Do you want the bad news or the good news?

[ozbob]

This is the actual situation:  

*TransLink undertook an investigation into the matters you raised about new train timetables. In consulting with our delivery partner, QR Passenger (QR), we were provided with the below information:

QR advises that a major overhaul of the entire timetables across the network will be implemented in early next year. This will be a completely new timetable, incorporated the new services, now and projected for the future.

* anonymous note stuck to floor of EMU22

Good news?   I anticipate a few services being rolled out in the forthcoming weeks.  Where or what?  No idea.

Folks, the 80,000 trains seats is basically a charade by the looks of things.  I cannot see the required 35 weekly services being added any time soon, hope I am wrong ...

[ozbob]

Putting aside the broken promises, will there be any real timetable consultation?

Who knows,  it does seem the rail commuters are being treated with contempt.

[O_128]

The issue really needs to be raised now on timetable consultation, better yet what happened to the crgs

[#Metro]

Ha ha, I can just see the headlines
Queensland Government misses the train...
It might also miss the ferry by the looks of it too.

[ozbob]

Media Release 16 April 2010

SEQ:  Wide community consultation for train timetable improvements essential

RAIL Back On Track (http://backontrack.org) a web based community support group for rail and public transport and an advocate for public transport commuters has said recent advice from TransLink has confirmed that a major revamp of the Citytrain timetables is planned for implementation in early 2011.

Robert Dow, Spokesman for RAIL Back On Track said:

"Advice has been received from TransLink  that a major overhaul of the Citytrain timetables across the network will be implemented in early 2011. This will be a completely new timetable, incorporate new services for the present and projected for the future."

"QR Passenger currently conducts Community Reference Groups for most lines of the Citytrain (1).  This is a great initiative and feedback concerning timetables has been ongoing through that process.  A wider community consultation is needed though and we would hope that this consultation is carried out in the next few months prior to the final preparation of the new timetables."

"Not withstanding that, and in view of the Governments commitment to 83,000 weekly public transport seats on rail to be added by 1st July 2010 (2), there are some very obvious gaps on the Rosewood and Sunshine Coast lines that need fixing now and some additional services are needed  for relief of peak congestion on the Cleveland, Caboolture and Ipswich lines. We look forward to the promised additional train services being implemented before the 1st of July 2010."

References:

1. http://www.citytrain.com.au/promotion/crg/overview.asp

2. http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=3533.0

Contact:

Robert Dow
Administration
admin@backontrack.org

[ozbob]

What a sad mess the miscommunication of TransLink has become ...  if you do get a response from TransLink, it is quite possibly not true, or maybe it has had the 'spin' test applied and then is not relevant in any case ...

When is the next state election?  I hear a rumour that an extra service to Doomben might be in place by then as an election treat  



From the Brisbane mX 16th April 2010 page 4

Backtrack on rail timetable revamp

[Jon Bryant]

What a sad state of affairs.  The Minister should be excitedly announcing more services and a timetable overhaul... Yet all we get is "The timetable worked 1979 (more a reference to 30 min off peak frequencies than the last time a timetable was updated) so why change it".  But the Govt is so green? Green my left [censored]!!!!  The oil and car companies must just love our Governments.

[#Metro]

  Disappointing.

I didn't have high expectations anyway...

[Golliwog]

  Grrrrr.

[stephenk]

I'm sure that at the first CRG I attended, we were told to expect new timetabled in early/mid-2010 for Ipswich-Caboolture, and late-2010 for other lines. This news is very disappointing, especially as my station (Enoggera) suffered badly from the March 2008 timetable.

I've put in a complaint, sorry, feedback to Translink also asking about whether we will see the promised services by July 1st 2010, and when the next "improved" Ferny Grove timetable will be released. I suggest that other RailBoT users also pressure Translink over the lack of action on extra train services.

[ozbob]

Sent to the Minister for Transport, and CC to TransLink and QR Passenger

----------------------------------

17th April 2010

Dear Minister,

Our members have received correspondence from TransLink indicating that an implementation of a complete overhaul of the Citytrain timetable was to be implemented in early 2011.

We have at times been promised various timetable improvements for rail from early 2010 to the present day.  Very few initiatives have been delivered.  Yesterdays revelation in the Brisbane mX newspaper (16th April 2010) that the information concerning the new timetable for 2011 was not correct beggars belief.

The fundamental problem with the present Citytrain timetable is the abysmal train frequency, particularly off peak and the gaps in the timetables, some at peak times.  A matter related to the unsatisfactory train frequency is the poor bus - rail integration.  This complicates public transport for many commuters.

A commitment was made in a statement by yourself, the Minister for Transport  on October 15 2009 ( http://statements.cabinet.qld.gov.au/MMS/StatementDisplaySingle.aspx?id=66877 )  " ... add more than 301,000 additional passenger capacity a week to the SEQ network by July next year ... ".  Commuters are now then wondering when these services, particularly rail, are to be delivered, 2016?

We are well aware that completion of the Corinda to Darra upgrade, and the Richlands Branch will necessitate further timetable changes and hopefully an improved train frequency.  To wait until then for improvement is not satisfactory.  Timetables can be set with a view to these future service additions.

If as a community if we are to change the transport paradigm from the mayhem on the roads, to safe sustainable transport options public transport must be frequent, accessible and affordable.

Best wishes
Robert

Robert Dow
Administration
RAIL Back On Track

[Nightwriter]

Wish I can say that I'm surprised to see them backtracking so fast they are tripping all over themselves....but I'm not.  Its just another instance of public transport, and the commuters who use the services, being seen as unimportant and irrelevant. 

After all, the lack of trains isn't exactly front page news is it? At least, to most people.

[Derwan]

I would suggest that QR is in fact planning for a new timetable early next year - and responded to TransLink accordingly when they were following up the letter, which was released back to the individual by the person processing the enquiry.

However, as the release of this information wasn't sanctioned by the bosses of TTA who have to oversee and approve everything, they did the backtrack.

Is the TTA going to delay the introduction of the new timetable simply because they have to interfere with everything that QR does?

[Golliwog]

I would suggest that QR is in fact planning for a new timetable early next year - and responded to TransLink accordingly when they were following up the letter, which was released back to the individual by the person processing the enquiry.

However, as the release of this information wasn't sanctioned by the bosses of TTA who have to oversee and approve everything, they did the backtrack.

Is the TTA going to delay the introduction of the new timetable simply because they have to interfere with everything that QR does?

I'm almost certain thats what happened as well. Still, I'm hopeful this QR plan will be approved.

[ozbob]

Advice has been received that a major timetable overhaul for 2011 IS being worked on, but has not yet been finalised.  Consultation will be carried out as the timetable develops.

[O_128]

Advice has been received that a major timetable overhaul for 2011 IS being worked on, but has not yet been finalised.  Consultation will be carried out as the timetable develops.

Ozbob i really liked your idea of a forum just for timetables, Is there any possible way of implementing this, or is perhaps handing out surveys at central a better idea?

[ozbob]

Thanks, but that was a suggestion made for TransLink. I think there should be community wide consultation and a TransLink lead initiative in that area would be good, many other options would be useful.  

They could do a number of things, standard feedback, set up a forum, and have an online and paper survey.

[somebody]

I would suggest that QR is in fact planning for a new timetable early next year - and responded to TransLink accordingly when they were following up the letter, which was released back to the individual by the person processing the enquiry.

However, as the release of this information wasn't sanctioned by the bosses of TTA who have to oversee and approve everything, they did the backtrack.

Is the TTA going to delay the introduction of the new timetable simply because they have to interfere with everything that QR does?

Sounds likely.  Their whole attitude stinks.

[#Metro]

Should it start from scratch? Complete overhaul?
OR just change a few slots here and there?

[ozbob]

There needs to be a major overhaul.  One of the problems is that the timetable in use today is basically formed from the 1991?  version and just plugged and tweaked here and there.

I think a reduction in the number of patterns, eg. Ipswich line, needs to be done.  In same cases elimination of express services would be sound. eg. Ferny Grove line.

I expect that there will be a major revamp as well over due.  The Richlands branch and track amplification between Corinda and Darra, possible extension of regular services from Caboolture to Beerburrum, some other possible novel routes will mean changes.

The gaps highlighted by members here just confirms why it needs to be sorted ..

[somebody]

There needs to be a major overhaul.  

True, but some improvements they should be able to implement now.  Like, for example filling in the hour gaps on Sunday am.  Although de-coupling Shorncliffe from the Ipswich line on weekdays does sound difficult.

But how can they justifying lying to the public just because they had some information which was leaked?

[ozbob]

Indeed, the outrageous gaps need plugging tomorrow.  And the longer term the revamp.

Besides July 1 is fast approaching ...   

[O_128]

out of curiosity would caboolture services simply be able to be extended to beerburrum?

[somebody]

out of curiosity would caboolture services simply be able to be extended to beerburrum?

I'd think not easily, but it depends on turnbacks, etc.

Indeed, the outrageous gaps need plugging tomorrow.  And the longer term the revamp.

Besides July 1 is fast approaching ...   

Why July 1?  Why not July 31?

[verbatim9]

Increasing the frequency of  services to 20 minute intervals off peak and weekends from 6 am - to midnight on all lines including the airport line.

[Arnz]

out of curiosity would caboolture services simply be able to be extended to beerburrum?

I'd think not easily, but it depends on turnbacks, etc.

There is crossovers just south of Beerburrum to turn the train.  But even with the crossovers, Beerburrum is not a suitable terminus as potentially both lines can be blocked if you were to turn the weekend shuttles back at Beerburrum as well.  Not to mention the single track between Beerburrum and Nambour is one of the busiest tracks in the country (Freight, Traveltrain, Citytrain, the odd excursion traffic, etc)

As I said before, it would be cheaper to get rid of the triangle siding at Landsborough and rebuild it as a electrified turnback siding so we can get extra services to Landsborough.  The 605, 615 and the 649s turn back at Landsborough to meet the extra services.  Preferably the extra 649s would be operated by Sunshine Coast Sunbus (shorter dead running times out of Marcoola instead of having KBL send out a dead running bus of Morayfield)

[ozbob]

Somebody, 1st July is the deadline for the 301,000 weekly public transport seats delivery promised in the statement on the 15th October.

-->  http://statements.cabinet.qld.gov.au/MMS/StatementDisplaySingle.aspx?id=66877 

[somebody]

Did they specify the day of month though?  If services start on 20 July 2010, the pollies will claim that they were delivered by July.

[ozbob]

out of curiosity would caboolture services simply be able to be extended to beerburrum?

It has been suggested.  Yes, some issues but can be got around, would I think be only an interim measure for future extensions to Landsborough.

Landsborough needs improved services.

[ozbob]

No, delivered by July, means just that.  By July delivered if you like.  When July arrives, services delivered.

I don't think they will try to worm around like that.  And we have highlighted this deadline in a number of media releases and other communications, and it is not challenged.  By 1st July, I would suggest if the services are not delivered there will be a bit of grief around George St, both ends ...

[somebody]

No, delivered by July, means just that.  By July delivered if you like.  When July arrives, services delivered.

I don't think they will try to worm around like that.  And we have highlighted this deadline in a number of media releases and other communications, and it is not challenged.  By 1st July, I would suggest if the services are not delivered there will be a bit of grief around George St, both ends ...

What's with all the secrecy?  The 22 Feb changes weren't announced until sometime in Feb, in spite of receiving numerous complaints about the Northern Busway.  Looking at ATDB, it seems that 4 Aug 2008 changes (to 130, 150, 156) were announced 31 Jul 2008, and ones to 396/397/398 announced on 28 Aug 2008.  27 Apr 2009 changes announced 24 Apr 2009.  I could go on.

[ozbob]

I agree, the lack of notice with changes, the latest bizarre example being the Glider, is stupid.  Customers are not treated as customers.

[Golliwog]

But at the same time, you can't have too much notice either. We would all be complaining if they announced changes a month in advance complaining about why couldn't they be implemented right away.

[somebody]

I agree, the lack of notice with changes, the latest bizarre example being the Glider, is stupid.  Customers are not treated as customers.

Not just stupid, disgusting if not disgraceful really.

But at the same time, you can't have too much notice either. We would all be complaining if they announced changes a month in advance complaining about why couldn't they be implemented right away.

I think less than a week is too little by far.  I started a thread I think before you joined comparing QR/TL with CityRail.  CityRail had released a draft timetable nearly a year before it was planned to be implemented for the Illawarra line.

[somebody]

Advice has been received that a major timetable overhaul for 2011 IS being worked on, but has not yet been finalised.  Consultation will be carried out as the timetable develops.

Is this official?  I'm actually quite angry about this one, especially after the Coro Drive thing, and am considering demanding heads roll if Translink have directly lied to the public here as it appears that they have.

[Jon Bryant]

Like any new product or service being released the more hype the better.   In fact the lack of immediate availability can increase demand... not so sure about PT but there needs to be advertising about the benefits of public and active transport, the cost saving, etc.   It is still treated like a social service.  It needs to be treated like a commercial business seeking market share.  Dis the competion whilst highlighting the good in your product.  The roads and car park operators do it to PT so is all fair in love and war in my books.

[ozbob]

This is a good example of how TransLink sees it.

On the 7th January 2009 I discovered some posters had been placed on Darra announcing a new service.

I subsequently put out a good news media release.  This was not received well by George St, the suggestion being that someone had leaked the service details to me.  Nonsense, I found the posters stuck up on the station (see the photographs).  The response by TransLink was immature to say the least.  Not my fault I found the posters and reacted in a positive manner.  The main issue being that we had beat the 'official' announcement. By the way the official announcement was  three days before the service started ... I think they have some problems, don't you?

See --> http://railbotforum.org/mbs/index.php?topic=1734.0

[ozbob]

Yes, the advice is from official sources, the highest.

[somebody]

Yes, the advice is from official sources, the highest.

Ok, but I still want to see something that I can show to my local member.  I don't think ozbob says it is true would hold much weight.

[Jon Bryant]

The mentality is beyond belief.  If this is how they react then they deserved to be fired and kicked out of office.