Any comments: Waive ticketing requirements next week on public transport?

[Jonno]

My only concern is that we see a massive road re-building program that does not just replace what was there but significantly upgrades roads to flood poof them or "use the funds better".

[Gazza]

And Yeerongpilly isn't that high.  I'm not sure if flood doors would be constructible.  Wouldn't water leak through the ballast?

A floodgate building is proposed, see page 3 of the Engineering Design document:
http://www.crossriverrail.qld.gov.au/images/stories/reference_design/pdf_cross_river_rail_reference_design_overview_eng_design.pdf

And Golliwog is right...Underground railways often don't use ballast, they just bolt it down:

[somebody]

Yes, I've seen un-ballasted underground railways.  Would still be difficult to make it tight IMO.  Maybe they'll pump out the leakage.

[justanotheruser]

I just saw a photo of Mayne, no water.

Pity they don't open up Richlands.  There is nothing from Inala, Forest Lake etc.  Richlands branch is intact. 

do they have the ability to open it?  Ok perhaps a shuttle bus to darra only and then change onto another bus for the city but my understanding is they still have trouble getting enough crew to operate.  Many of the crew are staying home to clean up (which is only fair) or still can't get in.

[ozbob]

A rail shuttle Darra - Richlands would be efficient in terms of crew. Platform 2 Darra (down branch platform) is open.

Obviously the line needs to be re-opened to Darra first though and I would expect a lot of other things to sort first.  But these are exceptional circumstances.

[justanotheruser]

The free travel applies to all bus, train and Ipswich FlexiLink services on the TransLink network (ferry services are not operating until further notice). Services will be free from the first service on Friday 14 January to last service on Friday 21 January.

what about other flexilink services?  Are they still free?  Ipswich is not the only place with flexilink. There is a flexilink service to prince charles hospital.

[Gazza]

Would still be difficult to make it tight IMO.  Maybe they'll pump out the leakage.

Its a feature on other underground railways, so clearly someone has already worked through the issues:
http://www.trainweb.org/tubeprune/Jubilee.htm (Scroll down)

[ozbob]

See --> http://www.translink.com.au/tickets-and-fares/fares/free-travel-jan-2011

Seems only Ipswich FlexiLink services are free.  

[STB]

Came back from doing a round trip to grab dinner for the night and upon my arrival at Birkdale station this afternoon, I found the AVVM and card readers all switched on.  There was even a poster up on the station wall of the now postponed fare changes (the poster had the changes due on 17th January).  Some quick calls sorted that out, although I am now worried about other stations.

[WTN]

With fare increases partly used to rebuild infrastructure, can we expect fewer new services and less than 305,000 new seats?

[somebody]

Hopefully not.

[Stillwater]

What we might see is a slowing of the rollout of big new projects.  Kippa-Ring line and upgrading / duplication to Ferny Grove are locked in.  Where contracts have not been let for major station upgrades, some of that money could be diverted to repairs at stations affected by the floods.  Arguably, this is the more sensible way to go.

In hindsight, thank God for the asset sales sell-off ahead of this disaster, although that mey not be enough to salvage a AAA credit rating.  Without a AAA credit rating, Queensland will have to pay higher interest on borrowings for money to undertake the reconstruction.

CRR might have to be put back 2 or 3 years, not just because whatever funding that's around in federal and state coffers will have to be diverted to more essential works, but because the workforce and skills required to build it will be occupied on flood recovery tasks.  The rapid requirements for all manner of construction product (concrete, reinforced steel etc) again will require the product to go elsewhere, onther than on CRR.  There is only so much manufacturing capacity out there.  Finally, the demand for product will force up prices, and may force up inflation as well.

Thus, a $16 million project starting in 2014 would be a $22 billion project starting in 2017 for a 2021 finish.

Let's hope the State Government does not continue to embarrass itself and insult us by producing glossy documents showing tantalising, yet unfunded, transport infrastructure projects that can be ready beyond 2031.  While these projects represent the ideal and point the way forward for planning purposes, what's required is a greater focus on the present and what FUNDED projects can proceed across, say, the next 10 years to wring greater efficiencies from the existing PT system, augmented with some realistic, yet very useful, capacity improvements projects.  We need to cut the cloth to fit the budget.  Champagne tastes are fine, but beer is more affordable.

[Stillwater]

It would not surpise me if the government has not started preparing an emergency mini budget.  Some additional state taxes may be needed -- say a two cent a litre surchange on fuel over three years, collected by the federal government and paid to Queensland, for road and bridge repairs.

[mufreight]

It would not surpise me if the government has not started preparing an emergency mini budget.  Some additional state taxes may be needed -- say a two cent a litre surchange on fuel over three years, collected by the federal government and paid to Queensland, for road and bridge repairs.

How long have you worked for Toy Boy Treasurer Fraser's spin department,
The asset sales will now even sooner prove to be the unmitigated disaster that they are with the loss of revenue from those profitable assets that have been sold off and the recovery from the floods will further show the fiscal incompetence of the current government.
The recovery fron the 74 floods was accomplished without resorting to increased charges and taxes or the sale of government assets and new infrustructure was built immediately following the recovery.

But then perhaps I am a little older and possibly wiser than many today.

[somebody]

Fuel excise can't be done, thanks to the High Court.  If it was put up in Qld, it would have to be across Australia, and I don't believe other states would be crazy enough to bring in a subsidy scheme.

I tend to agree with your other points.  Northern Busway beyond Kedron and Eastern beyond Main Ave, Coorparoo would be the first in the firing line IMO.

If anything good comes out of this maybe it will be to have more sensible services based transport expenditure rather than the current concrete fetish.

[Stillwater]

The High Court decision ruled out states placing a fuel franchise fee on petrol, correct.  The only 'fuel tax' allowable on petrol, tobacco and liquor is the fuel excise imposed by the federal government.  Hence my reference to the feds imposing a temporary tax (three years).  As the flood damage, and road damage in particular, extends across the board (Qld, NSW, Vic, Tas, SA, NT), it could go into a national pool of funds from which all flood-affected states would benefit.

[somebody]

So you are suggesting that the other states should wear a higher fuel tax?  I don't think Queenslanders would like that if it was the other way around!

[petey3801]

So you are suggesting that the other states should wear a higher fuel tax?  I don't think Queenslanders would like that if it was the other way around!

I think he means the extra revenue would go into a pool of funds that would feed the expediture for damaged roads etc. across all states.

[justanotheruser]

It would not surpise me if the government has not started preparing an emergency mini budget.  Some additional state taxes may be needed -- say a two cent a litre surchange on fuel over three years, collected by the federal government and paid to Queensland, for road and bridge repairs.

The asset sales will now even sooner prove to be the unmitigated disaster that they are with the loss of revenue from those profitable assets that have been sold off and the recovery from the floods will further show the fiscal incompetence of the current government.

and what does this have to do with anything???  Even if they had not been sold off there would not be a fast enough flow of income to fund rebuilding so the money would need to come from elsewhere.  Having said that I reckon the majority of the assett sales money has already been allocated so it makes no difference one way or the other.

[mufreight]

The now private operators of the transport system will minimise their operating costs by reducing their workforce but also increase their charges to maximise their return to cover the cost of the investment.
This means higher transport costs overall which you as a consumer will pay.
The rehabilitation of flood damaged rail infrastructure on the coal lines sold under the asset sales will be paid by the government which means effectively that you the taxpayer will now pay hundreds of millions for the repair of a private entity's property that will when repaired provide no return to the taxpayers who previously owned it.
Again this will effectively mean increased charges by the government imposed on the people of this state. 

[Derwan]

Following David's suggestion and Bob's media release, I have created a page on Facebook to spread the word:

http://www.facebook.com/pages/I-am-donating-my-saved-public-transport-fares-to-the-flood-relief-appeal/118966161508556

[Golliwog]

The now private operators of the transport system will minimise their operating costs by reducing their workforce but also increase their charges to maximise their return to cover the cost of the investment.
This means higher transport costs overall which you as a consumer will pay.
The rehabilitation of flood damaged rail infrastructure on the coal lines sold under the asset sales will be paid by the government which means effectively that you the taxpayer will now pay hundreds of millions for the repair of a private entity's property that will when repaired provide no return to the taxpayers who previously owned it.
Again this will effectively mean increased charges by the government imposed on the people of this state. 

Do you have any proof to back up those statements? I'm currently working at QRN and while I havn't been in since Brisbane flooded, before that I hadn't heard any gossip about downsizing or that the repair bill was to be footed by the government.

[mufreight]

The now private operators of the transport system will minimise their operating costs by reducing their workforce but also increase their charges to maximise their return to cover the cost of the investment.
This means higher transport costs overall which you as a consumer will pay.
The rehabilitation of flood damaged rail infrastructure on the coal lines sold under the asset sales will be paid by the government which means effectively that you the taxpayer will now pay hundreds of millions for the repair of a private entity's property that will when repaired provide no return to the taxpayers who previously owned it.
Again this will effectively mean increased charges by the government imposed on the people of this state. 

Do you have any proof to back up those statements? I'm currently working at QRN and while I havn't been in since Brisbane flooded, before that I hadn't heard any gossip about downsizing or that the repair bill was to be footed by the government.

A lifetime of working in the Transport industry in rail and road, passenger and freight and accumulated personal experience is the basis of my statement, might I suggest if you doubt this that a few minutes spent researching every privatisation in the transport industry in this country would change your perspective, what has been worse has been not only the increased transport costs as a consequence but the social costs as well.
In Tasmania the government was forced to pay more that what was received when their rail system was sold and now has been forced to spend billions more to rebuild the system so that it is usable, the choice was to spend even more on their road system to enable it to carry the freight in a considerably less efficent and far more costly manner than that was previously carried by rail before it was asset stripped.
The situation has been similar in Victoria and New South Wales and one must remain mindful that in this country reliant as it is on efficent freight services any increases in operating costs are borne by those least able to afford these imposed costs.

[somebody]

Sorry?  What was the problem with the NSW experience of rail privatisation?  Rail market share was dying pre-privatisation anyway.  At least SYD-PER services have been increased since then.

Vic, yes not really a success. And Tas pretty disastrous, but why would they have paid more than they received to get the assets back??

[mufreight]

In Vic the infrastructure has been run down and some country lines have reached the point that they are virtuarly unusable with the freight now being moved on road at increased cost by a road freight company that is one of the major shareholders of Pacific National.
The infrastructure has now been brought back by the Vic Government which is now spending hundreds of millions to rehabilitate the lines and even more on their road network which is being pounded to pieces by the increased road freight that has come from rail.
These costs are all being bourne by the taxpayers in both taxes and in increased prices due to the freight cost component.
In NSW it has also been a double edged sword.
Branch lines have been closed so the freight from those areas is now being moved by road at increased cost and again the roads are being pounded to pieces requiring increased maintenence the cost of which the government has to fund for the main roads but in some of the country shire areas the point has been reached where the shire is unable to stand the costs of maintaining the roads to the point where rather than attempt to maintain the road surface as a bitumin road for safety reasons the roads have been graded and are now gravel roads no longer all weather roads and in wet weather are frequently impassable for other than heavy vehicles at considerably reduced speeds.
Again all of this adds to freight costs and the increased taxation burden imposed everything purchased by all.
In Tasmania the Government paid the price they had to because the costs of the purchase and rehabilation of their rail system was less that the costs to the State to move all freight to road if the rail system were to be abandoned.   

[colinw]

The same process is now playing out in Western Australia, with QRN (ARG) cast as the "bad guys".  Basically the private operator & Government have walked away from hundreds of kilometres of grain only line.  We have already seen this on the downs as well, with grain transport dying away to the detriment of fragile roads over blacksoil country.

[brismike]

A rail shuttle Darra - Richlands would be efficient in terms of crew. Platform 2 Darra (down branch platform) is open.

Obviously the line needs to be re-opened to Darra first though and I would expect a lot of other things to sort first.  But these are exceptional circumstances.

A Shuttle service is running today between Richlands and Darra. I saw them with my own eyes this morning and I have seen it confirmed in this news article in the Courier Mail

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/public-transport-recovering/story-e6freoof-1225989270295

Regards Mike

[ozbob]

Trains are running Mike today yes.  See --> http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=639.msg45321#msg45321  At the moment they are through trains.

[colinw]

And I am sure the line is an instant success.

Just as a line to Springfield will be, or a line to Kippa-Ring, or a line to Browns Plains & Greenbank via the interstate corridor.

It will be interesting seeing how Richlands patronage settles down as the crisis passes and free public transport is withdrawn.