University exams - and a lack of public transport

[Emmie]

Exams began at University of Queensland at 8am this morning – a Saturday.  I was met when I arrived there by an irate student who had arrived by train at the Park Rd / Boggo Rd interchange to discover that there are no buses timetabled before 8am.  He walked from Boggo Rd across the Green Bridge and arrived in time – but others may not have been so lucky.

I've since checked, and there is only one 412 bus timetabled that MIGHT get students there on time – it is supposed to arrive at Chancellor's Place at 7.55am.  According to Translink, the only reliable way I could have arrived by 8am from Sandgate was to leave home at 5.15am, and change to the City Cat!

As it was, I drove – and not surprisingly there was a hell of a traffic jam in Sir Fred Schonell Drive – not helped by the fact that the BCC chose this morning to close off half of Benson St for kerbing and guttering.

This is an unacceptable situation.  Many students rely on public transport to get to university, and with inadequate public transport, they have no option but to do exams under unnecessarily stressful conditions.  If Translink can put on extra trains and buses for a rock concert or a sporting match, they should be able to do the same for university exams.

Actually – I don't blame Translink, which almost certainly wasn't warned by UQ administration of the problem.  Just as the BCC was not informed that there would be lots of traffic on Benson St this morning.  My suspicion is that as long as top administrators all have their own private car parks, they will never realise the need for decent public transport for the rest of us.

[ozbob]

QUT exams started last weekend on the Saturday (5th) confounded by the Northgate overhead wire meltdown.  Today we have the Caboolture line problems.  QUT GP is still relatively easy to get to on weekends providing you can walk up from Central or Roma St.  UQ is a different situation as your rightly point out Emmie. Maybe the university administration has to rethink this or ensure that some extra bus services are put on.  Next meeting I have with TransLink I will raise it, but I think it is incumbent on the UQ Registrar to get cracking.

[STB]

One of the problems is that the exam period is only on a few times a year.  Hence, to put on public transport, it'd be quite an expensive exercise with possible little return except during those few weeks, at the expense of the rest of the network. 

Probably the best thing would be for the universities is to charter services for students during the exam periods.

[ozbob]

I think TransLink could organise services for those weekends when examinations are on.  They can do it for sporting events.  It just needs some liaison work between the university administration and TransLink.

[ButFli]

One of the problems is that the exam period is only on a few times a year.  Hence, to put on public transport, it'd be quite an expensive exercise with possible little return except during those few weeks, at the expense of the rest of the network. 

Probably the best thing would be for the universities is to charter services for students during the exam periods.

What are you talking about?

It's not like this is peak hour. It's early Saturday morning. The services aren't there not because buses aren't available, but because the buses are sitting unused in a depot. The only thing stopping those buses from being used is that Translink hasn't organised it. If they can find enough drivers willing to operate Nightlink every Friday and Saturday and enough drivers to take people to and from Suncorp and the Gabba (and wherever else) every time there is an event surely they can organise enough drivers to ferry Uni students to exams on six Saturdays a year.

Translink are smart enough to cut back the number of services during Uni holidays so why can't they ramp up services on Saturday mornings in exam time?

[#Metro]

One of the problems is that the exam period is only on a few times a year.  Hence, to put on public transport, it'd be quite an expensive exercise with possible little return except during those few weeks, at the expense of the rest of the network.

Is "the bus was late" or "TransLink had no services on" an acceptable excuse for not doing an exam?
Could these people could have failed their courses as PT failures are not an acceptable excuse? I feel sorry for them.


I agree with ButFli. These universities are run by the Queensland Government. An example of one arm of government (universities) not co-ordinating with another part of government (TransLink).

[Jon Bryant]

"But there is no traffic on a Saturday so surely everyone would drive because everyone has at least one car...don't they... and there is lots and lots of car parking and most of it is free on a Saturday. Why would anyone in their right mind used Public Transport" a spokesperson for Translink said.   (We really need a 'Warning Intentional Sarcasm' icon)         

[ozbob]

Because of the 'service delays of late' my advice to students is if the examination commences at 8.30am, aim to be at the examination location at least one hour before.  Sad, but the reality is too many problems of late.  This and last weekend very significant problems on the rail network, and of course the 'you want a bus?  Come back Monday problem ...'

[#Metro]

Because of the 'service delays of late' my advice to students is if the examination commences at 8.30am, aim to be at the examination location at least one hour before.

Maybe they should just camp there.

[stephenk]

Last time I took exams at UQ, it was bad enough getting to UQ for 8am on a weekday. The 109 timetable has since improved a bit.

I'm having to get to an exam in the nether regions of New Farm for 8:30am on Tuesday. Due to holes in the counter-peak bus timetables, I'm considering getting a taxi from Fortitude Valley.

[ozbob]

Media Release 13 June 2010

SEQ:  Public transport priorities - sporting events versus student examinations

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport commuters has said many tertiary students have been caught out by a lack of forward planning by authorities to supply public transport to allow students to attend examinations on Saturdays (1).  Additionally major problems with the rail network have further caused students stress in attempting to make examination starts the past two weekends.

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"End of semester examinations are an important part of academic programs at universities. Many universities now schedule examinations on Saturdays to to cope with the increase in student numbers.  Unfortunately public transport has not matched this demand."

"The major problem is with students needing to travel to the St Lucia campus for examinations at the University of Queensland.  Yesterday for example, students who had arrived by train at the Park Road / Boggo Road interchange discovered that there were no buses timetabled before 8am."

"According to the present timetable there there is only one 412 bus timetabled that MIGHT get students to UQ on time – it is supposed to arrive at Chancellor's Place at 7.55am.  According to Translink, the only reliable way students could have arrived by 8am from Sandgate was to leave home at 5.15am, and change to the City Cat!"

"TransLink and Government delight in laying on public transport for sporting events, surely the same support can be given to tertiary students, regular users of public transport?"


Reference:

1. http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=3954.0

Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org

[Derwan]

When I went to UQ for a work function, I walked from Dutton Park station.  It's really not that far.

According to Google maps (walking), QUT GP (entrance) is about 1.4km from Central or 1.3km from Roma St.  UQ (bus station) is 1.5km from Dutton Park station.  It's virtually NO different!

Get the heart pumping, get the endorphins flowing.  You might actually do better at the exam. 

(Disclaimer:  Consideration has not been given for students with heart conditions, who are pregnant or who have a disability.)

[ozbob]

Problem is a number of students have disabilities as you have mentioned. Also carrying books etc.  Weather can also be an issue.

It is not an unreasonable request to have public transport in place. 

[Derwan]

Then Bob I think it is only fair to include both UQ and QUT GP in the push - considering the distances to the nearest train stations are equivalent.

What are the buses to QUT KG like?

[ozbob]

QUT KG is on the northern busway!  No problems.

QUT GP has bus as well.  It would be handy though if the loop bus ran on weekends though.  Also for special events they do run the 391 as well (the QUT KG - GP Shuttle).  Also QUT GP is easy to get to over the Goodwill bridge from Mater Hill bus station.

The major issue is UQ on Saturdays.

[somebody]

It is not an unreasonable request to have public transport in place. 

I agree.

Also QUT GP is easy to get to over the Goodwill bridge from Mater Hill bus station.

Also South Bank train station.  That's the best option if you are coming from a south train line, I'd think.

These issues wouldn't exist if either the 109 or 412 were a BUZ, but preferably both.

I think not being able to get in to the CBD from the busiest train line in Brisbane (Ipswich) by 6am on a weekend is a dead set shocker.  You can't do that on any bus route I can think of either.

[ButFli]

These universities are run by the Queensland Government. An example of one arm of government (universities) not co-ordinating with another part of government (TransLink).

Universities run by the State Government? The State Government enacts the enabling legislation and that is about it. Universities are funded and regulated by the Commonwealth Government but are largely autonomous.

I think not being able to get in to the CBD from the busiest train line in Brisbane (Ipswich) by 6am on a weekend is a dead set shocker.  You can't do that on any bus route I can think of either.

The first 199 on a Saturday morning arrives in the CBD before 6AM.  If you were prepared to catch a N199 you could get there even earlier.

[stephenk]

When I went to UQ for a work function, I walked from Dutton Park station.  It's really not that far.

According to Google maps (walking), QUT GP (entrance) is about 1.4km from Central or 1.3km from Roma St.  UQ (bus station) is 1.5km from Dutton Park station.  It's virtually NO different!

Get the heart pumping, get the endorphins flowing.  You might actually do better at the exam. 

(Disclaimer:  Consideration has not been given for students with heart conditions, who are pregnant or who have a disability.)

I'm sure may students would not like to get to their exams hot and bothered. Personally I prefer to be relaxed going into an exam.

[somebody]

The first 199 on a Saturday morning arrives in the CBD before 6AM.   If you were prepared to catch a N199 you could get there even earlier.

Ok, but there isn't much from the west.  You certainly can't use a N464, although I think an N412 from Toowong is allowed.  Other than that, there's nothing.  I wouldn't be surprised if the 199 and CityGlider are the only examples.

[Golliwog]

At least this problem seems to be something that would be solved if Translink adopts the high frequency bus routes (at least every 15 minutes 6am-9pm 7days) it talks about in their new network plan. They don't specify specific routes, but after the BUZ routes, as I'm sure most would agree either the 109 or 412 would be up near the top of the list.

[ButFli]

The thing is, 412 and 109 are already high frequency where the majority of the demand is - weekdays during semester. Providing the services required on exam Saturdays for the entire year would be a waste of resources IMO and I think Translink would see it that way too. So no, I don't think "upgrading" the 412 and 109 will lead to this problem being solved.

[#Metro]

How hard would it be to charter a single bus in the morning, to do a 109 run to reach UQ at 7.30 am?
Or a feeder from Dutton Pk station?
$100, $200?

[somebody]

The thing is, 412 and 109 are already high frequency where the majority of the demand is - weekdays during semester. Providing the services required on exam Saturdays for the entire year would be a waste of resources IMO and I think Translink would see it that way too. So no, I don't think "upgrading" the 412 and 109 will lead to this problem being solved.

Yes, but look how successful the BUZ - no compromises on timetabling idea has been.  If the 412 was done along these lines, it may well get a far bigger lift in patronage than anyone expects.

[#Metro]

Yes, but look how successful the BUZ - no compromises on timetabling idea has been.  If the 412 was done along these lines, it may well get a far bigger lift in patronage than anyone expects.

Agree. There is info to back this up too with the BUZ. Page 3 will blow you away.
http://www.thredbo.itls.usyd.edu.au/downloads/thredbo10_papers/thredbo10-themeA-Warren.pdf

----> 100% + increase in patronage after 4 years
-----> 150% + increase in patronage on weeknights
----> 180% + increase on Sundays (many routes showed more patronage than previous weekday patronage).

More BUZ please. Imagine if this approach were applied to the rail system?

[somebody]

I have this PDF.  I'd love an update to those graphs too, to include the 140 and show if the 444 being separated from the other Indro routes had any negative effect.

More BUZ please. Imagine if this approach were applied to the rail system?

And in fact, it's more appropriate for the rail system with its far higher fixed costs.

[STB]

The thing is, 412 and 109 are already high frequency where the majority of the demand is - weekdays during semester. Providing the services required on exam Saturdays for the entire year would be a waste of resources IMO and I think Translink would see it that way too. So no, I don't think "upgrading" the 412 and 109 will lead to this problem being solved.

Thank you.  That's what I was trying to say earlier.

[ozbob]

The point made in the release is that when the exams are ON Saturdays buses be put on, as is done for sporting events.  No brainer ...

As stated earlier just requires some liaison between UQ admin and TransLink.  No one is suggesting running buses for the whole year. 



For example some typical feedback received which highlights why support is needed for examination Saturdays (about 4 times a year)

Yes the problems with the bus to UQ!!!! - I took the Citycat last Saturday, but I remember for many years trying to get a bus back from Toowong on a Saturday during exam. time - with buses every half hour they didn't even stop, and I remember walking home - the 402 may have improved this slightly, but I try to steer clear now.

Also years ago I complained about the fact that the first 412 weekday service was at 6.30am and I was told to get the citycat. On Sunday the first bus from St Lucia leaves at 8am - and from the City at 8.30am. My retired neighbour is supervising exams at UQ and her husband told me she had to be there on Sunday morning - how do the students manage then when the buses start so late. An 8.30 am service to the university is antiquated.

As far as I am concerned all the good services are around the Teneriffe/West end area with a 10min buzz service and now the Cityglider catering to all the city dwellers - they forget that people at St Lucia also pay rates.

And ..

Keep up the good work Bob

I had 2 daughters go through UQ - I just loved 8am Saturday exams as it meant an early morning drive for me to St Lucia from that far flung (not) bit of suburbia - The Gap.

I felt they didn't need the added stress of trying to get some very early bus with rotten connections.

I would have thought with the busway / green bridge that things might have improved by now but apparently not

No brainer?  sure is ...

[STB]

So should this be a contract setup between the universities and TransLink?  Whereby the university pays for the service and advises on the service level required, as if it were a major sporting event and TransLink provides the services based on the agreed contract between the event organiser and TransLink?

[ozbob]

No no no!  For goodness sakes,  this is just normal public transport and meeting the demands of citizens (mainly students).

TransLink should have done this without having to be dragged along.  UQ is the major public transport trip generator outside the CBD!!!

[somebody]

Early morning Sat services only in exams do not go far enough.  It's a perfectly reasonable requirement for St Lucia residents to be able to reach the CBD by 7am, and even the ones who aren't handy to the CityCat.  If the 412 was a BUZ the problem wouldn't exist.  It's as simple as that.  And the 412 is a route with a strong rationale for BUZification - 4 votes in the poll for equal second place.

In the case of the 109, being able to get UQ Lakes and the PA Hospital justify that one too.  I suppose for the latter you could also use an Ipswich Rd bus.

No no no!  For goodness sakes,  this is just normal public transport and meeting the demands of citizens (mainly students).

TransLink should have done this without having to be dragged along.  UQ is the major public transport trip generator outside the CBD!!!

Hear here!!

[#Metro]

  LOL this is so funny.
People just want the services to be there. Doesn't have to be direct, may involve a wait or transfer, the main thing is that they be there.

412 or 402 should get a boost. Major exams are a special event.

No no no!  For goodness sakes,  this is just normal public transport and meeting the demands of citizens (mainly students).
TransLink should have done this without having to be dragged along.  UQ is the major public transport trip generator outside the CBD!!!

Agreed x 2. The whole idea of TL and PT is that someone else organises these things, and taxes/fares pay for them. Next thing will be every major shopping centre needs to organise transport for their own employees. No wonder The Almighty Car is King.

[Emmie]

Well the interesting thing will be - will there be extra buses put on this coming Saturday (after they failed completely last Saturday)?  And if not - whose fault is it? Translink or the UQ administration?  I think the problem is a lack of communication between the two - but as Bob says, putting on a couple of extra buses is a no-brainer.

[ButFli]

You don't seriously expect anything to be different this Saturday, do you Emmie? This problem has existed for as long as there have been Saturday exams. When the UQ Union was strong it used to kick up a stink every semester but nothing changed. Maybe one day things will be different.

[AnonymouslyBad]

No no no!  For goodness sakes,  this is just normal public transport and meeting the demands of citizens (mainly students).

TransLink should have done this without having to be dragged along.  UQ is the major public transport trip generator outside the CBD!!!

That is true, though UQ should also be willing to negotiate if they insist on having exams so early. TransLink certainly doesn't run services to sporting events out of their own (inadequate) funding, the venue and event organisers know they need that transport and are presumably paying quite a lot for it to be put on. Of course, in the case of UQ they can just charge for parking and make a bit of money whenever students are forced to drive

That said, I see no reason the 109 or 412 - or, hopefully one day, a route combining the two - couldn't have longer operating hours every day anyway. They are major services, UQ is the biggest trip generator by far but they also serve other destinations (especially the 109) and should be treated as such.

[ozbob]

I have been advised that TransLink has had discussions with UQ with a view to ensuring that timely notification of Saturday examinations periods are made to allow for better public transport support.  The BUZzing of 412 will also result in more services, and on Saturdays first from CBD  6.30am on Saturdays (arriving at 6.50am). Full details will be available in due course on the TL web site.

[Emmie]

Hi Bob - I've been away for a month, so didn't have a chance to respond to this until now.  So, very belatedly, thanks for your good efforts.

[ozbob]