Changes to go card fare structure announced today, 16th October 2011

[ozbob]

I understand the acting Premier is announcing some changes to the go card fare structure now.

To be confirmed, but after 10 journeys (Mon to Sun)  travel will be free within that period

More to come ...  waiting for statement.

[Stillwater]

Announcement being made without running it past the Transport Minister's advisory group?  Or was it run past group and everyone sworn to secrecy?  It would seem strange to have a committee to advise the minister on go-card and ticketing issues, then ignore that group to make this announcement.

[ozbob]

Feedback from PTAG was that fares was one of the three key issues.   No specific detail has been discussed at the PTAG.

This is not my preferred option.  Hopefully there will be further refinements.

[ozbob]

Premier Statement 16th October 2011

Government announces new go card incentives

Acting Premier Andrew Fraser today announced free travel for frequent users and more off-peak discounts to encourage more people to use South-East Queensland's public transport network.

Mr Fraser said the Labor Government had moved to introduce new rewards for frequent users that will maximise use of available seats.

"These changes will make life easier for families, students, pensioners and everyone who regularly uses public transport," Mr Fraser said.

"We're introducing a ten-journey cap so after your tenth trip using your go card you travel for free in a Monday-to-Sunday week.

"That means a Monday to Friday commuter can travel free all weekend across the network."

"We're also boosting the off-peak discount for go card from 15 to 20 per cent on all journeys between 9am and 3.30pm, after 7pm, and on weekends and public holidays.

"These discounts will encourage people to use available seats and help smooth peaks in commuter demand.

"This will give people even more of an incentive to travel outside of the peak period and take advantage of the growing number of high-frequency bus, train and ferry services.

"It doesn't matter whether you catch a bus, train or ferry, all you have to do is use your go card. We want to reward people who frequently use public transport."

Transport Minister Annastacia Palaszczuk said the 10-journey-then-free weekly incentive for all go card users, along with the increase in off-peak discounts would come into effect on January 2 next year.

"These changes will mean, if you travel to and from work using your go card during the week, you can travel for free on the weekend," Ms Palaszczuk said.

"The off-peak fare discount means that if you travel between 9am and 3:30pm or after 7:00pm on weekdays, or all day on weekends, not only will you be able to take advantage of the 20 per cent off-peak discount, you'll get free travel once you reach the limit.

"We already offer a 50 per cent discount for after people make 10 trips in a week. Now, once you reach 10 trips a week, you travel free."

Ms Palaszczuk said public transport was now even more cost-effective than running a car to work every day.

[STB]

Looks like I'll be making sure I rack up the trips for a free ride to Gympie North and back!

[david]

http://translink.com.au/tickets-and-fares/fares/changes-to-fares-and-ticketing-in-2012

Changes to fares and ticketing in 2012

Fare contribution for a growing and improving network

South East Queensland's population is growing and our network needs to develop with the increasing demand.

From Monday 2 January 2012 fares will be changing on all TransLink services.

Fares and network growth

    * 15% increase on all fares to support the funding for multiple improvements, with new services and facilities on the network

Ticketing

    * go card continues to be at least 30% cheaper than paper tickets
    * single paper tickets remain available for occasional public transport users

Benefits and discounts

    * travel free after 10 go card journeys in a week (Mon-Sun)
    * 20% discount for off peak go card travel
    * seniors and pensioners travel free after 2 journeys in one day

[david]

Free travel after 10 journeys is certainly going to increase demand for weekend services! I imagine a lot of full buses on Saturdays and Sundays!
I wonder what this will do to the Fare-Subsidy ratio. I expect that it will remain steady once again and won't get close to the 25:75 ratio they were aiming for with this fare strategy.

This is certainly interesting timing for a media release - Sunday noon. Are they possibly trying to fly under the radar?

[ozbob]

Yes, weekend escapes to the Sunny and Gold Coast are a real option for folks.  Now for the weekend frequencies .. LOL

[mufreight]

Free after ten trips but there will still be a 15% fare increase each year for the next three years plus thanks to the carbon tax an additional increase of between 7% and 9% next year and these clowns supposedly want a greater uptake of public transport usage and to reduce carbon emissions.  
They have to be kidding, to Mr/Ms average commuter who uses public transport to commute to and from work this incentive is of little relevance particularly in light of the pending fare hikes, if coupled to a overall limit on fare increases of the CPI it would by the end of next year hold some practical relevance and would effectively motivate more public transport usage by making it affordable in comparison with private transport.
One could be excused from comming to the conclusion that the current government and Translink have the intention of capping the numbers using public transport so that overdue transport infrastructure does not need to be provided which point makes even more obvious the window dressing effort by a desperate to be re-elected government that this free after ten trips exercise is in reality.

[Golliwog]

I kind of like this. It's not exactly the easiest thing to understand, but it is effectively a weekly ticket. I think this is a definite improvement. Once people starting using PT on weekends for travel other than commuting, I think you might just see an increase in travel earlier in the week once they start seeing where else they can use it to get the discount earlier.

[david]

Not only a standard weekly ticket, but a weekly ticket with unlimited zones! 

[somebody]

I calculated my fares for a random week in July 2011 - $36.66 under the current rules, would be $28.12 under these rules if I calculate it correctly.  About the same as what it would have been in 2008 with a 2 zone weekly ($27.30).

I don't mind the notion that 9-5 commuters might pay more though.

Free after ten trips but there will still be a 15% fare increase each year for the next three years plus thanks to the carbon tax an additional increase of between 7% and 9% next year and these clowns supposedly want a greater uptake of public transport usage and to reduce carbon emissions. 
They have to be kidding, to Mr/Ms average commuter who uses public transport to commute to and from work this incentive is of little relevance particularly in light of the pending fare hikes, if coupled to a overall limit on fare increases of the CPI it would by the end of next year hold some practical relevance and would effectively motivate more public transport usage by making it affordable in comparison with private transport.
One could be excused from comming to the conclusion that the current government and Translink have the intention of capping the numbers using public transport so that overdue transport infrastructure does not need to be provided which point makes even more obvious the window dressing effort by a desperate to be re-elected government that this free after ten trips exercise is in reality.

Indeed.

[ozbob]

Looks like I'll be making sure I rack up the trips for a free ride to Gympie North and back!

Journeys STB, journeys ....   

[ButFli]

I wonder if the frequent-user discount will still apply to Airtrain? I am currently a fan of the half price Airtrain tickets on weekends. Free Airtain sounds even better, haha!

[ozbob]

Four one zoners on a Monday, Four one zoners on Tuesday,  couple on a Wednesday, and then we are off!

But I am not sure how many might do that, the other thing that crosses my mind is that 'communal go cards' unregistered might be popular in some places ...

[Golliwog]

I wonder if the frequent-user discount will still apply to Airtrain? I am currently a fan of the half price Airtrain tickets on weekends. Free Airtain sounds even better, haha!

I didn't know it applied to it even now.

Mufreight/Simon, I agree this isn't anything major or game changing but I can't see how this would in any way cap the numbers using PT. I think free travel after 10 journeys would certainly attract more people that might only use it to commute some days but not all. Hell, once this is in I'd even start using the 362 to go to the shops up the road if it ran later and at a 30 minute frequency.

[somebody]

I wonder if the frequent-user discount will still apply to Airtrain? I am currently a fan of the half price Airtrain tickets on weekends. Free Airtain sounds even better, haha!

I didn't know it applied to it even now.

It does.  Perhaps an oversight.

Mufreight/Simon, I agree this isn't anything major or game changing but I can't see how this would in any way cap the numbers using PT. I think free travel after 10 journeys would certainly attract more people that might only use it to commute some days but not all. Hell, once this is in I'd even start using the 362 to go to the shops up the road if it ran later and at a 30 minute frequency.

Have a look at the patronage figures for the last few years then!

Seriously, I cannot believe that anyone can question that fare hikes are reducing patronage!  It's one of the main things that people I talk to whinge about re: PT.

[Golliwog]

The fare hikes might be, but this addition of free after 10 trips wouldn't be, which is what I was arguing. I don't think you would get any huge patronage increase but I think you would get some. Though whether that would be greater or smaller than the loss from the increased fare is unknown, but probably the latter.

[Stillwater]

From memory, Sydney has a discount go-anywhere (in Sydney) weekend ticket.  I was amazed about two years ago at the number of families travelling by train all over Sydney -- to the city, Circular Quay, Bondi Beach etc.  I kept thinking about all the cars that were left at home in the garage.

One thing about this new go-card initiative -- train frequencies may have to increase on some lines here, i.e Gold Coast.  What you save on car running and petrol costs on a journey to the Coast can be redirected to entry to Seaworld, etc, for mum, dad and the kids.  Let's hope the ticketing reforms won't just stop here.

[somebody]

From memory, Sydney has a discount go-anywhere (in Sydney) weekend ticket.  I was amazed about two years ago at the number of families travelling by train all over Sydney -- to the city, Circular Quay, Bondi Beach etc.  I kept thinking about all the cars that were left at home in the garage.

Those tickets are $20/day/adult.  It's hard to rack up that much PT in a day.

The fare hikes might be, but this addition of free after 10 trips wouldn't be, which is what I was arguing. I don't think you would get any huge patronage increase but I think you would get some. Though whether that would be greater or smaller than the loss from the increased fare is unknown, but probably the latter.

Ah Ok.  Yes, this change seems to get the worst of all possible worlds.  But I will pay less so therefore it is good for me.

[O_128]

Getting there, However one of the biggest current oversights is that peak hour ends at 6 on the dot, Why be encouraged to go out shopping after work etc, peak hour should stretch to 8pm even if its on ever 15 or 20 min.

Free weekend travel is a big plus though considering a i make 10 trips within the week easily. but a  15% fare hike is absurd especially when I didn't see 15% improvements on my line and many others (selfish I know). We are going to be more expensive than New York and London soon and once again the LNP is silent.

[Gazza]

Cool, so they've done something.

Yay, can we focus on mobility improvements now?

[ozbob]

From the Brisbanetimes click  here!

Regular commuters win free weekend travel - but there's a catch

Regular commuters win free weekend travel - but there's a catch
Daniel Hurst
October 16, 2011 - 1:25PM

Commuters who catch public transport to and from work every day will soon get free weekend travel anywhere in southeast Queensland.

The new measure, announced by the state government today, will come into effect in January at the same time as a planned 15 per cent general fare hike, prompting opposition claims it was a "con".

Following the changes, a commuter who uses a Go Card to make 10 journeys in a week will know that any more journeys to any zone will be free.

This means Monday-to-Friday commuters will have free bus, train or ferry travel if they go out later on Friday or over the weekend.

Currently, commuters are entitled to half price travel after 10 journeys each week. It resets every Monday morning.

Acting Premier Andrew Fraser said the free weekend travel measure would be a "great benefit" to regular 10-journey-a-week commuters who could then use public transport to go shopping, go out to the movies or even to the Gold Coast without charge.

"I think what this does is reward those people who use the network the most," he told reporters outside Roma Street station.

"We're saying to people, if you're a 'frequent flyer' you get the benefit."

Mr Fraser said 20 per cent of Go Card users travelled 10 times or more in a week and he expected more regular commuters would take up weekend travel when it became free.

He said the measure was likely to cost the government about $7 million in foregone revenue annually, but there were spare seats during off-peak periods so he would be happy to see higher weekend usage.

Mr Fraser said the separate 15 per cent discount on off-peak travel would also be boosted to 20 per cent from January 2, as previously announced in the five-year fare plan that includes 15 per cent annual fare hikes.

Transport Minister Annastacia Palaszczuk said the often-criticised fare hikes helped fund improvements to the public transport network and more services.

She said the measures announced today aimed to encourage greater public transport use, including boosting discounts during off-peak times (9am to 3.30pm and after 7pm weekdays and anytime weekends).

"Commuters have said to us they want to see Go Card fare enhancements and we are delivering them," she said.

Ms Palaszczuk earlier this year told brisbanetimes.com.au she was investigating ways to reinstate a version of periodic tickets such as scrapped three and six-month rail passes, but she played down the prospect of such a move today.

She said the old rail passes applied only to the train system and she wanted any improvements to apply to bus and ferry journeys too.

Mr Fraser said the government was always listening to commuters and looking for ways to reward regular users.

Opposition transport spokesman Scott Emerson dismissed the free weekend travel announcement as "a con" because it would coincide with another 15 per cent across-the-board fare hike.

"Very few people use public transport more than 10 times in a week and those that do are often the ones going to the footy at Suncorp Stadium where the cost of the fare is included in the ticket," he said.

Mr Emerson said the announcement today of a 20 per cent discount on off-peak travel from January next year was misleading because this was first flagged two years ago.

"This is just a con and panicky move because last week's TransLink Tracker [report] shows that affordability has crashed to a three-year low and the number of trips taken in the last quarter was down by 1.7 million compared to the previous quarter."

Asked whether regular commuters would really be better off given the free weekend travel would coincide with the 15 per cent hike, Mr Fraser said the free journeys offer included all destinations.

"If they jumped on the train [in Brisbane] to go to Surfers [Paradise] for a swim they're going to be miles better off," Mr Fraser said.

The fare changes will take effect on January 2.

Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/regular-commuters-win-free-weekend-travel--but-theres-a-catch-20111016-1lr81.html

[Astro]

While this may be good for the SEQ resident who uses a go card more then 10 times a week what about those who don't & what about the tourist, they are still going to be ripped off with having to buy single trip tickets.

[STB]

While this may be good for the SEQ resident who uses a go card more then 10 times a week what about those who don't & what about the tourist, they are still going to be ripped off with having to buy single trip tickets.

Tourists should be buying the Go Card and then returning it for a refund.  It's not that hard with a bit of research before you arrive in Brisbane .

I wonder when people will come to accept that single trip tickets are not the primary form of PT ticketing in SE Qld?  Single paper tickets are not the main form of ticketing and nor should they be!

[STB]

Looks like I'll be making sure I rack up the trips for a free ride to Gympie North and back!

Journeys STB, journeys ....  

Yes I know , I decided to put on the Joe Public voice on for the moment .

Essentially this is a weekly ticket.  For those who won't use up the 10 journeys for the free travel, tough, you don't deserve it!  It's no different than if you were buying the old Weekly paper ticket and then not using it fully (not travelling for those journeys that you paid for in the weekly ticket).

Obviously I would've preferred capping to be extended to students but you have to draw a line somewhere on the types of discounts/capping/free travel you give out.  This I'm satisfied with as I know I'll reach the 10 journey cut off sooner than what a typical commuter would, given my current travel patterns.

[ozbob]

The demographic that does the most journeys per week are uni students, so it is a win for them. Some of my former students were easily into journey number ten on a Wednesday.  They would be smiling a little now ...

This idea of free after 10 journeys has actually been around a while, it was nearly introduced  early this year informed sources tell me.   Modelling is available so why not?

Considering the tight budget positions, it is good that something has been done. In time I am sure the 20% who do more then ten journeys will increase ...

[somebody]

Yay, can we focus on mobility improvements now?

Yes please.  I never understood the focus on the fare "structure".

In time I am sure the 20% who do more then ten journeys will increase ...

I thought it was much lower than that - more like 3%.

[BrizCommuter]

http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/10/new-frequent-user-discount-gimmick.html
Useful, or just a gimmick?

[STB]

http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/10/new-frequent-user-discount-gimmick.html
Useful, or just a gimmick?

Nothing like a good ol whinge after some good news .  Can't please everyone I guess.

[Jonno]

I think is a good start as it will make people think again about making non-commute trips to add up to the 10 journeys. It may also make people catch PT on weekend when congestion is not always a driver for catching PT.

[ozbob]

Mr Fraser said 20 per cent of Go Card users travelled 10 times or more in a week and he expected more regular commuters would take up weekend travel when it became free.

[BrizCommuter]

http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/10/new-frequent-user-discount-gimmick.html
Useful, or just a gimmick?

Nothing like a good ol whinge after some good news .  Can't please everyone I guess.

It'll take far more than this "improvement" to please BrizCommuter! The new frequent user discount will make very little difference to the average commuter. We still have one of the worst value for money public transport systems in the world. We have laughable off-peak train frequencies. Service improvements are a fraction of the percentage fare increases. We have an unreliable ticketing system, that has no daily ticketing options. There is a massive lack of transparency. What is there to be pleased about?

BrizCommuter hopes that some RBoT readers are not starting to accept the mediocrity of public transport in Brisbane!

[STB]

http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/10/new-frequent-user-discount-gimmick.html
Useful, or just a gimmick?

Nothing like a good ol whinge after some good news .  Can't please everyone I guess.

It'll take far more than this "improvement" to please BrizCommuter! The new frequent user discount will make very little difference to the average commuter. We still have one of the worst value for money public transport systems in the world. We have laughable off-peak train frequencies. Service improvements are a fraction of the percentage fare increases. We have an unreliable ticketing system, that has no daily ticketing options. There is a massive lack of transparency. What is there to be pleased about?

BrizCommuter hopes that some RBoT readers are not starting to accept the mediocrity of public transport in Brisbane!

So what would you like?  50% discount after 2 journeys, free afterwards?  Foot rub on the trains if being forced to stand?  A train past your house every 5 minutes - even though you would only catch it twice, more in one day being less likely....

Seriously, like I said earlier, this IS an improvement, it's not an improvement that will satisfy everyone but it will certainly satisfy the market that makes the most more than 10 journeys in a week, namely uni students as Ozbob pointed out.

Rather than whinging about it, say something constructive, and I might be able to take you more seriously.  Only just though, speaking in third person tells me that something isn't all quite that right in your head in the first place - or it's just simply a gimmick to make you stand out in the crowd, or at least attempt to.

[somebody]

Mr Fraser said 20 per cent of Go Card users travelled 10 times or more in a week and he expected more regular commuters would take up weekend travel when it became free.

Indeed he did.  I remember it being much lower.  How's that reconcile with their thinking that 11 journeys/week/weekly was wrong?  Perhaps off peak patronage has increased.

[BrizCommuter]

http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/10/new-frequent-user-discount-gimmick.html
Useful, or just a gimmick?

Nothing like a good ol whinge after some good news .  Can't please everyone I guess.

It'll take far more than this "improvement" to please BrizCommuter! The new frequent user discount will make very little difference to the average commuter. We still have one of the worst value for money public transport systems in the world. We have laughable off-peak train frequencies. Service improvements are a fraction of the percentage fare increases. We have an unreliable ticketing system, that has no daily ticketing options. There is a massive lack of transparency. What is there to be pleased about?

BrizCommuter hopes that some RBoT readers are not starting to accept the mediocrity of public transport in Brisbane!

So what would you like?  50% discount after 2 journeys, free afterwards?  Foot rub on the trains if being forced to stand?  A train past your house every 5 minutes - even though you would only catch it twice, more in one day being less likely....

Seriously, like I said earlier, this IS an improvement, it's not an improvement that will satisfy everyone but it will certainly satisfy the market that makes the most more than 10 journeys in a week, namely uni students as Ozbob pointed out.

Rather than whinging about it, say something constructive, and I might be able to take you more seriously.  Only just though, speaking in third person tells me that something isn't all quite that right in your head in the first place - or it's just simply a gimmick to make you stand out in the crowd, or at least attempt to.

Ooh, personal attacks, nasty!

If you read my blog post, you should realise what a gimmick this is. Unless you make 14 or more journeys in 2012, it will still cost more than in 2011! BrizCommuter expects better service improvements for his 15% yearly fare increases. Within 1km of BrizCommuter's home last financial year saw a 0% improvement in combined bus/train frequencies, the previous year was approx. 3%, this year will probably see less than 2%. It's simply not good enough!

[STB]

http://brizcommuter.blogspot.com/2011/10/new-frequent-user-discount-gimmick.html
Useful, or just a gimmick?

Nothing like a good ol whinge after some good news .  Can't please everyone I guess.

It'll take far more than this "improvement" to please BrizCommuter! The new frequent user discount will make very little difference to the average commuter. We still have one of the worst value for money public transport systems in the world. We have laughable off-peak train frequencies. Service improvements are a fraction of the percentage fare increases. We have an unreliable ticketing system, that has no daily ticketing options. There is a massive lack of transparency. What is there to be pleased about?

BrizCommuter hopes that some RBoT readers are not starting to accept the mediocrity of public transport in Brisbane!

So what would you like?  50% discount after 2 journeys, free afterwards?  Foot rub on the trains if being forced to stand?  A train past your house every 5 minutes - even though you would only catch it twice, more in one day being less likely....

Seriously, like I said earlier, this IS an improvement, it's not an improvement that will satisfy everyone but it will certainly satisfy the market that makes the most more than 10 journeys in a week, namely uni students as Ozbob pointed out.

Rather than whinging about it, say something constructive, and I might be able to take you more seriously.  Only just though, speaking in third person tells me that something isn't all quite that right in your head in the first place - or it's just simply a gimmick to make you stand out in the crowd, or at least attempt to.

Ooh, personal attacks, nasty!

If you read my blog post, you should realise what a gimmick this is. Unless you make 14 or more journeys in 2012, it will still cost more than in 2011! BrizCommuter expects better service improvements for his 15% yearly fare increases. Within 1km of BrizCommuter's home last financial year saw a 0% improvement in combined bus/train frequencies, the previous year was approx. 3%, this year will probably see less than 2%. It's simply not good enough!

14?? It'll be free after 10!

And what do you expect, there's a much bigger network than within walking distance to your house.  You should be focusing on the overall network in terms of improvements, not what goes past your house.

[WTN]

To add to STB, I live not very far from Buranda busway - the number of frequency increases there this year have been fairly good. You might get improvements not close to you, but they'll be close to others and probably the places where you're going.

I think we should be thankful for the improvements we're getting, even if they come incrementally.

[Gazza]

Yeah I mean I'm not really getting the negativity surrounding this. In effect, it will mean a lot of free weekend travel for many, which pretty much trumps the $3 deal they have in Melbourne.

And it will be more useful for students then a straight weekly, because weekly tickets don't work if there are variations in the zones you travel. (Eg I live in Zone 3....When I was a student; Going to Uni is to zone 2, going into the CBD occasionally is to zone 1, working my weekend job on the Gold Coast involved boarding at coopers, so zone 4 to 15....A weekly would never have worked for all that, but a cap would have been great)

Pensioners already got a good deal with the daily cap. Having it kick in on a daily basis for them makes sense for that group because they do a lot of discreet trips in one day, but not necessarily every day.

And I reckon if you aren't someone doing 10 trips in a week then you aren't using it enough to deserve a discount....If it becomes so easy to get discounts under a particular structure that everyone is qualifying for it then they might as well just give everyone a lower fare level overall and be done with it, and not rely on complex qualifying calculations.

BrizCommuter expects better service improvements for his 15% yearly fare increases. Within 1km of BrizCommuter's home last financial year saw a 0% improvement in combined bus/train frequencies, the previous year was approx. 3%, this year will probably see less than 2%. It's simply not good enough!

I'm not understanding this cognitive disconnect I'm seeing...Basically what people are saying is that we aren't getting enough improvements for our 15%, so we should settle for this lack of improvement, but have lower fares to compensate.

No, the answer is actually to make sure we do get a lot of improvements for our buck, and they actually do it in places where it matters.

I still stand by this statement.
"Whats good is a discount to someone if they don't have services to use to begin with?"

[BrizCommuter]

14?? It'll be free after 10!

Do the math! 10 (or more) same zone journeys in 2012 still costs more than 13 same zone journeys in 2011.