many people don't bother buying tickets.

[O_128]

Sounds like argument in favour of fully gated stations to me.  This is a classic case of letting operational convenience override passenger convenience.

The ones at Toowong are hardly ever manned outside of peak times, at least when I've been there.

Over the last couple of months ive noticed toowong being manned full time

[somebody]

Over the last couple of months ive noticed toowong being manned full time

After 7-8pm?

[O_128]

Over the last couple of months ive noticed toowong being manned full time

After 7-8pm?

6am -6pm

[somebody]

Over the last couple of months ive noticed toowong being manned full time

After 7-8pm?

6am -6pm

Still only daytime then.  And missing the shoulder of the PM peak.  What about weekends?  Not too many more hours to do it properly.

[Golliwog]

Hmmm, I've never experienced this either. I do see the point though, as more than once I've been on the train and you can tell the ticketies are coming along when the dero kids move up the train to be further away from the inspector in the hope of getting off at the next station without being checked. Provided they've got enough inspectors to have 1 or 2 per carriage I don't see the problem, it wouldn't take long at all.

[Derwan]

This is another method used to catch fare evaders - often in conjunction with the rail squad (police).

If you don't like it, blame the people who choose to break the law and evade fares.

[longboi]

One of these operations was going on at Mitchelton tonight. Taking 6-7 minutes is a bit extreme and definately not the norm. Usually there are enough TOs to clear the whole train in under 2 minutes.

[dwb]

Sounds like argument in favour of fully gated stations to me.  This is a classic case of letting operational convenience override passenger convenience.

Fully gated stations only make sense where you can have a guard at the exit and there is only 1-2 exits, or it's a major origin/destination station. Otherwise they are practically useless!!

[HappyTrainGuy]

One of these operations was going on at Mitchelton tonight. Taking 6-7 minutes is a bit extreme and definately not the norm. Usually there are enough TOs to clear the whole train in under 2 minutes.

Times can vary depending on what type of passenger is onboard ie ones that have their go card/ticket ready to show, others might play the i'm trying to find my ticket in this bag game or some passengers might have headphones on and not hear/see them coming. eg. 5 passengers might take an extra 10 seconds to get out their go cards/tickets because they had headphones on. That's instantly an extra 50 seconds waiting there.

[longboi]

One of these operations was going on at Mitchelton tonight. Taking 6-7 minutes is a bit extreme and definately not the norm. Usually there are enough TOs to clear the whole train in under 2 minutes.

Times can vary depending on what type of passenger is onboard ie ones that have their go card/ticket ready to show, others might play the i'm trying to find my ticket in this bag game or some passengers might have headphones on and not hear/see them coming. eg. 5 passengers might take an extra 10 seconds to get out their go cards/tickets because they had headphones on. That's instantly an extra 50 seconds waiting there.

I know they can vary but in my personal experience working alongside TOs and Rail squad conducting these operations I can tell you it generally only takes 2-3 minutes.

[SteelPan]

I'm thinking of a new advertising slogan.
This is the 3rd delay this week for Sunshine Coast / Caboolture line.

"TransLink .... another day, another delay. Make the most of it."   

Regards,
Fares_Fair

Exactly, welcome to the unique "world class" Queeeeensland, with its "world class" Translate.  Try this on in LA, London, Tokyo, Chicago or NYC - and just watch people walk right over you.....

[p858snake]

Sounds like argument in favour of fully gated stations to me.  This is a classic case of letting operational convenience override passenger convenience.

Not needed at all... TO officers have stood at the exits to FG station before and its worked very well.... (infact it even speed a few things up which was nice)


I can not see a valid reason to ever hold up a train like this for ticket inspections (although admittedly i've only had my card checked 1.(~5)ish times this year so I don't have much experience in card checking routines)

[mufreight]

Saturation approach inspections are unfortunately justified but can be modified in the manner in which they are carried out.
Two or three officers board each carriage with a further two officers at each exit from the target station.
All tickets/cards are checked with the train operating to the next station where again officers are already positioned at each entrance/exit
where the saturation officers disembark removing from the train those without tickets/valid cards.
The operation then moves back on the next train back to the originating station or the officers from the originating station leapfrog by road on to the next station for a repeat on the next train.
As an entirely random operation it would readily deter repeats bearing in mind the inconvenience of being removed from the service as well as the penalty for fare evasion. 

[SteelPan]

Much this time and money wasting nonesense would not be necessary, if we went to a simple flat rate fare structure.  1 stop or 10 stops same price ticketing!  At the very least we should aim for a two zone system by say 2015.

[somebody]

Much this time and money wasting nonesense would not be necessary, if we went to a simple flat rate fare structure.  1 stop or 10 stops same price ticketing!  At the very least we should aim for a two zone system by say 2015.

I don't think so.  I don't see why you wouldn't still get people not paying.

[dwb]

Much this time and money wasting nonesense would not be necessary, if we went to a simple flat rate fare structure.  1 stop or 10 stops same price ticketing!  At the very least we should aim for a two zone system by say 2015.

This is a crazy idea for many many reasons already well debated on this forum.

[laughable]

There was another one today at Nundah. I witnessed for an hour, 2 arrests for wanted offences, 13 fines, 15 warnings and 8 notices to appear for fare evasion. Tell me these things aren't warranted.

Police like to do these as people who are usually wanted, carry drugs or are POI for other offences are too stupid to purchase tickets. It also keeps the crap out of their district if they do the OP at the start of their district.

Sometimes you avid readers and posters need to get off the high horse and realise these things aren't just done to annoy you.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Not bad for 4 trains lol.

[BribieG]

I've been travelling offpeak on the Caboolture line for about 8 years and note that:
There are hardly every any inspectors North of Zillmere.
In 8 years I have never seen a railway police officer on a train. I thought they had been disbanded?
Many local scruffos, single mums with prams and school truants with their little silver Mongoose bikes seem to use the train as a free shuttle service between Caboolture and Strathpine, judging by the number of collars made by the inspectors when they do, rarely, get on at Burpengary etc.
Seasoned fare evaders mostly sit in the front carriage where they can check the entire platform for inspectors as they enter a station.
The inspectors of course get on at the rear for some reason.
If a female is caught by the inspectors she knows that a good defence is to bury her head in her hands and sob uncontrollably until the inspectors give up and leave her alone. Similarly if you are a male you claim that you have no ID and do not carry a wallet, and persist with this line until the inspectors give up and leave you alone.

[O_128]

I've been travelling offpeak on the Caboolture line for about 8 years and note that:
There are hardly every any inspectors North of Zillmere.
In 8 years I have never seen a railway police officer on a train. I thought they had been disbanded?
Many local scruffos, single mums with prams and school truants with their little silver Mongoose bikes seem to use the train as a free shuttle service between Caboolture and Strathpine, judging by the number of collars made by the inspectors when they do, rarely, get on at Burpengary etc.
Seasoned fare evaders mostly sit in the front carriage where they can check the entire platform for inspectors as they enter a station.
The inspectors of course get on at the rear for some reason.
If a female is caught by the inspectors she knows that a good defence is to bury her head in her hands and sob uncontrollably until the inspectors give up and leave her alone. Similarly if you are a male you claim that you have no ID and do not carry a wallet, and persist with this line until the inspectors give up and leave you alone.

In paris its an instant fine if you have no id with ur go card, we learnt this the hard way and nearly ended up at the police station, They also carry eftpos machines with them so u can pay on the spot

[somebody]

In paris its an instant fine if you have no id with ur go card, we learnt this the hard way and nearly ended up at the police station, They also carry eftpos machines with them so u can pay on the spot

WTF?  Are you talking about a concession/seniors card?  I don't see why you should need ID with a full fare go card if you have paid.

[HappyTrainGuy]

Isn't it a potential fine here too if your using a concession go card with no concession id/student id as per terms and conditions of using a concession go card? The same as bus drivers/train staff refusing to allow concession rates without id.

[p858snake]

Isn't it a potential fine here too if your using a concession go card with no concession id/student id as per terms and conditions of using a concession go card? The same as bus drivers/train staff refusing to allow concession rates without id.

Yes, I nearly got busted when I had my id but the card was snapped in half.

[dwb]

Isn't it a potential fine here too if your using a concession go card with no concession id/student id as per terms and conditions of using a concession go card? The same as bus drivers/train staff refusing to allow concession rates without id.

I believe it is a 2-3 strikes approach. They take your details from other ID.

Isn't it a potential fine here too if your using a concession go card with no concession id/student id as per terms and conditions of using a concession go card? The same as bus drivers/train staff refusing to allow concession rates without id.

Yes, I nearly got busted when I had my id but the card was snapped in half.

That totally happened to me to, while I was waiting for the bus I had my ID and change in my hand and I was squeezing the card lengthwise... next thing I know it snapped in half. I was SO surprised! And then the bus driver gave me an earful about having a broken ID card. What a jerk!