Call for a review of the bus system

[ozbob]

The bus capacity issues are getting worse.  Time for TL, BT and the incoming government to get serious and start to fix it.

I think it is a good time to put something out on the need to transform much of the bus network.  Core trunk services, feed by more frequent local buses.

TT for a start, can you put together a couple of paragraphs on this please.  And we can refine it.

[Jonno]

Bus lanes on all major roads, greater stop spacing (800m) to coincide with greater frequency, route ironing, high frequency grid of routes.

[#Metro]

We need to be specific and narrow the focus to specific things. Action comes about from the narrowing, not broadening of focus (as Jarret says).

If people can post thoughts and ideas in this thread - general principles (i.e services should be steam ironed) and values are important here (I want speed, or I don't want to transfer), that way the specifics will precipitate out of that. Like Jonno has done.

I'll give a day or so for people to post here. The release could go out under the Core Frequent Network banner (Gazza or someone else- do you think we could have some kind of logo or banner specifically for CFN?)

[Mr X]

In general, a logical bus system should have/be:
- clearly marked, legible bus stopping places that follow CPTED principles (in well lit areas, clean, in common sight lines of the street and housing/businesses)
- competitive with road transport, in terms of price and speed
- welfare bus routes should aim for coverage (but not go dilly dallying ala 198 and 414), trunk routes should aim for speed and capacity
- require the minimum number of routes possible, with consistent stopping patterns
- variations should be kept to a minimum and where possible, removed. (Good examples of where this has successfully been done is the West End/New Farm route changes in 2006 and 2011)
- connect with local nodes and landmarks. Welfare buses can terminate at local landmarks (eg. shopping centres) where pax can connect to a mainstream bus service (eg. BUZ or similar) to the city
- bus jams are a symptom of too many routes going down one area, similar to the cause of traffic congestion. While concrete can "fix" it, ultimately it's a sign of our poorly managed system
- good service hours to suit demand
- connect with other modes of transport, such as trains and ferries
- FREQUENCY!!

[SurfRail]

Review how the district (school) bus services work and if possible, cascading them into more frequent "full" service routes in lieu.

Higher capacity buses.

Do a complete network restructure for BT in the next 5 years focusing on patronage and welfare service profiles and on feeding rail outside the immediate busway catchment.  Eliminate minor variations.

Clockface timetabling if and where possible.

Get rid of Sunday timetables and replace with a basic Saturday/Sunday/public holiday timetable.  People still drive on weekends.  If there are actual demand issues, then just omit the first and last service on Sundays/pub hols.

City stop locations and routings.  Get away from the "rockets go this way, expresses go this way, all-stoppers go this way" mentality and group services by corridor and suburb, not type.  Reduce number of CBD variations of possible routes, especially from the southside.

Common timetable design for BT and everybody else which identifies connections and plots routes the same way.  (Eg private operators tend to plot peak hour services in a completely different table to the local ones even though they often take mostly the same route - it makes it easier to follow if you group them the way BT and Surfside tend to.)

Get rid of one-way loops except as small diversions off a main route.

[#Metro]

Yes, we should get rid of the word transfer, and replace it with the word 'connect'.

When the TL chainsaw is released on the western suburbs, I think the services should say City Connect.
So the 435 would go from being City 435 to City Connect 435 via Indooroopilly

Language needs to change too. The word interchange needs to be used to raise the profile and awareness in the outer suburbs.

Carindale Interchange
Garden City Interchange
Chermside Interchange
Indooroopilly Interchange
Brookside Interchange
Toombul Interchange <--- better pedestrian access between Toombul and the bus station by elevated walkway would be good as well.

The pre-paid system of buses should be largely dismantled and incorporated into the existing rockets and BUZ system. There are just too many routes and numbers.

TL needs to grow some balls and say no and CUT services where they are not needed. In America transit funding is tied to sales tax dollars, which go up and down, so they have to make cuts periodically. In Australia there is not that link, which means stable funding but also encourages huge levels of waste to build up and inefficiency (see sydney bus network, human transit book vs San Fransisco).

[somebody]

With the 435, just remove the City-Indro bit full time, instead of just on weekends.  Then it would be "Indooroopilly express" I/B on weekdays like weekends.

[#Metro]

Non-BUZ routes via Mater Hill

66 Wooloongabba
105 Yeronga
107 Yeronga
108 Yeronga, Tennyson and Indooroopilly
110 Inala & Acacia Ridge
112 Mt Gravatt Campus to City via Annerly Road
113 Mt Gravatt to City via Ips. Road
115 Calamvale and Sunnybank via Ips Road
116 Moorooka to City Via Annerly Road
117 Acacia Ridge to City via Ips Road
124 Sunnybank to City
125 Garden City to Salisbury via Ips Road
135 Algester
172 Greenslopes and Garden City
183 Carindale via Griffith Uni to City
184 Garden City via Cavendish Road to City
185 Garden City via Cavenish Road to City
203 Carindale
204 Carindale
210 Carindale to City
212 Caridale to City
214 Cannon Hill to City
215 Carindale to City Via Tingalpa
220 Wynnum to City


These services flow via Mater Hill and then Cultural Centre. Removing these may allow more slots at CC for BUZ services.
Suggestions?

[#Metro]

105 Yeronga
107 Yeronga
108 Yeronga, Tennyson and Indooroopilly

These could all be terminated at Park Road or flow to Langlands Park busway turnaround circle. Land uses need to be strengthened at these urban shopping centres - more office space so that there is two way traffic flow like there is in Canberra between Belconnen-CBD-Woden

[#Metro]

124 Sunnybank to City
125 Garden City to Salisbury via Ips Road

I'm not sure why anyone would want to go to Sunnybank via Ipswich Road

124 could probably be deleted and services sent over to strengthen 125 Garden City via Ips Road. Services could be timed to slot in between
the BUZ 100 to Inala.

[#Metro]

203 Carindale
204 Carindale

These (204?) could probably go via Deshon street & Mains Ave, which would allow the BUZ 200 to be abolished and the funds released
to boost the flagship 222 to double the frequency on that. Cut!!

No need for 203 to go via Ipswich Road. In fact, why not terminate this at Langlands Park or Park Road station?
This thing is hourly!

[somebody]

Non-BUZ routes via Mater Hill

66 Wooloongabba
105 Yeronga
107 Yeronga
108 Yeronga, Tennyson and Indooroopilly
110 Inala & Acacia Ridge
112 Mt Gravatt Campus to City via Annerly Road
113 Mt Gravatt to City via Ips. Road
115 Calamvale and Sunnybank via Ips Road
116 Moorooka to City Via Annerly Road
117 Acacia Ridge to City via Ips Road
124 Sunnybank to City
125 Garden City to Salisbury via Ips Road
135 Algester
172 Greenslopes and Garden City
183 Carindale via Griffith Uni to City
184 Garden City via Cavendish Road to City
185 Garden City via Cavenish Road to City
203 Carindale
204 Carindale
210 Carindale to City
212 Caridale to City
214 Cannon Hill to City
215 Carindale to City Via Tingalpa
220 Wynnum to City


These services flow via Mater Hill and then Cultural Centre. Removing these may allow more slots at CC for BUZ services.
Suggestions?

Firstly 112 & 116 are via Annerley Rd.  Removing these from the South Bank stretch would require them to do some strange things.

Removing 66 for something that doesn't go south of Roma St seems sensible to me.

As for your other suggestions, I don't think I could disagree more with this whole plan!

124 Sunnybank to City
125 Garden City to Salisbury via Ips Road

I'm not sure why anyone would want to go to Sunnybank via Ipswich Road

124 could probably be deleted and services sent over to strengthen 125 Garden City via Ips Road. Services could be timed to slot in between
the BUZ 100 to Inala.

But they would go to Garden City that way?

My plan would be for the 116 to follow the 121 south of Cracknell Rd, restructure 124/125 for one route with the 125's Lilian Ave service but Sunnybank termination, and add stops the 120 as required between Musgrave Rd and Garden City.

I'm not sure if there is any need for the 116's weirdness around Rocklea, but perhaps that could be provided by an on demand service if needed.

203 Carindale
204 Carindale

These (204?) could probably go via Deshon street & Mains Ave, which would allow the BUZ 200 to be abolished and the funds released
to boost the flagship 222 to double the frequency on that. Cut!!

No need for 203 to go via Ipswich Road. In fact, why not terminate this at Langlands Park or Park Road station?
This thing is hourly!

Do you mean with the 222 extending to Carindale Heights?  I hope so.  204 should use the Eastern Busway though, not Deshon St.

[Gazza]

I think we should focus on what frequent routes we want, and what structure could get most of the population within reasonable distance...Not 400m...I think that only applies to local all stops buses.
But I reckon say everyone within 600-800m of a high quality route (and not necessarily till 11pm, 9pm is good to start with) would make a big difference.

What would people think of having my northside gird as the general idea for up there at least? Could of course be tweaked, but the general structure holds true.
http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=7051.0

The structure of rockets and the coverage routes doesn't need to be mentioned as much. The presence of coverage routes is a given, and any sort of rocket bus is really just a 'bonus'.

[#Metro]

We need a map.

204 needs to go via Deshon street so that BUZ 200 can be abolished.

[Jonno]

Maybe a controversal suggestion but instead of BUZ's having numbers they could be called "Carindale Line, Chermside/Aspley" etc.  Thus making them operate more likea transit line than a bus route.  

[Gazza]

I don't think its worth getting too hung up on bus numbers, except perhaps giving major routes catchy numbers like 66...Especially when some buses terminate at the same location by different routes (Garden City Line?)

[#Metro]

This idea was that we get these NON-BUZ routes outta Cultural Centre somehow to free up slots for the BUZ services that carry the patronage.

With a BUZ 245 (or whatever number) running down Wynnum Road, many air parcel services could be stopped before getting into the CBD.
Moorooka might also be a candidate interchange point as well.

[somebody]

We need a map.

204 needs to go via Deshon street so that BUZ 200 can be abolished.

I say that it should be, instead of current 200/204/222:
Route A: QSBS-South Bank-Eastern Busway-Old Cleveland Rd to Carindale shops-Carindale Heights (limited stops)
Route B: QSBS-South Bank-Eastern Busway-Old Cleveland Rd-Gallipoli Rd-Winstanley St-Carindale shops-then (perhaps) as per 204 (all stops)
Route C: Fortitude Valley-Story Bridge-Woolloongabba (Main St)-Deshon St-Old Cleveland Rd to Carindale shops. (open to arguments on stops)

I actually think that the 204's Meadowlands Rd area service should be done by the 210 running to Carindale shops, with the 212 going to Cannon Hill instead.

[Gazza]

Just a side point, but does anyone else reckon the route structure of the Transperth feeder bus network is really well thought out?
Frequency is a bit poor out of peak (Though it does get added up on the approach roads to the station)
, but in terms of the structure of the suburbs, the routings are easy to understand and logical and reasonably direct (as far as they can be)

http://www.transperth.wa.gov.au/timetablePDFs/Northern%2063%2020111106.pdf
http://www.transperth.wa.gov.au/timetablePDFs/Northern%2064%2020111106.pdf

Those two maps show the feeder setup east and west of Whitfords to Warwick station.

Brisbane should aim for this level of legibility

[ozbob]

Media release 29 January 2012



SEQ: Core Frequent Network: Less is more

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport passengers calls for a review of bus services. To support this call a Brief Discussion paper - Core Frequent Network - Less is more has been publicly released (1).

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"Busway congestion, inefficient bus routing, is causing a degradation in public transport services across Brisbane."

"It is time a review on how the bus system operates is conducted to transform the existing public transport asset into  a properly integrated, core frequent network with legible routes that maximises bus connections into high frequency bus and rail services in a cost effective way."

"It is a critical moment for the future of the public transport network.  Vision and boldness is now needed.

References:

1.  http://backontrack.org/docs/bus/cfn_v1.pdf

Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org
RAIL Back On Track http://backontrack.org

[Jonno]

Bob, TT

In the discussion paper I think the dot point:

Does the city want to prioritise travel for fewer people at high speed in cars or prioritise more people in slower, but higher capacity services (transit).

is probabaly want people do want because they think more roads is the answer when the truth is the exact opposite.  It also suggest Transit is slow which it is not if the frequency is provided.

suggest replacing with

"Does the city want to continue to invest in the least efficient form of modern transport and continue to force more people and freight onto already congested roads or focus on moving freight and people as efficient and safely as possible with the least impact on our city.

[ozbob]

Fair point, but it is a rhetorical question, couched in a wider context of a series of points which clearly indicates intent. Will leave it be now.

[#Metro]

Bob, TT

In the discussion paper I think the dot point:

Quote
Does the city want to prioritise travel for fewer people at high speed in cars or prioritise more people in slower, but higher capacity services (transit).

is probabaly want people do want because they think more roads is the answer when the truth is the exact opposite.  It also suggest Transit is slow which it is not if the frequency is provided.

suggest replacing with

"Does the city want to continue to invest in the least efficient form of modern transport and continue to force more people and freight onto already congested roads or focus on moving freight and people as efficient and safely as possible with the least impact on our city.

Johnno,

I posed the question in 'blunt' form because it is an important one. Different cities value different things and they get what they choose. LA values car trips so built a massive freeway network and tore up their PT system. They got what they wanted. Other places like Toronto value PT, cancelled their Spadina Expressway and extended their subway system. I use Toronto a lot because it has an urban form more like Australia, and less like Paris.

We cannot dictate what is right for people - they must decide their own future and fate. And we have to tell it like it is.

There is a tradeoff between car travel and PT. Cars are ideal for travel in the off peak when you don't have congestion. Looking purely from a neutral service characteristic point of view, they provide a direct, express trip, are never ever overcrowded, maximum comfort, stops on demand, fully flexible routing, 24/7 service span, has instant frequency and you can choose your vehicle. Note, I haven't prescribed, I've merely described.

As much as it may offend, this is why 80% of trips are made by cars (that and crappy PT network to compete).

The downside is the pollution aspect, the high personal cost ($20 000 to buy the vehicle), the fact that not everyone can drive, the carparking issues with space, and the geometric impossibility of fitting everyone in a lane, congestion, road accidents, the low capacity (2000 pphd per lane) and space (freeways take up a lot of land unless they are in tunnels).

Public transport is generally slower than car travel because, even under identical conditions, the transit vehicle must make stops to pick up passengers whereas the car does not. The exception may be bullet bus services in this respect, such as 142 which might have a single origin and destination and no intermediate stops. The service may not take the most direct path either as it deviates to collect pax from activity centres, welfare or legacy routing objectives may slow the service further, there may be overcrowding, the service span is restricted, and unless continuous frequency is provided there will be a wait.

The upside is pollution aspect, the cheap cost, you don't need to maintain a car, and the capacity is much much higher than freeway infrastructure and so forth.

Actions, not words, reveal values - the removal of the Coronation Drive Bus lane and failure to provide an interconnection between legacy way and the INB for $50 million despite boasting that the tender process saved $300 million in costs, and the refusal to provide traffic light priority to services (which North American cities and European Cities seem to have no issue doing) shows you what they value.

Brisbane is trying to run the bus system like a taxi service, and preserve 'welfare' routing so no-one gets upset that their local bus is steam ironed straight and they miss out- not only is this costly but it is also unsustainable in the long term - the high cost and geometric impossibility of running everything to the centre will see to it that will not happen. Ottawa tried that and they managed to block their inner CBD with buses AND at that point it is cheaper to move people on rail as well.

[somebody]

This idea was that we get these NON-BUZ routes outta Cultural Centre somehow to free up slots for the BUZ services that carry the patronage.

I understand I just strongly disagree with the whole concept.  If anything, it's the frequent routes which should run via the Captain Cook Bridge, with those heading via South Bank interchanging at somewhere like Buranda.

[#Metro]

I understand I just strongly disagree with the whole concept.  If anything, it's the frequent routes which should run via the Captain Cook Bridge, with those heading via South Bank interchanging at somewhere like Buranda.

I disagree with this. Interchange at Buranda? How are people going to access the 300 and 400 series plus West End buses at Buranda?
Captain Cook Bridge is also Class C ROW and misses activity centre of South Bank and Cultural Centre plus there is no possibility of connection to rail (whereas connections are possible at South Bank to GC, Cleveland, Beenleigh etc).

BUZ services are the main product, so I think they should stick to the busways and the infrequent, less legible services should be scarified first.

[somebody]

I understand I just strongly disagree with the whole concept.  If anything, it's the frequent routes which should run via the Captain Cook Bridge, with those heading via South Bank interchanging at somewhere like Buranda.

I disagree with this. Interchange at Buranda? How are people going to access the 300 and 400 series plus West End buses at Buranda?
Captain Cook Bridge is also Class C ROW and misses activity centre of South Bank and Cultural Centre plus there is no possibility of connection to rail (whereas connections are possible at South Bank to GC, Cleveland, Beenleigh etc).

BUZ services are the main product, so I think they should stick to the busways and the infrequent, less legible services should be scarified first.

I think about it in the exact opposite way.

Firstly, interchanging with the 300 or 400 series could be relatively easily done within the CBD, similarly for West End.  It would be slightly slower, but not much.

Secondly, I think of it as a benefit to get to the CBD faster.  South Bank is a destination, but <10% are actually going there.  I don't think the interchange for south lines is much of a reason either.  Who rides a 120 I/B (e.g.) to then get a train O/B?  The few people doing so can use Buranda for the Cleveland line or double change.

[#Metro]

We have to agree to disagree here. I'd hate to turn up at Mater Hill only to find illegible low frequency routes to catch.

There is always a trade off between speed and access to useful places. If you look at the Blue Rapid in Canberra, the line diverts to serve hospitals/uni/AIS rather than travel straight to belconnen.

[#Metro]

The southside suburbs need to be fixed up and then the wiggly routes abolished,
stop spacing could be increased to 500 - 700 meters to make the speed high as well
as the routes are fairly long (175 takes a while).

i.e.

[#Metro]

66 Wooloongabba

<--- this probably still has to say on the busway

These can be terminated at Park Road or Langlands Park Turnaround (never really liked putting buses underneath PA Hospital, no-one can see them!)

105 Yeronga
107 Yeronga
108 Yeronga, Tennyson and Indooroopilly

Either send this via Captain Cook Bridge or via Annerly Road, which will allow the other
Annerly road routes to be folded away.

110 Inala & Acacia Ridge

I've never understood these bus routes. Destinations via Ips Road should be Garden City and then change to destinations beyond that.

112 Mt Gravatt Campus to City via Annerly Road
113 Mt Gravatt to City via Ips. Road
115 Calamvale and Sunnybank via Ips Road
116 Moorooka to City Via Annerly Road
117 Acacia Ridge to City via Ips Road

This should be folded into 125 perhaps -

124 Sunnybank to City

This should be retained and strengthened

125 Garden City to Salisbury via Ips Road

Cut this somewhere - Griffith uni busway station perhaps?

135 Algester

Don't send this to the CBD. Cut this one short somewhere.

172 Greenslopes and Garden City

Perhaps this can be terminated at a busway station

183 Carindale via Griffith Uni to City

Perhaps these should be replaced with a straight BUZ that goes down Cavenish road proper (See red line image in previous post)

184 Garden City via Cavendish Road to City
185 Garden City via Cavenish Road to City

These can be sent up Deshon Street, fold the BUZ 200 into BUZ 222

203 Carindale
204 Carindale

These can be terminated at Cannon Hill or sent via Captain Cook Bridge after serving W'Gabba

210 Carindale to City
212 Caridale to City
214 Cannon Hill to City
215 Carindale to City Via Tingalpa

220 Wynnum to City <---- this *might* be a candidate for BUZification if the BUZ 245 does not go ahead.

[somebody]

Hmm, interesting.  I think you've posted that before.

I'd be reluctant to send another route down Cavendish Rd, and I doubt I'd go via the Eastern Busway & O-C Rd.  What's wrong with Chatsworth Rd?  Although I'm open to arguments.  The 180 can handle this BTW.

Definitely agree on Chatsworth Rd/Samuel St/Winstanley Rd needing something better than the 202.

I wouldn't mess with the 175, but probably put in a limited stops route via Cornwall/Juliette Sts to cover the 174 service.  That would serve most of Logan Rd quite well.

66 Wooloongabba

<--- this probably still has to say on the busway

These can be terminated at Park Road or Langlands Park Turnaround (never really liked putting buses underneath PA Hospital, no-one can see them!)

105 Yeronga
107 Yeronga
108 Yeronga, Tennyson and Indooroopilly

Either send this via Captain Cook Bridge or via Annerly Road, which will allow the other
Annerly road routes to be folded away.

110 Inala & Acacia Ridge

I've never understood these bus routes. Destinations via Ips Road should be Garden City and then change to destinations beyond that.

112 Mt Gravatt Campus to City via Annerly Road
113 Mt Gravatt to City via Ips. Road
115 Calamvale and Sunnybank via Ips Road
116 Moorooka to City Via Annerly Road
117 Acacia Ridge to City via Ips Road

This should be folded into 125 perhaps -

124 Sunnybank to City

This should be retained and strengthened

125 Garden City to Salisbury via Ips Road

Cut this somewhere - Griffith uni busway station perhaps?

135 Algester

Don't send this to the CBD. Cut this one short somewhere.

172 Greenslopes and Garden City

Perhaps this can be terminated at a busway station

183 Carindale via Griffith Uni to City

Perhaps these should be replaced with a straight BUZ that goes down Cavenish road proper (See red line image in previous post)

184 Garden City via Cavendish Road to City
185 Garden City via Cavenish Road to City

These can be sent up Deshon Street, fold the BUZ 200 into BUZ 222

203 Carindale
204 Carindale

These can be terminated at Cannon Hill or sent via Captain Cook Bridge after serving W'Gabba

210 Carindale to City
212 Caridale to City
214 Cannon Hill to City
215 Carindale to City Via Tingalpa

220 Wynnum to City <---- this *might* be a candidate for BUZification if the BUZ 245 does not go ahead.

66 - not impressed with the whole idea of this route, even though people in high places are quite proud of it.  Congestion in the Cultural Centre is only one limitation.

105/7/8 - I think the 105 should have stayed on Annerley Rd, but it doesn't operate peak direction anyway.  I guess you could force the 107/108 to terminate at PA Hospital and people transfer at Park Rd as there are facilities at PAH, but it wouldn't be liked.

110 - Why mess with this?  What would serve Acacia Ridge?  117 perhaps?  Why go all the way to Garden City?

112/6 - These obviously have to stick to Annerley Rd.  I don't see an imperative to change, as they are joining the busway AFTER the congestion points.

113 - Should be folded into 112 trips

115 - Should be folded into 110 trips

117 - I think this should be considered with 110/115 rather than 124/125.  Again, Acacia Ridge.

135 - It doesn't make sense for this to run all the way to Parkinson, but on the current network it makes some sense to have it serve Hellawell Rd.  A possibility is for it to run along Algester Rd between Ridgewood Rd 1 & 2.  Don't mind it serving the CBD though.

172 - W'Gabba would be the only real possibility for terminating it short.  Can't say I'm a fan.

183 - Remove for 177s

184/185 - Inclined to remove the 184.  185 can stay as a "Coverage route", picking up the all stations service on Cavendish Rd.

203 - Inclined to leave it as a Coverage route, but I think it can be improved significantly.

204 - Don't need to repeat myself

210 - I think this should be the basis of a BUZ.  Note: presently goes to Cannon Hill, but I prefer Carindale

212 - Inclined to leave it as a "Coverage route"

220 - *NOT* inclined to BUZ this one on its current route.

[#Metro]

STB, what are your thoughts ?

[Gazza]

One route I'd add to that is an orbital via Marshall and Boundary Rds through Seven Hills, to Morningside.

[STB]

STB, what are your thoughts ?

I'll put a raincheck on posting my thoughts on this as I've only just now had a quick glance, been a bit busy around my traps lately, and it'll only get busier with uni coming up and two production units thrown in (I'm preparing myself to be white as a sheet hiding from the world by week 13!).

[SurfRail]

Just a side point, but does anyone else reckon the route structure of the Transperth feeder bus network is really well thought out?
Frequency is a bit poor out of peak (Though it does get added up on the approach roads to the station)
, but in terms of the structure of the suburbs, the routings are easy to understand and logical and reasonably direct (as far as they can be)

http://www.transperth.wa.gov.au/timetablePDFs/Northern%2063%2020111106.pdf
http://www.transperth.wa.gov.au/timetablePDFs/Northern%2064%2020111106.pdf

Those two maps show the feeder setup east and west of Whitfords to Warwick station.

Brisbane should aim for this level of legibility

Design = excellent
Off-peak bus frequency = significant let down

But you can see the advantages of a properly integrated network.  At every station, once you hit the concourse you are confronted with a huge map depicting the bus routes and the local area.  No such luck here, or anywhere else.  The closest you will get elsewhere is in Melbourne where you will be directed to where specific buses leave from with prominent signage, but no maps or detail other than the general direction it goes (eg "Dandenong").  Everywwhere else it is just "Buses", if that.

[STB]

Okay, just quickly a splatter of thoughts

183 - upgrade to a full time route running at least every 30 minutes, retain the 178 but delete the 177.

205 - inclined to upgrade to a full time route to replace routes 202 and 203 (although one of the two will probably still need to be retained as a 'coverage' route.

I wouldn't recommend terminating any routes at W'Gabba, by the time you get there, you might as well go all the way and that would be the expectation of passengers as well.  The 172 would need to stay to fill in the gaps around the Holland Park and Mt Gravatt areas, although I could see it being split into two separate routes.

184/185, leave as is.  184 and 185 are used by TAFE students and the like to get to Coorparoo from Mount Gravatt (used to do that trip quite a bit when I was going to TAFE there).

135 or 155 needs to be upgraded to a high frequency service, at least in the peak hour.  The amount of Griffith Uni students waiting on the platform from even South Bank is actually quite high, and these services are often full by the time they leave Queen St Bus Station.

220 or 227 to be upgraded to a BUZ.  220 provides more coverage, but 227 does provide a service along a major corridor, so I'm in two minds on which one it should be.  I'd suggest if 227 becomes the BUZ, extend to Wynnum Central and have it operate as an express service from Cannon Hill in with limited stops, and a new service added in to service all stops along Wynnum Road.

230/235 - whatever is done, better co-ordination with trains at Morningside.

That'll do for now...

[SurfRail]

183 - upgrade to a full time route running at least every 30 minutes, retain the 178 but delete the 177.

Seriously?  You don't mean kill the 183 and get the 177 running full time?

[somebody]

183 - upgrade to a full time route running at least every 30 minutes, retain the 178 but delete the 177.

Seriously?  You don't mean kill the 183 and get the 177 running full time?

I wondered about that also.

[achiruel]

230/235 - whatever is done, better co-ordination with trains at Morningside.

230 doesn't pass Morningside Station

235 is so unreliable, I think about the only way to get reliable train connections is either run it every 5 minutes, or truncate it to the station.  Latter idea might not sit well with people going to East Brisbane/Gabba/Mater Hill etc though.

[somebody]

230/235 - whatever is done, better co-ordination with trains at Morningside.

230 doesn't pass Morningside Station

235 is so unreliable, I think about the only way to get reliable train connections is either run it every 5 minutes, or truncate it to the station.  Latter idea might not sit well with people going to East Brisbane/Gabba/Mater Hill etc though.

Increasing the 227 would help with accessing East Brisbane and the train gets to South Bank.  Are Mater Hill and the Gabba that important as destinations?